[01:39] <bluesabre> ochosi, flocculant: interested in adding the notification plugin to the panel?
[01:39] <Unit193> Hmm?
[01:44] <bluesabre> Unit193: xfce4-notifyd includes a panel plugin
[02:42] <bluesabre> flocculant: is this one fixed now? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1047384
[02:47] <bluesabre> full release note updated, https://wiki.xubuntu.org/releases/18.04/release-notes
[02:51] <bluesabre> Trying my best to just login to the ubuntu wiki now
[03:00] <bluesabre> ochosi: that adwaita screen looks great :)
[03:03] <bluesabre> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BionicBeaver/Beta1 updated with a link to our release note
[04:55] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xubuntu-default-settings:: [trunk] r665 Launchpad automatic translations update. (by Launchpad Translations on behalf of xubuntu-dev)
[05:50] <rev2k> Hey everyone, im trying to join some of the translation projects on transifex.com/xfce . I can see English (Australia) in the list that still has strings to translate, although when I try to join the team and choose English (Australia), it isnt in the drop down, only English UK and English Canada
[06:09] <ochosi> bluesabre: i personally am a fan of adding that plugin by default. gives quick access to DND mode, which is nice. but then again i'm probably biased since i'm the author ;)
[07:07] <ochosi> bluesabre: btw, i know i've created quite a few reviews for you, if you want me to hand them to someone else that's ok too (xfce4-settings, greeter etc)
[07:24] <flocculant> bluesabre: re notify plugin - I'm good if people want to add it
[07:27] <flocculant> thanks for doing release note stuff
[07:34] <flocculant> bluesabre: just to be certain cleared all the cache/config/local parole places - still no play button issue 
[07:47] <flocculant> bluesabre: shifted issues to top of release note
[08:22] <flocculant> bluesabre: well - we got some new names on the tracker \o/
[08:22] <flocculant> I'll follow any bugs they reported and try to triage them and shout if needed
[10:53] <knome> ochosi, yep, it's all done and now marked as such
[10:54] <bluesabre> ochosi: sorry about that, got caught up with other things
[10:59] <flocculant>  hi knome bluesabre 
[10:59] <bluesabre> hi flocculant 
[11:00] <flocculant> rn looks nice with all that stuffs :)
[11:00] <bluesabre> thanks
[11:01] <bluesabre> took longer than expected, but should get anybody up-to-date with the beta
[11:01] <flocculant> bluesabre: you want a vid of parole not playing a vid - play button thing
[11:01] <flocculant> if I get a mirror perhaps you could have an infinite one :D
[11:02] <bluesabre> lol
[11:02] <bluesabre> nah, I should be able to dig into it from the bug report
[11:02] <flocculant> ok :)
[11:03] <flocculant> bluesabre: did you see discussion in here last night re the slow desktop thing?
[11:05] <bluesabre> I think so... seemed like we didn't get anywhere
[11:09] <flocculant> yea - that's the one ...
[11:11] <flocculant> I guess we could release note it as a 'note'
[11:11] <flocculant> given that the 2nd login appears to be ok
[11:12] <bluesabre> Yeah, that seems fair
[11:13] <bluesabre> ali1234 is usually pretty good about debugging things like that
[11:13] <flocculant> right
[11:14] <ali1234> 90 seconds to log in the first time?
[11:15] <flocculant> ish
[11:15] <bluesabre> :)
[11:15] <ali1234> xubuntu doesn't use systemd for session login yet, right?
[11:15] <flocculant> ali1234: which suspiciously iirc is systemd default timeout or something 
[11:15] <ali1234> right
[11:16] <ali1234> you could check "systemd-analyze blame" but it might not tell you anything useful about the user's session
[11:16] <flocculant> ali1234: yea it doesn't
[11:16] <ali1234> is it reproducible in virtualbox?
[11:16] <flocculant> can't remember tbh - I use kvm
[11:16] <bluesabre> it is
[11:17] <ali1234> what's the exact steps to reproduce and when exactly does it happen?
[11:17] <ali1234> is it before or after the login screen?
[11:19] <bluesabre> I believe it only happens on live cd boot and on first login on an installed system. After the first login it's normal.
[11:20] <flocculant> ali1234: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/YPNCQ2Nd2B/
[11:20] <ali1234> can you try making a new user account and logging in to it?
[11:20] <flocculant> wasn't 90s last night
[11:20] <flocculant> ali1234: in an installed version? 
[11:20] <flocculant> can do that now pretty swiftly
[11:21] <ali1234> yeah, i mean: do first log in, see 90 second delay, reboot, login, no delay, make new user, log in as new user. do you get the delay?
[11:21] <flocculant> oh - not got time to do that right now - off out pretty shortly
[11:21] <ali1234> if you do, it's something in the default user profile
[11:22] <flocculant> ack
[11:22] <ali1234> most likely something missing which gets created after the first login
[11:22] <flocculant> I can check that out later
[11:23] <flocculant> bluesabre ali1234 - when I've done it I'll ping result
[11:41] <ali1234> hmm
[11:42] <ali1234> "Failed to send D-Bus message Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply,... etc"
[11:46] <ali1234> is there a way to login on console on the livecd?
[11:49] <ali1234> hmm i think this is it
[11:50] <ali1234> ERROR:dbus.proxies:Introspect error on org.bluez [blah blah] Failed to activate service 'org.bluez': timed out (service_start_timeout=25000ms)
[11:50] <ali1234> and it tried 3 times, so 75 seconds, which is what i measured the delay as
[11:50] <knome> hooray ali1234 :)
[11:52] <flocculant> ali1234: awesoome - thanks :)
[11:53] <ali1234> (also i have no bluetooth icon, not sure if that's expected as i have no bluetooth hardware in the VM)
[11:53] <ali1234> that error is in ~/.xsession-errors btw
[11:54] <ali1234> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/2HW5944kpG
[11:55] <flocculant> ali1234: I see it in xsession-errors.old in the install from last night - missing from xsession-errors there
[11:55] <ali1234> basically lines 54 to 60
[11:55] <flocculant> can paste them if they're any use
[11:56] <flocculant> and yea - it tried 3 times
[11:56] <ali1234> so out of interest, is that blueman PyGIWarning present in your latest logs?
[11:57] <ali1234> it could be related if somehow the wrong version is loading
[11:57] <flocculant> not locally - but present in errors.old 
[11:58] <flocculant> not in the xsession-errors there
[11:58] <ali1234> do you have bluetooth hardware and/or a bluetooth indicator icon?
[11:58] <flocculant> no hardware - can't remember what was on that install panel
[11:59] <flocculant> certainly not locally - all removed
[12:00] <flocculant> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/7Zyv2kpZHz/
[12:01] <flocculant> from last nights install, which had 2 boots only
[12:01] <flocculant> off now for a while
[12:04] <ali1234> so in the livecd session if i kill blueman-applet and restart it, it times out again
[12:07] <ali1234> bug 1533206 seems related
[12:07] <ali1234> previously it would crash if you had no bluetooth hardware... seems now it just hangs for 75 seconds :(
[12:13] <knome> phew... good thing i have bt stuff :P
[12:13] <knome> joking aside, bbl
[14:51] <knome> slickymasterWork, would you be around at 16UTCish?
[14:53] <slickymasterWork> yep
[14:53] <slickymasterWork> but just until 17:45 UTC, knome 
[14:53] <slickymasterWork> have to pick up little at 18:00 at school
[14:53] <slickymasterWork> + one
[15:10] <FurretUber> Hi, is this bug: https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13979 planned to be corrected for 18.04 release?
[15:14] <knome> slickymasterWork, ok, then let's start the sprint then as i have unexpected alone time home at that point and "nothing" (yeah right) to do
[16:03] <slickymasterWork> I'm going to need a few more minutes knome, please
[16:04] <knome> slickymasterWork, sure, np
[16:04] <knome> (and me too kind of, wife and son are still in the progress of leaving)
[16:07] <knome> ok, i'm free
[16:07] <knome> i mean alone
[16:07] <knome> :P
[16:10] <slickymasterWork> ok knome 
[16:10] <slickymasterWork> shall we start
[16:10] <slickymasterWork> ?
[16:10] <knome> sure
[16:11] <knome> so, what do *you* have in mind for this cycle?
[16:11] <slickymasterWork> installer first?
[16:11] <knome> whichever order
[16:11] <slickymasterWork> you said you had some changes in mind you'd like to propose
[16:11] <slickymasterWork> namely graphically wise
[16:12] <knome> yes
[16:12] <slickymasterWork> specifically what?
[16:12] <knome> i'm just pulling my branch to see where that is at
[16:12] <knome> well the main thing being "let's make it smaller"
[16:12] <slickymasterWork> let me fire up a VM so I can see it also
[16:12] <knome> https://code.launchpad.net/~knome/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/xubuntu-1804
[16:12] <slickymasterWork> I'll have to do some RDP for that
[16:13] <knome> fun
[16:13] <slickymasterWork> well, it's work 
[16:13] <knome> do you want to discuss the other things while things are rolling?O
[16:13] <slickymasterWork> only Linux here, besides that machine is server
[16:13] <slickymasterWork> yep
[16:13] <slickymasterWork> regarding the end user docs I don't have, or plan any major revamps
[16:14] <knome> at this point that would be outrageous anyway :P
[16:14] <slickymasterWork> or better, not thinking in altering them just for the sake of it
[16:14] <knome> visually, i'm ok with them as they are
[16:14] <slickymasterWork> same here
[16:14] <knome> at some point i'll probably update them but that's a longer term plan
[16:14] <slickymasterWork> I already add the mate apps changes
[16:14] <knome> and is related to website
[16:14] <slickymasterWork> hm hm
[16:15] <slickymasterWork> did you have anything in mind, regarding the -docs
[16:15] <slickymasterWork> other than that?
[16:15] <knome> no, not really
[16:16] <knome> the poking was just to make sure you handle your responsibilities :P
[16:16] <knome> or if you can't that i know to make it happen otherwise
[16:16] <slickymasterWork> :P
[16:16] <slickymasterWork> it's true I've been pretty swallowed up here at work
[16:17] <slickymasterWork> it will be worst in the near future
[16:17] <knome> it's ok, the comment wasn't meant to be as snarky as it came out..
[16:17] <slickymasterWork> but by no means I'm planning on leaving this boat
[16:17] <knome> so if we're sure all changes in all packages are covered in docs, then they are fine
[16:18] <knome> i think we also removed all mentions to release
[16:18] <knome> or if there was something, updated them, so it's good
[16:19] <slickymasterWork> all the changes, release wise, are already in the -docs
[16:19] <slickymasterWork> I think we're not missing anything new
[16:19] <knome> apart from an upload
[16:20] <slickymasterWork> not sure I understood you now
[16:20] <slickymasterWork> what do you mean by an upload?
[16:20] <knome> package upload
[16:20] <knome> wait
[16:20] <slickymasterWork> the -docs package?
[16:20] <knome> yes
[16:21] <slickymasterWork> I can't upload it
[16:21] <slickymasterWork> lack the permission
[16:21] <knome> i know
[16:21] <knome> but we need that done
[16:21] <slickymasterWork> that's generally bluesabre doing
[16:21] <knome> yes
[16:21] <knome> :P
[16:21] <slickymasterWork> bluesabre ^^
[16:21] <slickymasterWork> ;)
[16:21] <knome> bluesabre, assigned to you on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/xubuntu-b-documentation
[16:22] <slickymasterWork> right
[16:22] <knome> bluesabre, i'll look at the source to make sure it's smooth for you
[16:22] <slickymasterWork> BB is booting
[16:22] <knome> bluesabre, eg. changelogs done
[16:22] <slickymasterWork> I think the changelog is in condition
[16:23] <knome> apparently so
[16:23] <slickymasterWork> :)
[16:23] <slickymasterWork> does have his moments 
[16:23] <knome> hah
[16:23] <knome> :P
[16:23] <knome> anyway
[16:23] <knome> the installer slideshow
[16:23] <knome> it's relatively bare atm
[16:24] <slickymasterWork> VNware is damn slow :P
[16:24] <knome> :P
[16:24] <slickymasterWork> starting to pull your branch
[16:25] <knome> so i guess the next questions are:
[16:25] <knome> what content do we want there?
[16:25] <knome> in what quantity?
[16:25] <knome> ^ less than now, but how much less
[16:25] <slickymasterWork> and how much slides/imagery in it?
[16:25] <knome> yes
[16:25] <knome> and what kind of images
[16:25] <knome> don't remember if you had looked at https://staging.xubuntu.org/
[16:26] <slickymasterWork> I'd hate to loose some of the interactivity we have now
[16:26] <knome> i have that updated desktop/laptop image on the frontpage and new image ont he community page
[16:26] <knome> i mean the development page
[16:26] <knome> one option is to use those images in the slideshow as well
[16:26] <slickymasterWork> that's a big +1 from me 
[16:26] <knome> and i could try to have more time and motivation to draw a few more
[16:27] <slickymasterWork> wouldn't hurt
[16:27] <slickymasterWork> even though I do like the ones you already did
[16:27] <knome> but first i'd need to know the concept
[16:27] <knome> of the slideshow, that is
[16:27] <knome> to know what kind of imagery i might draw
[16:28] <knome> for the help & support slide, it could work if we added a few "buttons" like the links on the website
[16:28] <knome> for the links we have there
[16:28] <slickymasterWork> there are a few slides we could approach distinctly 
[16:28] <slickymasterWork> that's one
[16:28] <knome> it would give the slide the required amount of facelift
[16:28] <slickymasterWork> other would be the apps slide
[16:28] <knome> or could at least'
[16:29] <knome> yes..
[16:29] <slickymasterWork> do we really have to continue saying what comes with the distro after all these years?
[16:29] <knome> no
[16:29] <knome> and we don't
[16:29] <slickymasterWork> exactly
[16:29] <knome> if you looked at my new branch :P
[16:29] <slickymasterWork> still branching it 
[16:29] <slickymasterWork> sigh
[16:29] <knome> haha
[16:30] <slickymasterWork> yeah :(
[16:30] <knome> so... suggestion:
[16:30] <knome> add the monitor/laptop artwork for the "ready to go" slide
[16:30] <slickymasterWork> how big (slide numbers) is the reduction you have in mind?
[16:31] <knome> and the community face one on the get involved one
[16:31] <slickymasterWork> agree
[16:31] <knome> this new slideshow has 5 slides
[16:31] <knome> and it's also smaller in terms of resolution
[16:31] <slickymasterWork> so, dropping 3
[16:31] <knome> yep
[16:31] <knome> it's not set it stone if we need more slides
[16:31] <knome> but with new fast disks...
[16:32] <slickymasterWork> well, monitor/artwork one was one of the suggestions I was going to propose 
[16:32] <slickymasterWork> dropping it
[16:32] <slickymasterWork> that is
[16:32] <knome> the slide?
[16:32] <slickymasterWork> yep
[16:32] <knome> then it would be 4 slides...
[16:33] <slickymasterWork> my reasoning is the same as the one for the apps
[16:33] <slickymasterWork> we started it circa 16.04
[16:33] <knome> the text now is:
[16:33] <slickymasterWork> by one it's a given fact
[16:33] <knome> eh, i can't copy-paste
[16:33] <slickymasterWork> * by now
[16:34] <knome> well it says where you can find the apps and what you can use to customize your system
[16:34] <pleia2> knome: thanks for replying to that contacts email
[16:34] <knome> eg. app menu, package manager, settings manager
[16:34] <knome> pleia2, np
[16:34] <knome> slickymasterWork, i think that's sane information, but obviously if you have better ideas...
[16:34] <slickymasterWork> yeah, I know
[16:34] <knome> the wording is stale at least
[16:35] <knome> also we still need to keep in mind we don't need to market xubuntu any more; the user is already installing at this point
[16:35] <slickymasterWork> what I'm saying is do we still need to keep saying/displaying that info?
[16:35] <slickymasterWork> that's my point
[16:36] <knome> what if it's the first time the user boots up a linux OS?
[16:36] <slickymasterWork> but that also extends to the apps one
[16:36] <knome> which is why i'm only proposing dropping one of them
[16:37] <slickymasterWork> that user is also unaware of what comes installed with xub
[16:37] <knome> in this slide we are pointing them to explore their system
[16:37] <slickymasterWork> I know it's a bit of a trade off
[16:37] <knome> (that's a good word, we could use that to drop something else stale)
[16:37] <slickymasterWork> ok
[16:37] <slickymasterWork> sold
[16:37] <knome> this exploring includes finding out which apps are there
[16:38] <knome> but with that we come back to the first slide
[16:38] <knome> we mention that the user can try out their system if they use the live cd
[16:38] <slickymasterWork> the welcome
[16:38] <knome> err, the try xubuntu option, not live cd
[16:38] <slickymasterWork> yes
[16:38] <knome> so there's some redundancy in those things
[16:38] <knome> also, do we need to congratulate people for choosing to install xubuntu?
[16:38] <knome> isn't that a strong cliche?
[16:39] <slickymasterWork> it's a redundancy alright
[16:39] <slickymasterWork> no we don't
[16:39] <knome> have you already got the branch?
[16:39] <slickymasterWork> glad you also mention that becasue it has been bugger him for a while now
[16:39] <slickymasterWork> mot yet
[16:39] <slickymasterWork> * not
[16:40] <slickymasterWork> 436 kb/s
[16:40] <knome> siggggh
[16:40] <knome> ;)
[16:40] <slickymasterWork> getting back to the last slide
[16:40] <knome> yes
[16:40] <slickymasterWork> I do want to drop the congrats
[16:40] <knome> you mean the first slide?
[16:41] <knome> did we have a pad to work on this?
[16:41] <slickymasterWork> think not
[16:41] <knome> https://pad.ubuntu.com/xubuntu-1804-installer-slidshow
[16:41] <knome> there it is
[16:42] <knome> but i think it might be outdated
[16:44] <knome> just a sec while i make some small changes in the branch too
[16:45] <slickymasterWork> \o/ finished 
[16:45] <knome> huzzah
[16:46] <slickymasterWork> not running
[16:47] <knome> you need that one extra package
[16:47] <slickymasterWork> webkit?
[16:47] <knome> Unit193!!!
[16:47] <knome> i don't remember...
[16:47] <knome> or flocculant, do you happen to recall?
[16:48] <slickymasterWork> or krytarik
[16:49] <knome> i can try lastlogging
[16:51] <knome> 14:18  Unit193: gir1.2-webkit2-4.0 or gir1.2-webkit-3.0
[16:52] <slickymasterWork> let me install it
[16:53] <slickymasterWork> that's not the one as I already have it 
[16:53] <knome> ok, one more sec
[16:54] <knome> libwebkitgtk-3.0-dev
[16:54] <knome> maybe move the idea about a "ready to go" system to the first slide?
[16:55] <knome> but it's hard because it would then be the first sentence
[16:55] <knome> but that's ok, we can figure it out
[16:55] <knome> i mean the sentence is also too long because it's one sentence for the whole slide
[16:56] <slickymasterWork> you mean it will extend to more than one line?
[16:56] <knome> that's not the issue
[16:57] <knome> i don't want a slide with only on period
[16:57] <knome> *one
[16:57] <slickymasterWork> gotcha
[16:57] <knome> or from a different angle, why try to make those two things fit in one sentence when you can just use two?
[16:58] <knome> as i said in the pad, maybe move the "pre-installed" thing to the first slide
[16:58] <knome> and try to make the customization thing more interesting
[16:58] <slickymasterWork> I've split it into two sentences 
[16:58] <knome> yes, but now we're back to square one
[16:58] <knome> ;)
[16:59] <slickymasterWork> lol 
[17:02] <knome> ok, another way to approach it
[17:03] <knome> let's use irc for the chat because the pad becomes hard to read otherwise
[17:03] <knome> so if we drop the "once...", then it becomes very technical and boring
[17:03] <slickymasterWork> not necessarily 
[17:03] <knome> we can definitely change the beginning (or the whole thing if we have better ideas)
[17:04] <slickymasterWork> I mean we shouldn't assume that all our users are technicians nor noobs
[17:04] <knome> nope
[17:04] <knome> what i meant with technical is really
[17:04] <slickymasterWork> I'd start with Use the package...
[17:05] <knome> "written by technical people"
[17:05] <knome> written like code documenation
[17:05] <knome> :P
[17:05] <knome> this can be a more fun thing
[17:05] <slickymasterWork> what about Software Manager instead?
[17:05] <knome> if that's what the menu says
[17:06] <knome> i mean the whole package manager thing is meh
[17:06] <knome> if you are a new user, it doesn't mean anything to you
[17:06] <slickymasterWork> nopes, just Software
[17:06] <knome> if not, then you already know this
[17:06] <slickymasterWork> yes, and Software is discernible for the newbies and familiar to old users 
[17:07] <knome> what if we go a more general way
[17:07] <knome> like "xubuntu is really customizable"
[17:07] <knome> dunno, the settings manager is a cool feat
[17:08] <knome> in that all of the stuff is in one place
[17:08] <slickymasterWork> but that doesn't really is associated with the application installation question
[17:08] <knome> no
[17:08] <slickymasterWork> a one liner only?
[17:08] <knome> nope
[17:08] <knome> but this kind of tries to fix the first slide
[17:10] <slickymasterWork> yes
[17:10] <slickymasterWork> and it does look stupid now
[17:11] <knome> there's an idea...
[17:11] <slickymasterWork> but now the second one is completely 
[17:11] <slickymasterWork> lol
[17:11] <slickymasterWork> was about to say that
[17:11] <slickymasterWork> I don't have any issues with this approach, tbh
[17:11] <knome> i kind of like the idea of going a bit like:
[17:11] <knome> first do this, ...
[17:11] <flocculant> evening you 2
[17:12] <knome> once you've done that, then ....
[17:12] <slickymasterWork> even because the installing time is getting smaller
[17:12] <slickymasterWork> hey flocculant 
[17:12] <knome> eg. try to split the now first slide into two int he time scale as well
[17:12] <knome> you get what i'm saying?
[17:12] <knome> the thing with "once you've..."
[17:12] <slickymasterWork> yes
[17:12] <knome> makes it sound more like "this can take time, when you are ready get back to.."
[17:13] <knome> now it's like "do this, this and this"
[17:13] <slickymasterWork> yep
[17:13] <knome> flocculant, hello
[17:13] <knome> flocculant, feel free to join our brainstorming
[17:14] <slickymasterWork> https://pad.ubuntu.com/xubuntu-1804-installer-slidshow
[17:14] <knome> flocculant, on the sliDshow ^
[17:14]  * flocculant looks
[17:14] <knome> slickymasterWork, on another note, not sure the community fe... faces artwork fits on the last slide with the new note ;P
[17:16] <slickymasterWork> yeah, but sliding aspects of help could remain
[17:16] <knome> hello bluesabre!
[17:16] <knome> slickymasterWork, ack
[17:16] <slickymasterWork> hi bluesabre 
[17:16]  * bluesabre waves
[17:17] <flocculant> :)
[17:18] <bluesabre> Only stopping by for a bit since I saw the channel was active on my lunch break :)
[17:19] <knome> slickymasterWork, oh, you mean those sliding things
[17:19] <knome> slickymasterWork, nooooo
[17:19] <knome> :P
[17:19] <slickymasterWork> don't like them?
[17:19] <knome> nope
[17:19] <knome> let's do something else if you want flashy
[17:20] <slickymasterWork> ok
[17:20] <knome> but maybe i can come up with something nice with the installation media comment
[17:20] <slickymasterWork> yep, and preferably not static
[17:20] <flocculant> I'm not at all convinced that making the slideshow say next to nothing is helpful - but I'm also *shrug* you can do what you want with it and I'll not say more than that
[17:21] <knome> flocculant, i'll happily include all kinds of stuff that can be helpful there in that time and space :)
[17:21] <slickymasterWork> thing is we're always saying way too much, flocculant 
[17:21] <knome> brb
[17:21] <slickymasterWork> in the slideshow
[17:21] <flocculant> like I said "I'll not say more than that"
[17:28] <bluesabre> Seems like you guys are doing a fine job. :-) bbl
[17:28]  * bluesabre peaces out
[17:29] <knome> hf bluesabre 
[17:32] <tracker5> I'm new here. I want to help testing 18.04. I have done the RC1-live-session-testcase. Then I did the RC1-install testcase. Would it be helpful to now to the nightly version of these testcases? And as an aside: which would be more helpful for the devs: the RC1 or the nightly testcases? Thank you.
[17:32]  * knome points tracker5 to flocculant 
[17:32] <flocculant> hi tracker5 
[17:33] <flocculant> tracker5: basically a milestone is just a point - now we've almost moved past it - the qa team (me and akxwi-dave) have no interest in it :D
[17:34] <flocculant> if in doubt - always the daily :)
[17:34] <flocculant> tracker5: what sort of thing are you testing on? vm? hardware?
[17:35] <flocculant> are you in a position to use it fulltime?
[17:35] <flocculant> the last is probably one of the most useful things people could do - but also understandable when it's not possible
[17:36] <tracker5> As I said I'm new here, so here goes: I don't know what you mean by "a milestone is just a point" (and just to be absolutely clear: english is not my own language)
[17:37] <flocculant> tracker5: taking the language first - don't worry - many of the xubuntu team are the same as that :)
[17:37] <tracker5> I am testing on a laptop. I am in a position to use it full time. As a back up I have 16.04 on a different partition
[17:37] <flocculant> tracker5: that's great - then I'd be inclined to make use of you like that 
[17:37] <tracker5> So, if I download the daily that would be more helpful?
[17:38] <flocculant> frankly if the installer part of the iso breaks - it's likely to be broken for everyone
[17:38] <flocculant> tracker5: do you still have the iso you grabbed for beta?
[17:38] <tracker5> yes
[17:38] <knome> tracker5, milestone is just a point means it's just a single daily image from a predetermined day
[17:39] <flocculant> tracker5: ok - so let me introduce you to zsync :D
[17:39] <knome> tracker5, we keep on testing that to make sure everyone is on the same page for at least the milestone
[17:39] <flocculant> using that - you don't have to download the whole iso - you can just download the differences
[17:40] <tracker5> So: should I install zsync and from that point on I am testing the daily?
[17:40] <flocculant> tracker do you have 30 minutes or so now?
[17:40] <tracker5> Yes, unless my wife wants her hot chocolate between now and then
[17:40] <tracker5> :-)
[17:40] <flocculant> :)
[17:41] <flocculant> ok - so I'll take over the channel for a bit then :D
[17:41] <tracker5> please do
[17:41] <flocculant> take some time explaingin and making some things easier for you
[17:41] <knome> flocculant, it's yours!
[17:42] <flocculant> so - open a terminal in the folder you've stored your downloaded iso
[17:42] <flocculant> then install zsync with apt
[17:42] <flocculant> let me know when you've done that
[17:44] <tracker5> Ah.. ehm... well: the iso is in the Downloads folder in the 16.04 partition; I am now running this from the 18.04 partition/session. Your suggestion would mean I'd have to log out here, reboot and etc... Is that what you want me to do?
[17:45] <flocculant> shouldn't need to - just mount that partition
[17:45] <tracker5> right. will try. brb
[17:47]  * flocculant runs to kitchen
[17:48] <tracker5> So so so sorry... The iso is not in that Downloads folder anymore. It's on my usb-stick... 
[17:48] <flocculant> tracker5: well I've got time if you want to copy it over?
[17:49] <flocculant> if not we can talk and I'll just give you the zsync command you can use later - you tell me
[17:49] <flocculant> also tell me if I'm going to quick
[17:49] <tracker5> will do. which would make more sense: to put it in the download folder of the 16.04 partition or in the 18.04 parition?
[17:50] <flocculant> well - if you're going to move to using the 18.04 then in there would make more sense
[17:52] <tracker5> I need some advice here: what's the best way to copy the iso? (If i use thunar I don't "see" the iso, but the files)
[17:53] <flocculant> oh 
[17:53] <flocculant> probably best to just grab it again 
[17:53] <flocculant> we could actually use zsync so you'll know how to use it next time
[17:54] <tracker5> ah right, you really meant the iso, and not the "live"-usb... sorry for being daft.
[17:54] <flocculant> yea - no worries :)
[17:54] <tracker5> I'll download the iso again
[17:54] <flocculant> hang on :)
[17:54] <tracker5> remember all this time we are actually testing 18.04 here :-)
[17:54] <flocculant> yup :)
[17:55] <flocculant> open a terminal where you want the iso to be
[17:55] <tracker5> you want me to download the daily?
[17:55] <flocculant> you will be shortly - but with zsync
[17:56] <tracker5> so not the daily now?
[17:56] <flocculant> sort of - lets get it going - then I'll explain about dailies etc
[17:57] <flocculant> do you use 64bit?
[17:57] <tracker5> yes
[17:58] <flocculant> ok - so install zsync with apt
[17:59] <tracker5> wait.. I have not downloaded an iso yet...(sorry for being slow).
[17:59] <tracker5> Can I use this? http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily-live/current/bionic-desktop-amd64.iso
[18:00] <flocculant> tracker5: we'll do the iso shortly :D
[18:00] <tracker5> ah right.
[18:00] <knome> tracker5, don't download an iso. install zsync ;)
[18:00] <tracker5> will do
[18:00] <flocculant> just install zsync and let me know when you have
[18:00] <tracker5> zsync installed nicely
[18:01] <flocculant> ok now we can use it 
[18:01] <flocculant> in the terminal run 
[18:01] <flocculant> zsync http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily-live/current/bionic-desktop-amd64.iso.zsync
[18:01] <flocculant> as you have no iso - it will tell you it's grabbing the whole thing
[18:01] <tracker5> running
[18:01] <tracker5> eta 6 mins
[18:02] <flocculant> tomorrow or Sunday or any day you can use exactly the same command - next time it will ONLY grab the difference
[18:03] <tracker5> cool. "icremental" iso updating?
[18:03] <tracker5> ETA 4 mins
[18:03] <flocculant> https://i.imgur.com/I8y3mDy.png
[18:04] <flocculant> is what I see now using the same command - nothing to grab as I have it all
[18:04] <flocculant> generally I see it only having to download somewhere between 10 and 20 %
[18:05] <tracker5> I can see how this is helpful.
[18:05] <flocculant> indeed :D
[18:05] <flocculant> hi donofrio - just chatting to a new tester atm
[18:05] <donofrio> yepper
[18:05] <donofrio> I selected "autojoin" this channel and dev so I'll be here moar often
[18:06] <flocculant> donofrio: this is where we hang out
[18:06] <tracker5> less than 1 min
[18:07] <flocculant> tracker5: so - as far as testing the iso goes - you can obviously 'use' 18.04 as your main install - and report issues you find with ubuntu-bug
[18:07] <flocculant> sigh - not testing the iso at all - that's testing 18.04 in the real world :D
[18:07] <flocculant> so do that while you can
[18:08] <tracker5> zsync is done
[18:08] <flocculant> iso testing - do you have vm capability on the laptop - mostly that's down to ram
[18:09] <tracker5> hmmm. You want me to run a vm on this machine? RAM would not be a problem I think.
[18:09] <flocculant> tracker5: this is how I do stuff ...
[18:10] <flocculant> I run the dev version more or less immediately after we release a version
[18:10] <tracker5> whatever needs to be done, I'll do it
[18:10] <flocculant> I then test our iso's for the most part in a vm
[18:10] <flocculant> I also have the iso listed on my grub - so I can at least boot it on hardware
[18:11] <tracker5> I'd be quite willing to update this 18.04 partition on a daily basis and use that
[18:11] <tracker5> whatever is more helpful
[18:11] <flocculant> tracker5: you misunderstand me there
[18:12] <tracker5> Ah, sorry
[18:12] <flocculant> once you've got it installed - you can let the updater do it's thing to keep you updated
[18:13] <flocculant> then - I use a vm to test the iso for installs
[18:14]  * flocculant grabs a picture to show you
[18:14] <tracker5> (thank you for being patient)
[18:15] <flocculant> https://i.imgur.com/3bpaDGs.png
[18:15] <flocculant> see - vm of the current daily and us chatting :)
[18:15] <donofrio> I see me name ;)
[18:15] <flocculant> he he he 
[18:16] <tracker5> So, I'll now have to install VirtualBox?
[18:16] <donofrio> just so you all know I run 18.04 on my windows 10 installs using wsl - my daily driver setup is http://www.tinyurl.com/donofrio1804 in case anyone wonders why I'm trying to update and when it fails....just for the log I figured I'd let you know all that I'm doing... ;)
[18:16] <flocculant> that's up to you - I use kvm
[18:17] <tracker5> Am installing VirtualBox now...
[18:17] <flocculant> donofrio: yea I've seen you in the +1 channel
[18:19] <flocculant> tracker5: so with booting to 18.04 AND using a vm - you're doing invaluable things for the community
[18:20] <donofrio> (was sharing for the 'others' here and that will come - I figure this like others is logged daily?)
[18:20] <flocculant> donofrio: the channel? if so yea - logged 
[18:20] <tracker5> well booting to 18.04 is not a problem. installing virtual box is though: I tried to install the zesty version but that won't install it appears. Where can I get kvm?
[18:21] <flocculant> tracker5: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/KVM/Installation
[18:22] <flocculant> you also want virt-manager
[18:22] <tracker5> oh man... I'm learning lots. *takes a look at the link you sent*
[18:23] <flocculant> tracker5: this could take a while
[18:23] <donofrio> I tried to use VB to build my windows and couldn't bootp until I used VMware player that hooked rightin ti pxe/bootp just fine
[18:24] <donofrio> ti = to
[18:25] <flocculant> tracker5: do you want to have a read of that - pretty self explanatory - then shout? 
[18:25] <flocculant> also - more reading material at https://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/qa.html
[18:26] <flocculant> it's getting close to 'belly sounds like volcano' time here lol
[18:28] <flocculant> tracker5: quick question - what prompted you to come here offering help? 
[18:29] <tracker5> I installed synaptic, then virtual box. So am ready to use that.
[18:29] <flocculant> ok 
[18:29] <tracker5> If you need food: eat
[18:29] <tracker5> :-)
[18:29] <flocculant> check out the secon dlink I gave above at some point
[18:30] <flocculant> tracker5: so at this point - you're running 18.04 and are in a position to test iso's as often as you want to
[18:30] <flocculant> what would help me now is for you to have questions :D
[18:31] <tracker5> as to what prompted me: I have been using xubuntu for years and want to contrinute. I saw Elizabeth Krumbach Joseph's call out on google+ yesterday
[18:31] <tracker5> I had been doing some testing before
[18:31] <knome> ^ pleia2 :)
[18:31] <flocculant> tracker5: aah cool - glad that worked then :D
[18:32] <flocculant> bluesabre: ^^ our blog post did some good \o/
[18:33] <tracker5> as to questions: if I use 18.04 on a daily basis and update/upgrade that each day, and I do regular installs in the VM, that would be helpful?
[18:34] <flocculant> tracker5: yep :)
[18:34] <flocculant> tracker5: were you the person asking Lyz questions on the g+1 post?
[18:35] <flocculant> whobers on launchpad
[18:36] <tracker5> I am the one who "complained" about the test process being not as straight forward as I had hoped (sorry about that), but yes: that's me :-)
[18:36] <tracker5> indeed
[18:36] <tracker5> whobers
[18:36] <flocculant> excellent - that squares that circle
[18:36] <tracker5> it triaged the traingle I think
[18:36] <tracker5> ;-)
[18:37] <flocculant> tracker5: would you think it worth 'our' time to run some sort of 'welcome to testing xubuntu' type session on here?
[18:38] <tracker5> *needs to take care of his wife's hot chocolate now; will be right back*
[18:38] <flocculant> okey doke
[18:42] <ochosi> bluesabre: hey no worries, i just noticed you're doing so many different things at the moment and i don't wanna stress you out or anything
[18:43] <pleia2> tracker5: welcome! glad you found your way here :)
[18:44] <flocculant> pleia2: some time in the next day could you g+1 the mail that's about to hit the mailing list for us please :)
[18:45] <flocculant> knome: could you twitter it ;)
[18:45]  * flocculant will fb
[18:45] <knome> maybe politely ask pleia2 
[18:45] <knome> :P
[18:45] <pleia2> okie
[18:45] <knome> she's probably logged in already...
[18:45] <knome> thanks!
[18:45] <flocculant> oh right :D
[18:45] <pleia2> I can do twitter too
[18:46] <flocculant> I'll do fb a bit later or it'll 404 when getting the mail and it looks stupid :d
[18:46] <tracker5> *wife's happy now*
[18:48] <flocculant> tracker5: just quickly - re testcases and what you might see - the testcases aren't constantly updated - there's me and a couple of other people who do it for the whole shebang
[18:48] <flocculant> so if you see an issue with one - you can report that as a bug - I see them quickly
[18:49] <tracker5> so, flucculant: would it be worth your time to have a session here? Not sure: for me (and perhaps people like me) the irc-channel is not q well know medium. 
[18:49] <tracker5> to log into this was a bit of a step, because of the fact that it's out of my normal channels
[18:49] <flocculant> right
[18:50] <flocculant> I can point people at the dev tracker option - which is perhaps where you came from? 
[18:50]  * flocculant refuses to do video ;)
[18:50] <tracker5> so, to me (but that may just be me) it seems the people who get to come here have already taken some steps beyond their comfort zone.
[18:50] <flocculant> :)
[18:50] <tracker5> Also: 
[18:52] <tracker5> the terminology "you guys" use, is somewhat overwhelming. Don't get me wrong: I see that you are patient and do explain things the best way you can. But:
[18:53] <tracker5> just to show you what I mean:
[18:54] <knome> (before you even say it, i want to say this is important and very useful for us, so thanks for sharing!)
[18:54] <tracker5> from this conversation alone:
[18:54] <tracker5> "until I used VMware player that hooked rightin ti pxe/bootp"
[18:54] <tracker5> and
[18:54] <pleia2> flocculant: the mailing list post about possibly running an intro session?
[18:54] <tracker5>  my windows 10 installs using wsl - my daily driver setup 
[18:55] <tracker5> " I use a vm to test the iso for installs" (which I now understand
[18:55] <knome> tracker5, maybe it helps understanding that those comments were from donofrio, not flocculant :)
[18:55] <tracker5> "the dev version"
[18:56] <knome> maybe IRC as a platform (and how it's usually output) can make following some of the stuff harder when there are multiple discussions going on 
[18:56] <tracker5> I am not trying to be unkind here. Jut trying to paint the picture
[18:57] <knome> i absolutely understand; as i said, this is valuable information for us
[18:57] <knome> would a glossary with explanations help?
[18:57] <knome> eg. vm <> virtual machine
[18:57] <knome> dev version <> development version, ...
[18:57] <knome> obviously with more thorough explanations
[18:58] <knome> the problem with those is that they don't help you if you haven't read them - and referencing to them live is tedious...
[18:58] <knome> and if you read them without knowing the subject, they might not help you understand anything either ;)
[18:58] <tracker5> I've been thinking about that: I think it might indeed. Does irc do marco's, so that when you type "vm" it expands to virtual machine?
[18:58] <knome> nope
[18:59] <knome> but the glossary could be with the developer documentation
[18:59] <knome> which we hope is written in a way that is understandable, btw
[18:59] <knome> if that is not, then "good news", because that's relatively easy to fix :)
[18:59] <tracker5> a lot of the documentation is indeed understandable!
[18:59] <knome> great
[19:00] <knome> if you find it potentially lacking in some parts, knowing where would be useful
[19:00] <knome> and in what ways lacking or misleading or whatever
[19:00] <knome> ultimately there's also this other thing: terminology is a bit complex because the whole matter is kind of complex
[19:01] <flocculant> tracker5: when we talk about documentation in this scenario - we're usually talking about the contributor docs online - is that what you're referring to?
[19:02] <knome> https://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/ <- that
[19:02] <knome> and i guess ultimately any other documentation that links to
[19:02] <knome> :)
[19:02] <knome> now for something completely different... bbl
[19:02] <flocculant> heh
[19:03] <knome> tracker5, thanks for your interest! :)
[19:03] <tracker5> flocculant: that's indeed a very useful place to start. I used it some time ago.
[19:03] <flocculant> tracker5: cool
[19:03] <tracker5> Shall I give another example of where i got confused?
[19:03] <flocculant> yea for sure
[19:03]  * flocculant goes to make cup of tea while you type
[19:05] <tracker5> I am a bit of a language fanatic: I speak and read/write Dutch, speak and read/write German, speak and read/write English. So:
[19:07] <tracker5> I thought I could do some translation work. I headed over to 
[19:07] <tracker5> https://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/
[19:08] <tracker5> then: https://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/docs-translations.html
[19:08] <tracker5> then: https://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/docs-translation-guidelines.html
[19:09] <tracker5> then https://help.launchpad.net/Translations/Guide
[19:09] <tracker5> then https://help.launchpad.net/Translations/StartingToTranslate
[19:09] <flocculant> and still weren't sure?
[19:10] <tracker5> and then I sort of gave up.
[19:10] <flocculant> slickymaster: ^^
[19:10] <flocculant> knome: ^^]
[19:10] <tracker5> It's not your fault though
[19:10] <tracker5> It's a bit of a wall which I ran into I think
[19:10] <flocculant> translations are not an easy way in at all from what I read
[19:11] <tracker5> I would not know how to make this any easier though, so I am not complaining. I am just trying to paint the picture here
[19:12] <flocculant> yea for sure - and as know said earlier - all good for us to know
[19:12] <flocculant> it's not easy to do docs for things you understand - very easy to forget not knowing things
[19:13] <flocculant> the qa docs turned up when I wrote them after 5 or 6 years of doing it for instance
[19:15] <flocculant> tracker5: so back to the testing stuff - any thing you'd like to know now that will help you?
[19:16] <tracker5> I think I now understand what I can do to help: I'll update my 18.04 on a daily basis; will zsyng the iso in the downloads folder as often as I can to test the install
[19:16] <tracker5> and i'll report anything I think might be a problem \
[19:17] <flocculant> ok - any thing you need to ask - come back here, or mail the dev list
[19:17] <flocculant> I'm at UK times 
[19:17] <tracker5> I'll subscribe to the devlist
[19:17] <flocculant> yep
[19:17] <tracker5> I'm at Dutch times.
[19:17] <flocculant> I don't always post to both list
[19:18] <flocculant> especially early in the 6 month cycle
[19:18] <flocculant> tracker5: that's easy then - quite a few of the team are EU times
[19:19] <tracker5> *confused* "in the 6 month cycle" you hibernate? ;-)
[19:19] <flocculant> :)
[19:20] <tracker5> seriously though: what 6 month cycle are you refering to?
[19:20] <flocculant> the development cycle
[19:20] <tracker5> Ah, I see. Sorry
[19:20] <flocculant> when we release bionic in April - we'll immediately (almost) start the next
[19:21] <tracker5> If people only knew how much time and dedication you guys put into this!
[19:21] <flocculant> so what I meant by my comment was 'at the beginning of the cycle I don't include the user list - not fair' and only mail the dev list who are fair game for me :D
[19:22] <flocculant> tracker5: well you can spread the word now ;)
[19:22] <knome> my main issue with translations is that our translations go bureaucratically through the ubuntu translation teams
[19:22] <knome> this means we have no simple way to tell you to do this to get doing that
[19:23] <knome> this is also where the stuff under help.ubuntu.com comes into the show...
[19:23] <tracker5> knome: that's yet another of these confusing things: I looked into translating for xubuntu, but after 42 (:-)) hyperlinks I found myself on a Ubuntu-site. So I decided I had taken some wrong utrn somewhere
[19:23] <knome> nope, xubuntu shares a lot of things with ubuntu
[19:24] <knome> like the testing tracker is the ubuntu testing tracker, not the xubuntu testing tracker :)
[19:24] <knome> basically all of our infrastructure is donated by canonical (the company behind ubuntu)
[19:24] <tracker5> Yes, I realise that now but not when I was trying to get involved then
[19:24] <knome> or not really even "donated" but given into use
[19:25] <knome> mhm, so it might help to mention this in the contributor docs as well. ack.
[19:26] <tracker5> BTW: just tried to start the ISO in VM (see I'm learning the lingo here), but got an error: VT-x is disabled in the BIOS for all CPU modes (VERR_VMX_MSR_ALL_VMX_DISABLED).
[19:26] <knome> i'll bring this up again as we're hitting a wall related to this again; i still think we might be better off just ripping ourself off from the ubuntu translation team bureaucracy for our own packages
[19:26] <knome> like xubuntu-docs could easily be translated under xubuntu-specific bureaucracy
[19:27] <flocculant> tracker5: you need to turn that on in BIOS 
[19:27] <tracker5> So I'll have to logout now, and may return later but possibly not with the alias "tracker5"
[19:27] <knome> xfce stuff we can get translated upstream with their transifex
[19:27] <knome> (yes, this is the downside: you probably need two team memberships and accounts)
[19:27] <tracker5> thanks for your patience
[19:27] <flocculant> tracker5: you might want to look into setting up an irc nicname
[19:27] <knome> but again, bbabl
[19:27] <tracker5> will do
[19:28] <flocculant> tracker5: no problem at all - thanks for coming by and mostly for testing for us all 
[19:28] <tracker5> pleasure
[19:28] <flocculant> :)
[19:28] <tracker5> *now trying to find the right way to log out here*
[19:29] <flocculant> if you're on the webthing - just close the tab :)
[19:29] <pleia2> flocculant: the one about a testing session?
[19:29] <flocculant> pleia2: sorry - yea that one :)
[19:29] <tracker5> ah thanks
[19:30]  * flocculant should possibly check twitter and g+1 when things are there for 'me' lol
[19:30] <pleia2> ok, I did the things
[19:30] <flocculant> <3
[19:35] <I_was_tracker5_o> I turned the virtualisation on and am now running the install in virtualbox. So all is well
[19:36] <flocculant> excellent
[19:37] <flocculant> I_was_tracker5_o: if you're likely to be back to irc (and we do most of our communication here) have a look at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/XChatHowto
[19:37] <flocculant> just remember to use hexchat instead when installing
[19:38]  * flocculant patiently waits for knock on the door
[19:40] <I_was_tracker5_o> installing hexchat now
[19:41] <flocculant> https://freenode.net/kb/answer/registration
[19:41] <I_was_tracker5_o> great; thanks
[19:42] <flocculant> no problem :)
[19:52] <Used2BTracker5> Anyone out there? (This is a test)
[19:53] <ochosi> nooooope
[19:53] <ochosi> test failed. only bots in here. right ubottu?
[19:54] <Used2BTracker5> I see. Shame. But thank you. :-)
[19:54] <flocculant> ha ha 
[19:59] <flocculant> evening ochosi 
[20:14] <ochosi> evening flocculant 
[20:18] <flocculant> been busy in here since yesterday lol
[20:23] <donofrio>  knome keep in mind if your new to iirc'ing then you simply can look to the left side in hexchat and see who is typing and when you reply to someone just type (part of there name and hit tab to complete) name and then a comma will show up then you can talk with them....never though you'd think my comments were for you hope you have a good day in iirc land ;)
[20:25] <Used2BTracker5> So: what I learned just this eveneing thanks to you all: usage of zsync; xchat; freenode...  
[20:25] <Used2BTracker5> donofrio, thanks for the explanation
[20:25] <donofrio> Used2BTracker5, yep iirc good for the last 25 years online ;)
[20:26] <flocculant> :)
[20:26] <Used2BTracker5> I've been using computers since the 80s, worked on mainframes... never used irc though. 
[20:27] <Used2BTracker5> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodore_PET 
[20:27] <Used2BTracker5> happy days.
[20:27] <Used2BTracker5> bye for now
[20:28] <donofrio> ttyl8r
[20:29] <ochosi> flocculant: yeah, i noticed the backlog :)
[20:33] <flocculant> :)
[20:40] <flocculant> ochosi bluesabre - the people I worry about are the ones who just try something else > https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2386737
[20:43] <flocculant> right - been sat in front of the screen since 5:30 ish - comfier seat fpr a while
[20:53] <ochosi> flocculant: well thanks for catching those ppl on the forums and replying
[21:18] <donofrio> anyone seen a xubuntu 18.04 beta1 cloud squishfs file around?
[21:21] <donofrio> I mean a daily cloud squishfs xubuntu release of 18.04
[22:03] <slickymaster> we tried that, or something similar, with the installer translations knome 
[22:04] <knome> yes and tbh there weren't any blockers
[22:04] <knome> well for that package there are
[22:04] <slickymaster> was going to say that
[22:05] <slickymaster> never got any feedback from other flavors reagrding it
[22:05] <slickymaster> regarding even
[22:08] <knome> yep...
[22:09] <knome> that was a sad story
[22:13] <Unit193> Sad, sad Robot.
[22:24] <Unit193> pa-plug and -terminal in Debian.
[22:24] <Unit193> (libwnck and vte remaining delta)
[22:50] <ochosi> bluesabre: i think we should make the warnings shown in the restart and shutdown windows infobars, but i guess we don't want that in 18.04 because of translations, right?
[22:50] <ochosi> although if we don't change any strings, maybe it's ok...
[22:58] <bluesabre> ochosi: got a screenshot of what it looks like now?
[22:58] <ochosi> the warning you mean?
[22:59] <bluesabre> yeah
[22:59] <ochosi> unfortunately not, because dm-tool doesn't allow the power windows to show and from the greeter you can't take screenshots
[23:00] <bluesabre> lovely :)
[23:00] <bluesabre> will lock and check
[23:00] <Unit193> Ah, greeter.  OK.
[23:01] <ochosi> bluesabre: haven't finished the infobar stuff yet
[23:01] <bluesabre> ochosi: ah, yeah, wouldn't be so bad there
[23:02] <Unit193> I think I pasted a LL bug somewhere... :>
[23:04] <ochosi> only sucky part is that the dialog title leaves you with a fairly empty window...
[23:10] <ochosi> bluesabre: anyway, maybe test and review my other UI fixes first and i can try to get the infobar in until UIF
[23:10] <bluesabre> ochosi: will do
[23:10] <ochosi> also would be good to get more greybird testing
[23:11] <ochosi> currently the checkboxes don't look the same in all contexts (e.g. in menus they are still drawn by murrine)
[23:12] <ochosi> btw thanks for all the release note work you did!
[23:15] <Unit193> -ind-plug?
[23:20] <ochosi> ah right, thanks for the reminder
[23:20] <ochosi> bluesabre: i'd also really like to get the mirror fixes for display settings into 18.04
[23:23] <ochosi> Unit193: crap, the hook declines the release branch
[23:23] <ochosi> i need to check in with Skunnyk
[23:30] <Unit193> Don't break it...
[23:30] <ochosi> oh dear
[23:30] <knome> ;)
[23:31] <ochosi> seems like there were never proper release notes for the thing
[23:31] <knome> whenever skunnyk is mentioned, it's indeed best to make sure anything won't be broken...
[23:31] <knome> slickymaster, so we kind of didn't do our sprint... but i think it's better to sleep on it anyway
[23:32] <knome> i'll look at it tomorrow again
[23:33] <ochosi> Unit193: this would be a potentially nice commit to get into the release too https://git.xfce.org/panel-plugins/xfce4-indicator-plugin/commit/?id=311efa7951487e5d5652541543509ae2ed8e7dcf
[23:33] <ochosi> but then again this may create a very confusing history...
[23:33] <ochosi> at least for people comparing master and a very cherry-picked release branch
[23:34] <ochosi> also this one https://git.xfce.org/panel-plugins/xfce4-indicator-plugin/commit/?id=f01133757140d6ca42d3dff37394e19260897230
[23:34] <ochosi> or we may even want this in xubuntu specifically: https://git.xfce.org/panel-plugins/xfce4-indicator-plugin/commit/?id=7c3c1e68abd91f054fe02f7ea904d8c904de106a
[23:35] <ochosi> basically everything but the xfconf stuff :
[23:35] <ochosi> :p
[23:36] <ochosi> bluesabre, Unit193 anyway, give me your thoughts on the above ^
[23:36] <ochosi> i don't mind cherry-picking a branch together for v2.3.4
[23:36] <Unit193> What *specifically* are we trying to exclude?
[23:36] <ochosi> the switch to xfconf 4.13
[23:36] <ochosi> oh
[23:37] <ochosi> crap. i just see now that this is just optional
[23:37] <Unit193> https://git.xfce.org/panel-plugins/xfce4-indicator-plugin/commit/?id=7099de347f70817005725899bfb0f4ccfcc00ef2 this, where it's guarded?
[23:37] <ochosi> *facepalm*
[23:37] <Unit193> OK, was a bit confused as I'm *basically* running git.
[23:37] <ochosi> in that case, nothing i guess. i'll just delete the release branch and do a proper release
[23:37] <Unit193> (Cherry picked commits.)
[23:37] <ochosi> we just have to make sure to sell it as bugfix
[23:38] <ochosi> (square icons may be considered a feature)
[23:38] <Unit193> http://paste.openstack.org/show/697152/
[23:38] <Unit193> So, this means that any future ayatana fixes will take a long time to get released. :/
[23:38] <ochosi> how so?
[23:41] <Unit193> Basically, given the attention that the plugin gets, and frequency of release.
[23:42] <ochosi> heh
[23:42] <ochosi> well, i can do another release anytime if somebody steps up and does the ayatana patches
[23:43] <Unit193> Should be very easy...
[23:43] <Unit193> Basically do what xfconf does, with the patch I pushed to Debian?
[23:44] <ochosi> i know nothing of that
[23:44] <ochosi> but if you already know what to do, why don't you just propose a patch?
[23:44] <Unit193> Because I don't know autotools well enough. :P
[23:45] <ochosi> hah, well i would be one to talk
[23:49] <ochosi> ok, 2.3.4 released. night everyone
[23:51] <bluesabre> nice
[23:53] <ochosi> bluesabre: still remember what i need reviewed from you? i can send you a shortlist as a reminder if you like ;)
[23:53] <bluesabre> ochosi: that would be super handy
[23:53] <ochosi> (most of it are settings branches)
[23:53] <ochosi> ok
[23:54] <ochosi> xfce4-settings-4.12: https://git.xfce.org/users/schuellerf/xfce4-settings/
[23:54] <ochosi> (contains my mirror fixes cherry-picked for 4.12, a segfault fix and another fix that is already in 4.12 and master)
[23:55] <ochosi> xfce4-settings-4.13: https://git.xfce.org/users/ochosi/xfce4-settings/log/?h=mirrored-cloned-inconsistent
[23:55] <ochosi> (baseically the same as above)
[23:55] <ochosi> xfce4-settings-4.13: https://git.xfce.org/users/ochosi/xfce4-settings/log/?h=find-cursor
[23:55] <ochosi> the find-cursor implementation for 4.13 (same codebase as for 4.12)
[23:56] <ochosi> lightdm-gtk-greeter: https://code.launchpad.net/~ochosi/lightdm-gtk-greeter/fix-panel-adwaita/+merge/340773
[23:56] <ochosi> fixes appearance with adwaita (without breaking e.g. greybird)
[23:57] <ochosi> i think those are the most important ones
[23:58] <bluesabre> awesome
[23:58] <ochosi> and we need to pull in updates to xubuntu-artwork and do another release (at least one before UIF)
[23:58] <ochosi> i made the checkboxes the same in gtk2 and gtk3 in greybird (finally)
[23:58] <ochosi> and the radiobuttons too
[23:58] <bluesabre> nice
[23:58] <bluesabre> consistency ftw
[23:58] <ochosi> and another tiny icon fix in elementary-xfce
[23:59] <ochosi> what would be nice in the power manager btw is checking if light-locker is running in the security tab
[23:59] <ochosi> and showing an infobar if not
[23:59] <ochosi> (like i do in notifyd)
[23:59] <ochosi> but i dunno if i can hack that in for 18.04
[23:59] <ochosi> maybe for the future