[00:12]  * agaida will like black global menues on a black background much
 aaaand that's why I'm doing dark panels ;)
 RIGHT
 XD
 great, my bouncer is down
 @VikingRedwolf, Aren't they supposed to be like 6'4"... 6'6" tall and girthy tho
 Hard to take them down
 Did he drink too much?
 º__________º
[00:43] <agaida> redwolf: become modern and get a quassel-core
 a wut?
[00:43] <agaida> no more bouncers needed :P
[00:44] <agaida> and quassel client works fine on windows - and there is even quasseldroid
 isn't quassel an irc client?
 there
[00:44] <agaida> and server
 ah
 https://quassel-irc.org
 is it hosted there?
[00:45] <agaida> no
[00:45] <agaida> one can host it everywhere
 hm, it seems complicated. remember that I'm internally blonde
 I did enough by setting up a normal server, nextcloud and even a pastebin service, but tthat's all
[00:47] <agaida> nah - its easy - setup an super performant postgresql server, setup a quasselcore and be done with :P
 can you see my irc user here, btw? ("here")
[00:48] <agaida> redwolf, redwolf[m] ?
 aye
[00:50] <agaida> https://pb.5id.eu/OgIC - my own little quassel server
 oohh
[00:51] <agaida> ok, little is a bit understatement
[00:51] <agaida> :P
 indeed
[00:52] <agaida> ok, my server just for fun
 I like when a man doesn't bluff about the size of his server .__.
[00:53] <agaida> https://pb.5id.eu/cnIN - as i said, only for pet projects
 "persistent"
[00:54] <agaida> cheaper than a root server - so what :P
 oh, there's a package for ubuntu (quassel-core)
[00:56] <agaida> right - i guess two cores and a littel postgre database should be enough - isn't so expensive
[00:56] <agaida> and works with nearly everything
 two cores?
 as in cpu?
[00:56] <agaida> a VM with 2 processor cores
[00:57] <agaida> 10 is a little bit much :D
 I should check mine
[00:58] <agaida> https://contabo.com/?show=configurator&vserver_id=193 - had this as starter, was fully enough for my web things and quassel
[00:59] <agaida> my own gitlab instance changed this a little bit
 I have 1 CPU core :(
[01:01] <redwolf> I'M BACK!!
[01:01] <redwolf> YISSSS
[01:02] <agaida> :)
[01:02] <redwolf> but it's definitely something to think about
[01:03] <redwolf> I'm happy with my server though. I only use it mainly for syncing things to nextcloud
[01:04] <redwolf> I know it's cheap and tiny, but it's enough for someone like me
[01:04] <redwolf> but I can add cores ;)
[01:04] <agaida> i like to have a strong machine as a backup or for testing things without the need of digital ocean or aws
[01:04] <redwolf> that's expensive here
[01:05] <redwolf> for me, I mean, for now
[01:05] <agaida> 4 cores/12G for 9 € isn't to bad
[01:11] <tsimonq2> !offtopic
[01:11] <tsimonq2> :)
 😐
 @tsimonq2 for the docs should I remove anything that has to do with using the terminal
 @anyytime, tbh, I think that it shouldn’t be just content from leafpad site, screenshot and output from `leafpad -h`
 what do you suggest otherwise?
 @anyytime, Wouldn't that discourage the use of the terminal for future lubuntu users?
 @num13, Saying that you should open temrinal to start leafpad instead of using applications menu or alt+f2 isn't good idea
 Either way @tsimonq2 What do you suggest?
 imo it should say in what category you can find the app, its features (but not copy-pasted), explanation of UI and maybe what to do if the file was opened with incorrect encoding
 and explain some options available in settings window, if any
 yea I decided to replace the usage from terminal part to which category to find the app
 (y)
 about explanation of ui, it's just a standard text editor I believe?
 yup
 and 2051x1379 is probably too big resolution for a screenshot…
 of something as simple as leafpad
 that’s just what I think
 I’m trying to guess what typical user would think, but it’s hard for me
 somebody says that people with Asperger’s syndrome (like me) can’t understand others XD
 But it’s definitely off-topic, so I won’t say about it here… :>
 @num13, I don't have much of a preference tbh :)
 I’ll make a PR basing on how I think it should look and I’ll ask @anyytime for review
 Ok
 @tsimonq2, @julienlavergne, wxl, one small detail. I have to completely replace Openbox and LXQT (widgets and panel) themes. I need a day for that. Maybe two.
[14:17] -GitHub113:#lubuntu-devel- [lubuntu-artwork] vikingredwolf pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vNKTV
[14:17] -GitHub113:#lubuntu-devel- lubuntu-artwork/master 953e881 Redwolf: Add Lubuntu Arc theme
 @VikingRedwolf, OK. We're waiting on @julienlavergne to look into XDG brokenness anyways ;)
 O.O why?
[14:23] -GitHub189:#lubuntu-devel- [lubuntu-artwork] vikingredwolf pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vNKIJ
[14:23] -GitHub189:#lubuntu-devel- lubuntu-artwork/master 3ed6170 Redwolf: Add (custom) Lubuntu Arc for Openbox
 @GitHub189, sneaky!
 @tsimonq2, ? Bug number ?
 @VikingRedwolf, ...screen is black on login?
 @tsimonq2, that's minimalism! XD
 @julienlavergne, I don't have one but I assumed Rafael mentioned something to you... Try grabbing a Lubuntu Next ISO, the themes and everything is black on login, and the panel is empty. I suspect XDG.
 Themes are already uploaded. we only need three packages to make this look possible:
[14:27] <lubot1> - arc-themes (in the repos)
[14:27] <lubot1> - papirus-icon-theme (in the repos)
[14:27] <lubot1> - kvantum (somewhere)
 I might need to re-send you, @julienlavergne, the settings for gtk2 and gtk3
 I wonder if all this LXQt confifurarion will collide with LXDE's
 it's siesta time. brb!
[14:51] <lubot1> ramon_gabriel was added by: ramon_gabriel
 @ramon_gabriel, o/
 @VikingRedwolf, OK, but I'm lost when touching XDG settings so I'll pass that to @julienlavergne to figure out and get working :)
[15:17] <lubot1> agaida says things are merged upstream, so there shouldn't be any blockers left?
 @ramon_gabriel, Welcome!
[15:22] <agaida> for the XDG things - we have moved nearly all XDG things to /usr/share/lxqt iirc - except the configurations for lxqt-globalkeys
[15:24] <agaida> in case where no upstream pre-configurations are available the normal XDG behaviour works, implemented in libqtxdg - so the application will have a look at the '"normal" pathes in /usr/share, etc/xdg/$foo, /etc/$bar and $HOME/.config/$baz
 @tsimonq2, Thank you!
[15:26] <agaida> i would suggest to use /etc/xdg to provide settings and not to touch the XDG standard dirs - that will leave /etc/$bar open and not touched for derivatives
[15:27] <agaida> to sum it up - lubuntu can just throw the lubuntu configs to /etc/xdg - there will be no file conflicts with debian or upstream
 @tsimonq2, I hope so
[17:57] -GitHub58:#lubuntu-devel- [lubuntu-artwork] vikingredwolf pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vNKiA
[17:57] -GitHub58:#lubuntu-devel- lubuntu-artwork/master 8461385 Redwolf: Fix some colours
 @GitHub58, 🇬🇧
 @GitHub58, *colors :P
 🖕🏻🇺🇸
 have you added papirus-icon-theme and arc-theme to the seed?
 and KCALC?   º___º
 @VikingRedwolf, It's open for pull requests...
 Although yeah I guess I should
 @VikingRedwolf Have we switched to Arc on LXDE and LXQt?
 nope
 we could though
 Just LXQt needs those seed additions then?
 @VikingRedwolf, No
 yes
 Ok
 I prefer to keep the diferent settings
 I do too
 Which is why we need different default settings packages boi
 *ahem* ;)
 BTW agaida, lubuntu-meta in Bionic should be fixed now.
 aah, don't tell me that. tell @julienlavergne ;)
[18:09] <gilir> you want to switch the theme + icons for the LTS ? Really ?
 yes, he does :)
 @gilir, Not for Lubuntu, Lubuntu Next
 Lubuntu needs to stay static
 Lubuntu Next however is the playing ground :)
[18:12] <gilir> ok
[18:15] <gilir> btw, the settings should work, because there are in a XDG directory
[18:16] <gilir> I'm downloading the ISO, I'll look at it
[18:29] <agaida> tsimonq2: is a fixed iso ready to download?
[18:30] <agaida> hi gilir
 @gilir, OK
 @agaida, Idk offhand if today's daily has the fix.
[18:56] <agaida> hmm - just downloaded the daily image - unfortunately the metapackage changes are not in
 Then apt update in tty1, wipe away your settings, kill lightdm and start sddm :D
[19:08] <agaida> that doesn't help much - in that special case reading the sources is more fruitful and faster - look good first hand
[19:09] <agaida> and btw - apt purge libgtk* libqt* would help more
[19:09] <agaida> after that starting with a nearly cleaned up system even :D
 gilir: Mind if I just do a quick Lubuntu Next amd64 rebuild to pick up the metapackage changes?
 question. can we include pcmanfm-qt settings there as well?
 @VikingRedwolf, agaida: Was the xdg change made there as well?
 I already have the settings. do you want them?
[19:22] <agaida> tsimonq2: i had a nice and clear black screen
 @julienlavergne ?
 agaida, it's a "minimalistic screen"
[19:22] <agaida> and after choosing the wm a installer icon on the screen
[19:23] <agaida> redwolf: the cool thing about is - one can start with an empty task bar - a future proof solution :D
[19:23] <gilir> hi agaida
[19:23] <agaida> s/task bar/lxqt-panel
 :) xfce does that: "do you want an empty panel or a default one?" gentle
 @agaida, I really think this is XDG settings at fault
[19:24] <gilir> tsimonq2: no, I'll restart the download after :-)
[19:24] <agaida> so what i can say about the meta packages is - looks good for me right now
[19:25] <agaida> apt install lubuntu-qt-desktop looks reasonable with no debris in it (given that one use --no-install-recommends)
 @gilir, OK :)
[19:26] <gilir> redwolf: yes, you can send them to me, but currently lxqt-config doesn't apply gtk settings, so it will be tweaky to apply them
 how does lxappearance work? we need it for gtk
 the qt settings manager should call the other one. otherwise we'll have some apps "naked"
[19:28] <gilir> that's not so simple, lxappearance is GTK & C, lxqt-config is Qt + C++, and no way to run lxappearance without the GUI
[19:29] <agaida> redwolf: just provide reasonable gtk2 and 3 default to start with
 @gilir, :(
 ok
[19:30] <redwolf> gilir, there: https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/26453603/
[19:35] <agaida> https://github.com/lxde/lxqt/issues/403 - so i guess LXQt 1.0 will have GTK support for themes and so on
[19:36] <agaida> and if one have a look on the date - it really has very high priority
[19:36] <redwolf> I always said it's absurd to make end users to have TWO different engines. it's confusing
[19:36] <agaida> until then lxappearance is the best bet for openbox
[19:36] <redwolf> there's people who don't know what's gtk or qt, and they shouldn't at all
[19:36] <redwolf> agaida, but lxappearance can control qt either
[19:37] <agaida> nope
[19:37] <agaida> in no way
[19:37] <redwolf> bidirectional problem
[19:37] <agaida> only if qt use the gtk2 themes
[19:38] <redwolf> or if you use the gtk-qt-bridge. same things reversed. ugly
[19:38] <agaida> and thats a f***ing problem since i started with linux
[19:38] <redwolf>  yes. as it was the package format. this always was OUR problem in Linux
[19:38] <redwolf> the fragmentation
[19:38] <agaida> and that was 2009 - also here the best bet is using the qt-gtk theme
[19:39] <redwolf> gilir, you got the settings?
[19:39] <redwolf> I included the pcmanfm-qt one too
[19:40] <gilir> redwolf: yes, thank you
[19:40] <redwolf> you're welcome
[19:42] <agaida> redwolf: but in the real world™ the gtk thing isn't really a deal breaker - with some reasonable gtk defaults most people don't tinker around with the settings (that was the feedback from siduction users)
[19:56] <redwolf> you had no problems at all?
[19:57] <redwolf> you're telling me you made possible to load gtk settings in a qt environment, right?
 agaida: So I've been thinking about lxqt-panel more and more... One thing that I think would be good is to have it like other panels where you can add favorites and have your profile pic + name there. If I write the code, is this something that would be accepted?
[20:18] <redwolf> tsimonq2, wouldn't you need some setup "manager" for that?
 @redwolf, No, the defaults would be sane.
 Then you can customize on the panel itself from there.
[20:19] <redwolf> and how would you change layouts?
 ...what do you mean?
 I'm just thinking about expanding the start menu a bit :)
[20:20] <redwolf> ah, I was thinking about a different thing, like MATE, having different layouts (mutiny, gnome2...)
 That's something I'm still thinking about; let's see what happens after gilir gets the default settings working :)
[20:21] <redwolf> ok
 It honestly wouldn't be hard to do.
 I have some cool ideas for that should it all work out.
 But one thing I want to finish, get packaged, and upload to Ubuntu is the Lubuntu About program.
[20:24] <redwolf> YESSS!
[20:24] <agaida> tsimonq2: have fun and make the "new" enhanced Version of the main menu optional - like in kde - so one could choose the classic one via the enhanced one
[20:25] <agaida> we will see it in 0.13 or 14 then
 @agaida, Should enhanced be default or should classic?
 @agaida, Alright, cool.
[20:26] <agaida> classic - and not to forget - file a bug about so people have a place for opinions about
 Ok
 If it's not accepted upstream, I fully expect Lubuntu to carry it downstream.
[20:28] <redwolf> where's my audacious-qt?!
[20:28] <redwolf> dinner is ready. brb
 @redwolf, I'll work on it.
 *burp*
 *cough*
[21:00] -GitHub175:#lubuntu-devel- [lubuntu-default-settings] tsimonq2 pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/vN6fX
[21:00] -GitHub175:#lubuntu-devel- lubuntu-default-settings/master d47b797 Julien Lavergne: Add a symlink from xdg-Lubuntu to xdg-QLubuntu to apply also the settings on QLubuntu session
[21:00] -GitHub175:#lubuntu-devel- lubuntu-default-settings/master 6d03722 Julien Lavergne: Fix debian/changelog
[21:00] <gilir> not sure the fix for default-settings is enough, but that should be better
[21:01] <agaida> redwolf: re audacious-qt - it isn't primetime ready yet - i was playing with the debian packaging a bit to separate the gtk and qt-part a bit more and cleaner -- after some days i switched back to audacious gtk. I would guess another year until GTK and Qt are feature par and a-Qt is mature enough
 aw, okies :(
[21:02] <agaida> debian had another solution to handle the Qt situations - they don't even build the Qt part first hand :P
[21:03] <acheronuk> still not? feels like they have been working on the Qt UI for like ever
 qmp then!
 .____.
[21:04] <agaida> i don't know how qmmp behave now - but there was a reason why i switched with siduction LXQt to audacious :D
 :)
[21:05] <agaida> and i had the latest upstream in siduction for three years - to be honest - there are better opportunities if one want to waste time
 I know gilir had ideas for other media players :)
 I don't :|
[21:07] <gilir> well ... actually I don't :-( The only ones I know on Qt are Clementine and Amarok ...
 Amarok is dead upstream and will be removed when Qt 4 is removed from Debian
 Clementine might work
 I'm still inclined to go with VLC, actually.
[21:08] <agaida> clementine is a fine choice - ok, not exactly lightweight and qt4 too
 Kubuntu uses it.
 @agaida, I'm -1 because it's Qt 4
[21:08] <agaida> apt show clementine
[21:08] <agaida> right
[21:08] <acheronuk> Amorok is being ported, but seems to have stalled again in that
 gilir: What objections did you have to VLC?
[21:09] <acheronuk> babe and elisa have promise
 I know it's a really popular media player, I use it too.
 Honestly I know VLC is the de-facto choice for a lot of people, much like LibreOffice
[21:10] <gilir> smplayer has better performance, less cpu to play the same movie
[21:10] <acheronuk> gilir: but a F ugly default UI
[21:10] <gilir> and the VLC UI sucks :-p
[21:10] <agaida> erm - while we talk about Qt4 - one should have a look at the libreoffice choice - libreoffice-kde will go away soon - it is dead
[21:10] <gilir> acheronuk: agree, but it can be changed
 @agaida, Yep, I've been keeping my eye on that
 LibreOffice looks awful, btw, in Lubuntu Next
[21:11] <acheronuk> agaida: LO 6 should have Qt5 VCL
 @gilir, Honestly, I prefer the VLC UI.
[21:11] <lubot1> And like I said, the upside is that it's very popular :)
 @acheronuk, I hope so!
[21:12] <agaida> erm - not soon
 When will LO 6 come out?
[21:13] <gilir> tsimonq2: the UI can be changed, my only real point is about performance
[21:13] <agaida> when it is released https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan/6.0
[21:14] <gilir> if performances were equal, I'll be agree to go with VLC (and hope we can find a good UI / theme ...)
[21:14] <agaida> https://tracker.debian.org/media/packages/libr/libreoffice/control-16.0.0rc2-1 - just search for Qt
[21:14] <acheronuk> LO 6 is scheduled end of January
[21:15] <agaida> and i will talk with the maintainer about libre office beginning of march at the CLT 2018
 @gilir, Out of curiosity, what stats do you have regarding VLC performance?
[21:16] <acheronuk> I asked libroffice uploaders before Xmas, and they seemed to think V6 would definitely go in 18.04
[21:16] <agaida> but right now the Qt Frontend isn't release ready  - and LO6 will hit sid on release date - and we all hope to have it in sid as soon as possible
[21:16] <agaida> s/sid/experimental
 If the performance is just slightly less gilir, it shouldn't make much of a difference. But if it's a lot, then yeah.
[21:17] <acheronuk> that is annoying. I lost tack with that. last I heard LO devs had asked KDE devs for help getting the UI up to speed. guess not much help happened
[21:17] <wxl> sed: -e expression #1, char 13: unterminated `s' command
[21:18] <gilir> tsimonq2: try to play the same video with both player, you will see
[21:18] <acheronuk> to be blunt, the gtk LO VCL is now better than than the KDE4 one.
 @gilir, I have, with little difference :)
[21:18] <acheronuk> which is a painful truth
 @acheronuk, We might go with that temporarily then until the Qt 5 frontend gets better.
[21:20] <acheronuk> tsimonq2: I am seriously wondering for Kubuntu, as the KDE4 one is getting quite bad
[21:20] <acheronuk> and especially does not take dark themes well
[21:21] <gilir> tsimonq2: last time I checked it was 30 - 40 % better, of course on small % because I have good CPU
 @gilir, OK, I'll check it out.
[21:22] <acheronuk> yes, smplayer can be made to look ok https://i.imgur.com/mNSAnkK.png
[21:22] <agaida> and i might not be the most clever developer in the world - but for now i prefer nice working GTK solutions combined with LXQt over Qt only and crappy - and that count even more because some big applications rely on GTK already
[21:23] <agaida> esp there is no secure and well maintained browser available in Qt (and please don't mention the upcoming falcon as secure)
 About that...
 I've been talking with the security team
 We can make it work
 So I'll stand behind Falkon being secure on this one :P
[21:24] <agaida> falcon will be secure if it is possible that qt.io is following the chromium development with less than one week delay
 And they are, iirc.
[21:25] <agaida> hihihi - and when QtWebengine will hit the distributions - having patched sources is one thing
[21:25] <agaida> ...
 I can make it work
 I'm telling you :P
 assuming you can, can you guarentee that can be mantained for lifetime of a LTS release?
[21:30] <gilir> tsimonq2: let me know the result of your testing, perf may have changed since I tested them
 Ok
 @acheronuk, Yes.
[21:31] <lubot1> * acheronuk raises eyebrow
[21:35] <agaida> ok - back to reality - last chromium update in QtWebengine 5.9.2 was 17. Sept. 17 or so
 I'm not focusing on Artful for QtWebEngine security updates
 Only Bionic
[21:36] <agaida> lifetime half a year - cool
 that is still a very ambitous commitment
 @acheronuk, Not really.
 It is, unless it is being back officially by ubuntu security teams
 *backed
[22:02] <wxl> are redwolf and i the only ones that totally hate the desktop pager?
[22:02] <wxl> they just look so..... plain
[22:02] <wxl> (lxqt btw)
[22:03] <redwolf> booooooooring
[22:03] <redwolf> I prefer the "squared" ones, not just plane numbers. and having a visual representation of the windows is also handy
[22:03] <wxl> i think even if they were visually more like desktops (as with lxpanel) it might be at least a wee bit more appealing
[22:05] <redwolf> like diz: https://lescahiersdudebutant.fr/jessie/index-en-img/index-en-img93.png
[22:05] <redwolf> that'd be enough
[22:05] <wxl> yeah
[22:05] <redwolf> wxl says it's possible using the current code
[22:05] <redwolf> right?
[22:05] <wxl> well with a few tweaks
[22:05] <redwolf> aha
[22:06] <wxl> visually all that is, relative to what we already have is a fixed (non expanding) area, with a specific color
[22:06] <wxl> although it ALSO has the windows
[22:06] <wxl> that will take more i believe
[22:06] <redwolf> it should take the accent colour of the theme
[22:06] <redwolf> aka "selection colour"
[22:07] <wxl> i'm not sure i grok this enough to know where the color is even coming from. obviously, it seems to match the panel color
[22:08] <redwolf> I'm sure that colour variable is being used in the code
[22:08] <wxl> yeah it's just not entirely obvuious
[22:09] <redwolf> yes, tsimonq2, I said COLOUR .___.
[22:10] <wxl> i can say this is where the expanding size comes from https://github.com/lxde/lxqt-panel/blob/master/plugin-desktopswitch/desktopswitchbutton.cpp#L43
[22:10] <wxl> and it does look like you can choose not to use a label https://github.com/lxde/lxqt-panel/blob/master/plugin-desktopswitch/desktopswitchbutton.cpp#L56
[22:11] <redwolf> so it's a switch
[22:11] <wxl> it seems like (not a c++ expert) the button is inheriting things from a parent https://github.com/lxde/lxqt-panel/blob/master/plugin-desktopswitch/desktopswitchbutton.cpp#L37
[22:13] <wxl> and there is some style function (assumedly from QStyle) that allows it to change color with alerts https://github.com/lxde/lxqt-panel/blob/master/plugin-desktopswitch/desktopswitchbutton.cpp#L81
[22:32] <wxl> is there a problem with the current lubuntu-next iso?
[22:32] <wxl> it just dies on boot in vbox 5.2.6-120293~Ubuntu~trusty
 Yes
[22:34] <wxl> what's the deal?
[22:35] <agaida> get a working vbox - thats the primary problem - secondary problem is the, erm, strange design right now
[22:35] <wxl> oh vbox works fine, actually
[22:36] <lubot1> * tsimonq2 nods
[22:36] <agaida> ok - more verbose about - if you get finally a black screen, the iso is started correctly, only the settings are messed up
[22:37] <wxl> no, i mean it crashes
[22:37] <agaida> could you provide a log?
[22:37] <wxl> i get to the GRUB menu and then if i select try or install it dies
[22:37] <wxl> a vbox log, sure
[22:38] <wxl> actually even the old check disc for defects fails
[22:38] <agaida> right now i have a problem with vbox (upstream) - and it might be a kernel problem to,  in my case it is - dkms don't like some migitation patches in my kernel or the provided headers
[22:39] <agaida> beside of that - the current iso just work fine with kvm
[22:39]  * agaida will just fix his vbox
[22:39] <wxl> harumph
[22:41] <wxl> xp works.. a super old precise lubuntu works...
 That's because those are OLD :)
[22:45] <wxl> weird that there's nothing on the tracker suggesting problems
 @gilir, Yes
[23:25] <wxl> yeah it is something with the current kernel. harumph
[23:26] <wxl> the guest kernel
[23:26] <wxl> that's weird. haven't had that one yet
[23:28] <agaida> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWssLQSlRdQ
[23:28] <agaida> todays image
[23:29] <agaida> current vbox, kernel 4.14.15
[23:30] <wxl> so what ended up fixing it?
[23:30] <agaida> i had to delete a line in the kernel headers - a unmotivated retpolline mention - and rebuild the kernel objects
[23:31] <agaida> and after that just start the vm from the ispo
[23:31] <wxl> this is upstream vbox yah?
[23:31] <agaida> this is upstream - sid and debians vbox aren't good ideas - esp if one run his own kernel
[23:33] <agaida> you might notice some lxde packages in the iso and lightdm as dm - fixed yesterday, unfortunately the newest meta packages wasn't used in that build
[23:33] <agaida> so the remaining problems are "only" some settings
[23:34] <agaida> ok, not exactly release ready, but very usable - if one can start it and know the beast
[23:35] <wxl> heh we don't even have 4.14 in bionic
[23:37] <agaida> :) - thats one point in siduction - we don't use the debian kernel - ok, we borrow some settings now and then - but we manage a set of patches from the upstream queue and so on
[23:37] <agaida> and if we like something - we just throw it in :P
[23:38] <wxl> so it seems the fix was the kernel
[23:39] <agaida> thats esp. helpful when it comes to patches or minor glitches - get a patch, apply it, upload it - and just update the system 25 mins later
[23:39] <wxl> but we have an older kernel and it still seems to be a problem
[23:39] <wxl> i'm on 4.4.0
[23:39] <agaida> two possible choices - try upstream vbox or kvm - at least kvm should work fine without glitches
[23:39] <wxl> i am using upstream vbox
[23:40] <wxl> i always do
[23:40] <agaida> strangse
[23:40] <agaida> e
[23:40] <agaida> grr
[23:40] <wxl> and yes i can use kvm but that doesn't necessarily fix whatever problem there is with vbox
[23:40] <wxl> it seems to be something specific about the image that's failing
[23:40] <agaida> but your current problem is vbox and not the iso
[23:41] <wxl> the most current artful (17.10.1) works fine
[23:41] <agaida> the iso work fine even in Microsofts hyper-v
[23:41] <wxl> and the problem is not restricted to lubuntu
[23:43] <agaida> so i guess that you are not running the latest bionic on your workhorse?
[23:43] <wxl> nope
[23:44] <agaida> :) - sorry, no experiences with stable systems
[23:46] <wxl> and its not restricted to ubiquity either
[23:46] <wxl> alternate fails just the same
[23:53] <agaida> hmm - strange