clivejoacheronuk: ping13:19
acheronukclivejo: pong13:19
clivejoI used to keep in contact with JR regarding the Paypal donation button on the website13:20
clivejowould you take this on?13:20
clivejoand make sure this is up to date - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Y0g-lWr8QSom6ZbfjgFt0pYRb-930FtO_egC_UhP9WQ/edit#gid=013:21
clivejoThe last Paypal withdrawal was 17/2/2016 and there is quite a sizable sum in there13:22
clivejoHe will send you a screen shot of Paypal account13:28
acheronukclivejo: maybe. can't try to make sense of it today.13:33
acheronukmaybe deal with this when he is back from canoeing the nile, or whatever13:38
clivejoyeah for some reason submitting my self assessment made me think about it13:40
clivejoanyways I'll leave you with it, cheerio13:55
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> Quite a bit in there for Kubuntu.15:13
IrcsomeBot1<acheronuk> @ahoneybun, I would like to understand how that figure was arrived at. Not that I don't trust it, but you know what I mean.15:43
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> Yea I get you. We should find some use for some funds.16:05
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> Maybe the devs need a machine to run local builds?16:05
IrcsomeBot1<acheronuk> As Launchpad is still ****ed waiting for spectre microcode fixes? LOL16:09
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> I know we need to handle the server costs somehow once Linode is over16:12
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> @ahoneybun, I could see it being used in the case where Ubuntu doesn't approve funding requests to go to conferences16:19
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> well we can't do what we do without servers16:19
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> I think that should be top usecase for the funds.16:19
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> Right16:20
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> But we already have those...16:20
IrcsomeBot1<acheronuk> @ahoneybun, define local builds?16:26
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> @tsimonq2, but Linode is not renewing next year.16:29
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> @acheronuk, image a machine that you can build all of the packages on16:29
IrcsomeBot1<acheronuk> I can build them all here. Just would take for *ever*16:30
IrcsomeBot1<acheronuk> so you mean a mini build farm or do builder setup?16:31
yofelwould be something worth thinking about - we just need to decide how it should look like: CI exclusive like neon, or using a dediated scheduler (which would need some kind of API to jenkins) that allowes manual uploads16:33
IrcsomeBot1<acheronuk> at the moment with launchpad, I am about ready to just give up on 18.04. it's just useless, and canonical don't seem to be able to find their backsides with their hands to fix the capacity problems16:33
yofelAs for server costs, I would delete linode once it runs out, there are more cost efficient options - either dedicated servers or cheaper cloud providers like scaleway16:34
IrcsomeBot1<acheronuk> only way I got stuff done lately is to build in the ninja ppa to get buiold priority, then copy to a normal ppa to QA16:35
IrcsomeBot1<acheronuk> yeah. linode is nice, but seems paying over the odds if we have to pay the bill. like paying for a premium brand, when actually the value one is 95% as good16:36
yofelto be honest, if anything the build farm has regressed to ~2010 levels. Back then - when the PPA builders were seperate from the archive ones - build queues of 2 days were not really uncommon16:45
yofelthe private PPA was the only reason we got anything done16:45
yofelas for linode: this is how much we're actually using it: https://kyofel.de/owncloud/index.php/s/r90ABiDbFJgJ9Wp16:46
yofeli.e. 99.15% idle16:46
yofelwhen the CI is running properly it's better, but still around 95%16:46
IrcsomeBot1<acheronuk> we could use it more, but I either dont know how, or am reluctant to spend time setting things up on a service we know we are going to lose16:49
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> I'm up for going to a different hosting17:10
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> but it's something we should look at before the Linode runs out not when it does.17:10
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> So I have an interesting offer19:16
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> Altispeed, my employer, hosts some Lubuntu infrastructure at the moment19:17
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> He's asked me to let him know if I need any more servers for anything else because apparently it's been hugely successful for marketing19:17
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> He's willing to offer a server of any size for the Kubuntu team with no expiration date on how long we can have it given that we put Altispeed's name somewhere on the site (maybe the footer)19:18
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> ("he" being @Kernellinux)19:19
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> @ahoneybun @acheronuk Interested?19:19
IrcsomeBot1<ahoneybun> I don't see a problem we do it for Linode now.19:40
IrcsomeBot1<tsimonq2> Alright.19:44
acheronuk[16:57] <acheronuk> any eta on getting capacity back on the build farm. I am guessing not, but ask on the off chance21:23
acheronuk[17:00] * mpt (~mpt@canonical/mpt) has joined21:23
acheronuk[17:14] <cjwatson> The ball remains in the CPU vendors' courts.21:23
acheronukat this point I am serious tempted to just go over the road and just do Neon fixes until May21:24
valorieis it very difficult to get our linode to do what we now rely on the builders to do?21:30
valorieor just skip directly to scaleway, or take Altispeed up on their offer?21:31
valorieI guess that question is both for yofel and acheronuk21:33
valorieand maybe tsimonq221:33
valorietsimonq2: could you get a firm offer from your boss and send it to the list?21:33
tsimonq2valorie: It's the other way around I think; Altispeed will provide whatever Kubuntu needs/21:41
valorieok, but getting that offer to the list would be good21:42
valoriebecause I assume a short discussion would get us to a "we need this, this and this, as soon as possible"21:43
valorieso we can start setting stuff up21:43
valorieI know that neon does a lot of stuff with droplets21:43
tsimonq2valorie: For what it's worth, Launchpad's builders can't be replaced by our own infra. Maybe for KCI we could make it work, but ultimately we need it for archive stuff.21:44
valoriebut the tooling to do all that seems very involved21:44
valoriethey can't?21:44
valoriesplain why21:44
valorieI mean I understand they they need to build things on their own servers21:45
tsimonq2That's it, for the archive.21:45
valoriebut we could certainly build ourselves first and resolve problems, right?21:45
valoriewhich is the CI21:45
valoriebuild problems and autotest issues21:45
tsimonq2We could set up our own infra solely for KCI but I'm unsure the time spent is worth the gain.21:46
valoriewhere do we run KCI now?21:46
tsimonq2On Blue Systems' infra iirc.21:47
valoriewhat do we do on linode now?21:47
tsimonq2iirc just workspaces for developers21:47
valorieI see21:49
valorieso, what Santa_ is doing on his uni server is more what I was thinking of, I guess?21:49
valoriebuilding and doing the auto-tests21:50
tsimonq2Yeah, we could do that.21:50
acheronuksanta doesn't seem to be doing anything now21:50
valorieit just seems to me that if we could feed our stuff *somewhere* and move it along21:51
valorieinstead of waitingwaitingwaiting21:51
valoriethis wouldn't be so frustrating21:51
acheronuknight all21:51
tsimonq2Honestly Valorie, I see that as the only option at the moment.21:51
tsimonq2acheronuk: o/21:51
tsimonq2We have to wait for this thing to be patched.21:51
tsimonq2The build farm is only crippled, but it's superslow.21:52
valorieif our stuff was already fixed before hitting their builders, perhaps we would have a better reputation with the release team21:52
tsimonq2Which is why I am starting to spark discussions regarding giving everyone in ~ubuntu-dev Bileto access.21:52
valoriewhat does that access allow?21:53
valorieniters acheronuk21:53
tsimonq2It allows access to CI Train PPAs which have a full suite of automated tests and everything that would be ran if uploaded directly to the archive.21:53
acheronukI will go in a sec, lol21:53
tsimonq2Once everything is tested, you press one button and sources + binaries are copied to the archive.21:54
valoriethat would be awesome21:54
valoriewhy don't we have access to that NOW?21:54
acheronukand then all the tests that did pass, fail21:54
tsimonq2I've convinced them to give me access to do Qt transitions but other than that, only Core Developers have access to it otherwise.21:54
valorieacheronuk: lol21:54
tsimonq2acheronuk: hah21:54
acheronukbecause someone uploaded broken stuff in the meantime21:55
valorieso I guess riddell always had access to that21:55
valorieand since he was an AA, everything was painless21:55
* valorie shakes her fist at the universe21:56
valorieso unfair21:56
valorieah well21:56
* acheronuk shakes fist at main and multiverse21:56
tsimonq2I totally blame Intel for this (excuse my french) bullshit.21:56
tsimonq2acheronuk: hahahahahaha21:56
acheronukbut mostly universe21:56
tsimonq2valorie: Had this not been disclosed early, things would be fine.21:57
valoriewhoever let that out.....21:57
valoriewell, Intel scientists were monumentally arrogant21:58
tsimonq2I agree.21:58
acheronuktsimonq2: doubt that would have got the microcode updates out by now, unless those spectre vulns would have still been under wraps21:58
tsimonq2acheronuk: They released it a week early.21:58
tsimonq2They expected to have that long.21:58
valoriesort of a double-edged sword though21:58
valoriethe builders wouldn't have been shut down21:59
valorieand perhaps those vulns would have been baked in for even longer21:59
acheronuktsimonq2: yes, and nearly a moth later, things are still borked, and would have been on that basis, even it not leaked21:59
tsimonq2All of this is frustrating.22:00
tsimonq2I'm Frustrated.22:00
acheronukinitial crap was the early release, but now there is not that excuse22:00
tsimonq2This release cycle...22:00
tsimonq2like holy shite22:00
valorieI have no clue why they don't replace the crippled machines22:01
tsimonq2It doesn't work like that.22:01
acheronukI though it was bad last year waiting for gpgme to get fixed!22:01
valoriejesus, canonical is in the BUSINESS of providing that stuff22:01
tsimonq2valorie: Canonical has said multiple times, the machines that are open for building already have patches. Blame Intel and AMD for taking so long.22:02
tsimonq2They've done what they can.22:02
tsimonq2We should stop giving them a hard time about it.22:02
tsimonq2They've done what they can.22:02
valoriethey could provide more patched machines22:02
valoriethat's what they DO22:02
tsimonq2It doesn't work like that; they already have a set of machines, and they have a limited budget to that department.22:03
tsimonq2I've had these conversations.22:03
tsimonq2I've asked the exact same things.22:03
acheronukI've not heard of any other distro being so crippled22:03
tsimonq2There's nothing they can do at the moment.22:03
tsimonq2acheronuk: They have a different build infrastructure.22:03
acheronukOBS seems to being going as normal22:03
valoriethere's nothing they WILL do at the moment22:04
valorieI get that22:04
valoriethat's why it's so frustrating22:04
acheronukseems a case of sit on their hands and wait for someone else to fix it22:04
acheronukI am probbaly being mean, but I'm starting to not care22:05
valoriesuse and redhat are not suffering that I've heard22:05
valorieor for that matter, microsoft or apple22:05
valorieor google, or amazon22:05
* acheronuk wonders if we could submit our stuff to OBS. lol22:05
valoriewe can22:05
valorieprobably more trouble than it's worth22:06
tsimonq2Y'all are frustrating me.22:06
acheronukthat would be funny. and very sad22:06
valoriebut anybody can22:06
acheronuktsimonq2: join the club22:06
valorietsimonq2: this is the universe we live in, and those are the rules22:07
valoriebut the next universe over doesn't seem to have quite the same limitations22:07
valoriealso I missed seeing the lunar eclipse because CLOUDS22:08
acheronuk+++Divide By Cucumber Error. Please Reinstall Universe And Reboot +++22:08
acheronuk^^^ Pratchett22:08
tsimonq2There's nothing we can do. I'm moving on with my life, and I'll come back if there's any hope.22:08
valorieRIP Pratchett!22:08
tsimonq2I've accepted this,22:08
valorieoh, me too22:08
valorieI hope we can fix some papercuts while we're waiting22:09
tsimonq2E: No time22:10
acheronukI've been tinkering with Neon the last few weeks, and honestly think maybe I can be more productive over there.22:11
acheronukcanonical seems to be on a suicide mission with their attitute22:12
acheronukubuntu itself may scrape by, but screw the rest22:13
acheronukok. going now. lol22:14
valoriebye acheronuk22:15
valoriehope you are feeling more hopeful about kubuntu later22:15
acheronukI hope so too23:17

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