[07:20] <oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
[07:21] <Nafallo> morn' o/
[07:22] <Nafallo> I need coffee
[07:23] <oSoMoN> hey Nafallo
[07:23] <oSoMoN> tough morning?
[07:24] <Nafallo> every morning is ;-)
[07:24] <Nafallo> at least before the first four or five espressos :-P
[07:28] <oSoMoN> :)
[07:29] <Nafallo> meh. "hey google, what week is it" "according to wikipedia, a week is a time unit equal to seven days"
[07:30] <Nafallo> bah
[07:31] <Nafallo> hmm. can I get week numbers on the desktop? :-)
[07:31] <duflu> Nafallo, gnome-tweak-tool > Top Bar
[07:31] <duflu> Morning oSoMoN, Nafallo
[07:32] <oSoMoN> good afternoon duflu
[07:32]  * oSoMoN → school
[07:33] <duflu> As it happens, it is also end-of-school time right now
[07:33] <duflu> :)
[07:33] <Nafallo> duflu: cheers, or in ansible: dconf: key="/org/gnome/desktop/calendar/show-weekdate" value=true state=present
[07:33] <Nafallo> ;-)
[07:34] <duflu> Nafallo, Yes, just not in "Linux for human beings" :)
[07:35] <Nafallo> except it didn't work :-P
[07:35] <Nafallo> haha
[07:35] <duflu> Well, the GUI works
[07:36] <Nafallo> hmm, it was "['true']" as well ;-)
[07:36] <Nafallo> this early in the morning, and Australians call me non-human ;-)
[07:37] <duflu> To be fair, you might be a bot
[07:37] <duflu> And so might I
[07:37] <Nafallo> hmm, true. you started after I left :-P
[07:38] <duflu> Nafallo, 2011/2012?
[07:38] <Nafallo> I think I left 2012...
[07:38] <duflu> Well then, let us marvel at our collective bot AI
[07:39] <Nafallo> oh, hi google ;-)
[07:42] <Nafallo> hmm. logout/login needed it seems.
[09:01] <Laney> ahoy
[09:02] <duflu> Ahoy Laney
[09:02] <duflu> And hello seb128
[09:03] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[09:03] <seb128> hey duflu
[09:03] <seb128> how is everyone today?
[09:03] <duflu> Hi seb128, good. Hangout?
[09:03] <seb128> yeah, on my way
[09:08] <oSoMoN> good morning Laney, seb128
[09:08] <seb128> lut oSoMoN
[09:11] <Laney> hey seb128 duflu oSoMoN
[09:11] <seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
[09:14] <Laney> seb128: good!
[09:14] <Laney> my shoulder aches, just tried to do the maximum number of reps on my physio stuff
[09:14] <Laney> feels goooooooooooooooooooood
[09:14] <Laney> you?
[09:15] <seb128> I'm good, could have slept a bit longer though :)
[09:15] <Laney> watching the olympics right?
[09:15] <Laney> ;-)
[09:16]  * Laney has been following the curling
[09:16] <seb128> I didn't watch much, I should
[09:16] <seb128> at least hockey and curling
[09:20] <seb128> looking at the sponsoring queue, Laney could you have a look to bug #1744941 / help Trevinho to land that fix?
[09:20] <ubot5`> bug 1744941 in appstream-glib (Ubuntu) "gnome-software crashes in as_app_parse_desktop_file" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1744941
[09:29] <willcooke> morning all
[09:29] <duflu> Morning willcooke
[09:30] <willcooke> Good show with Linux Unplugged last night, hopefully that will help dispel some of the FUD and BS
[09:32] <duflu> Oh Will is famous. Again
[09:34] <seb128> hey willcooke
[09:34] <seb128> nice
[09:42] <jibel> willcooke, re your question about images not being promoted, this is caused by bug 1750403
[09:42] <ubot5`> bug 1750403 in casper (Ubuntu) "Live Session - Increased memory usage with preinstalled snap (fails to start with - gnome-session timeout)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1750403
[09:44] <willcooke> thanks jibel
[09:52] <jibel> Laney, i've the timeout again in a VM with 2GB of RAM, so it must be something else
[09:53] <jibel> the session fails to start, I'm dropped to the login screen, then I can login successfully
[09:53] <Nafallo> morning Laney seb128 willcooke :-)
[09:53] <Laney> jibel: interesting
[09:53] <willcooke> morning Nafallo
[09:54] <Laney> well maybe you can post the journal and systemd-analyze thing, might be something to spot in there
[09:54] <Laney> maybe your IO from the ISO is slower than mine or something
[09:54] <Laney> hey Nafallo
[09:55] <Nafallo> right. I suppose I should leave here and get ready to go work at the bank...
[09:56]  * Laney pictures Patrick Bateman
[09:58] <Laney> seb128: I replied on there
[09:58] <Laney> we should do patch piloting again
[09:59] <seb128> Laney, thx
[09:59] <seb128> hey Nafallo
[10:02] <duflu> \o/ All upstream developers satisfied at 6pm
[10:03]  * duflu goes to celebrate with dinner
[10:03] <seb128> duflu, well done, enjoy your evening!
[10:16] <willcooke> jamesh, hi!  Do you know what the current status of portals support in snapd is?  Is it imminent?
[10:16] <willcooke> bah, probably too late for today
[10:21] <willcooke> where it = will it get merged soon?
[10:22] <jamesh> willcooke: still haven't gotten the user-mounts feature required for document portal support landed.  There was a request for some extra security checks from jdstrand that we couldn't get working reliably.  zyga was going to do a partial merge of the non-controversial parts first though.
[10:23] <jamesh> willcooke: I've got a branch that adds everything but the document portal access to the desktop interface, but we can't easily turn on access to just some portals
[10:32] <willcooke> jamesh, got it, thanks
[10:35] <willcooke> jamesh, re: security checks - is that a blocker?
[10:36] <jamesh> willcooke: yes.  I asked jdstrand that when I first ran into trouble
[10:37] <willcooke> jamesh, oki, once kenvandine and jdstrand are online I'll chat with them (cc mvo)
[10:37] <jamesh> willcooke: essentially he wanted us to parse /proc/self/mountinfo to ensure that the result of the mount matched what was expected.
[10:38] <jamesh> willcooke: I could decode the data back to the original mount source in some cases, but in others I couldn't.
[10:39] <jamesh> the main problem was that for the mounts we want to perform, both the source and destination are controlled by the user
[10:39] <jamesh> so symlinks or race conditions could be used to redirect the mount elsewhere
[10:41] <willcooke> jamesh, are we at an impasse then?
[10:43] <jamesh> maybe.  Zygmunt was having another look at this, but I'm not sure if he got any further than I did.
[10:51] <seb128> jamesh, that sounds like things are stucked until/unless zyga or you find a way to resolve that problem?
[10:55] <jamesh> willcooke: thinking about it a bit more, I'll check with jdstrand to see whether verifying the mount point is enough.  It wouldn't protect against random other directories being mounted under $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR, but it would prevent replacing /etc, for instance
[11:01] <willcooke> jamesh, oki, fingers cross, thanks
[11:19] <jbicha> seb128: I'm dropping telepathy support from Ubuntu's GOA. Upstream disabled it by default in 3.26 but I overrode that, but it will be gone permanently in 3.30
[11:19] <jbicha> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2017-October/msg00040.html
[11:20] <seb128> jbicha, hey, fine, I don't think that stack still has many users
[11:30] <seb128> jbicha, when you wrote " 3) Drop support for the WOFF2 format in webkit2gtk", do you know
[11:30] <seb128> - if that's easy, like is that supported by the upstream build system?
[11:30] <seb128> - how used is WOFF2/how much of an impact that would have?
[11:31] <seb128> I guess that's only visible in webbrowser so wouldn't have much impact on the default installation?
[11:31] <Laney> can't reply to the community hub by email?
[11:32] <jbicha> Laney: no :(
[11:32] <Laney> good job I looked up before pressing send :P
[11:32] <seb128> willcooke, ^ known issue right?
[11:32] <seb128> the snapcraft instance allows that :/
[11:32] <willcooke> yeah, we've got an RT open
[11:32] <willcooke> and have done for some time
[11:33] <willcooke> grr
[11:33] <seb128> :/
[11:35] <Laney> moar score / discuss it in the IS liaison call
[11:35] <Laney> #internalchats
[11:35] <jbicha> seb128: it does look like there is a configure flag to disable woff2 in latest webkit2gtk
[11:35] <seb128> I didn't even know we had a such call :)
[11:35] <Laney> in #externalchats: inotify is a difficult API
[11:35] <seb128> jbicha, ok, good, so in any case the review is not blocking us
[11:36] <jbicha> websites need to offer a fallback to woff2 if they care about IE (but not Edge) https://caniuse.com/#feat=woff2
[11:36] <jbicha> it would still be a regression though
[11:36] <seb128> jbicha, but only impact "web" I guess?
[11:36] <jbicha> yes
[11:36] <seb128> k, doesn't sound like a blocker then
[11:36] <seb128> if we had to go that road
[11:37] <Laney> captive portal detector?
[11:37] <seb128> at least not blocking the update, we can re-enable the feature later once the MIRs are approved
[11:37] <jbicha> I pinged in #ubuntu-hardened yesterday and it turns out that the Canonical Security team was assigned to those 2 MIRS instead of Ubuntu Security so it wasn't on their list :(
[11:37] <seb128> jbicha, right, and it came back to us asking what are our priorities because they have quite some items in their backlog
[11:38] <jbicha> brotli and woff2 are technically already in main :|
[11:38] <seb128> that's not how things work
[11:39] <seb128> "they got in through a backdoor process" isn't a reason for not having them properly reviewed
[11:39] <jbicha> *cough* they are still in Firefox now…
[11:39] <seb128> what's your point?
[11:40] <seb128> we should downgrade firefox? or let them in without review just because firefox bundled them?
[11:40] <seb128> I mean you are arguing that having them properly reviewed is wrong or what are you trying to say?
[11:42] <willcooke> seb128, Laney - the hub is likely changing name again, so email replies can hopefully be part of that work
[11:42] <willcooke> hopefully be fixed as..
[11:42] <jbicha> seb128: it just annoys upstream when we diverge like this, but I don't have easy answers :(
[11:47] <seb128> jbicha, k, same then :)
[11:47] <seb128> jbicha, but don't worry, those are going to get reviewed, I'm just trying to make we sure we don't get blocked
[11:48] <seb128> jbicha, seems we are not, we can easily turn that off for a bit to unblock the update if needed (hopefully it isn't though)
[11:48] <jamesh> willcooke: Here's the post about handling themes in snaps: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/supporting-desktop-themes-via-the-content-interface/4122
[11:50] <jbicha> Trevinho: should I publish https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3161 ?
[11:52] <willcooke> thanks jamesh
[11:58] <willcooke> jamesh, great stuff :)
[12:51] <Trevinho> jbicha: no
[12:51] <Trevinho> It compiled fine only because there's gdb in the middle
[12:51] <Trevinho> Well when launching tests
[12:52] <jbicha> ok
[13:08] <tseliot> xnox: the new systemd doesn't seem to solve the problem
[13:09] <xnox> tseliot, yet stopping logind, allows you to unload the module, right?
[13:09] <xnox> tseliot, and/or stop and start logind (NB! not restart)
[13:09] <xnox> tseliot, maybe crank up the logging of all the things as well (debug in /etc/systemd/system.conf)
[13:10] <tseliot> xnox: yes, stopping systemd-logind allows me to unload the module
[13:10] <xnox> tseliot, *sigh*
[13:10] <xnox> tseliot, i think, i may have nvidia prime stuff laptop. but i typically purposefully disable nvidia in the bios.
[13:11] <xnox> tseliot, is there some guide, that i can follow to enable nvidia on Ubuntu and try to reproduce this all? I'm on bionic.
[13:11]  * xnox has never used anything nvidia, cause proprietary
[13:11] <xnox> tseliot, i guess it might be quicker for me to debug this stuff.
[13:13] <tseliot> xnox: do you have a laptop with intel and nvidia?
[13:15] <xnox> tseliot, i believe so, let me bring up a URL with specs. I have this one - http://www.dell.com/en-us/work/shop/dell-laptops-and-notebooks/xps-15/spd/xps-15-9560-laptop?view=configurations the third column. It sais it should have NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 with 4GB GDDR5
[13:15] <xnox> and it does have intel too, and i use intel-only at the moment.
[13:15] <xnox> but i have the uk model
[13:16] <tseliot> xnox: yes, that should do it
[13:16] <tseliot> xnox: of course you're going to have to enable nvidia from the BIOS, or undo whatever you did to disable nvidia
[13:16] <tseliot> then install nvidia-384
[13:16] <jbicha> seb128: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/webkit2gtk/2.19.91-1ubuntu1
[13:17] <seb128> jbicha, great :)
[13:17] <tseliot> xnox: then "sudo prime-select nvidia", and reboot (unless you're using mesa from -proposed)
[13:17] <jbicha> I didn't fully test build it becuase that takes hours but I think that will work for us for now
[13:19] <jbicha> but actually webkit2gtk built in less than an hour on s390x in my ppa https://blogs.gnome.org/mcatanzaro/2018/02/17/on-compiling-webkit-now-twice-as-fast/
[13:21] <seb128> jbicha, is there a packaging vcs?
[13:21] <seb128> jbicha, ignore that
[13:22] <seb128> https://anonscm.debian.org/git/pkg-webkit/webkit.git is right, it's just that the new version is in a branch
[13:22] <jbicha> yeah, it's a bit confusing
[13:25] <seb128> jbicha, looking at https://anonscm.debian.org/git/pkg-webkit/webkit.git/commit/?h=wk2/experimental&id=8ec6b681 some symbols were added when it was turned off ... so let's see if that's an issue
[13:28] <jdstrand> willcooke (cc jamesh, and kenvandine): fyi, zyga took over the per-user mounts branch for portals. he isn't in this channel, so probably need to talk in #nappy, but it is his highest priority
[13:29] <xnox> tseliot, i have a team meeting, and then i will play with this. please bear with me.
[13:30] <willcooke> thanks jdstrand, did you see jamesh previous comments on the security aspects?  Is that all related to the work zyga was doing?
[13:31] <willcooke> I understand that he's off sick today, so just want to get things straight in my head today if poss
[13:35] <jdstrand> willcooke: that is precisely what zyga is working on. he has already given me PRs to review (which I did), doing some rfactors (in progress), trying different approaches to avoid the race at all (in progress) and is confident we can fallback to 'check after' approach if his experiments don't pan out
[13:35] <willcooke> jdstrand, got it, thanks very much
[13:38] <jdstrand> willcooke: as for mounting underneath, users shouldn't be able to race a predictable file/dir name (that is the existing issue). if portals itself (which does the mounts) can be raced/etc, then that would be a bug in portals that should be reported
[13:51] <tseliot> xnox: no problem
[13:56] <kenvandine> jdstrand, thx
[14:28] <seb128> jbicha, seems like webkitgtk builds fine ;)
[14:50] <kenvandine> jbicha, about bug 1750382 how do you feel about sticking with 0.11 for 18.04?
[14:50] <kenvandine> i'm inclined to say it's fine
[15:04] <oSoMoN> kenvandine, I'm preparing a new upload for libreoffice 6.0 with a patch that disables the failing autopkgtest, will you be able to upload it for me when it's ready?
[15:06] <kenvandine> oSoMoN, sure
[15:07] <oSoMoN> thanks
[15:07] <oSoMoN> it should be ready soon
[15:26] <oSoMoN> kenvandine, ready at https://people.canonical.com/~osomon/libreoffice-6.0.1/bionic/0ubuntu2/
[15:27] <kenvandine> oSoMoN, i'm on it
[15:27] <oSoMoN> thanks
[15:31] <oSoMoN> ricotz, FYI, to unblock the migration: https://git.launchpad.net/~libreoffice/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/commit/?id=90fd3ce6645729ad57c6f043b3316bcb47f85097
[16:22] <jbicha> kenvandine: 0.11 will be harder to justify for SRUs if anyone wants to work on them
[16:23] <jbicha> on the other hand, like I said before Debian/Ubuntu were the only distros I know that of that used the 0.8 LTS series
[16:23] <jbicha> and people complained about that
[16:24] <kenvandine> yeah
[16:24] <Trevinho> seb128, jbicha: once ppa binaries have been published you can now publish this please https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3138
[16:25] <jbicha> kenvandine: ask Alex what he recommends then?
[16:25] <ahayzen> jbicha, 0.11 with the possibility of 1.X SRU later ;-)
[16:26] <ahayzen> also, you might have issues contacting Alex for two weeks https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/flatpak/2018-February/000946.html
[16:26] <kenvandine> hey ahayzen!
[16:26] <ahayzen> kenvandine, o/
[16:26] <jbicha> ahayzen: Flatpak's biggest problem in Ubuntu is it needs an Ubuntu developer using it, to make sure things work and make sure SRUs are ok
[16:26] <jbicha> I don't use Flatpak so that's not me
[16:27] <ahayzen> right, i've been using it and submitting bugs/fixes where appropriate if i can. But guess it needs an official maintainer
[16:27] <kenvandine> me either
[16:27] <kenvandine> ahayzen, sounds like you win :)
[16:27] <ahayzen> hah, did i win beer ?
[16:28] <kenvandine> you can help maintain it :)
[16:28] <jbicha> part of the problem finding Ubuntu developers is that a major use case for Flatpak is running latest version of apps, but that's mostly satisfied by running Ubuntu's dev release
[16:28] <kenvandine> or maybe let us know when it breaks
[16:28] <ahayzen> happy to help were appropriate, but i may lack maintainer knowledge
[16:38] <ricotz> oSoMoN, thanks
[16:39] <kenvandine> oSoMoN, sponsored
[16:42] <ahayzen> kenvandine, what sort of thing would be involved if one did want to become a maintainer/help out with SRUs ? I assume syncing packaging for future releases, fixing autopkgtests, testing the packages in -proposed etc, looking for issues? (is there a Wiki with this info)
[16:45] <kenvandine> most of those things
[16:45] <kenvandine> the primary key is someone that would notice there are bugs
[16:45] <kenvandine> and help test those in an SRU
[16:45] <kenvandine> even better would be actually handling the SRU of the package
[16:45] <kenvandine> that would rock
[16:45] <kenvandine> i'd be happy to sponsor such package updates
[16:46] <kenvandine> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
[16:46] <kenvandine> ahayzen, ^^ has the rationale and the steps (rather verbose)
[16:48] <ahayzen> kenvandine, interesting, would be happy to help. thanks for the link
[16:48] <kenvandine> ahayzen, awesome!
[16:49] <kenvandine> ahayzen, maybe you could comment on bug 1750382 mentioning you are willing to help look after it in ubuntu
[16:50] <ahayzen> kenvandine, sure
[16:54] <oSoMoN> kenvandine, thanks!
[17:00] <jbicha> ahayzen: Ubuntu 17.10's Flatpak needs to be updated if you want to work on that… :)
[17:01] <kenvandine> jbicha, throw him into the fire :)
[17:01] <jbicha> this is how it starts
[17:02] <ahayzen> as in to 0.8.9? from 0.8.7
[17:02] <jbicha> yes
[17:04] <jbicha> in 2011, Seb's like "you could help work on GNOME3 packaging in the GNOME3 PPA"  ok.  and then later "you could start a GNOME flavor of Ubuntu"  well, ok…
[17:04] <jbicha> and this is where we end up
[17:04] <ahayzen> kenvandine, are you uploading them manually at the moment? rather than having a branch somewhere with recipies/bileto linked?
[17:04] <kenvandine> jbicha, and it's awesome right? :-D
[17:04] <kenvandine> ahayzen, yeah
[17:05] <jbicha> kenvandine: mostly, this is the crazy part of the release cycle :)
[17:05] <kenvandine> jbicha, but debian has it in gitlab
[17:05] <ahayzen> gitlab \o/ \o/
[17:05] <jbicha> break all the things
[17:05] <kenvandine> jbicha, it is crazy time :)
[17:05] <kenvandine> ahayzen, so you could create git branches somewhere if you like
[17:05] <ahayzen> ok, i'll try and take a look when i get a moment :-) see if i can figure anything out
[17:06] <jbicha> ahayzen: you can fork from https://salsa.debian.org/debian/flatpak
[17:06] <ahayzen> ah cool :-)
[17:07] <jbicha> smcv (the Debian maintainer) would love to have team maintainers help out so I'm sure you could get commit privileges there once you've done some packaging work
[17:08] <kenvandine> that would be awesome :)
[17:08] <jbicha> bileto is mostly only used for Unity stuff (and it's optional there currently)
[17:08] <kenvandine> ahayzen, everyone would love to know someone is looking after it in ubuntu
[17:11] <ahayzen> cool, i'll take a look, thanks for the pointers :-)
[18:01] <oSoMoN> time for some real-life activities, have a good evening everyone!
[19:00] <willcooke> EOD time, night all
[20:39] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, I was playing around yesterday and made a thing (https://github.com/robert-ancell/snapper). What's the easiest way to get that onto the Snap store - it would need classic
[20:53] <kenvandine> robert_ancell, is that just a cli tool for querying?
[20:56] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, no, that's a GUI app that shows installed snaps, has searches and does install/remove. The only delays are the search round-trip and the async icon loading (though that will be invisible once I put in an icon cache).
[20:56] <robert_ancell> I'm half done putting in the PK support
[20:57] <kenvandine> neat
[20:57] <kenvandine> do you want me to snap it up?
[20:57] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, yes please. It needs the latest snapd-glib so if you could bundle that in that would be helpful
[20:58] <kenvandine> sure
[20:59] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, I'd like to use it to show what performance we could get and if we can ship it as a snap that would make it super easy for others to see
[20:59] <kenvandine> indeed
[21:34] <kenvandine> robert_ancell, can you please register snapper in the store and add me as a collaborator?
[21:34] <kenvandine> i'll handle getting it packaged
[21:34]  * kenvandine has a build going already
[21:35] <kenvandine> robert_ancell, i'll also submit a PR on github when it's ready
[21:38] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, hmm already registered
[21:38] <kenvandine> oh?
[21:39] <kenvandine> or is it reserved?
[21:39] <kenvandine> they pre-reserved names of packages in the archive as well as some other variations
[21:39] <kenvandine> i believe
[21:39] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, yeah, there's an archive package called snapper
[21:39] <kenvandine> ah
[21:40] <kenvandine> well, you could startout calling it snapper-robert :)
[21:40] <robert_ancell> and snapper-store is reserved too!
[21:40] <kenvandine> wouldn't be the first
[21:40] <kenvandine> snapper-desktop?
[21:40] <kenvandine> desktop-snapper?
[21:41] <robert_ancell> robert-ancell-snapper it is
[21:42] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, where do I set you as a collaborator?
[21:42] <robert_ancell> might have to upload a version first?
[21:42] <kenvandine> "Collaboration"
[21:42] <kenvandine> oh, you don't see that?
[21:42] <kenvandine> ugh...
[21:43] <kenvandine> I'll send you a snap you can download then :)
[21:43] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, this is on dashboard.snapcraft.io ?
[21:43] <kenvandine> yes
[21:43] <kenvandine> Do you see "Overview" ?
[21:44] <kenvandine> indeed
[21:44] <kenvandine> you don't get those controls until it's been uploaded
[21:44] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, it just has "view snap upload instructions". I can't click on it like the other snaps I've already uploaded
[21:44] <kenvandine> yeah
[21:44] <kenvandine> i'll send you something you can upload tomorrow
[21:44] <robert_ancell> kenvandine, just PR in the snacraft stuff and I can build and upload right?
[21:45] <kenvandine> yeah
[21:45] <kenvandine> it'll be faster if you don't bother with the cleanbuild part
[21:45] <kenvandine> i'll do all that and send you the snap to push