[15:00] o/ [15:00] o/ [15:00] 🙋 [15:01] o/ [15:01] o/ A bit sick, but here [15:01] I suppose we have quorum [15:01] I'd prefer to abstain as ahasenack is on my team. [15:01] #startmeeting DMB [15:01] Meeting started Mon Dec 18 15:01:50 2017 UTC. The chair is sil2100. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. [15:01] Available commands: action commands idea info link nick === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | DMB Meeting | Current topic: [15:02] But I'll +1 to get a quorate vote as needed (I'm already +1 as I endorsed him). [15:02] rbasak: I would say it's not relevant that much, if you have are able to endorse someone as per his experience, I'm fine with counting your vote [15:02] Bias can appear everywhere [15:03] #topic Review of previous action items === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | DMB Meeting | Current topic: Review of previous action items [15:03] handsome_feng's two action items are done, right? [15:04] I think it's all done indeed [15:04] Yes [15:04] #topic Package Set/Per Package Uploader Applications === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | DMB Meeting | Current topic: Package Set/Per Package Uploader Applications [15:04] #subtopic Andreas Hasenack [15:04] hello [15:05] ahasenack: hello o/ Could you please introduce yourself? [15:05] sure [15:05] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AndreasHasenack/UbuntuServerDevApplication <- application [15:05] http://ubuntu-dev.alioth.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu-sponsorships.cgi?render=html&sponsor=&sponsor_search=name&sponsoree=Andreas+Hasenack&sponsoree_search=name <- uploads [15:05] I started working on Ubuntu when I joined Canonical, many years ago (~2008) [15:05] working on landscape as a QA engineer [15:05] this year I switched to the ubuntu-server team [15:06] and as can be seen in my uploads list, they ramped up [15:06] I come from a server background, where I worked mainly with authentication/authorization packages [15:07] and sometimes the email stack [15:07] I think I can contribute to Ubuntu with that work on ubuntu server [15:07] and the server package set seems a good fit [15:08] I think that's it for a short summary [15:08] Ok, thanks - let's move on to questions [15:10] ahasenack: easy one first - if you have a version number like this 1:9.10.3.dfsg.P4-10.1ubuntu5.3, what is the first number before the : and what is it used for? [15:10] it's an epoch [15:10] used to fix mistakes in previous version numbers [15:10] the epoch trumps the version comparison and wins [15:11] Ok [15:11] although I've seen some tricks with the word "really" in package versions [15:12] so it's used sparingly [15:12] because it's really the last resort [15:16] let's say you uploaded a package to bionic last week and it's still only in bionic-proposed now, how would you find out why? [15:16] I go to the excuses page [15:16] wouldn't wait a week, though [15:16] it could be help because its dep8 tests failed, [15:17] or because dep8 tests in dependent packages failed [15:17] there could also be a large queue due to some big migration that is triggering a lot of test runs [15:17] s/help/held/ [15:17] then I check the failed tests, if any, see if they are really failures in the package, or flaky tests [15:17] I can check the history of that test in any architecture [15:18] if I think it's a flaky test, I check if there is a bug about it. If not, I file one [15:18] if it's an infrastructure problem, I ping someone to click the retry button for me, and present my evidence [15:18] I have such a case with samba, which triggers gvfs2 tests and there is one test in particular that is flaky, I filed a bug about it [15:19] and it's on my list to check in more detail and try to fix [15:19] ahasenack: have you ever seen "unsatisfiable Depends" on excuses for a package that does look like it is present in Ubuntu? do you know what that tends to mean? [15:19] I haven't seen that, I would have to look it up [15:19] I suppose it means that a new depends was introduced [15:19] and that is not available in the archive [15:20] if that's the case, it sounds like a silly mistake, [15:20] because we are expected to test-build things before uploading [15:20] ahasenack: somewhat related to jbicha's question - let's say you uploaded a package to bionic, you check the excuses page and see that all tests have passed, no visible errors seen but the package is still marked as 'Not considered' [15:20] maybe it could be because the package is in main and has a depends on universe [15:20] so a ppa test build wouldn't catch that [15:20] ahasenack: how would you investigate further what's wrong? [15:20] Where would you look for clues? [15:21] you say tests have passed [15:21] so a) it built [15:21] b) its own tests passed [15:21] ahasenack: "unsatisfiable depends" is often because a main package depends on something in universe, good work on figuring that out as a possible reason :) [15:21] c) tests in dependent packages passed [15:21] sil2100: those 3 assumptions are correct? [15:22] sil2100: there is usually a hint somewhere [15:22] like it could be blocked due to a release (freeze) [15:22] ahasenack: yeah, let's say all 3 assumptions are correct and there is no freeze [15:22] when we are in that final week [15:22] then migrations are manual [15:22] ok [15:23] I don't know then, barring it having been flagged for manual migration for some reason [15:23] or I didn't refresh the excuses page [15:23] ahasenack: did you have any experience in proposed-migration update_output.txt parsing? [15:23] no, but I remember it being mentioned to me now [15:24] but I haven't had the need to parse it yet [15:24] If not, it's a good thing to note and be mindful of when your package is stuck in -proposed and excuses doesn't give any useful info [15:24] ;) [15:24] I would certainly ask around if I saw that situation [15:24] following up, how do you get a universe package to main? [15:24] through a MIR (Main Inclusion Request) [15:25] have you ever done one of those before? [15:25] no, just followed up on the progress of some done by others [15:25] ok, that's fine [15:25] I'm aware (without looking) of some of its requirements [15:25] secteam review, [15:25] history of cves [15:25] it needs to have an owner [15:25] dependencies must be in main as well [15:25] thanks [15:25] build-depends are a bit more relaxed [15:25] since x I think [15:28] Thanks [15:28] Any other questions? [15:29] not from me :) [15:30] No questions from em. [15:30] me [15:30] rbasak, BenC, micahg: all good? [15:30] Yep [15:30] Let's start the vote then [15:31] #vote Grant ahasenack ubuntu-server-dev upload rights [15:31] Please vote on: Grant ahasenack ubuntu-server-dev upload rights [15:31] Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname) [15:31] +0 abstaining as he's on my team and I endorsed him, and we appear to be quorate without me. [15:31] +0 abstaining as he's on my team and I endorsed him, and we appear to be quorate without me. received from rbasak [15:31] +1 [15:31] +1 received from BenC [15:31] +1 [15:31] +1 received from sil2100 [15:31] +1 [15:31] +1 received from jbicha [15:32] micahg said he might be in and out of the meeting [15:32] So we might need to wait a moment for his vote [15:32] (just hope he didn't go 'out' completely!) [15:33] Do we have enough votes if he doesn’t? [15:33] Not without mine currently. [15:33] Over my time on the DMB I've come up with my own personal rules on how to remain objective. [15:34] For people on my team, I've decided to always abstain (rather than +1) if I've endorsed, with the exception that I'll +1 if we don't get quorum. [15:34] So if micahg is unable to vote, I'll +1. [15:34] If he does vote, I won't vote regardless of which way micahg votes. [15:34] Makes sense [15:35] I guess it might be nice to have such an official policy for votes, since I know I didn't follow anything like this [15:36] I'm fine with not requiring this upon anyone lse. [15:36] else [15:36] Inevitably there will be other exceptional circumstances when any such policy will need to be broken. [15:37] And I trust everyone so am fine with people deciding this kind of thing for themselves. [15:40] Let's wait 5 more minutes and then I guess we'd have to assume we don't have quorum without your vote rbasak [15:40] OK [15:42] * jbicha plays a few minutes of background holiday music while we wait [15:44] ... "girl from impanema" muzak? [15:44] jbicha: you could play chord names through IRC so we have our share [15:45] cpaelzer: that sounds like too much work. Just imagine Bing Crosby's White Christmas or something :) [15:45] +1 breaking abstention in order to reach quorum [15:45] +1 breaking abstention in order to reach quorum received from rbasak [15:48] sil2100: ^ [15:49] what? [15:49] +1 [15:49] +1 received from cyphermox [15:51] sil2100: [15:53] \o/ [15:53] #endvote [15:53] Voting ended on: Grant ahasenack ubuntu-server-dev upload rights [15:53] Votes for:5 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0 [15:53] Motion carried [15:53] ahasenack: congratulations! [15:53] thanks! [15:54] congrats ahasenack [15:54] #topic AOB === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | DMB Meeting | Current topic: AOB [15:54] Any other business? [15:55] I guess next meeting next year, so - happy new year o/ [15:55] happy new year, happy holidays, enjoy the rest [15:55] #endmeeting === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology [15:55] Meeting ended Mon Dec 18 15:55:20 2017 UTC. [15:55] Minutes: http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2017/ubuntu-meeting.2017-12-18-15.01.moin.txt [15:55] I'll handle adding all the permissions and sending the announcements [15:58] Thanks sil2100! === Mister_Q_ is now known as Mister_Q === ogasawara is now known as Guest76312