[00:05] <katnip> very few updates today
[03:34] <howarth> Why is the bionic using such an old linux 4.15.0 kernel release instead of the current 4.15.15?  We seem to be missing a slew of fixes like https://patchwork.kernel.org/patch/10279307/  which would make suspending more reliable.
[03:41] <flocculant> howarth: I'm on 4.15.0-15-generic - which I guess will come out of -proposed soonish
[03:45] <howarth> Okay, I guess current is -13
[03:45] <howarth> I just checked kernel's git and 4.15.13 doesn't have that fix
[03:46] <howarth> I am hoping the Gnome 3.28 suspend issue may have nudge a decent number of fixes into the kernel recently like that
[03:47] <howarth> I wish it was easier to cherry pick out of proposed instead of taking everything.
[03:48] <howarth> I haven't been able to find a web view of the repo outside of hash directories for direct downloads
[03:49] <howarth> And https://packages.ubuntu.com/ doesn't seem to have -proposed as an option to search
[03:55] <flocculant> howarth: I either reinstall 'a thing' when proposed is enabled or synaptic 
[03:57] <krytarik> howarth: It appears the fix you are looking for is already in the current Ubuntu kernel though: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+changelog
[04:02] <howarth> Went ahead and switch on proposed. Hopefully the churn won't be as bad now that the release is slushy
[04:02] <howarth> Surprised mesa isn't out of the rc releases yet though
[04:04] <krytarik> (And by "current" I meant in 'release' btw.)
[04:04] <howarth> I guess you can toggle 'proposed' back off and hope everything eventually syncs up in 'updates'
[04:05] <howarth> rebooting
[04:08] <phoenix_firebrd> final beta released?
[04:09] <katnip> dont you guys keep up with updating?
[04:10] <katnip> they've said if you keep updating, you'll have the final in the end
[04:10] <phoenix_firebrd> i want to test iso
[04:10] <katnip> i couldnt tell ya  then :)
[04:10] <howarth> Okay, now to see if that stabilizes suspend on a Radeon HD2600XT
[04:11] <katnip> i just keep apt updating
[04:11] <flocculant> phoenix_firebrd: no - not yet
[04:11] <phoenix_firebrd> flocculant: major show stoppers?
[04:11] <howarth> Also puzzled out the Google Chrome indicator under bionic. Installing the Unite chrome shell extension brings it back.
[04:11] <flocculant> and rather pointless to look at it anyway - it'll be out of date pretty quickly
[04:11] <flocculant> phoenix_firebrd: no idea - I do Xubuntu
[04:12] <howarth> Unite also shove them all to the right making it looks a bit more like Unity.
[04:12] <phoenix_firebrd> afaik there where only 1 high
[04:14] <katnip> http://omgfoss.com/ubuntu18-04-lts-bionic-beaver-release/
[04:16] <katnip> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
[04:17] <katnip> there is your iso
[04:18] <katnip> final beta freeze was the 5th
[04:19] <howarth> Don't forget http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/pending/
[04:20] <howarth> Used that to get yesterdays
[04:20] <katnip> are the dates the same?
[04:20] <katnip> no wayland eh
[04:21] <howarth> I wish they would stop installing gnome components as snaps
[04:21] <katnip> ill switch over then
[04:21] <katnip> i run hexchat as a snap
[04:21] <howarth> They have some 3.26 snaps there instead of the 3.28 ones
[04:22] <katnip> my guess is by mid summer or fall
[04:22] <howarth>  gnome-calculator  gnome-characters  gnome-logs  gnome-system-monitor
[04:22] <katnip> i might be wrong, but i thought i saw the date for gnome 3.28 as in sept
[04:23] <katnip> need to log out and in
[04:23] <howarth> That is 3.30
[04:26] <katnip> ahh
[04:26] <katnip> well now night mode works under x-org
[04:28] <katnip> just noticed daily builds are in the topic, bhwhaha
[04:30] <katnip> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BionicBeaver/ReleaseSchedule < - also in topic, final beta this week
[04:32] <flocculant> and tomorrow it will be out of date ;)
[04:33] <katnip> i was kinda hoping for wayland tbh
[04:34] <katnip> however, i have noticed tonight the night mode / f.lux isnt working under wayland
[04:36] <valorie> the point of alphas and betas is to get testing, and in particular get bugs fixed
[04:37] <valorie> the installer is so important for a good release
[04:37] <flocculant> people can do all that with dailies - unfortunately eveeryone is primed to want alphas/betas
[04:37] <katnip> good to be reminded of that valorie 
[04:38] <katnip> flocculant, it appears as though, there is 1 beta and a final beta
[04:38] <flocculant> katnip: for flavours only
[04:38] <katnip> and possibly a RC
[04:39] <flocculant> ubuntu only does final beta 
[04:39] <flocculant> then everyone does RC
[04:39] <katnip> i was just only looking at the link above
[04:39] <valorie> flocculant: but deadlines help people get those bugs get fixed
[04:40] <valorie> we could do it with "test the daily day" maybe once per month
[04:40] <valorie> but there wouldn't be the urgency
[04:42] <valorie> we could all agree to do them together, and build that urgency
[04:42] <flocculant> there would be if we trained testers
[04:42] <valorie> but then what's the difference between that and the milestones?
[04:42] <valorie> I think our testers are getting better and faster
[04:43] <flocculant> valorie: actually I'd prefer a roll your own milestone - where a flavour can turn off build when it suits them
[04:43] <valorie> I know I am much more efficient
[04:43] <flocculant> anyway - I think we've had this discussion a while ago :D
[04:43] <flocculant> with tsimonq2 iirc
[04:43] <valorie> flocculant: why not throw that idea out? I bet a lot of flavor leads would follow you
[04:43] <valorie> if the release team supports it
[04:44] <flocculant> I think Adam wanted to discuss stuff next cycle (iirc)
[04:44] <valorie> right, tsimonq2 doesn't like the milestones much either
[04:44] <valorie> cool
[04:44] <valorie> I'm willing to talk, listen, think together
[04:44]  * flocculant too
[04:44] <valorie> having a week to test instead of waiting around until the magic hour
[04:45] <valorie> would be so much better
[04:47] <flocculant> I'll think about kick-starting a discussion early in the cantankerous ciacada cycle
[04:48] <flocculant> going to be too many c's after bionic releases ...
[04:49] <katnip> ill show my age a little here, i remember this +1 channel yrs ago, i upgraded so to say, and within 2 days, my system was garbage, so i think this has come a long way to have a working system at this point.
[04:50] <flocculant> katnip: iirc that's a lot to do with how they deal with proposed packages now
[04:51] <katnip> not surprised
[04:51] <katnip> it's much better
[04:51] <flocculant> indeed
[04:52] <katnip> i started with linux in '99, speaking of a nightmare, redhat and debian, slackware too
[04:54] <katnip> i left linux in '05 though due to illness and came back last year, quite impressed at the improvements made
[05:01] <Bashing-om> http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-18-04-lts-bionic-beaver-final-beta-released-available-for-download-now-520571.shtml .
[05:08] <katnip> i like the 'darker' theme
[05:09] <katnip> i see you do not really need flux and night light now
[05:13] <fkorling> I'm trying to upgrade a unattended install from xenial to bionic beta, but having problem with the partioning. The installer stops at the "Installation type" screen, waiting for input. Any changes to partman in bionic?
[07:11] <Guest82229> Hi, question about snaps... I see that there are multiple mounted versions of the gnome calc app. Is this normal ?
[12:53] <tomreyn> !bug
[12:55] <hitchhiker54> hey all, is launchpad still the place to file a report for 18.04 beta 2? No crash or major issue, just an oddity with minimal installation and software center
[12:57] <flocculant> hitchhiker54: yes - ubuntu-bug <package>
[12:59] <hitchhiker54> cheers. amusingly software center doesnt know firefox is installed
[14:15] <howarth> No joy with the proposed update 4.15.15 kernel eliminating the suspend issues on the HD2600XT radeon.
[14:16] <howarth> Still see an occasional checkerboard (B&W) when coming out of suspend.
[14:16] <howarth> Any suggestions of kernel arguments to make suspend play better with ACPI?
[14:17] <howarth> This is on a 2008 MacPro FYI.
[15:05] <brainwash> howarth: I would test with 4.16 from http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v4.16/
[15:09] <howarth> I guess there is no ppa for that as a repo
[15:29] <Exterminador> help! yesterday I've installed Nvidia drivers on Xubuntu. then I decided to uninstall them. after rebooting the laptop, everything appears huge on the screen! any ideas?
[15:30] <flocculant> Exterminador: I absolutely have because I had the same issue ... 
[15:30] <flocculant> let me find the info
[15:31] <Ian_Corne> That sounds like no driver loaded
[15:31] <Exterminador> oh. and weirdly my screen appears as only 640x480
[15:31] <flocculant> Ian_Corne: almost 
[15:31] <Ian_Corne> so it's resorting to a very small resolution
[15:32] <Exterminador> I've even installed nouveau-firmware and no cigar
[15:32] <flocculant> Exterminador: check in /etc/modprobe.d for a nvidia file - I had it left after nvidia uninstall - it was blacklisting nouveau
[15:32] <Exterminador> right away
[15:33] <flocculant> if there is one - and remocing said leftover fixes it - what version of nvidia did you install?  I bug reported against nvidia-340 
[15:33] <Exterminador> yeah. there's a nvidia-340.conf there
[15:33] <flocculant> \o/
[15:34] <Exterminador> so, deleting it and reboot solves the problem?
[15:34] <flocculant> either remove it completely or move it somewhere like desktop
[15:34] <flocculant> did for me - can you me to bug 1761593
[15:36] <flocculant> assuming that fixes it for you :)
[15:37] <Exterminador> flocculant: that did the trick! thanks a lot!
[15:38] <flocculant> np - don't forget to me too the bug please - that'll confirm the issue
[15:38] <Exterminador> perhaps we should use '--purge' while apt remove?
[15:38] <flocculant> shouldn't need to do that for it afaik
[15:39] <flocculant> a file got left ehind by nvidia - not one of of the dependencies I think
[15:46] <Exterminador> well, I've done my contribution in the bug ;)
[15:46] <Exterminador> thanks a lot again, flocculant
[15:47] <flocculant> cool and glad I could help :)
[15:58] <Exterminador> I was like, WTF, when I've rebooted the laptop.
[16:03] <Exterminador> it's amazing how such a new OS version can run so smoothly on my ancient laptop
[16:03] <flocculant> nice - and you're just the sort of person Xubuntu is after - new testers ;)
[16:06] <Exterminador> didn't experienced much troubles on my daily use. just that one today. I'm having a few issues with Stremio but I don't know if it's Xubuntu fault or not.
[16:06] <flocculant> well - never heard of it :p
[16:08] <Exterminador> it's a stream application to watch series and movies. but now, when I try to search for a movie/series, the "cover" simply doesn't appear. weird tho
[16:09] <Exterminador> also having troubles with Appimage of the program. it simply doesn't start. :/
[16:11] <flocculant> not sure about those things tbh
[16:13] <tomreyn> Exterminador, flocculant: if you run "dpkg -S /etc/modprobe.d/nvidia-340.conf" and it outputs something then this file belongs to a package you still have installed (or whose configuration were not yet purged)
[16:14] <flocculant> tomreyn: too late for me for sure
[16:15] <Exterminador> well, I've done apt remove nvidia*, then it said that some packages weren't needed no more and to do "apt autoremove", which I've done. but still, the file was there after all that steps. I can reinstall the drivers and do it all again
[16:16] <nacc> Exterminador: remove or purge?
[16:16] <nacc> Exterminador: remove may leave some files around, depending on the file
[16:16] <nacc> I think, in particular, conf files
[16:16] <Exterminador> I've done just "apt remove nvidia*"
[16:17] <nacc> Exterminador: right, that doesn't remove configuration files (iirc)
[16:17] <Exterminador> so, "apt remove --purge"?
[16:17] <nacc> Exterminador: apt purge
[16:18] <Exterminador> well, I can try to install it in a bit and do that and see if the problem persists
[16:18]  * flocculant wanders off to do that on the 'let this install break partition'
[16:31] <flocculant> nacwell - that all happened again 
[16:31] <flocculant> nacc: ^^
[16:32] <nacc> flocculant: the same stray file(s)?
[16:32] <flocculant> seems that after additional drivers reinstalls nouveau - that blacklist file is still there
[16:32] <flocculant> there were some packages to autoremove - did that - still there
[16:32] <nacc> flocculant: autoremove won't purge
[16:33] <flocculant> why should I need to purge?
[16:33] <flocculant> well
[16:33] <nacc> flocculant: because config files aren't removed otherwise
[16:33] <nacc> flocculant: i think you need to call `sudo apt-get remove --autoremove --purge` to do it?, not sure
[16:33] <flocculant> what I mean is - if nvidia is leaving a blacklist - then additional drivers should do that
[16:34] <flocculant> you and I know about apt - but bert up the road might not - he's just got 640x480px now
[16:34] <nacc> flocculant: additional drivers as in the dialgoue?
[16:34] <flocculant> yea
[16:34] <nacc> hrm, sorry, i hadn't read the backscroll all the way :)
[16:34] <nacc> so it's a matter of clicking then unclicking said dialogue?
[16:35] <flocculant> nacc: ftr - I've done this previously in this cycle and it worked fine - and during a and z and y cycles :)
[16:35] <nacc> in *theory*, i think apt is supposed to remove config files that are unmodified
[16:35] <nacc> so i wonder if it's a bheavioral change in apt
[16:35] <nacc> (see `man apt`, purge section
[16:35] <flocculant> possibly 
[16:35] <flocculant> also not sure if it's just nvidia-340
[16:35] <nacc> flocculant: Exterminador: i'd file a bug, add tasks for apt, nvidia-340, and whatever owns taht GUI dialogue
[16:35] <flocculant> I guess tseliot would be the one to know
[16:36] <flocculant> nacc: ok
[16:36] <nacc> flocculant: it would be good to know if manually purging nvidia-340 fixes it
[16:36] <flocculant> nacc: right
[16:36] <flocculant> I'll just get a cup of tea and redo it in the more broken install partition :)
[16:37] <nacc> flocculant: :)
[16:37] <flocculant> then I can update the bug some more
[16:37] <BionicMac> Good day folks. How goes it? =)
[16:37] <nacc> flocculant: Exterminador: were you both using apt or apt-get?
[16:37] <nacc> i wonder also if it's a behavioral difference between them (technically allowed)
[16:40] <flocculant> nacc: I used the gui in software and updates - additional drivers - which is the normal (for non tech people) way
[16:40] <flocculant> mostly because I can't be bothered to work out which driver is for the card ;)
[16:40] <nacc> flocculant: right, but i don't know what that actually uses :)
[16:40]  * flocculant neither
[16:40] <flocculant> so in a moment I'll do it the techy way :p
[16:40] <nacc> heh
[16:41] <flocculant> if that's fine - then there is a problem with the gui method which I'm guessing -release would like to know about :d
[16:41] <flocculant> biab
[16:58] <vivid> so did you guys break dhcp
[16:59] <nacc> vivid: this is the support channel, not necessarily where developers live, so maybe re-ask the question, with details.
[16:59] <vivid> which details are missing?
[17:00] <nacc> vivid: any details?
[17:00] <nacc> vivid: no, dhcp is not broken, afaik
[17:01] <vivid> well its not working here after this mornings 81 packages of updates
[17:01] <nacc> vivid: logs? what kind of networking setup, etc/
[17:01] <vivid> everything is default
[17:01] <nacc> vivid: ubuntu or one of the flavors/
[17:07] <flocculant> nacc: well that was interesting 
[17:08] <nacc> flocculant: how'd it go?
[17:08] <flocculant> so software & updates/additional drivers leaves behind files and thus 640x480px cos nouveau blacklisted - apt purge does as we would expect
[17:08] <flocculant> and it took a pot of tea ...
[17:09] <flocculant> I'll let infinity know
[17:09] <nacc> flocculant: strange, yeah --- that does seem like a regressions somewhere
[17:09] <flocculant> yup
[17:10] <flocculant> I don't really use nvidia tbh - only check it a couple of times a cycle - good timing perhaps :)
[17:17] <flocculant> nacc: I changed bug to software-properties - seems more logical
[17:17] <nacc> flocculant: yeah
[17:19] <flocculant> that's hopefully my good deed of the day - I can go be bad again :p
[17:20] <flocculant> would I guess be useful if someone with a different nvidia card could look 
[17:20] <flocculant> but I guess it probably doesn't matter
[17:24] <Exterminador> sorry. I went afk. what do you need me to test?
[17:25] <flocculant> Exterminador: it's ok - you escaped at the right time - I did it :)
[17:25] <Exterminador> hahaha. that's what happens when kids are on your tail. xD
[17:25] <flocculant> :)
[17:27] <Exterminador> just wondering if anyone knows a backup system that can use Gdrive or Dropbox to store the backups automatically
[17:33] <ZaZaQR> hi
[17:34] <ZaZaQR> I'm using Ubuntu Bionic Beaver (development branch). whats the 
[17:34] <ZaZaQR>                 differents between this and the last beta?
[17:34] <ZaZaQR> lastest
[17:42] <ZaZaQR> ?
[17:43] <nacc> ZaZaQR: if they are both fully updated, nothing
[17:43] <nacc> ZaZaQR: beta is just a point in time
[17:43] <flocculant> ZaZaQR: ubuntu has only had one beta anyway 
[17:43] <flocculant> for some cycles now
[17:47] <ZaZaQR> oh ic
[18:57] <flocculant> nacc: just tried the same in 17.10.1 iso - works fine there
[18:57] <flocculant> from software-properties that is
[19:00] <LevierMRQ> Why +1, as it was a totaly revolutionary release?
[19:01] <nacc> flocculant: interesting
[19:01] <nacc> LevierMRQ: are you asking about flocculant's point?
[19:04] <LevierMRQ> nacc: wasnt.  Reading back a bit.
[19:04] <flocculant> nacc: yea indeed :)
[19:04] <nacc> LevierMRQ: ok, unclear who your question was directed to, and regarding what, then
[19:05] <flocculant> nacc: tagged it regression-update - not sure there's much more that I can do :)
[19:05] <nacc> flocculant: ack
[20:42] <maxb_> Bionic seems to have removed the ability to right-click using the bottom-right corner of my touchpad. Does anyone know how to get it back? Googling is less fruitful than I expected in this case.
[20:43] <nacc> maxb_: does tapping with two fingers (i use my pointer and middle) on the right-side of the touchpad work?
[20:44] <maxb_> two fingers works, independent of position, but that's not what 
[20:44] <maxb_> .. I've spent the last few years being accustomed to
[20:44] <nacc> maxb_: sure
[20:44] <nacc> maxb_: just wondering
[20:44] <nacc> maxb_: can you check if you are using libinput or synaptic?
[20:45] <maxb_> synclient works ... is that an answer?
[20:46] <nacc> maxb_: yeah, that probably means you have xserver-xorg-input-synaptics installed
[20:46] <maxb_> 'xinput list' says 'SynPS/2 Synaptics TouchPad'
[20:49] <maxb_> Behaviour seems the same after removing it and switching to libinput though
[20:50] <nacc> maxb_: you *might* need to reboot after switching it
[20:50] <nacc> maxb_: i really don't know
[20:51] <maxb_> I did (I'm on IRC via a bouncer)
[20:51] <nacc> maxb: ok
[20:51] <maxb> I think it's time to fall back on fetching my second machine that's still on artful, and diffing all the synclient properties before and after upgrade
[21:07] <Ian_Corne> I tied to install touchpad-indicator before, but it didn't launch
[21:08] <Ian_Corne> https://github.com/atareao/Touchpad-Indicator/issues/12#issuecomment-379371876
[21:11] <Ian_Corne> It's working now apparently :)
[21:17] <Ian_Corne> Don't see that option though
[21:50] <maxb> Well. First, I'd forgotten I'd upgraded my second laptop to bionic back in March. But it turns out bionic back in March was old enough to predate the issue.
[21:51] <maxb> A bionic->bionic intermediate upgrade managed to turn the touchpad off entirely!
[21:52] <maxb> Having fixed that, it appears that the main problem is that all the values for 'Synaptics Soft Button Areas' are getting zeroed out
[21:52] <nacc> maxb: hrm, weird
[22:02] <maxb> Weird indeed:
[22:02] <maxb> maxb@spectre:~$ grep SoftButton .local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log
[22:02] <maxb> [    23.969] (**) Option "SoftButtonAreas" "50% 0 82% 0 0 0 0 0"
[22:02] <maxb> maxb@spectre:~$ xinput list-props 11 | grep "Soft Button"
[22:02] <maxb> 	Synaptics Soft Button Areas (308):	0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0