[15:00]  * slangasek waves
[15:01] <philroche> \o
[15:01] <Tribaal> o/
[15:01] <slangasek> #startmeeting
[15:01] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Oct  5 15:01:26 2017 UTC.  The chair is slangasek. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[15:01] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[15:01] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Lightning round
[15:01] <slangasek> $ echo $(shuf -e slangasek bdmurray xnox tdaitx doko sil2100 rbalint infinity cyphermox mwhudson rcj philroche Odd_Bloke tribaal fginther)
[15:01] <slangasek> fginther bdmurray rcj xnox tribaal rbalint tdaitx philroche doko infinity cyphermox Odd_Bloke slangasek mwhudson sil2100
[15:01] <rbalint> o/
[15:01] <sil2100> o/
[15:02] <sil2100> Wow, dead-last
[15:02] <fginther> goodness, one moment
[15:03] <fginther> * Continued library development to facilitate automated publication
[15:03] <fginther> * provided an automation script to IS to improve deployment of cloud-image jenkaas slaves
[15:04] <fginther> * Enabled launchpad <-> trello automation
[15:04] <fginther> (done)
[15:04] <bdmurray> Research into LP: #1515513 re: dkms leftovers in /boot
[15:04] <bdmurray> Uploaded X and Z SRUs for LP: #1515513
[15:04] <bdmurray> Tested LP: #1720331 re whoopsie restarting constantly
[15:04] <bdmurray> Investigation into gdebi python3.6 issue LP: #1708947
[15:04] <bdmurray> HIGHLIGHT(?): Wrote blog post re free-ing space in /boot - http://www.murraytwins.com/blog/?p=156
[15:04] <bdmurray> reported LP: #1721364 re apt autoremove and Never-MarkAuto-Sections
[15:04] <bdmurray> tested LP: #1715490 again, looked for similar bugs
[15:05] <Tribaal> SCHWEET
[15:05] <bdmurray> ✔ done
[15:05] <bdmurray> SCHWEET?
[15:05] <Tribaal> Swiss-German for "Sweet"
[15:06] <Tribaal> JIT meeting :)
[15:06] <slangasek> skip rcj for the moment
[15:06] <rcj> * sprinted
[15:06] <slangasek> heh
[15:06] <rcj> * got sick after sprint
[15:06] <Odd_Bloke> * failed to read lists of people
[15:06] <rcj> * automated cloud-image build work
[15:06] <rcj> done
[15:07] <xnox> artful ntp vs systemd: systemd is in -proposed, ntp is the unapproved queue - please review
[15:07] <xnox> zesty: systemd failed verification, fixup and more fixes are in the unapproved queue - please review
[15:07] <xnox> xenial: systemd passed verification, there are adt regressions. Filed bugs for linux-* and open-iscsi, these appear to be broken tests. nplan seems to fail for a testcase in NetworkManager, and nplan/autostart test case appears to have regressed under lxc on xenial. However, creating autopkgtest lxc container does not work for me on artful
[15:07] <bdmurray> xnox:
[15:07] <xnox> openssl-ibmca libica et.al. landed thus we have full accelerated z14 encryption landed
[15:07] <xnox> mdadm/systemd shutdown - still in progress
[15:07] <xnox> fixed s390-dasd for final beta (failing to format DASD drives)
[15:07] <xnox> zfcpdump-kernel - failing to upgrade for GA, to be escalated to IBM
[15:07] <xnox> cloud-init leases merge in progress (started, and handed over to cloud-init team)
[15:07] <xnox> ...
[15:07] <slangasek> Tribaal:
[15:07] <Tribaal> * Some of the memory issues investigated previously were due to transparent huge pages being set to "enabled". That led to memory fragmentation.
[15:07] <Tribaal> * Vaguard duties for the build system this week.
[15:07] <Tribaal> * Helping partners kick the tires on the final 17.10 beta to make sure everything is ok for the final release.
[15:07] <Tribaal> * OoO tomorrow and beginning of next week
[15:07] <Tribaal> done.
[15:07] <rbalint> * GCE new upstream LP: #1718922
[15:07] <rbalint> * UBuntu Rally
[15:07] <rbalint> * image minimization
[15:07] <rbalint> * updating runc to 1.0.0~rc4 and creating docker-runc with the version needed by docker.io in Debian
[15:07] <rbalint> * unattended-upgrades 0.98 for Debian
[15:07] <rbalint> (done)
[15:08] <tdaitx> * Trying to figure out OpenJDK 8 build failure in i386 (error: "unsupported size for integer register")
[15:08] <tdaitx> * +1 maint
[15:08] <tdaitx> * Checked and (re)setup jenkaas slaves for jck after the lgw01 scalingstack redeploy (zeroed slaves)
[15:08] <tdaitx> (done)
[15:08] <philroche> - Cloud image build system vanguard
[15:08] <philroche> - Ubuntu rally (via hangouts)
[15:08] <philroche> - Cloud image build system development
[15:09] <philroche> - Cloud partner calls
[15:09] <philroche> (done)
[15:09] <philroche> doko:
[15:10] <bdmurray> no infinity either
[15:11] <bdmurray> cyphermox:
[15:11] <cyphermox> yay
[15:11] <cyphermox> shim:
[15:11] <cyphermox> - preparing shim for signing
[15:11] <cyphermox> - Microsoft and shim-review submissions
[15:11] <cyphermox> artful:
[15:11] <cyphermox> - unbroke keyboard selection/translations in ubiquity due to console-setup
[15:11] <cyphermox> - reword partman-efi non_efi_system template again
[15:11] <cyphermox> - testing subiquity image
[15:11] <cyphermox> SRUs:
[15:11] <cyphermox> - [xenial] preparing ubiquity SRU for WPA2 Enterprise support (LP: #1107935)
[15:11] <cyphermox> - [xenial] investigating search domains issue in klibc.
[15:11] <cyphermox> - [zesty] isc-dhcp DNS search domains handling
[15:11] <cyphermox> other:
[15:11] <cyphermox> - catching up on cloud image minimization work
[15:11] <cyphermox> - netplan 0.29 backport to 16.04 is waiting in the unapproved queue
[15:11] <cyphermox> (done)
[15:11] <Odd_Bloke> * Ubuntu Rally last week
[15:11] <Odd_Bloke> * Finalising new GCE publication flow in preparation for bb opening
[15:11] <Odd_Bloke> * Preparing for product sprint next week
[15:12] <Odd_Bloke> (done)
[15:12] <Odd_Bloke> slangasek:
[15:12] <slangasek>  * at the Ubuntu Rally last week in New York, lots of great discussions and development work
[15:12] <slangasek>   * first in-person meetings for a while with quorum of the archive, SRU, and release teams
[15:12] <slangasek>   * worked with the foundations team to fix papercuts around netplan, systemd-network migration
[15:12] <slangasek>   * worked with the kernel team to design solution for extra initramfs generation on package removal
[15:13] <slangasek>  * HIGHLIGHT (if sil2100 doesn't do it) Artful Final Beta released last week
[15:13] <slangasek>  * working on livecd-rootfs changes for artful and xenial:
[15:13] <slangasek>   * landing support for preinstallation of snaps in images
[15:13] <slangasek>   * adding support for minimizing cloud images
[15:13] <slangasek>  * next week, at the Product Roadmap Sprint, again in NYC
[15:13] <slangasek> (done)
[15:13] <slangasek> sil2100:
[15:13] <sil2100> - Sprinting, then swap day, then partially away due to sickness (not really productive yet)
[15:13] <sil2100> - Setting up e-mail for release-bits
[15:13] <sil2100> - SRU reviews, cleanup and releases
[15:13] <sil2100> - ubuntu-image work on coverage, refactoring the builder classes
[15:13] <sil2100> - Reading up on preparations for final release
[15:13] <sil2100> - Last week: Final Beta :O
[15:13] <sil2100> Ah, indeed, that was a good highlight!
[15:13] <sil2100> (done)
[15:14] <slangasek> any questions on status?
[15:14] <bdmurray> Nope
[15:15] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Bugs
[15:15] <slangasek> probably late in the cycle to be committing to anything non-critical for the 17.10 release :)
[15:15] <slangasek> [LINK] http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-aa-incoming-bug-tasks.html#foundations-bugs
[15:15] <slangasek> there are a couple of 'high' bugs here
[15:15] <bdmurray> I mentioned bug 1721364 but would like to discuss it
[15:16] <slangasek> bdmurray: fwiw I have it in my inbox to review the commit jak pointed to
[15:16] <slangasek> bdmurray: but I guess we should discuss what the path forward is if that doesn't get reverted?
[15:17] <bdmurray> slangasek: Yeah, autoremove could have surprising results.
[15:17] <slangasek> frustrating
[15:17] <slangasek> bdmurray: so your position is that it's too high-risk?
[15:18] <bdmurray> Well, I'm guessing people remove metapackages like ubuntu-desktop but could be wrong.
[15:18] <slangasek> I don't know; they might because they wanted to remove one of the packages it pulled in
[15:19] <bdmurray> I mean if they've used autoremove in recent history then they would have hit an issue.
[15:19] <bdmurray> s/hit an issue/ran into this/
[15:20] <slangasek> bdmurray: yeah.  I think we should revisit with upstream the decision to change how markauto is handled, but that won't change the fact that systems already installed will have their package database in a state that makes autoremove dangerous
[15:21] <slangasek> bdmurray: which I guess leaves only the remove-newly-autoremovable path, which rbalint has mentioned?
[15:22] <bdmurray> slangasek: Yeah, I think so
[15:22] <slangasek> ok
[15:22] <slangasek> annoying, that's going to take more work to implement
[15:23] <slangasek> but +1 for this on the path forward
[15:23] <bdmurray> Well the newly-autoremovable only works if you are install the kernel update with u-u
[15:23] <slangasek> couldn't we make it work with update-manager?
[15:24] <slangasek> by implementing the same logic as in u-u
[15:24] <bdmurray> Oh, I see
[15:24] <slangasek> this isn't something we need to magically solve for users running apt from the commandline
[15:24] <slangasek> they will run apt autoremove or not
[15:25] <slangasek> bdmurray: agreed?
[15:25] <bdmurray> slangasek: Yes
[15:25] <slangasek> ok
[15:25] <slangasek> anything else on bugs?
[15:25] <slangasek> we have two 'high' in incoming
[15:25] <bdmurray> bug 1720331 - I'm not sure if its whoopsie or the control panel
[15:26] <rbalint> slangasek, bdmurray: the remove-newly-autoremovable path is already released in u-u which is why i'm hesitant to revert it, but special handling for kernel packages seem to be a safer bet
[15:27] <bdmurray> rbalint: We weren't talking about reverting it but using the same code in update-manager
[15:29] <bdmurray> cyphermox: Is not being able to use 'videoinfo' in grub relevant with bug 1715490?
[15:29] <slangasek> bdmurray: AIUI videoinfo is specific to VESA, and if you're using the qemu vga driver you don't even have VESA
[15:29] <cyphermox> bdmurray: I don't think so
[15:30] <slangasek> so you don't have videoinfo because it's literally not configurable
[15:30] <rbalint> bdmurray: yes, i mentioned that because https://launchpad.net/linux-purge is a valid safer alternative imo
[15:30] <bdmurray> Okay, well I couldn't find any more bugs like 1715490 so lets punt it then
[15:30] <rbalint> bdmurray: and i think it is worth a separate discussion
[15:30] <cyphermox> sounds like it's "just" broken video in VM, "as usual"
[15:31] <sil2100> heh
[15:31] <slangasek> ok; anything else on bugs?
[15:31] <cyphermox> oh, also
[15:32] <cyphermox> bdmurray: you on artful and running in wayland?
[15:32] <bdmurray> cyphermox: the host or the guest?
[15:32] <cyphermox> because that breaks arrow keys, so it wouldn't be overly surprising if it broke video too somehow
[15:32] <rbalint> bdmurray: but adding remove-newly-autoremovable option to update-manager is also valuable for the sake of consistency IMO, it may or may not be the default
[15:32] <cyphermox> on the host
[15:34] <slangasek> rbalint: this is only interesting to do if we make it the default
[15:34] <bdmurray> cyphermox: not wayland
[15:34] <cyphermox> aok
[15:34] <bdmurray> I did get the arrow key issue though
[15:34] <cyphermox> ok
[15:35] <rbalint> slangasek: ok
[15:37] <slangasek> [TOPIC] AOB
[15:37] <slangasek> anything else?
[15:38] <bdmurray> nope
[15:38] <slangasek> #endmeeting
[15:38] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Oct  5 15:38:55 2017 UTC.
[15:38] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2017/ubuntu-meeting.2017-10-05-15.01.moin.txt
[15:38] <slangasek> thanks, all!
[15:38] <bdmurray> Monday is a US holiday though
[15:39] <slangasek> true
[15:39] <cyphermox> yep, Thanksgiving!
[15:39] <bdmurray> Doh, Canada too
[15:39] <bdmurray> My bad
[16:40] <elopio> RadioZen: this is not the best place. You can try askubuntu.com
[16:52] <ahoneybun> Here everyone
[16:57] <elopio> here o/
[16:59] <flexiondotorg> Present o/
[16:59] <ahoneybun> is it 4/6 that we need for a meeting in general
[17:00] <ahoneybun> ?
[17:00] <flexiondotorg> Is quorum required to meet? Isn't that just if there is a vote?
[17:00] <ahoneybun> I think just for votes
[17:00] <ahoneybun> just checking
[17:01] <flexiondotorg> marcoceppi: Will you be joining us?
[17:01] <flexiondotorg> #startmeeting Community Council
[17:01] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Oct  5 17:01:31 2017 UTC.  The chair is flexiondotorg. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[17:01] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[17:01] <flexiondotorg> Let's assume we are meeting :-)
[17:02] <flexiondotorg> wxl: Will you be joining?
[17:03] <wxl> o/
[17:03] <ahoneybun> o/
[17:03] <flexiondotorg> Well, we have 4 of us so far. Let's see if we are joined by any others. If not, we'll get started in a few mins.
[17:05] <flexiondotorg> So we know jose can't make it. Possibly
[17:05] <wxl> what about marcoceppi ?
[17:05] <flexiondotorg> It is possible the elacheche is also travelling.
[17:05] <wxl> is sabdfl joining us?
[17:06] <flexiondotorg> wxl: sabdfl is in NYC. Not sure if he will be joining.
[17:06] <wxl> ah ok
[17:06] <flexiondotorg> I think we should assume it's just us for now.
[17:06] <wxl> ok
[17:07] <flexiondotorg> I think we are all aqauinted, but introductions are probably a good idea.
[17:08] <flexiondotorg> I am Martin Wimpress. I work for Canonical as a Developer Advocate. I'm also the lead for Ubuntu MATE, which is a personal project.
[17:08] <flexiondotorg> Who's next.
[17:08]  * elacheche loves MATE :D
[17:09] <flexiondotorg> elacheche: Hello, and thank you :-)
[17:09] <wxl> I'm Walter Lapchynski. I work for a small bicycle manufacturer in the US, which I help manage an array of Kubuntu desktops and FreeBSD/Ubuntu servers. I contribute mostly to Kubuntu and Lubuntu.
[17:09] <flexiondotorg> ahoneybun: You next?
[17:09] <elopio> I am Leo Arias, from Costa Rica. I work on the snapcraft team at canonical. I have contributed with LoCo events, translations, bug triaging and a few other things.
[17:10] <elacheche> Hey there! I am Anis, I work as a SysAdmin, I lead the Tunisian LoCo Team and try to contribute to any Tunisian FOSS projects whenever I have spare time..
[17:10] <ahoneybun> I'm Aaron Honeycutt from Denver CO, I work support at system76
[17:10] <wxl> Oh, I guess I should also mention I'm still on the LoCo Council and the Ubuntu Membership Board and I'm also the Ubuntu Oregon Team Lead.
[17:10] <flexiondotorg> wxl Busy then!
[17:11] <wxl> flexiondotorg: yeah, especially given i have a wife, a daughter, a house, a full time job, etc. XD
[17:11] <flexiondotorg> Given that we're all new here, does anyone have anything they want to discuss regarding the Community Council?
[17:11] <wxl> p.s. should we be using meetingology?
[17:11] <flexiondotorg> wxl I start it
[17:12] <flexiondotorg> *started
[17:12] <elopio> I have a few points I would like to propose. Should I go ahead?
[17:12] <flexiondotorg> Yep
[17:13] <wxl> actually i have something, too, when elopio is done.
[17:13] <flexiondotorg> Great. So do I
[17:14] <elopio> First, it worries me that we are an all-male panel, and would like to work to improve that for the next election in two years. Second, I think it these meetings would be awesome as youtube on air.
[17:14] <elopio> or maybe we could have a text meeting, and a video meeting.
[17:14] <ahoneybun> video meetings are nice
[17:15] <elopio> (and as a side note, there's a bad storm here, I might lose electricity, internet and water any time during the meeting. If I'm gone, please continue and I'll check back later)
[17:15] <wxl> elopio: do you think there are examples of non-inclusiveness within the community that we can address?
[17:15] <flexiondotorg> I agree with your first point. I think that points to a large issue of Ubuntu Member drop off which I feel we should try and turn around.
[17:15] <wxl> afaik we had no nominations for anyone female
[17:15] <elopio> wxl: I think we need to investigate that first, and use the reset on community.ubuntu.com to our advantage to make sure it is inclusive from the begining.
[17:16] <flexiondotorg> I also agree that video meetings would be a great way to communicate more effortlessly.
[17:16] <wxl> i think video meetings would possibly be a good way to invite the community to participate with us
[17:16] <flexiondotorg> And are more accessible for the wider community to access.
[17:16] <wxl> i think we should be responding to the needs of the community and unless we invite them in to speak with us and make us accessibility, we'll be hard pressed to do that
[17:17] <elopio> for the video, maybe we can use 45 minutes to go through our agenda, and leave 15 minutes in the end to answer questions from the community, or listen to their input.
[17:17] <flexiondotorg> Complete agree wxl.
[17:17] <flexiondotorg> elopio: I also think we should leverage the new Ubuntu Community Hub.
[17:17] <wxl> as an alternate, perhaps we should create a new thing that is like a Q&A session
[17:17] <elacheche> About the 1st point, we should investigate the roots, we need to find ways to get people around to world to contribute more, then apply for a membership, and encourage them to keep contributing and apply for boards!
[17:17] <wxl> like a town hall meeting
[17:17] <flexiondotorg> If we are to reach a new generation of Ubuntu users, and help onboard them to the community, we should use technologies they will embrace.
[17:18] <ahoneybun> +100 to the video meetings
[17:18] <wxl> i don't think that membership or locos are a very visible part of what we do, but the cc is
[17:18] <flexiondotorg> While I'm happy using IRC and mailing lists, they are not a great way to attract new users and contributors.
[17:18] <wxl> (to the outside)
[17:18] <popey> Note: Text is translatable, easily logged, easily read very quickly. videos less so.
[17:18] <wxl> i think we can transcribe it
[17:19] <wxl> i can work on finding solutions for that
[17:19] <popey> You won't :)
[17:19] <popey> Everyone who makes videos says "we'll transcribe it" but they don't :)
[17:19] <wxl> i meant algorithmically
[17:19] <wxl> i've been looking at it recently anyways
[17:19] <wxl> because i HATE videos, personally
[17:19] <elacheche> About the video meeting, it'll be good, and have already the video chat plateform for the other private meeting, we should not drop IRC..
[17:19] <elopio> popey: hum, it's not terribly hard to translate subtitles for a video. Not a lot harder than for an irc meeting. But we would need help to do both, that's for sure. And that might be a good way to encourage new people to join.
[17:19] <flexiondotorg> I see that we are all agreed on growing the Ubuntu community membership though :-D
[17:20] <popey> Videos are actually more intimidating for new people than text
[17:20] <popey> And harder to join when you're at work.
[17:20] <wxl> i disagree given the current culture, popey
[17:20] <wxl> but do agree with how distracting they are
[17:20] <ahoneybun> youtube has some translations
[17:20] <elacheche> flexiondotorg: Yeah, but that's the result of helping locos being more active!
[17:20] <elopio> flexiondotorg: with the note for: not just growing it, making it less male-centric by making it more welcoming to other genders.
[17:20] <ahoneybun> not great but they are there
[17:20] <popey> We had tremendous difficulty getting people to join hangouts because they don't want to be seen, don't have the right hardware or are travelling/working
[17:21] <popey> Just my 2p based on past experience.
[17:21] <wxl> i suspect that is, in part, due to it being a google product
[17:21] <flexiondotorg> popey: Thanks for the insight.
[17:21] <wxl> *ahem* matrix *ahem*
[17:21] <popey> No, that wasn't the issue, but okay.
[17:22] <flexiondotorg> elopio: What thoughts did you have of using the Community Hub?
[17:22] <ahoneybun> yea google was the issue with some
[17:22] <ahoneybun> maybe look at BigBlueButton?
[17:22] <elopio> flexiondotorg: I love it!
[17:22] <flexiondotorg> Yeah, there is a reason Discourse has become the go to community building tool.
[17:23] <elopio> I hate google hangouts because they are google. However, I live in a place with terrible bandwith, and it's the only thing that really works here. No bbb, no talky, no jitsi, we tried everything.
[17:23] <elacheche> ahoneybun: We have rocket.ubuntu.com.. Why looking for BBB?
[17:23] <elacheche> x)
[17:23] <flexiondotorg> What do you guys think about moving Community Council "docs" off the Ubuntu Wiki to the Community Hub?
[17:23] <ahoneybun> rocket does video?
[17:23] <elopio> flexiondotorg: +1
[17:23] <wxl> yes, ahoneybun
[17:24] <elopio> ahoneybun: it uses jitsi for video.
[17:24] <flexiondotorg> Perhaps we should take an action to review available voice/video chat services?
[17:24] <wxl> i think we should do regular talks on how to get involved with ubuntu
[17:24] <flexiondotorg> Discus again in the next meeting?
[17:24] <popey> +1
[17:25] <flexiondotorg> wxl Agree.
[17:25] <elacheche> flexiondotorg: this will kill the wiki more and more, LoCo already having issues keeping they're wiki updated, people will ask why CC is using the HUB and we (locos) are forced to use Wiki!
[17:25] <flexiondotorg> elacheche: Perhaps the Community Hub is a better place for LoCos too.
[17:25] <elacheche> wxl: I'm planning to prepare a talk about that for the next SFD x)
[17:25] <flexiondotorg> SFD?
[17:25] <elacheche> Software Freedom Day
[17:26] <flexiondotorg> ty
[17:26] <elacheche> flexiondotorg: Why not, we shold get the LC involved in this..
[17:26] <elopio> elacheche: why is the loco forced to use the wiki? aren't they free to use what they like?
[17:26] <flexiondotorg> Yes, we should work with the LC on this.
[17:27]  * wxl puts on his LC hat :)
[17:27] <popey> Nice hat!
[17:27] <elacheche> elopio: Locos should report to the wiki
[17:27] <flexiondotorg> So wxl, is there push back about the LoCos using the Wiki?
[17:27] <wxl> there's push back in general about doing anything XD
[17:28] <wxl> seriously what i mean is that some people insist on ONLY doing facebook
[17:28] <elopio> :)
[17:28] <flexiondotorg> elacheche: Is it more a case of having LoCo report activities and events, rather than where they report that?
[17:29] <flexiondotorg> wxl So each LoCo has their own Facebook groups?
[17:29] <wxl> some do, some don't
[17:29] <flexiondotorg> Right.
[17:29] <flexiondotorg> The Hub is intended to be a portal to the community.
[17:30] <flexiondotorg> So having Facebook etc is fine.
[17:30] <wxl> and there are some that will ONLY use facebook
[17:30] <flexiondotorg> But using the Hub so the is one place for users to start their community discovery is valuable.
[17:30] <elacheche> flexiondotorg: The Ubuntu Tunisia FB group & page did not bring any active contributors to the community.. All engaged contributors are comming from events and staying in the ML and IRC..
[17:30] <wxl> so we should have links to the LCs and membership and etc.
[17:31] <wxl> and it should be easy to find
[17:31] <elopio> I think it's fine, they should use whatever works for them. But I would suggest them to try the hub. I think most of them will like it.
[17:31] <flexiondotorg> And, LoCo certainly need Facebook and all the rest.
[17:31] <flexiondotorg> Using Ubuntu MATE as an exmaple, we have Discourse. But we are active on Facebook, Twitter, G+, Mastadon etc.
[17:32] <flexiondotorg> I'd like to use the Hub to prepare agendas for future CC meetings.
[17:33] <flexiondotorg> We can collaborate there and also solicite involvement from the wider community.
[17:33] <elacheche> flexiondotorg: based on my experience, FB did not helped in gaining active & engaged contributors..
[17:33] <flexiondotorg> Something we can't do on the wiki because spamming means only members can contribute to the wiki.
[17:33] <elacheche> It can be just the situation in my loco.. Can't talk for others :/
[17:33] <elopio> we have another opportunity to improve things with the upcoming loco election :)
[17:33] <elopio> lots of new beginnings these days, I'm happy to be part of this.
[17:33] <flexiondotorg> So the wiki is exclusive.
[17:34] <flexiondotorg> elopio: Indeed :-)
[17:34] <elacheche> It'll be great to re-plan how LoCos are running with the new LC :)
[17:34] <flexiondotorg> elacheche: Also agree about Facebook. The least useful community reasource for Ubuntu MATE.
[17:34] <flexiondotorg> Any of you standing for the LC?
[17:35] <elacheche> The most engaged community is what we have on the ML + IRC and events..
[17:35] <wxl> the thing that i have experienced is that some communities (these are usually not in the English speaking world) seem to find Facebook the best way to community build
[17:35] <wxl> i don't LIKE facebook, but i understand their point
[17:35] <wxl> i think it's hard for us to dictate the tools a community must use when we don't really know what their situation is like
[17:35] <flexiondotorg> Agree.
[17:36] <elacheche> flexiondotorg: It think it will be bad to be in CC, UMB and applying for the LC.. wxl is a special case as he already was part of the LC :p
[17:36] <wxl> that's why LCs are so valuable. they understand what the local community is
[17:36] <wxl> i'd honestly like to leave the LC. my hope is enough people step up.
[17:36] <flexiondotorg> My understanding the intended role of LC is to help LoCo's grow and "do cool stuff".
[17:37] <wxl> yeah
[17:37] <wxl> kind of
[17:37] <wxl> in reality, the work is more administrative
[17:37] <elacheche> wxl: You're not moving until there is enough people in there dude x)
[17:37] <flexiondotorg> Yeah, I hear it has become that. But that wasn't the intention.
[17:37] <wxl> this is why we as the CC are apparently tasked with recreating the vision for the LC :(
[17:38] <ahoneybun> damn this meeting is long already lol
[17:38] <wxl> i mean the way it's set up, both the LC and the UMB have no real decision making power in terms of new directions
[17:38] <elopio> so, I propose that as a first task related to LC, we encourage people to propose for the election
[17:38] <wxl> YES @elopio !!!!
[17:38] <flexiondotorg> elopio: Yes!
[17:38] <elopio> once they are elected, work with them on defining communication channels and tasks
[17:38] <elacheche> Yes!
[17:39] <wxl> i mean this is the second call
[17:39] <elacheche> elopio: s/people/Ubuntu Memebers/
[17:39] <wxl> that's not good
[17:40] <wxl> i know there's a degree of distrust or dismay surrounding LoCos in general, too. there was a time where it seemed the LC was an impediment to the groth of LoCos (before my time). that's a problem we need to solve
[17:41] <wxl> we need to "advertise" the purpose of the LCs and what their value is and i think most importantly provide examples of good work done
[17:41] <elopio> let's talk with the members we know. Let's convince them that anything that they hate about locos now can be changed during the next two years, and that we need them in the council to help.
[17:41] <wxl> yeah i think that's a great idea
[17:41] <flexiondotorg> Agree.
[17:42] <elacheche> +1
[17:42] <flexiondotorg> I'm taking some basic notes here.
[17:42] <elopio> ok. next topic? Everybody have already proposed their topics for today?
[17:42] <ahoneybun> the main issue I see is when LoCo's only have one member in charge of everything
[17:42] <flexiondotorg> Which leads me to realisation we need to share actions etc from todays meeting.
[17:43] <flexiondotorg> So how do we want to share our discussions with each other and the community?
[17:43] <flexiondotorg> I'd like to bootstrap using the Community Hub. Thoughts?
[17:44] <wxl> by as many ways as possible
[17:44] <elopio> flexiondotorg: I think it would be good for the next meeting to make a call for topics, maybe on monday, on the hub.
[17:44] <elacheche> With each others, the ML, with the community → ML, twitter, fb, irc, etc..
[17:44] <wxl> i think the reality is that everyone seems to connect in a different way
[17:44] <flexiondotorg> elopio: I was thinking exactly that.
[17:44] <elopio> and after the meeting, paste the log and a summary in the hub. I can translate it to spanish :)
[17:44] <ahoneybun> I think posts on the community hub and blogs on planet would be good
[17:44] <wxl> it should be on the hub, it should go to every community mailing list there is, it should be in the news, it should go on all social media
[17:45] <flexiondotorg> We should have "once version of the truth". And link to that via the ML and social networks IMO.
[17:45] <elopio> ahoneybun: I have been thinking that to reset things, it would be good to join locos in wider regions. Like one for central and south america. And when they grow, split them again.
[17:45] <flexiondotorg> Have the discussion happen in a place anyone can participate easily.
[17:45] <wxl> maybe even working to get news outlets to pick it up might be good. this is a new vision we're forming and i think it's important to make it clear to EVERYONE that they're invited to participate
[17:45] <ahoneybun> yea joining is always good for larger areas
[17:45] <elopio> popey: do you have a plan for multilanguage in the hub?
[17:46] <wxl> or maybe not even that they're invited. that we need them!!!
[17:46] <flexiondotorg> wxl I agree with trying to raise the profile of this effort in news sites etc.
[17:46] <elopio> wxl: I like that! Let's make more noise.
[17:47] <wxl> does anyone have good connections out there?
[17:47] <flexiondotorg> Me
[17:47] <wxl> then you have an action item :)
[17:47] <flexiondotorg> Just noted it :-)
[17:47] <elopio> Martin is friends with everybody. Literally, every single person.
[17:48] <flexiondotorg> Well, not quite everyone.
[17:48] <flexiondotorg> Next year maybe ;-)
[17:48] <flexiondotorg> What social accounts should we be using to spread the word?
[17:48] <popey> No plans for multi language yet, but could certainly have separate categories for loco or language specific things.
[17:48] <wxl> twitter, facebook, g+
[17:48] <popey> That would be awesome
[17:48] <wxl> i don't know what else we have
[17:48] <wxl> mastodon?
[17:48] <wxl> who's in charge of those things anyways?
[17:49] <popey> MySpace?
[17:49] <flexiondotorg> wxl You mean the Ubuntu social accounts right?
[17:49] <wxl> flexiondotorg: yes
[17:49] <flexiondotorg> popey: Back in your box! ;-)
[17:49] <flexiondotorg> OK
[17:50] <flexiondotorg> wxl: I can ge the message out via those.
[17:50] <ahoneybun> mastondon?
[17:50] <ahoneybun> what about that too lol
[17:50] <wxl> let's also work with other flavors and key people to make sure they spread the message too
[17:50] <flexiondotorg> We did ask about this for something else.
[17:50] <flexiondotorg> wxl: Good point.
[17:51] <flexiondotorg> ahoneybun: Mastadon is not what it was. Unless you speak Japanses.
[17:51] <wxl> what about putting something on the download page? too dramatic?
[17:51] <elopio> hey, what about inviting flavors to the next meeting? It would be good to hear what they need.
[17:51] <wxl> flexiondotorg: you're referring to the global feed, of course
[17:51] <ahoneybun> well you have Lubuntu and Kubuntu here lol
[17:51] <wxl> and MATE!
[17:51] <flexiondotorg> elopio: That was something I wanted to discuss.
[17:52] <flexiondotorg> I was invited to a CC meeting ages ago for Ubuntu MATE.
[17:52] <wxl> i believe that's also one of the cards we have to deal with
[17:52] <flexiondotorg> I think we should reach out to the flavours.
[17:52] <flexiondotorg> But I also think we should have a scope for meeting with them.
[17:52] <flexiondotorg> What do we want to know. What value are we going to add?
[17:53] <wxl> yeah in the past they've been just simple check ins
[17:53] <elopio> maybe not next week then. We still need to figure out too many random topics.
[17:53] <flexiondotorg> I feel that is "busy work".
[17:53] <wxl> yup
[17:53] <flexiondotorg> I think we can hold off catching up with falvour for the future.
[17:54] <elopio> sounds good.
[17:54] <flexiondotorg> When we've figured out what the value of those meetins would be.
[17:54] <ahoneybun> +1
[17:54] <wxl> agreed
[17:55] <flexiondotorg> Is anyone objected to using the Ubuntu Community Hub to organise our activities and report on our meetings?
[17:55] <wxl> no
[17:55] <flexiondotorg> Because I am motivated to move our focus there. Not least because we can track social engagement there.
[17:56] <flexiondotorg> Having used Discourse in Ubuntu MATE for years I see a whole lot of potential in the Community Hub.
[17:56] <flexiondotorg> And I also feel we should be leading from the front.
[17:56] <flexiondotorg> ahoneybun: elacheche You thoughts on that?
[17:56] <elopio> no objection, big +100
[17:57] <flexiondotorg> As we only have a few mins, one last topic.
[17:57] <flexiondotorg> Repeating Calendar invite to this meeting?
[17:58] <elopio> this time and day works for me.
[17:58] <flexiondotorg> Good.
[17:58] <ahoneybun> +1 flexiondotorg  I've not looked at the hub yet but it looks nice
[17:58] <ahoneybun> same here
[17:58] <flexiondotorg> OK.
[17:59] <wxl> i forgot what i wanted to ask XD so i guess i'm good for now
[17:59] <flexiondotorg> So I will talk to popey and find out how we can make a new home for the CC on the Community Hub.
[17:59] <flexiondotorg> wxl Go!
[17:59] <flexiondotorg> :-)
[17:59] <wxl> but yeah this time is good
[17:59] <flexiondotorg> Can all CC members sign up on the Community Hub please.
[18:00] <wxl> yeah i'll get that done today
[18:00] <flexiondotorg> Cheers.
[18:00] <wxl> it's been sitting in my browser to remind me to play with it anyways
[18:00] <elopio> so, before you leave, we have two events that will be great to diversify our community: hacktoberfest and google code-in. We are organizing that in the hub, so just give it a look and help in any way you can.
[18:00] <flexiondotorg> We can use it to tag one another.
[18:00] <flexiondotorg> elopio: Good point!
[18:00] <elopio> thanks everybody. I can collect the log and paste it in the hub.
[18:00] <elopio> who wants to make a summary?
[18:00] <flexiondotorg> I will write up a summary.
[18:01] <ahoneybun> I'm on the Hub
[18:01] <elopio> <3
[18:01] <flexiondotorg> I'll post it on the Hub and share via the MLs and socials.
[18:01] <flexiondotorg> Once we have a suitable category on the Hub.
[18:01] <elopio> oh, the bot collects the log, right?
[18:01] <elopio> I will just translate it.
[18:01] <flexiondotorg> Yep. I'll stop the bot in a sec.
[18:02] <flexiondotorg> Any last questions?
[18:02] <ahoneybun> that's it for me
[18:02] <flexiondotorg> 5...
[18:02] <flexiondotorg> 4...
[18:02] <flexiondotorg> 3...
[18:03] <flexiondotorg> 2...
[18:03] <flexiondotorg> 1...
[18:03] <flexiondotorg> OK, all done. See you on the COmmuntiy Hub :-)
[18:03] <elopio> 👏
[18:03] <flexiondotorg> #stopmeeting
[18:03] <wxl> thanks everyone
[18:04] <ahoneybun> thanks folks!
[18:04] <flexiondotorg> #endmeeting
[18:04] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Oct  5 18:04:32 2017 UTC.
[18:04] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2017/ubuntu-meeting.2017-10-05-17.01.moin.txt