[12:53] <mrgoodcat> morning
[12:54] <jrwren> Good Morning!
[12:56] <rick_h> morn
[12:58] <_stink_> hello
[13:59] <cmaloney> Good morning
[16:00] <Scary_Guy> good.... noon
[19:18] <mrgoodcat> lol my coworker on the google clips: https://dsc.cloud/dyladan/Screen-Shot-2017-10-13-at-3.19.42-PM.png
[19:19] <jrwren> its rediculous that people are impressed that these things can be done on device.
[19:19] <jrwren> the compute power on phones is what? 10-20X what was considered a supercomputer 15-20yrs ago, which was capable of doing it then.
[19:20] <jrwren> The only limiting factor has been the providers.  apple and google wanting us captive and online.
[19:20] <mrgoodcat> a supercomputer 20 years ago was deciding in real time when to take photos?
[19:20] <jrwren> no.
[19:20] <mrgoodcat> and also stitching HDR together
[19:20] <mrgoodcat> and also doing EIS
[19:20] <jrwren> a desktop EASILY could.
[19:20] <jrwren> no idea wtf you are talking about now.
[19:20] <jrwren> i'm just gonna assume you are buying into thier nonsense.
[19:20] <mrgoodcat> that is what the camera is doing
[19:21] <jrwren> smh
[19:21] <mrgoodcat> go ahead and shake
[19:21] <mrgoodcat> if its so easy you should undercut them with a competing device
[19:21] <jrwren> like a poloroid picture over here.
[19:21] <jrwren> are you serious?
[19:21] <mrgoodcat> no
[19:22] <mrgoodcat> obviously
[19:22] <jrwren> Do you honestly believe the technical solution is the hard part?
[19:23] <mrgoodcat> the processing power? no. tuning the model training? maybe. the data gathering? definitely.
[19:24] <cmaloney> I think what jrwren is saying is that Google / Amazon aren't sending their corpus of data to the devices so folks can reverse-engineer what's going on
[19:25] <cmaloney> and the signals and what-not are getting sent to Google / Amazon so they can process them off-site and tune their algorithms
[19:27] <cmaloney> What's really interesting about these though is having that sort of compute ina tiny package running on batteries
[19:27] <cmaloney> That's the part that I'm finding interesting
[19:27] <mrgoodcat> i think what jrwren is saying is that the product is unimpressive because the theory behind it is well understood
[19:27] <cmaloney> though again, this is the sort of thing that is the ARM chip's strength
[19:27] <cmaloney> Not at all
[19:27] <jrwren> the product is impressive.
[19:27] <mrgoodcat> jrwren | its rediculous that people are impressed that these things can be done on device.
[19:28] <jrwren> I'm saying, its late, for artificial reasons and I'm disappointed by our duopoly of apple and google in providing us with things which function offline.
[19:28] <cmaloney> jrwren: Add Amazon to that list as well
[19:28] <mrgoodcat> ah
[19:28] <cmaloney> with Alexa / Echo / Dot
[19:28] <jrwren> amazon doesn't make phones.
[19:28] <mrgoodcat> this isn't a phone
[19:28] <jrwren> but i'll accept adding them to the list of jerks.
[19:28] <cmaloney> \o/
[19:28] <jrwren> wtf do you mean it isn't a phone?
[19:29] <cmaloney> Yeah, this is the camera
[19:29] <mrgoodcat> its a camera
[19:29] <jrwren> k, we've been talking about 2 diff things for the last 10min.
[19:29] <jrwren> nevermind.
[19:29] <cmaloney> It's the one that doesn't have a button on it for taking photos
[19:29] <cmaloney> it just finds something "interesting" and takes a snapshot
[19:29] <mrgoodcat> you just place it in the room and it takes photos when what it can see is deemed interesting
[19:30] <cmaloney> So in our house it would never take a photo
[19:30] <mrgoodcat> its all done on device which i presume is to appease privacy advocates
[19:30] <mrgoodcat> it may also be a performance win though
[19:30] <cmaloney> while in some houses it would never stop taking photos
[19:31] <cmaloney> It could also be a combo of sending what it thinks to the mothership and the mothership determining which ones are kept
[19:31] <cmaloney> eg: two-factor verification of interestingness
[19:31] <cmaloney> Camera: "I think this is interesting" Google: It's a picture of a toilet brush you idjit
[19:32] <mrgoodcat> they went out of their way to make it seem like it wasn't sending any photos up to the internet
[19:32] <cmaloney> Camera: "Is this interesting?" Google: "I didn't know you could do that with a toilet brush".
[19:32] <cmaloney> mrgoodcat: How are the results displayed?
[19:32] <cmaloney> I think that's a bit rubbish
[19:33] <cmaloney> Might be that you have to opt-in to send them data
[19:33] <cmaloney> but I doubt Google is just letting these things sit unattended
[19:33] <cmaloney> from a developer perspective I'd like to see how they're performing in the field
[19:34] <cmaloney> and from a Google perspective I'm sure they're interested in the human behavior that would lead you to think that toilet brush goes there.,
[19:35] <mrgoodcat> cmaloney: i watched the keynote and it definitely seemed like it didn't depend on the network
[19:35] <jrwren> so... I happend to work on something that does similar things :p
[19:35] <jrwren> Vivint Ping Camera
[19:35] <mrgoodcat> I assume most people that buy these are also google photos users though
[19:35] <mrgoodcat> and will promptly upload all snaps
[19:36] <mrgoodcat> good or bad
[19:36] <jrwren> Still, for all of my argument, it may as well be a phone ;)
[19:36] <mrgoodcat> which are tagged with the camera name
[19:36] <cmaloney> jrwren: If you want to get _technical_ :-]
[19:36] <jrwren> cmaloney: but why do that in a channel named #ubuntu.... :)
[19:37] <mrgoodcat> i must be tired
[19:37] <mrgoodcat> just had the overpowering urge to respond with "BURN!"
[19:38] <cmaloney> jrwren: I wouldn't put the words Ubuntu and Phone together inan Ubuntu channel. ;)
[19:38] <jrwren> bwahahahaha
[19:38] <jrwren> RIP
[19:39] <cmaloney> Never underestimate how completely fucked USA telecom is
[19:39] <jrwren> s/usa//
[19:39] <cmaloney> Yeah
[19:39] <jrwren> hahaha and s/telecom/
[19:39] <jrwren> "Never underestimate how completely fucked"
[19:40] <cmaloney> and unless you have bags of cash to say "please shut up about telecom regulations and just take our money and leave us alone" it never happns
[19:41] <cmaloney> I'm sure that's the whole reason AT&T accepted the iPhone. That and Steve Jobs wasn't about to let someone dork with it.
[19:41] <cmaloney> something something tonerheads
[19:44] <jrwren> well, remember back then ATT wireless was kind of shit. they were a LONG distance from VZ. Now they are kind of closer and a large part of that is because if iphone.
[19:45] <jrwren> I'm sure you are right. $$ was involved, but only $$ not $$$ because apple didn't have it before the iphone.
[19:46] <cmaloney> AT&T didn't have $$ either
[19:46] <cmaloney> I'm sure they were desperate
[19:47] <jrwren> right.
[19:48] <jrwren> interesting how that works when no one has the $ to be a total jerk.
[19:49] <mrgoodcat> can you imagine what phones would be like today if jobs had rolled over to telecoms about software "enhancements"?
[19:49] <mrgoodcat> even android is somewhat tempered by the example of the iphone
[19:51] <jrwren> ugh. it would be worse for sure.
[19:52] <jrwren> and yet, I feel like it could be so much better.
[19:56] <mrgoodcat> i mean theres always the possibility that if iphone was never released and android was more successful that more manufacturers would have forked android and built their own ecosystems and we'd have less lock in
[19:56] <mrgoodcat> but that is a remote possibility i think
[19:57] <mrgoodcat> but the iphone crushed the market so completely in terms of revenue that only a very small handful of manufacturers can make profitable phones anymore
[19:57] <jrwren> amazon's failure of firephone shows how difficult it is to fork android and build own ecosystem.
[19:58] <mrgoodcat> but more companies might have tried
[19:58] <jrwren> you are dead on right when you say, "in terms of revenue" because android seems to be a race to the bottom.
[19:58] <mrgoodcat> amazon is the only company that has credibly attempted
[19:58] <jrwren> yup
[19:58] <jrwren> well, samsung.
[19:58] <mrgoodcat> with tizen?
[19:58] <jrwren> didn't all of samsung, lg, htc have some which weren't google play tied?
[19:58] <mrgoodcat> i didnt think that was a fork
[19:59] <jrwren> no, tizen is their own thing. Its my one hope for a 3rd :)
[19:59] <mrgoodcat> gl with that
[19:59] <mrgoodcat> my hope for a third is for a company to release something that doesn't look anything like what current phones look like and to be obviously better
[19:59] <mrgoodcat> the way the iphone was obviously better
[20:01] <jrwren> that is a new 1st :)
[20:07] <jrwren> http://osgameclones.com/  cool list