[16:21] I was just reading https://insights.ubuntu.com/2018/03/20/lxd-weekly-status-39 and noticed something about cluster placement. Does anyone know when LXD got clusters and placement and where it is in the docs? [16:23] Ah, https://lxd.readthedocs.io/en/latest/clustering/ there. no idea when this landed [16:24] jrwren: it's new trying to make lxd more 'cloud-like' [16:24] rick_h_: its great and sensible! [16:24] jrwren: it's been in progress the last 2 cycles I think [16:24] yea [16:27] configured correctly it can be a nice alternative to a simple openstack. [16:27] definitely [16:28] less overhead by a long shot, 5 machines in a lxd cluster > those 5 machines just running OS components [16:28] though when you outgrow and need SDN and storage and ... [16:28] no need for complexity of glance, keystone, neutron (zomg complex!) [16:28] yup, exactly. [16:29] but still, if you are small enough... do everything you can to stay small and avoid needing neutron for as long as possible :p [16:29] and cinder... UGH... cinder and swift are THE WORST! :p [16:30] yea, it's a nice way to put something like guimaas to better work tbh [16:30] take the 6 nodes into a lxd cluster and then juju deploy on top of that "cloud" across machines and such [16:30] mmmhmmm. [16:30] or if you are very lucky, skip juju :p [16:31] :P [16:31] still have to operate the stuff so [16:31] operate? [16:31] k8s I guess. :p [16:32] but juju is probably best way to deploy k8s, and then you are back to guimass being juju managed. But I guess k8s on metal is better than k8s on Openstack. [16:32] heh, back to running openstack [16:32] so flexible! [16:32] yea, definitely k8s on bare metal [16:33] I don't get k8s on openstack tbh [16:33] I do, but I don't like it. [16:33] Its because k8s doesn't do any network security and since it is soft containers it doesn't technically do any OS security either and so you need the NOVA + Neutron for host and network security. [16:34] It also lets you build many small k8s clusters in VMs instead of one large one. [16:34] k8s doesn't do resource management quite as nicely as nova, again because of its container not VM nature. [16:36] yea, fair enough I guess [16:36] * rick_h_ just get sad face at the resources running the stacks of stuff needed to run the application container [16:37] Me too. [16:37] at some point the complexity has to out weigh the 'ease of deploy' of stuff [16:37] It is why I still LOVE the stackoverflow approach. [16:38] It doesnt' even have to be complexity. It can be pure cost. Running this stuff in the public cloud gets expensive pretty quickly. [16:39] yea, I think the research was something like around 30 large instances it get more cost effective to run your own hardware? [16:40] * rick_h_ needs to look that back up, maybe it was a bit more than 30 [16:40] its subjective because it depends on so many things. I'm convinced you can pretty much make those number say wahtever you want them to say. [16:41] fair enough, there's definitely a crossing point for folks I think [16:42] definitely.