| cskama | i tried the new slack snap but it doesn't seem to come with a *.desktop file (doesn't show up in launcher or dock). is this normal? | 02:53 |
|---|---|---|
| === croppa_ is now known as croppa | ||
| lotuspsychje | anyone knows whats the xserver-xorg-video-intel update about this morning? | 06:29 |
| lotuspsychje | i have an ati graphics and amd cpu | 06:30 |
| acheronuk | lotuspsychje: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/2:2.99.917+git20171229-1 | 07:54 |
| acheronuk | "New upstream snapshot" | 07:54 |
| gunix | hey guys | 12:21 |
| lotuspsychje | hey gunix | 12:21 |
| gunix | what dekstop environment do you recommand for bioniv beaver? | 12:21 |
| gunix | *bionic beaver ? | 12:21 |
| lotuspsychje | gunix: default ubuntu-desktop is gnome | 12:22 |
| gunix | that was not the question | 12:22 |
| lotuspsychje | !flavors | gunix | 12:22 |
| ubottu | gunix: Recognized Ubuntu flavors build on Ubuntu and provide a different user experience out of the box. They are supported both in #ubuntu and in their flavor channel. For a list, see https://www.ubuntu.com/download/ubuntu-flavours | 12:22 |
| gunix | still not an answer to the question | 12:22 |
| gunix | lol | 12:22 |
| lotuspsychje | gunix: we dont reccomend desktop enviroments, because its the users choice | 12:23 |
| * TJ- recommends the console | 12:23 | |
| gunix | ok, my choise is to know your personal prefferance | 12:23 |
| gunix | ok, don't tell me what you recommend | 12:23 |
| gunix | tell me what you use | 12:23 |
| gunix | :) | 12:23 |
| flocculant | windows | 12:24 |
| lotuspsychje | lol | 12:24 |
| flocculant | morning lotuspsychje :) | 12:24 |
| TJ- | doors | 12:24 |
| lotuspsychje | hey flocculant | 12:24 |
| TJ- | flocculant: I couldn't reproduce your ISO boot failures | 12:24 |
| flocculant | TJ-: I looked when more awake at your link to console | 12:24 |
| flocculant | of course - failing here on hardware | 12:25 |
| gunix | ok, so are you going to recommend me a desktop environment and tell me what you guys like to use, or are you going to refuse to answer to my question? | 12:25 |
| TJ- | flocculant: I added my findings to the bug report | 12:25 |
| flocculant | TJ-: thanks :) | 12:25 |
| lotuspsychje | gunix: im on gnome, as bionic default | 12:25 |
| flocculant | and I use Xubuntu | 12:25 |
| flocculant | TJ-: useful nonetheless | 12:25 |
| TJ- | flocculant: if it fails on hardware but no in VM best to log the dmesg from a working boot at least so we have some idea of what is being dealt with | 12:26 |
| flocculant | TJ-: aah yes sorry - we'd had the 'oh it works on vm's' conversation with infinity in -release | 12:27 |
| gunix | lotuspsychje: i've used gnome the last year and i just tried manjaro kde and it feels very nice, however i am not sure if it's stable enough on the beaver ... and i would also like to try budgie since i never used it | 12:27 |
| lotuspsychje | gunix: im having real stable on gnome bionic already | 12:27 |
| TJ- | flocculant: I'll put it on USB and try it | 12:27 |
| flocculant | TJ-: awesome - ftr - you could grab any 32 bit flavour to try - not just xubuntu | 12:28 |
| gunix | lotuspsychje: i am kind of bored of gnome :( | 12:28 |
| lotuspsychje | acheronuk: but would you know why it installs on my system, package says 'optional' | 12:28 |
| TJ- | flocculant: I use xubuntu mainly | 12:28 |
| lotuspsychje | flocculant: that 32bit issue not solved yet? | 12:29 |
| flocculant | nah - but only found it yesterday and got -release interested last night | 12:30 |
| flocculant | TJ-: \o/ | 12:30 |
| lotuspsychje | gunix: try another flavor? | 12:30 |
| flocculant | valorie tsimonq2 - tried kubuntu/lubuntu at your ends? | 12:32 |
| lotuspsychje | flocculant: can you share whats happening exactly? might search for new bugs perhaps | 12:37 |
| flocculant | lotuspsychje: grab a flavour's 32 bit iso - put it on a usb (or add it as a grub option) boot it - machine reboots | 12:40 |
| flocculant | doesn't happen in vm's that I can see | 12:40 |
| TJ- | flocculant: I can't reproduce on bare hardware | 12:40 |
| flocculant | TJ-: good | 12:41 |
| flocculant | ish | 12:41 |
| TJ- | flocculant: what *exactly* are the symptoms you see? | 12:41 |
| flocculant | perhaps it's just some hardware | 12:41 |
| flocculant | TJ-: start from usb - or grub - it gets to the kbd/human page - starts to boot - then machine restarts | 12:42 |
| TJ- | flocculant: There's a problem with the initial desktop painting but the system boots fine. Desktop takes a while to init | 12:42 |
| TJ- | flocculant: nope, nothing like that | 12:42 |
| flocculant | yea - had that for a while | 12:42 |
| flocculant | TJ-: k | 12:42 |
| flocculant | I've got the -proposed kernel installed for bionic | 12:42 |
| TJ- | flocculant: so you need to provide the exact hardware of your failing system, as I said, attach it's dmesg log to the bug | 12:43 |
| flocculant | well I can add dmesg from this install of course | 12:43 |
| lotuspsychje | flocculant: cant find anything related yet https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+bugs?orderby=-importance&start=0 | 12:44 |
| TJ- | flocculant: you should also be able to capture the failing boot kernel log using netconsole | 12:44 |
| flocculant | TJ-: don't understand how to to do that from usb or grub boot tbh | 12:45 |
| TJ- | I notice the poiner isn't accelerated - moves about 1/8th of the screen with a full wipe across the touchpad | 12:45 |
| TJ- | flocculant: Requires wired Ethernet, but: on another system something like "nc -u -l -p 6666 -s 10.254.1.51 | tee /tmp/bionic-boot-i386.log" (IP address being that of the listening PC) and then on the target interrupt the ISO boot menu and add "netconsole=@10.254.1.99/,@10.254.1.51/" (first IP address is assigned to the booting PC, second address is where to send the console messages (the listening PC) | 12:50 |
| flocculant | TJ-: aah right - so only got 1 machine | 12:52 |
| TJ- | flocculant: is the system using the syslinux or GRUB bootloader? | 12:54 |
| flocculant | TJ-: I can reliably fail the boot from the iso I've got in the grub bootloader | 12:56 |
| acheronuk | lotuspsychje: what flavour are you on? | 12:56 |
| lotuspsychje | acheronuk: gnome | 12:57 |
| lotuspsychje | acheronuk: ubuntu-desktop vanilla | 12:57 |
| TJ- | flocculant: right, but which bootloader is the ISO using!? | 12:57 |
| flocculant | grub | 12:58 |
| TJ- | flocculant: You really need to test it from a USB or DVD/CD boot rather than using a GRUB chainload, to verify the issue is due to the ISO and not due to your intermediate GRUB config | 12:59 |
| TJ- | flocculant: how is it using GRUB? is the system booting with EFI? | 12:59 |
| flocculant | TJ-: I've done both - in fact I did getting on for 10 from usb | 12:59 |
| flocculant | not using efi | 12:59 |
| acheronuk | lotuspsychje: ok. gdm3 recommends xserver-xorg; xserver-xorg recommends xserver-xorg-video-all; xserver-xorg-video-all recommends xserver-xorg-video-intel | 13:00 |
| flocculant | TJ-: F12 to boot menu, choose usb - get a grub menu | 13:00 |
| acheronuk | or some similar chain apt followed | 13:00 |
| TJ- | flocculant: if the ISO shows the GRUB menu it's booting using EFI mode | 13:01 |
| flocculant | TJ-: hang on :) | 13:01 |
| flocculant | ok yea - you're right sorry | 13:03 |
| TJ- | flocculant: The ISOs are hybrid. If starting on a BIOS system they'll use isolinux (syslinux) for a USB mass-storage device, and for an ISO-9660/El Torito native CD boot. If the system boots using EFI mode it uses GRUB | 13:03 |
| TJ- | flocculant: so, all this is important to specify in the bug report to enable others to understand the precise scenario and attempt to reproduce it | 13:04 |
| flocculant | yea - I think at some point I got the grub menu picking the efi option from the machine boot menu | 13:04 |
| TJ- | flocculant: and when in front of the the various ISO boot methods you've got a system-installed (presumably EFI) GRUB bootloader effectively chain-loading an ISO, things become hidiously complicated | 13:05 |
| flocculant | tbh - not that bothered about 32bit not working - I never use it - I just tested the option and it fails | 13:05 |
| flocculant | machine is 64 bit - and secure boot etc is all turned off as far as I remember | 13:06 |
| TJ- | flocculant: Well, if the system is booting using 64-bit EFI into GRUB x86_64 EFI, I'd expect a 32-bit image boot to fail | 13:06 |
| flocculant | TJ-: you thinkg it's failing because the machine is 64 bit? | 13:07 |
| flocculant | and I don't use efi | 13:07 |
| TJ- | flocculant: This is why you need to precisely specify the scenario when reporting issues like this. You're now revealing extremely important information that is significant | 13:08 |
| flocculant | mmm | 13:09 |
| TJ- | I still don't fully understand it, but it sounds like this: EFI-PC > CSM-BIOS > grub-pc > loopback ISO 32-bit [ SKIP ISO's BOOTLOADER ENTIRELY ] > load vmlinuz/initrd directly | 13:12 |
| flocculant | TJ-: but if secure boot etc is all off - isn't it just a 64bit machine booting a 32 bit iso - like I've done hundreds of times in the past | 13:16 |
| flocculant | nothing has changed on this machine for some years | 13:17 |
| flocculant | so I'm even more confused than I was now :D | 13:17 |
| TJ- | flocculant: disabling Secure-Boot doesn't change the boot mode of the PC | 13:18 |
| TJ- | flocculant: is it the PC you're on right now? | 13:19 |
| flocculant | yea | 13:19 |
| TJ- | flocculant: if so, does "ls /sys/firmware/efi/efivars" list files? | 13:20 |
| flocculant | ls: cannot access '/sys/firmware/efi/efivars': No such file or directory | 13:20 |
| TJ- | flocculant: OK, and if you do "ls /boot/grub/" do you see "i386-pc" and/or "x86_64-efi" directories? | 13:21 |
| flocculant | TJ-: nope | 13:22 |
| flocculant | sorry | 13:22 |
| flocculant | i386 in /boot/grub | 13:22 |
| TJ- | flocculant: OK so it's booting in BIOS mode, so you've got EFI-PC > CSM-BIOS > grub-pc | 13:23 |
| TJ- | flocculant: can you attach the system's current dmesg log to the bug and I'll see if I can spot anything to give a clue | 13:24 |
| flocculant | TJ-: if there was one I would - how about a journalctl file | 13:26 |
| TJ- | flocculant: "dmesg > /tmp/dmesg.log" then attach /tmp/dmesg.log | 13:26 |
| flocculant | TJ-: there is no dmesg in /var/log | 13:27 |
| TJ- | flocculant: use the command I just gave you. "dmesg" is a command not a file, it reads the kernel's ring buffer | 13:27 |
| flocculant | TJ-: attached it - expected to see dmesg in /var/log tbh - used to live there | 13:29 |
| TJ- | flocculant: it's directed to /var/log/kern.log now | 13:33 |
| flocculant | aah right | 13:33 |
| TJ- | but other 'stuff' gets put in that file by syslog too | 13:33 |
| flocculant | :) | 13:33 |
| TJ- | so 'dmesg' on it's own gets a 'clean' kernel message log | 13:33 |
| flocculant | thanks for that info :) | 13:34 |
| albert23 | flocculant: do you press any keys when you boot? | 13:36 |
| albert23 | if i don press any key i fall back to my systems grub menu | 13:36 |
| albert23 | if i go via the language slector, i can boot 32 bit xubuntu usb stick just fine | 13:36 |
| TJ- | the thing with 'dmesg' is it reads the kernel's ring-buffer, so after a while the earliest messages get over-written with later messages, so it's important to capture 'dmesg' early before that can happen. | 13:37 |
| flocculant | albert23: doesn't matter if I do or don't - fails anyway | 13:37 |
| flocculant | TJ-: you saying you want me to reboot and grab a clean one? | 13:37 |
| TJ- | flocculant: no, that was just FYI so you know | 13:38 |
| flocculant | TJ-: ok :) | 13:38 |
| TJ- | flocculant: generally after several hours/days the messages being wrapping around the buffer - depends on whether the system started with "quiet" or "debug" verbosity | 13:38 |
| TJ- | s/being/begin. | 13:39 |
| flocculant | I see - rare this machine doesn't get 2 or 3 boots a day :p | 13:39 |
| TJ- | flocculant: like albert said, if you do a bare metal boot from USB of the i386 ISO, in CSM/Legacy mode, and hit a key when you see the keyboard symbol at bottom of display, select language, then at the boot menu highlight "Try.." then press F6 to get the 'expert boot options' sub-menu, press Esc to dismiss it, then move the cursor on the kernel command-line to before the final "--" and delete "quiet splash | 13:46 |
| TJ- | " and add " debug " then press Enter... that should let you see the kernel messages and possibly see where it gets to and even photograph it before it resets if you're lucky - depends on whether it hangs then reboots or just reboots without warning | 13:46 |
| TJ- | In these situations I set-up a camcorder videoing it and review it afterwards :) | 13:47 |
| flocculant | TJ-: trying that (not sure why I didn't yesterday at least once in the too many times ...) | 13:48 |
| flocculant | TJ-: not a thing shown | 13:49 |
| flocculant | well - cursor for 'that long' | 13:50 |
| flocculant | iirc from last cycle text doesn't work anymore woth systemd - can't remember what you need instead | 13:50 |
| TJ- | works fine here | 13:51 |
| TJ- | that's how i did the tests | 13:51 |
| flocculant | mmm - I'll try again then - remove quiet splash add text? | 13:51 |
| TJ- | no, add "debug" | 13:51 |
| flocculant | oh ok, let me do that | 13:52 |
| flocculant | TJ-: early console in setup code - then it reboots | 13:55 |
| TJ- | was that a message? I don't recognise it | 13:57 |
| flocculant | that was all there was | 13:57 |
| flocculant | TJ-: thanks for your help - but I'm running out of time now :) | 13:58 |
| TJ- | OK, one last option to add in there with "debug" - add also "earlyprintk=vga" | 14:01 |
| flocculant | ok - will do that :) | 14:01 |
| TJ- | flocculant: that should get you VERY early kernel setup messages | 14:01 |
| flocculant | right | 14:01 |
| flocculant | brb | 14:01 |
| TJ- | flocculant: I'm beginning to think this a bug in the system firmware; it's behaving as if the CPU is in 64-bit protected mode trying to execute (kernel) code that expects the CPU to be in 32-bit real mode | 14:03 |
| flocculant | managed to capture that on the phone | 14:05 |
| TJ- | nice one :D | 14:06 |
| flocculant | not too shaky either :D | 14:06 |
| TJ- | can you attach it to the bug report? | 14:12 |
| flocculant | yea - also trying to read it in vlc - will do it in a short while - little one calling for Dad taxi ... | 14:13 |
| TJ- | OK :) | 14:13 |
| flocculant | TJ-: attached - back later | 14:15 |
| flocculant | well watched it slowly - made little sense to me :p | 14:39 |
| TJ- | flocculant: It was enough for me to see roughly where it's resetting. I've been emulating the same CPU as in your PC using QEMU/KVM but can't reproduce it. We really need to capture the log via a serial console | 14:53 |
| TJ- | I suspect it's due to a regression caused by the recent PTI patches, which aren't supposed to affect x86 (only x86_64) but some of the memory-management code is shared | 14:57 |
| flocculant | TJ-: mmm - not sure how we can accomplish that - also if others can't reproduce then perhaps it's not something to worry about too much, 32 bit for me is something that Xubuntu Team decided to carry on with - not sure how many of that team even have 32 bit hardware to test on, I know I don't | 14:57 |
| flocculant | TJ-: ack - that was sort of the sentiment from infinity in #u-release last night | 14:58 |
| TJ- | I think I've an EFI system lying around somewhere I could test on... not sure which one though :) | 14:58 |
| flocculant | TJ-: don't worry too much - unless of course you want to - I'm kind of waiting for a reply from a lubuntu person in another channel to get involved too :p | 14:59 |
| TJ- | flocculant: well we don't want unbootable ISOs being distributed - best to figure it out early | 15:01 |
| flocculant | well no of course not - hence the pinging in -release :) | 15:01 |
| TJ- | My method is to collect accurate data to act on rather than guess :) | 15:01 |
| flocculant | :) | 15:01 |
| TJ- | which is why I'm after the best logs we can get | 15:01 |
| flocculant | off for a bit now - time with little one, will be back this evening | 15:02 |
| flocculant | thanks enormously for your help so far :) | 15:02 |
| gunix | how do i enter grub? | 16:49 |
| gunix | i get the purple screen from ubuntu and than error message | 16:49 |
| gunix | i need to boot CLI mode to disable nvidia driver | 16:50 |
| TJ- | Press Esc key when firmware hands over to GRUB | 16:52 |
| gunix | i wanted to install kubuntu 17.10 but somehow i managed to install ubuntu 18.04 | 16:53 |
| gunix | ... | 16:53 |
| flocculant | TJ-: following up a bit, someone from xubuntu team booted 32 bit iso (though our not quite official core one) on 32 bit machine | 17:34 |
| flocculant | if this issue is it not booting on a 64 bit machine then I'm a bit *shrug* ;) | 17:35 |
| TJ- | well it booted here on x86_64 CPU as well | 17:36 |
| flocculant | so on some 64bit - even more shruggy then :p | 17:37 |
| flocculant | thanks for your help - I think I'll just wait to see what -release say - I'll let you know if I hear anything | 17:37 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: Hey, sorry, been out of it the last few days... what's up with these ISOs? :) | 18:06 |
| flocculant | tsimonq2: currently not sure tbh - some (at least 1) 64 bit machines not booting 32 bit iso(s) | 18:07 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: `I | 18:07 |
| tsimonq2 | grr | 18:07 |
| tsimonq2 | I'll create a task on Phab for wxl to get to testing the stuff. | 18:08 |
| flocculant | currently also waiting to see what Adam finds | 18:08 |
| tsimonq2 | Alright. | 18:08 |
| flocculant | other than that I'm now stepping back on this | 18:08 |
| * tsimonq2 shamelessly plugs phab.lubuntu.me :P | 18:08 | |
| flocculant | mmm | 18:08 |
| flocculant | saw that | 18:08 |
| flocculant | we used trello a few cycles back - fell back to m/l and talking to each other as our default | 18:09 |
| flocculant | have a good day - wandering | 18:09 |
| tsimonq2 | ok have fun :) | 18:10 |
| flocculant | you too :) | 18:10 |
| gunix | how come i downloaded 17.10 and got a great new install of bionic beaver? :D | 21:38 |
| gunix | i mean it works nice but i am confused | 21:38 |
| tomreyn | gunix: what's the name of the file you downloaded? | 21:41 |
| tomreyn | and if you can tell, where did you download it from | 21:42 |
| gunix | tomreyn: one sec | 21:45 |
| gunix | tomreyn: https://kubuntu.org/getkubuntu/ | 21:45 |
| gunix | 64 bit one | 21:45 |
| gunix | and i got bionic beaver gnome | 21:46 |
| gunix | :)) | 21:46 |
| tomreyn | gunix: so this? http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu/releases/17.10.1/release/kubuntu-17.10.1-desktop-amd64.iso | 21:46 |
| gunix | yes | 21:47 |
| gunix | at first i thought i made a mistake | 21:47 |
| gunix | but than during the installer i noticed that the backgroud image was an aardvark, not a beaver | 21:48 |
| gunix | well anyway i am happy with the system | 21:48 |
| tomreyn | maybe emntion it in the kubuntu channel | 21:48 |
| gunix | as long as i don't install nvidia, nothing crashes | 21:48 |
| TJ- | nothing wrong with that ISO I just pulled it on | 21:49 |
| TJ- | cat /mnt/.disk/info | 21:49 |
| TJ- | Kubuntu 17.10 "Artful Aardvark" - Release amd64 (20180105.2) | 21:49 |
| TJ- | $ grep gnome /mnt/casper/filesystem.manifest | 21:51 |
| TJ- | libsoup-gnome2.4-1:amd64 2.60.1-1 | 21:51 |
| TJ- | it's all pure Kubuntu | 21:51 |
| gunix | maybe it was a long day for me | 21:52 |
| gunix | anyway i am happy with the system | 21:52 |
| gunix | except the theme | 21:52 |
| tsimonq2 | uh | 21:52 |
| tsimonq2 | what? | 21:52 |
| gunix | but both lxd and kvm are working so that is great | 21:52 |
| * tsimonq2 grabs that ISO | 21:52 | |
| TJ- | tsimonq2: it's fine; user mistake | 21:53 |
| gunix | hmm i guess you guys are right | 21:53 |
| gunix | i am installing distros since last night | 21:53 |
| gunix | i might have mixed up a USB | 21:53 |
| tsimonq2 | TJ-: oh | 21:54 |
| tsimonq2 | ok | 21:54 |
| tsimonq2 | TJ-: But still... gonna check it to be extra safe :P | 21:54 |
| TJ- | tsimonq2: I just did, see my results above | 21:55 |
| tsimonq2 | TJ-: oh, k | 21:55 |
| tsimonq2 | thanks | 21:55 |
| gunix | it all started when a manager said "so we will do openstack with redhat support. you can manage that, right?" ... so i said "ok better delete my debian and roll a fedora so i get used to redhat better. so i get fedora 27 and everything crashes. and i am like "i am not going back to debian, i'll get something new" ... so i try manjaro and lxd doesn't work. and well from there i installed multiple distros and | 21:55 |
| gunix | the only distro that works and is new is bionic beaver. | 21:55 |
| gunix | though i really don't like this gnome theme :( | 21:55 |
| tsimonq2 | gunix: Have you tried CentOS? | 21:57 |
| gunix | centos is far too old for day to day use | 21:57 |
| tsimonq2 | hm ok | 21:58 |
| gunix | i think the best distro atm is debian 9, probably till 18.04 will be live (and themes will work, nvidia drivers won't crash and stuff like that) | 21:58 |
| gunix | at least for me | 21:58 |
| gunix | but i wanted to switch from kvm to lxd anyway | 22:00 |
| gunix | where do i report bugs, since i am on devel version now? | 22:32 |
| gunix | does it help anybody if i do? | 22:32 |
| TJ- | !bug | 22:34 |
| ubottu | If you find a bug in Ubuntu or any of its derivatives, please report it using the command « ubuntu-bug <package> » - See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs for other ways to report bugs. | 22:34 |
| gunix | for example | 22:55 |
| gunix | gnome integration plugin is not working | 22:55 |
| gunix | with chromium | 22:55 |
| gunix | since chromium is now not part of apt | 22:55 |
| gunix | but in snap | 22:55 |
| gunix | :D | 22:55 |
| gunix | ok, i added some themes | 23:24 |
| gunix | it looks great now | 23:24 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!