[00:02] <tomreyn> i detest their meltdown + spectre PR. it's hardly possible to find the bits of actual information in there and interpret it correctly.
[00:03] <tomreyn> amd's "we're the untouchables" approach is not really better, though.
[00:08] <daftykins> and Apple claiming they fixed it all in patches, oy
[00:09] <tomreyn> well a microcode update is a patch for them
[00:26] <daftykins> not a 100% fix though
[03:41] <JanC> I wonder if there is an archive somewhere of "Ubuntu sightings in popular media" (movies, series, documentaries, etc.)?
[06:19] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[06:21] <Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Saturday - support !
[06:24] <lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om
[06:24] <lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/canonical-invites-ubuntu-users-to-test-kernel-patches-for-spectre-security-flaw-519448.shtml
[06:26] <lotuspsychje> !info xserver-xorg-video-intel
[06:27] <lotuspsychje> hmm i wonder why i get this update, i have ati
[06:28] <lotuspsychje> cpu amd
[06:59] <Bashing-om> Time ! g nite \o
[06:59] <lotuspsychje> nite nite Bashing-om
[07:00] <Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: make it the best you are able ... see ya :)
[07:04] <shanu> Needed help in fixing a problem I am facing since morning. Since upgrading to ubuntu 17.10, I am unable to log into sites like amazon. Other sites like netflix do not open at all.
[07:05] <lotuspsychje> shanu: this is the discuss channel use #ubuntu instead and have patience
[07:05] <shanu> oh
[07:05] <shanu> Somebody there pointed to discuss it here. That's why I posted
[07:06] <lotuspsychje> shanu: they did not, it was meant for another user
[07:06] <shanu> My bad
[07:44] <ducasse> morning, all
[12:19] <lotuspsychje> hey guys
[12:22] <Donmel> Hi
[12:22] <Donmel> Hello lovers
[12:22] <lotuspsychje> hey Donmel
[12:22] <Donmel> hi
[12:22] <Donmel> Can you share your specs please
[12:23] <lotuspsychje> Client: HexChat 2.12.4 • OS: Ubuntu "bionic" 18.04 • CPU: AMD C-60 APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics (800MHz) • Memory: Physical: 3,5 GiB Total (2,6 GiB Free) Swap: 2,0 GiB Total (2,0 GiB Free) • Storage: 73,7 GB / 129,5 GB (55,8 GB Free) • VGA: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Wrestler [Radeon HD 6290] @ Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Family 12h/14h Processor Funct
[12:23] <lotuspsychje> ion 5 • Uptime: 9m 1s
[12:23] <Donmel> nice
[12:23] <Donmel> How do i share mine
[12:23] <lotuspsychje> Donmel: are you on hexchat?
[12:23] <TJ-> Donmel: I don't think my specs would suit your eyes
[12:23] <lotuspsychje> lol
[12:24] <Donmel> lol why wouldn't it suite me eyes
[12:24] <Donmel> its good
[12:24] <Donmel> Yes I am on hexchat
[12:24] <lotuspsychje> Donmel: rightmouse/window/sysinfo
[12:24] <Donmel> Client: HexChat 2.12.4 • OS: Ubuntu "artful" 17.10 • CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU         T5300  @ 1.73GHz (1.07GHz) • Memory: Physical: 2.9 GiB Total (1.9 GiB Free) Swap: 2.0 GiB Total (2.0 GiB Free) • Storage: 17.9 GB / 247.7 GB (229.8 GB Free) • VGA: Intel Corporation Mobile 945GM/GMS, 943/940GML Express Integrated Graphics Controller @ Intel Corporation Mobile 945GM/PM/GMS, 943/940GML
[12:24] <Donmel> and 945GT Express Memory Controller Hub • Uptime: 40m 34s
[12:24] <Donmel> Hows that for starters?
[12:25] <lotuspsychje> pretty cool Donmel
[12:25] <Donmel> But you got a graphics card
[12:25] <Donmel> which distro are you using dear
[12:25] <lotuspsychje> Donmel: look in my sysinfo
[12:25] <Donmel> it says bionic
[12:26] <Donmel> do you know which one I am using
[12:26] <lotuspsychje> Donmel: yes, artful
[12:26] <Donmel> but what is artful?
[12:26] <lotuspsychje> Donmel: whats written behind artful?
[12:26] <Donmel> Ubuntu
[12:26] <lotuspsychje> behind
[12:27] <Donmel> As in? 17.10?
[12:27] <lotuspsychje> !yay
[12:27] <Donmel> :)
[12:27] <Donmel> So do you know which one it is
[12:28] <Donmel> Am I using Ubuntu / Lubuntu / Xubuntu , etc.?
[12:28] <Donmel> Client: HexChat 2.12.4 • OS: Ubuntu "artful" 17.10 • CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU         T5300  @ 1.73GHz (800MHz) • Memory: Physical: 2.9 GiB Total (2.6 GiB Free) Swap: 2.0 GiB Total (2.0 GiB Free) • Storage: 17.9 GB / 247.7 GB (229.9 GB Free) • VGA: Intel Corporation Mobile 945GM/GMS, 943/940GML Express Integrated Graphics Controller @ Intel Corporation Mobile 945GM/PM/GMS, 943/940GML
[12:28] <Donmel> and 945GT Express Memory Controller Hub • Uptime: 44m 37s
[12:28] <lotuspsychje> Donmel: you just said lubuntu
[12:29] <Donmel> ok.. but you couldn't get it from artful
[12:29] <Donmel> Lotus
[12:29] <Donmel> I got 4GB ram but its only detecting 2.9
[12:29] <Donmel> I am pretty sure around 128MB is going on graphics memory
[12:34] <lotuspsychje> Donmel: pretty cool specs for a lubuntu system
[12:34] <lotuspsychje> !info preload | Donmel install this aswell
[12:35] <TJ-> Donmel: if I recall correctly, the 945GM chipset can only address 4GB maximum (despite being a 64-bit chipset it only has 32 physical address lines)
[12:36] <TJ-> Donmel: and due to needing up some for memory mapping I/O devices often the maximum available usable RAM is 3GB, less any reserved for the GPU
[12:41] <lotuspsychje> hey DJones
[12:45] <lotuspsychje> hey hey EriC^^
[12:47] <EriC^^> hey lotuspsychje
[12:47] <EriC^^> what's up?
[12:48] <lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
[12:48] <lotuspsychje> im bit testing stuff on bionic
[12:48] <EriC^^> nice
[12:49] <lotuspsychje> EriC^^: can i add your git url to my topic?
[12:54] <EriC^^> i removed the stuff for now, gonna fix it up more and add them back later
[12:57] <lotuspsychje> EriC^^: kk
[12:57] <lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
[12:57] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[12:58] <EriC^^> hey BluesKaj
[12:58] <BluesKaj> Hey lotuspsychje, EriC^^   ;-)
[12:59] <BluesKaj> back on debian again
[13:11] <lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: more stable?
[13:19] <BluesKaj> I just like having it around , yeah it's like a rock :-)
[13:19] <lotuspsychje> cool
[13:20] <BluesKaj> still have Kubuntu 17.10 and 18.04
[13:21] <lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: you tested loading times to desktop on bionic?
[13:21] <lotuspsychje> im having a bug that takes long time from login to desktop
[13:22] <lotuspsychje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/+bug/1742063
[13:23] <BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, yeah I had a long one too, but that was after debian was installed , the swap UUID had changed so i reinstalled the new entry from blkid
[13:25] <BluesKaj> just installed the nvidia driver here on decian , so I'll have to reboot anyway, I'll check Bionic boot time
[13:26] <BluesKaj> bbiab
[13:33] <BluesKaj> took about 45 secs to boot Bionic to the desktop
[13:33] <lotuspsychje> yeah same here
[13:34] <lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: thats on kde on your side?
[13:34] <BluesKaj> it's on a HDD, so not as fasr as debian and 17.10, which are on a ssd
[13:35] <BluesKaj> yup all kde here
[13:35] <lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: could you systemd-analyze blame plz?
[13:36] <DJones> Afternoon all
[13:37] <lotuspsychje> hey DJones
[13:37] <DJones> Hi lotuspsychje
[13:38] <lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: here's mine https://hastebin.com/inapexejuc.go
[13:56] <lotuspsychje> bbl
[14:23] <pauljw> hi everyone
[14:24] <BluesKaj> 'Morning pauljw
[14:25] <pauljw> good morning BluesKaj :)
[14:26] <BluesKaj> how are you on this fine sat morning pauljw?.... jan thaw here , above freezing with sunshine :-)
[14:28] <pauljw> yeah, same here.  i'm doing fine, you?  still white out there, but going to 50 this afternoon.
[14:33] <BluesKaj> yeagh same here, but the snow is taking a beating
[14:33] <BluesKaj> our local ski hill is in trouble , as are all the snowmobile trails
[14:37] <BluesKaj> real winter has moved north this last couple of weeks
[14:38] <lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: ive tested a system with nouveau/wayland with nvidia graphics working like a charm
[14:39] <BluesKaj> yeah, nouveau works to some degree, i'm sure, but with multiple monitors?
[14:40] <lotuspsychje> didnt test that part yet
[14:47] <pauljw> :)
[16:31] <lotuspsychje> http://www.linuxandubuntu.com/home/playonlinux-for-easier-use-of-wine
[16:32] <jer> nouveau is garbage ... multiple monitors doesn't work, random lockups with a 1080 ti, poor performance, no cuda...
[16:33] <lotuspsychje> jer: with wayland comming as default, you have alternatives?
[16:33] <jer> lotuspsychje, waiting to see when/if nvidia will port their proprietary drivers to wayland before upgrading
[16:34] <lotuspsychje> jer: alot of wayland users out there already on fedora
[16:34] <jer> i'm not on 17.10 yet, and won't move up to any version that doesn't also give me an X11 option because these are things i need. nouveau doesn't work for me unfortunately =/
[16:34] <jer> ok that's fine for them
[16:35] <lotuspsychje> jer: we'll have to wait and see whats gonna happen at bionic release
[16:35] <jer> well i suppose i sohuldn't say that, i do have one computer on 17.10 using wayland, but it's using the intel integrated graphics for gpu, and the nvidia gpu in it is not used for display at all. my main workstation though has no integrated gpu, so my choices are either go out and buy something with good driver support for use under wayland and upgrade, or stay where i am. =/
[16:36] <jer> lotuspsychje, yeah i know. if i get cramped for time, it'll end up being taking a weekend and moving this machine off ubuntu and onto something else
[16:36] <lotuspsychje> jer: you mean another flavor?
[16:36] <jer> lotuspsychje, no i mean a different distribution
[16:36] <lotuspsychje> right
[16:37] <jer> anyway, that's how markets work =] something not satisfying your need or want, find something else. i like the idea of wayland, but i do need proprietary nvidia drivers or the nouveau drivers to get stable and fully featured soon. the latter is unlikely to happen (re: fully featured)
[16:39] <lotuspsychje> jer: i think we at an impasse right now, ppl saying xorg is dead, future is wayland..but wayland not ready..
[16:40] <lotuspsychje> and will other distro's do the wayland move like systemd did
[16:40] <jer> lotuspsychje, it's a transitionary thing; wayland will never be ready if you don't force it on people -- more people == more bug reports == more interest in fixing them == quicker moving the product; sucks for users in the short term, but will be better in the long term. yes, xorg is not a modern rendering / windowing system
[16:41] <lotuspsychje> yeah i agree on the forcing part, alot of bugs created on 17.10 and higher already about it
[16:43] <lotuspsychje> jer: im testing bionic on 3 machines, 2 out of 3 still need xorg...and the funny part the only wayland going smooth is on nouveau lol
[16:44] <jer> lotuspsychje, heh
[16:45] <jer> of all the linux systems i have that have gpus, only one has anything other than an nvidia gpu for display -- and it's an intel based laptop =]
[16:46] <jer> but that's also got problems re: power management in 17.10 so it stays off most of the time
[16:47] <lotuspsychje> yeah
[16:59] <TJ-> Does anyone remember the Ubuntu Holly Holbach release?
[17:01] <lotuspsychje> no?
[17:01] <lotuspsychje> whats that about TJ-
[17:01] <TJ-> I just found it listed on changelogs.ubuntu.com :)
[17:02] <TJ-> made me giggle... I suspect Seb Holbach added it and 'Holly' is his partner: http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/meta-release-unit-testing
[17:02] <TJ-> obviously a 'red' herring release :D
[17:02] <lotuspsychje> lol
[17:08] <tomreyn> :)
[17:10] <TJ-> tomreyn: there was something I spotted I was going to tell you about... but it's gone out of my head now!
[17:10] <tomreyn> TJ-: sometime during the next night you'll remember, be sure to run to your keyboard and type it immediately!
[17:11] <tomreyn> TJ-: before *I* forget (although i got to be afk for a bit shortly, sorry): you had shared your mainline kernel download script with me a while ago, wget_kernel_mainline.sh - i forgot to take note about a source location. do you have it on your github repository or somewhere else in git?
[17:12] <TJ-> tomreyn: oh! I know. in the changelog server's meta-release entries they change the "ReleaseNotes" link when it goes EOL... I had the hair-brained idea of having update-manager use that as a trigger to warn of EOL but then realised it won't change until the EOL day itself
[17:12] <TJ-> tomreyn: haha, I updated that recently to a little cleverer... let me check where it is
[17:14] <TJ-> tomreyn: got it: http://iam.tj/projects/ubuntu/  ... you might also be interested in "grub_custom_sort_menu.tar.gz" which creates GRUB sub-menus for mainline and RC builds and prevents them being listed ahead of the regular Ubuntu kernels.
[17:17] <lotuspsychje> https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=GNOME-Wayland-GTK-Input-Proto
[17:17] <TJ-> my wrapper for dpkg-divert is there too which I use with my package-content-replacement tooling to move files under /etc/dpkg-divert/{orginal-path} and then symlink my tooling from /usr/local/*
[17:19] <TJ-> I'm currently tidying up all my tooling and adding documentation then I'm going to publically share the /usr/local/ file-system I share locally so anyone can mount/copy it
[17:47] <tomreyn> TJ-: thank you! have you heard about versionioning systems? ;)
[17:47] <TJ-> tomreyn: you mean git... i heard a whisper :p
[17:48] <tomreyn> this kind of sounds like a good use case.
[17:48] <TJ-> tomreyn: the reason for sharing /usr/local/ is so it can be mounted over NFS or sshfs
[17:49] <TJ-> all my remote systems share it over VPN but there's so many useful things it makes sense to export the entire FS for hackers to enjoy
[17:51] <tomreyn> i guess it would amke sense for your use case
[17:51] <tomreyn> *also make
[17:51] <TJ-> There's 15 years of accumulated tools and customisations I use so regularly I'm lost without them
[17:52] <tomreyn> especially those i would not want to keep elsewhere than in a versioning system
[17:53] <tomreyn> well you know what you're doing, i'm just trying to evangelize ;)
[17:56] <TJ-> I use git for developing, even for /etc/ (triggered by an inotify watch for any WRITE,CLOSE changes)
[17:56] <tomreyn> etckeeper?
[17:57] <tomreyn> ah no that hooks into apt, inotify is even better i guess
[17:58] <tomreyn> !info etckeeper
[17:58] <TJ-> something I developed myself back around 2007 I think
[17:59] <tomreyn> wasn't inotify only invented in 2010? ;)
[17:59] <tomreyn> oh 2005 already
[17:59] <TJ-> originally it was on a cron job then gained some sophistication
[18:00] <TJ-> I think I got into inotify around 2008 when debugging it
[18:00] <tomreyn> wikipedia: "Inotify was created by John McCutchan,[1] and it was merged into the Linux kernel mainline in kernel version 2.6.13, released on August 29, 2005;[2] later kernel versions included further improvements. The required library interfaces were added into the GNU C Library (glibc) in its version 2.4, released in March 2006, while the support for inotify was completed in glibc version 2.5, released in September 2006.[3]"
[18:01] <tomreyn> debugging a file system filter sounds like ... oh look, a unicorn!
[18:01] <tomreyn> if i was able to, it would not be  my favourite hobby
[18:05] <TJ-> brings back memories actually; first major bug I found in Linux was around 2005 with a dmraid 1+0 on 4 disks where the kernel would cause the disk drives to crash their heads repeatedly against the end-stops because it was reading the MBR PT from the underlying disks and trying to seek on the first disk of a pair to a sector on the 2nd disk (which works when looking at the MD device of course)
[18:05] <tomreyn> ouch
[18:06] <tomreyn> i bet this saved a lot of people some money, including myself, thanks.
[18:06] <tomreyn> well not just money, also a lot of annoyance / labor
[18:07] <tomreyn> i'm impressed, and conclude you must be more than 20 years of age. :-P
[18:07] <tomreyn> (i'm not 20 either)
[18:07] <TJ-> not sure, had a to-and-fro with Linus in the LKML over it because my patch was in the partition handling code and he said it should be elsewhere, but couldn't say where, then when I produced a suitable patch refused to accept it because he didn't believe my name is "Tj" so I told him to go stuff it
[18:08] <tomreyn> thats your actual first name?
[18:08] <tomreyn> or did he just not like you abbreviating it
[18:08] <TJ-> that's my entire name
[18:09] <TJ-> I have this argument with so many people who try to tell me it can't be my name, or it's an acronym
[18:09] <tomreyn> doh, that's short
[18:09] <TJ-> hence my domain name to reinforce the point :)
[18:09] <TJ-> pronounced "teej"
[18:10] <tomreyn> i thought it was that domain name because you did not want to by the TLD.
[18:11] <tomreyn> ..and did not want to expand the acroynm
[18:11] <tomreyn> *buy
[18:11] <TJ-> haha, I actually tried to buy it in the early 2000s when the USA company that was operating it was suspended, but it was handed over to the Tajik government as it is their CC TLD
[18:12] <tomreyn> it's now managed by astute.ly though, which also do .ly, i think, and are just some agency
[18:12] <tomreyn> isnt it?
[18:13] <tomreyn> ah no i made that up apparently
[18:13] <TJ-> No, astute.ly is another of my domains
[18:13] <tomreyn> oh it seemed familiar
[18:14] <tomreyn> gtg again, bbl
[18:14] <tomreyn> thanks again for the updated script
[18:14] <tomreyn> oh and if you can fix ubottu's HTTPS by chance...
[18:14] <TJ-> ubottus!? not another broken
[18:16] <lotuspsychje> bbl
[18:40] <tomreyn> hehe
[18:40] <tomreyn> well i just mean the website is unavailable for some days now
[18:42] <TJ-> tomreyn: I think I lost track; I've been redeveloping everything internally before pushing it out - planning on nuking all the existing data-center stuff so not been bothering to maintain it
[18:44] <tomreyn> okay, it doesn't seem like anyone can remember, and Pici (bot owner) doesn't respond, so...
[18:46] <TJ-> tomreyn: Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh you mean ubottu's factoids?
[19:23] <tomreyn> TJ-: right
[19:24] <tomreyn> aka https://ubottu.com/
[19:28] <tomreyn> any idea how can fix it?
[19:29] <oerheks> was there ever a certificate for ubottu.com?
[19:30] <daftykins> i heard the ops alienated and then kicked out the real maker of ubottu
[19:31] <TJ-> openssl s_client reports connect: Connection refused
[20:05] <tomreyn> netcat, too
[20:06] <tomreyn> and yes there was a certificate for ubottu.com
[20:07] <tomreyn> https://censys.io/certificates/4ba8e9ae2ee2aa9804da41e7947ddae80d68dd90f6fe1ff5b2c32f24783e5a9f
[20:07] <tomreyn> gandi DV
[20:08] <tomreyn> there must have been a later one, though
[20:10] <tomreyn> last spotted 4 days ago: https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:6Tp2t0tW2vAJ:https://ubottu.com/
[20:25] <tomreyn> bug reported :) maybe someone will read it sometime.
[20:30] <tomreyn> i like how there is a bug tag "mess"
[20:30] <TJ-> it's easier than trying to remember CVE numbers