[01:42] <tgBot> tryexceptpass was added by: tryexceptpass
 Mr. Anderson...
 Welcome!
 Also, I love your username, @tryexceptpass. A true `F it.` moment.
 Thank you 😬
 @tryexceptpass, Hello @tryexceptpass and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 Ubuntu touch can install in another phone sir like Chinese phone ( Xioami ) ? Real Rom not virtual .. ?  … Thanks before
 who do I talk to regarding support for the click system? not any particular click app, but rather the click framework itself
[06:59] <tgBot> chihchun was added by: chihchun
 @KrisJacewicz I think it was in xenial canonical ended support of click in favour of snap. So it's not currently maintained. What are you wanting to know anyway? someone here might be able to help
 I wish sometimes we would have the same energy ON TOPIC:
 (Photo, 258x69) https://irc.ubports.com/5vrB0w5y/file_2622.jpg
 Flo I'm sorry that's my fault
 I take all the responsibility for that
 @DanChapman, actually you actually know about my problem, we spoke, that the click will not install xmir app properly, because when it creats launcher for your app, it will not copy XMir flags over from your app's .desktop file
 @vanyasem, Did not take a look, what is it all about? =)
 @DanChapman, do you know if  snap will be able to handle that properly at least?
 @Flohack, about me creating an off-topic chat ? :P
 that gets all the attention
 instead of the main one
 Time to leave it 😆
 @wayneoutthere Congratz for the last podcast, love it. Thank you sir as usual. Great work.
 16.04 OTA-4 … No due date Last updated about 8 hours ago
 Why I can't paste anything?
 The past button doesn't work?
 no it doesnt
 It works but not in Telegram 😆
 I'm trying to paste a URL in podbird but nothing
 @Flohack , Hi, I would like to ask pls, trying to reply to new persons that are joining SG it also does not work, for us Welcomers is important, is there possibility Flo to fix that soon pls?
 @milkor73, What do you mean with it does not work?
 @Flohack, Hello Flo and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 @Flohack, I can reply you now, but not new commer
 You mean until he wrote smth
 because there is no message bubble right?
 @chihchun, Test
 @chihchun, Hello Rex and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 From Android. So not a real test
 @Flohack, Yes
 Please file a ticket for this ^^
 OK
 Hello, can I ask questions about porting UT to new device in this chat?
 @fekz115, A little. Please be patient and don't take up too much space 😀 For detailed stuff, Halium group is more appropriate but that group is more for people who are already making a lot of progress
 hey guys, I've been asked many times or the question has been asked in general: SSH. … I've promised some time ago I would cover this, and now I have. … @Flohack I relicensed ssh-pull-id to MIT, so I think it is super permissive now, would you consider including it in UT? The rationale (if you don't rememebr sine lot of discussion happens here) is also explained in the post in the chapter "SSH on Ubuntu Touch" (can jumpt directly form the t
[10:45] <tgBot> content), subsection called "deploy its public key to the UT device". … the post: kriscode.blogspot.tw/2017/12/ssh-and-ubuntu-touch.html
 I just biginner in ut, and now I download sources. Tell me is there some soft in ut like logcat in android? If no, how to debug it?
 @KrisJacewicz, "Sorry, the page you were looking for in this blog does not exist."
 @Lorxu, pls let me know which link, and I'll fix right now
 @KrisJacewicz, The one in your Telegram message, at the bottom
 works now
 I forgot to hit "Publish: button :P
 Yup, can confirm
 thank you!
 @fekz115, I wish you success but porting is quite honestly not a task for a beginner, especially if you have no experience of UT. Forget everything you know about desktop distros, modified Android (Lineage). This is a hundred times more complicated. For now, install and learn about UT, until you are 'advanced'
 Tought i'd share some of  the changes i made to Camera app photo roll UI :  https://youtu.be/-nAW3sgY8EI
 (Still under work...)
 @Eranuzan, +1
 @Eranuzan how do you screen cast your device ? , like this ?: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ScreenRecording
[11:08] <artnay> hi all. I have the original ubuntu phone (bq E4.5) and UBports which I installed in June. the device tells me it's running "Ubuntu 15.04 (r1)" and device image is 20170512-1010. I can't find any OTA updates and http://cdimage.ubports.com/devices/ has recovery-krilling.img dated in May.
 @lduboeuf  Exactly :)
[11:09] <artnay> are there any updates available? if yes, how do I obtain those? I'd like to know if krack has been fixed
 There is quite Long OTA 2, soon will arrive OTA 3
 I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 Try here pls, I did not modify the welcome message, sorry
[11:54] <tgBot> Sqmplr was added by: Sqmplr
 @KrisJacewicz, Please make a ticket on the tracker for that, so that we can disucss this in a broader way ;)
 @Flohack, sure
 Hello @Sqmplr ! … Welcome in the Ubports Supergroup!  … I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :D
 (Photo, 240x153) https://irc.ubports.com/cafwPfjF/file_2630.jpg
 @malditobastardo, Thanks, feedback appreciated.
 hype Alert! Telegram will try to send 1st messages to our server ^^
 @Flohack, \o/
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/nGS21Uu0/file_2631
 @Eranuzan, wha??  is that an old-school date stamp on there?  Nice!  this seems like 'news' to me?  Or 'hint of news' ;)
 @lduboeuf, what would it take to turn this into an app?
 @Flohack, i know that this isn't the point of make our push server but... will it solve in the future our problems with notifications?
 Lets see, at least it will be easier to debug, for example if your device is not registering I can take a look on the server to confirm that. We cant do that now
 👍 understood! thanks Florian
 @Flohack, this seems like 'news' ... let me know if anything successfull happens and then submit it to the news desk please :)
 Also I plan to introduce metrics to better see any bottlenekcs there like message/minute etc
 @wayneoutthere, Of course Sire
 @wayneoutthere, humm, no idea, we should ask to real UT devs :)
[12:54] <tgBot> 「 B O I 」 was added by: 「 B O I 」
 Hello 「 B O I 」 and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 Also, you might be repelled by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @ubports_news
 @Eranuzan, Nice!
[13:12] <tgBot> Pascal92 was added by: Pascal92
 Hello @Pascal92 and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 Also, you might be repelled by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @ubports_news
 @KrisJacewicz, No. It is handled differently, but still a bit messy. And the work to handle snaps under unity8 was never finished. But whether your app uses X11 or Mir depends on which interfaces the snap is connected to
 hmm. would be nice if those "welcoming new users" messages were private messages. seems like something appropriate for a bot too
 We've tried both, this works best
 And Telegram rules say you shouldn't PM people without express consent
 @dohbee, I think the point was also to keep these messages human on purpose
 Human touch
 Behold the first notification via ubports push ^^ its real!
 (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/Q5s05fPa/file_2642.jpg
 😁
 Now its  stuck, nothing coming ^^
[13:39] <tgBot> onajjar was added by: onajjar
 Hello everyone, thanks for the nice efforts here , I’ve got a nextbit Robin ,  can I install Ubuntu touch on it instead of android ?
 @Flohack, Yep stopped for me as well 🙈
 Hello @onajjar and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 @peternerlich, Thank You so much
 I’ll read it and find out
 @Flohack, Uuuuooooouuuuuhhhhhh
 @onajjar, you can basically find the answer at th bottom of https://ubports.com/page/devices
 @peternerlich, Thanks a lot !
 @peternerlich, yes, we are real people sending real welcome messages.
 @wayneoutthere, Nice try Markov chain bot
 `w e   a r e   n o t   a u t o m a t e d   i n   a n y   w a y`
 Y U THINK BOT?
 `bow before us human`
 I THINK NOT
 Great news! The Millennial Member Audiocast has now been launched!  Get the link and info here on the news channel: … https://t.me/ubports_news
 @Flohack, This is a very important milestone: congratulations!
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/Bf0FI85c/file_2647.mp4
 @Flohack, Yeah!!!
 @Flohack, that's nice !!!!!!
 Ok so let me do this public ANNOUNCEMENT: With OTA-3 we will switch push notification, right before end of year. There will be a dead period after OTA-3 is out and Telegram switched services. Until you update your device you wont receive any notifications. Now comes the more important part: DEVEL and RC images will get the switch sooner, and therefore will have a longer dead period. I try to keep it as small as possible, but it will be 3 or 4 days p
 It require ubuntu on login? Or we can remove it from the account manager?
 @Gabigol, It will still require it, since the push client uses it as a precondition. Its only a server change
 @Flohack sorry I went hush for a couple of days. I also must admit ignorance to how security is handled across different web browsers. I know that in desktop Ubuntu, Firefox has individual security patches, as does it's upgrades etc. But the default Vivid repo just has one version of Firefox and all the other programs/packages I think. So I assumed that security-dependent programs like web browsers would have some level of independent security layers
[14:41] <tgBot> maintained by Canonical and now, Ubports. I guess not. Not too much of a problem though because it's the narcoleptic offspring of an inbred snail and a tortoise with broken legs. So slow as to be unusable, and it seems even more so on Ubports OTAs! Hopefully the move to 16.04 will fix both
 the security and the speed, like The Flash from Justice League :)
 *and none of the packages seem to be maintained, being from a two and a half year old/extinct version of Ubuntu
 @Flohack, Wooooo
 @Seumas, "it's the narcoleptic offspring of an inbred snail and a tortoise with broken legs" Awesome line... I'm going to steal that one! LOL
 @Seumas, Well without going to omuch into details, but bear in mind the UBports is a "Distro-Follower", similar to a flavour of Ubuntu. We dont have time and resources to provide or own packages, specifically crafted with more spirit than upstream Ubuntu. If there is anyone volunteering to be a browser maintainer, be my guest. Besides that, oxide engine plus Chromium base will get updates, but we had broken all BQ devices last time we tried. Its all
[14:49] <tgBot> so easy for us. :) - Firefox is not phone-specific, nor is it a core App
 updating oxide is a massive pain to do
 it's basically a full time job in itself
 i think the UN classifies it as torture and a crime against humanity
 Guys, it is possible to install ubports without ubports installer?
 Time has come for Ubuntu Touch users to being able to launch HTOP in their Terminals!😁😁 … https://open.uappexplorer.com/app/htop.emanuelesorce
 @Mattia, You can try magic-device-tool as alternative installer
 @Mattia, With commandline tool ubuntu-device-flash for example
 In a windows pc
 @dohbee, i see, well I will wait untill snap lands on my UT then try to figure out what can be hacked around. It would be nice to fix clicks but I dont know where to ask for help.
 @Mattia, you can google cdk installer
 no not cdk what was the name CPT installer ^^
 @TronFortyTwo, High Five!  That is pretty sweet.  Thanks!
 🙏
 (Photo, 1920x1080) https://irc.ubports.com/9e5wYO0o/file_2653.jpg
 YAY!
 @TronFortyTwo, Just now when we added htop to the rootfs 😆
 @Crash_Burn, You have it running with full greeter?
 Or...
 @Flohack, oh😶
 ohhhhhh
 I see
 @Flohack, Anyway, it's a test, I can package other tools too
 sure!
 I accept suggestions 😂
 @TronFortyTwo, ☕️ I send you a virtual coffee :)
 First thing I launch on bootup... is `nmon` ... I love it for watching system activity as well as network activity.  Is that a good candidate?
 (Photo, 1280x719) https://irc.ubports.com/bUctcyaD/file_2655.jpg
 sure, I'll do it
 cool... I have it in a libertine conatiner on the M10 but didn't set it up on the N5.  This would be awesome =)
 I smell progress....
 @Flohack, But there isn't Nexus 4
 @Mattia, Hmmmm I take a look when I am home
 @Flohack, Thanks
 And i can't use ubports because It can't find phone
 @Mattia, Did you check udev rules?
 No... How?
 (Photo, 800x460) https://irc.ubports.com/xjoWrnQv/file_2657.jpg
 (Photo, 635x476) https://irc.ubports.com/nhAeQVlR/file_2659.jpg
 (Photo, 542x500) https://irc.ubports.com/ar7lKUQO/file_2660.jpg
 @Mattia, See Github of the ubports installer, I added instructions on the README.md file
 But i have got Windows, bot Linux
 Udev is in Linux
 @Mattia, I thought you mean you did not find it in Linux ^^ sry
 @KrisJacewicz, https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-app-launch/blob/xenial-7.1-caf-sudoku/desktop-hook.c
 A news item about the App Poll Results has just been dropped in the UBports News Channel.  To learn more about this news be sure to subscribe to the News Channel here: https://t.me/ubports_news
 [english] … We're sorry.  There may have been a video embed problem in the Millennial Member Audiocast link.  It has now been corrected if you refresh the link:  … https://ubports.com/blog/the-audiocasts-3/post/ubports-millennial-member-audiocast-mma-103 … Sorry for any inconvenience and enjoy the show.
[17:33] <tgBot> dcavedon was added by: dcavedon
 @dcavedon, Wooo! Hi Dario!
 Hello @dcavedon and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 @KrisJacewicz actually, reading this code again, it should keep the X-Ubuntu-XMir-Enable key if the .desktop in the click package has it
 @KrisJacewicz If this is breaking for you, can you pastebin the before and after (one created in ~/.local/share/applications), for your app?
 (Photo, 1280x1024) https://irc.ubports.com/WwBRIJoH/file_2663.jpg help me... i restart to bootloader, but this...
[18:03] <tgBot> Antonio Pardo was added by: Antonio Pardo
 @lduboeuf is your PR in-progress?
 humm i added another doc, but did not PR yet
 Hello Antonio and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 @UniversalSuperBox should i PR all at once ?
 ok sorry, all is fine now
 (if i made no mistake of course :) )
 @Flohack, Wauuuuuu
 @lduboeuf, It's fine. I just kept seeing commits.
 Everything you push to master goes into the PR
 I wanted to make sure before doing a review
 @vanyasem, you can?
 👍
 @dohbee, I don't know if it is a realistic alternative but I see that Vivaldi are releasing ARM builds: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/12/vivaldi-browser-arm-raspberry-pi
 Probably not really.
 and Vivaldi is also a fork of Chromium these days anyway, right?
 if ubports is moving to qt 5.9, it'd probably be better to port webbrowser-app over to QtWebEngine instead
 @Crash_Burn, What is this right? App name?
 Its not htop
 @dohbee, Some people think that QtWebEngine is dead slow ;) - never tried myself
 @Flohack, I don't know. It's new in 5.9 though, and is meant to replace the older qtwebkit afaik
 We should give it a try, yes. Whats the underlying engine there
 @dohbee, Fork of old opera, without-chromium opera
 @Flohack, not sure. i don't know much about it myself. just saw it suggested to the yunit person instead of trying to bother with oxide on gcc 7 and qt 5.9 and upgrading it to newer chromium
 @archi_dagac, oh. but it's just a browser, and not open source, afaict?
 I dont know how source
 https://vivaldi.com/source/?lang=en_US and pretty sure it is based on chromium
 it's not something that ubports can distribute, nor something that could be embedded in other apps
 I don't think it was to begin with though
 oh hmm
 no git?
 so weird
 Nope only forks that folks have extracted to github etc
 @dohbee, indeed
 well let's see what's in this massive tarball
 720 MB is freaking huge for a source tree
 and that's compressed
 @Flohack, Chromium, just like Oxide. I recall Marius was already giving it a try, but got some error with building iirc ^^
[19:27] <tgBot> <demokrit atomos> Don't know if this is relevant and don't have time to join this discussion but is maybe qupzilla  (falkon) an option for new browser?
 it's not just about a "browser"
[19:28] <tgBot> <demokrit atomos> Ok sorry xD
 ok vivaldi is based on chromium, indeed
 @demokrit atomos, We have not many choices, since most websites will reject unknown user agent strings and also rely on functions. I think unfortunately Chromium is a must
 and a browser being available on ARM, doesn't mean it works on mir, or well with touch
 yep
 3.7G vivaldi-source
 crikey
 😳
 that's insane
 webbrowser-app doesn't just provide the "browser" in ubuntu. it handles multiple instances and confinement, so each "web app" remains separated; and provides the Ubuntu.Web component for embedding in apps (ie, the online accounts login pages)
 and oxide-qt provides integration between chromium and Qt, and another qml component which the browser bits are built on
 i don't know how well qtwebengine is, but it's gotta be better than maintaining oxide
 apple/google/mozilla/ms have basically made it impossible to build reasonable alternative rendering engines now, though :-/
 how big is the current firefox source tree
 as is understand it ... qtwebengine is pretty outdated !? as is shipped in the release cycles of qt .. and that can be a long time ago
 well it's all in rust now, iiuc
 so probably not as big as it was in c++, depending on how much "third party" junk they keep in-tree
 Would anybody want to watch the API docs build?
 No?
 Well here you go: https://travis-ci.org/ubports/api-docs/builds/312039819
 @delijati, Well, every release of anything is going to be outdated, because it's a release and not git/hg/whatever master.
 Qt 5.9 (which is what we'll likely use) is an LTS btw. They keeps backporting security patches for QtWebEngine/Chromium … e.g. http://code.qt.io/cgit/qt/qtwebengine.git/tree/dist/changes-5.9.2/?h=v5.9.2
 yeah but qt shipped with ubuntu 17.04 is from 13. Dezember 2016 5.7.1 and thats pretty "new"
 There are 5.9 packages, no worries
 @delijati, 17.04 will be end of life next month anyway
 oh webengine is in 5.6 too; and 5.6 is an "lts" release of qt
 anyway, best suggestion so far is to replace oxide with webengine. but i don't know how easy it will be
 I need some volunteers for a small test plz
 @Flohack Depends for what
 Can you, after I tell here, wait 5 secs and then mention me with @Flohack ? I need to see how fast notifications are being processed and if it spawns processes or handles the queue. I need roughly 10-20 ppl ;)
 @Flohack spam time
 AFTER I TELL!
 oh
 I want to create a moment of synchronous actions if possible ^^
 so raise your hands who is ready?
 @Flohack
 @Flohack
 That's not many hands.
 @Flohack
 hmm ^^
 So ok. after I say now! wait 5 secs and then mention me plz ^^
 NOW!
 @Flohack
 @Flohack
 @Flohack
 @Flohack hey! you!
 I think you just need a bot to spam you @Flohack
 lol
 @Flohack
 Florian
 too late this was more than 5 secs lol
 :(
 I tried
 sure it was useful. In some way ;) at least for a nice screenshot
 :D
 @Flo
 @Flohack
 (Photo, 1080x1920) https://irc.ubports.com/Q7htCerA/file_2670.jpg
 @Flohack
 so, it looks like porting webbrowser-app to webengine should be doable, but will be a fair bit of work
 @Ern_st, To late
 Its hard to tell how much message we can handle, but I think it will be at least 200/s :) - for the beginning should be enough
 what is with those icons
[20:23] <tgBot> <Gleb Lee 🇸🇨> @demokrit atomos, Firefox in Libertine container looks like good alternative to official Web Browser. Firefox already can be launched on UT and it's UI can be well tweaked for phone screen (UI elements size can be increased, etc.)
 @dohbee, asking me?
[20:23] <tgBot> <Gleb Lee 🇸🇨> And Firefox do not eat much memory as Chromium do.
 @Flohack, well about the icons in your screenshot, not necessarily if you know the answer
 you mean why they are not showing the supergroup symbol?
 is that what it's supposed to be?
 but more the paper plane icon
 it looks way out of place
 @dohbee, Its telegram symbol, it was always like that ^^
 If you click it, it will open telegram app and the respective conversation
 really? i thought it was supposed to be the app icon
 Not sure where it comes from. Maybe the push helper can register that additionally?
 @Flohack, It's in the desktop file. an x-canonical-* field or something like that
 if you remove that field you get the normal app icon back.
 oh, for some reason the "symbolic" svg doesn't at all match the actual app icon
 @Gleb Lee 🇸🇨, Last time I tried Firefox in libertine I couldn’t enter passwords because the keyboard wouldn’t pop up with password fields.
 Also would libertine/firefox handle all webapps too?
 How about this browser? … https://otter-browser.org/
 hi
 (Photo, 1280x693) https://irc.ubports.com/CjjgPfVn/file_2672.jpg
 Yay!
 🤘
 @YougoChats, nope
 Then that would be only half a solution?
 besides, webengine in qt 5.9 is already a newer version of chromium engine than oxide is, i think
 @YougoChats, less than half probably, as it doesn't really solve any of the problems with oxide
 @samitormanen, also not really a solution. the problem isn't the browser app
 Also, Oxide is being used as module in many QML apps or web apps, so we would still need to find a web engine, even if there's a different browser
 @dohbee, Oh, sorry.
 Or keep oxide + a new browser?
 why does everyone keep talking about a new browser
 because I am not an expert like you? What is the deal then?
 the core issue is maintenance of the oxide layer
 and it can be replaced by qt webengine easily enough, while breaking the fewest number of apps
 and there would be no real reason to keep oxide itself, if the browser was going to be replaced. really, webbrowser-app needs to stay, because it's a core part of what makes ubuntu on a phone mildly useful outside of voice/sms
 drop oxide and use qtwebengine instead?
 sorry I am a noob, I am just trying to understand a bit
 I agree with you
 right, replace oxide inside webbrowser-app with qt webengine seems like the best option
 and don't apologize :)
 asking questions and learning is fine. no need to apologize for it. apologies are for being rude or something. :)
 Thank you. I am learning a lot reading here and I appreciate that a lot.
 me also
 @wayneoutthere Did you tick on your todo nextcloud cal test ?
 @malditobastardo, 👍
 me too
 i think that guys like me miss the big picture of how things work on UT, what are the implications. Finding information is really hard sometimes. So sparse. Would love to see architectures and inter process communication schemas and so on.
 @lduboeuf, me, too. I think that also falls under the topic of documentation which is a huge point made by marius humself near the end of the MMA (→@ubports_news)
 👍