[08:08] <tarzeau> it'd be easy to upgrade qtractor to 0.9.0 (from 0.8.5)
[08:08] <tarzeau> (even with the official packages)
[15:31] <OvenWerks> tarzeau: step one, get qtractor upgraded in debian. Step two ask for a sync in ubuntu.
[15:31] <OvenWerks> tarzeau: so check if there is already a bug report asking for update and create one if not.
[15:33] <SlidingHorn> What are people's thoughts on adding Cadence & Carla?
[15:38] <OvenWerks> Carla yes. cadence not as sure... the next ubuntustudio-controls pretty much replaces it
[15:39] <OvenWerks> (and adds to it)
[15:40] <SlidingHorn> I didn't even know USC was a thing...lol
[15:41] <OvenWerks> SlidingHorn: I have been waiting to see one or the other make it into debian. So far no one has touched it... due to licencing?
[15:42] <OvenWerks> -controls next starts jack at session start allowing using more than one audio device and allows seeting which ports pulse gets connected to.
[15:42] <OvenWerks> -controls next will auto connect a USB device to jack as well
[15:42] <OvenWerks> this will allow using the USB mic
[15:43] <OvenWerks> (lets not call it a pro-mic :P
[17:08] <ErichEickmeyer> OvenWerks: Cadence is GPL, there's no reason why it can't be added.
[17:08] <ErichEickmeyer> https://github.com/falkTX/Cadence/blob/master/COPYING
[17:09] <ErichEickmeyer> That said, with -controls being so good, it might just be something to add to the repos, but we'd have to work with upstream.
[17:28] <OvenWerks> SlidingHorn: take a look at yesterdays log of #ubuntustudio for some of the problems Cadence gives for trouble shooting.Cadence is, Carla can be if some things are left out (like linux sampler) Carla would be a much better addition as there is nothing else that does what it does any more.
[17:28] <OvenWerks> Opps the last part of that was in responce to ErichEickmeyer comment
[17:31] <OvenWerks> Cadence makes system changes that are hard to revert temporarily without removing cadence.
[17:32] <OvenWerks> I am not sure if that is good or bad :)
[17:33] <OvenWerks> -controls makes any changes to pulse on the fly. Cadence does not deal with USB mics.
[17:34] <OvenWerks> Adding cadence to the repos if -controls is default would result in conflict. Both can not be installed at the same time.
[17:34] <ErichEickmeyer> Yeah, that's true. I think that is something that needs to be left to the user to decide, tbh. My biggest issue (and advantage for Cadence) is that, when using a dummy card, I can specify how many ports it has in & out, whereas with qjackctl I cannot. Is that something we can put in -controls?
[17:34] <SlidingHorn> I didn't know about -controls to begin with, so I'll be playing with that to see how it works
[17:35] <OvenWerks> Once I have -controls working as it should, it should be possible to allow both to co-exist.
[17:36] <OvenWerks> I could certainly add dummy as an option and allow for number of ports in and out
[17:36] <ErichEickmeyer> Well, here's my idea: I'll work on packaging both Cadence and Carla (and Calf 0.90.0) and have them in my PPA and, when -controls can do it, we'll try to push Cadence upstream. Carla and Calf can be more immediate.
[17:36] <OvenWerks> I am finding I will have to rework the GUI yet again anyway :)
[17:36] <ErichEickmeyer> OvenWerks: Oh man, sorry. :/
[17:37] <ErichEickmeyer> Is the goal for -controls to be able to replace much of qjackctl's funtionality?
[17:38] <OvenWerks> Well, in playing with USB stuff I am realizing that if the user has more than 1 USB device, things get wierd. I need to allow the user to tell which usb device to use as master if they want that.
[17:39] <OvenWerks> qjckctl will be changing for sure Rui has announced that we should all watch his LAC presentation this year :)
[17:39] <ErichEickmeyer> OH good. For all of its functionality, it definitely needs a revamp.
[17:39] <OvenWerks> -controls is not set up to make connections or to show them.
[17:40] <ErichEickmeyer> Yeah, that's where something like Carla could come in, and of course Ardour can manage connections.
[17:40] <OvenWerks> -controls will start jack and add extra clients from hw changes.
[17:40] <OvenWerks> patchage can work too.
[17:40] <ErichEickmeyer> Unfortunately, patchage is unmaintained. :/
[17:40] <OvenWerks> true
[17:41] <OvenWerks> The author has gotten a real job... (with Ableton?)
[17:41] <ErichEickmeyer> If we can get Carla in the repos, then I'd honestly recommend dropping patchage from our metapackages.
[17:42] <OvenWerks> maybe look at Catia as a patch bay
[17:42] <ErichEickmeyer> Catia is part of Cadence.
[17:43] <ErichEickmeyer> Can't be separated.
[17:46] <OvenWerks> the kxstudio repos show it as separate
[17:47] <ErichEickmeyer> Strange. Any time I compile Cadence from source it installs /everything/. 
[17:47] <ErichEickmeyer> Or if I install cadence from the KXStudio repos.
[17:48] <ErichEickmeyer> They're not separate in github.
[17:49] <OvenWerks> Ya, I see that, I downloaded Catia from kxstudio and Cadence is in there too.
[17:49] <ErichEickmeyer> Yep.
[17:49] <ErichEickmeyer> Carla, however, is separate.
[17:50] <OvenWerks> Yes. I have built it here a few times... will have to again for 18.04
[17:50] <OvenWerks>  I will see if I can build Catia separately
[17:50] <ErichEickmeyer> Is it a build option?
[17:51] <OvenWerks> looks like.
[17:51] <OvenWerks> make catia should work
[17:52] <ErichEickmeyer> Oh cool! If that works and can be packaged, there's our solution. That said, having Carla couldn't hurt, it's a good (potential) competitor to Waves Central.
[17:52] <OvenWerks> I haven't played with cadence at all
[17:53] <ErichEickmeyer> Try it out. Maybe we can take ideas and integrate them into -controls.
[17:53] <OvenWerks> ErichEickmeyer: the hard thing about Carla packaging is that it does not use any auto build
[17:54] <OvenWerks> When it builds it just seems to build with whatever resources it can find.
[17:54] <ErichEickmeyer> Hmmm... I'll play around with it and see what I can come up with. Probably just needs some build dependencies defined.
[17:54] <OvenWerks> I could not figure out how to set up a src package when I tried.
[17:55] <OvenWerks> It needs a build script
[17:55] <ErichEickmeyer> Might even be a matter of working with upstream (FalkTX). He seems like a reasonable guy.
[17:55] <OvenWerks> (a custom build script)
[17:56] <OvenWerks> falktx (now that he is no longer doing MOD) may be packaging for debian himself.
[17:56] <ErichEickmeyer> I thnk he is, but he's still using his PPA as his repo.
[17:57] <ErichEickmeyer> Perhaps, if that's the case, then it's just a sync request?
[17:57] <OvenWerks> Yes, but it is easy to create a binary package... but debian/ubuntu require a buildable src package first
[17:58] <OvenWerks> So the KXstudio stuff is binary, but there are no src packages I know of
[17:58] <ErichEickmeyer> There's got to be a way.
[17:58] <OvenWerks> That is why controls is in python rather than c++ in case you were wondering  ;)
[17:59] <ErichEickmeyer> Easier to code, I get it. :)
[17:59] <OvenWerks> I am sure there is a way... I just don't have the time and patience to learn it at this time
[17:59] <ErichEickmeyer> No worries. If I were you, I'd focus on -controls. It's good stuff. :)
[17:59] <OvenWerks> I really do want to get -controls our in the next 3 months
[18:00] <OvenWerks>  And I have a half done bit in Ardour I want to get done before Paul adds his huge chunck of code.
[18:01] <ErichEickmeyer> I'll see what I can do about Carla. I'm no coder (haven't coded since MS BASIC 2.0 on a C64) but I've been learning packaging.
[18:01] <OvenWerks> It would be no problem to have catia run from with in -controls.
[18:02] <OvenWerks> Carla is very easy to build (from my POV)
[18:02] <ErichEickmeyer> Would you just call Catia from a button?
[18:02] <ErichEickmeyer> Or make it a tab?
[18:02] <OvenWerks> I think getting the depnds right is the hardest part.
[18:03] <OvenWerks> from a button. Unless it is written in python.
[18:03] <ErichEickmeyer> Pretty sure all of Cadence (incl. Catia, et al) is written in Python.
[18:03] <OvenWerks> If it is written in python it would not be so hard to swallow it
[18:04] <OvenWerks> Catia is a binary
[18:05] <ErichEickmeyer> https://github.com/falkTX/Cadence/blob/master/src/catia.py
[18:06] <OvenWerks> The Catia I downloaded from KXStudio is a binary file
[18:07] <ErichEickmeyer> Which makes sense since he's probably compiling it before uploading it.
[18:08] <OvenWerks> So maybe it is written in python but compiled to a binary for dist.
[18:08] <ErichEickmeyer> That's what I'm gathering.
[18:09] <OvenWerks> It is qt4
[18:10] <ErichEickmeyer> The binary, yes. The code on github is ported to Qt5.
[18:11] <OvenWerks> I was reading INSTAL.md
[18:11] <OvenWerks> I guess it is out of date
[18:11] <ErichEickmeyer> He just recently finished the port and hasn't updated his docs yet.
[18:12] <OvenWerks> ya it says he finished the qt5 port 2 months ago.
[18:13] <ErichEickmeyer> Yep. I'm subscribed to the watch ML for the project.
[18:20] <OvenWerks> if you play with it his INSTAL file suggests libjack-dev don't install that!
[18:20] <OvenWerks> you have to install the jackd2 version :)
[18:22] <OvenWerks> Oh and they are all QT4 of course.
[18:26] <ErichEickmeyer> Yeah, looks like he needs a branch to fix the Install file and a pull request to follow.
[18:38] <OvenWerks> Catia when run is still looking for qt4
[18:39] <OvenWerks> ModuleNotFoundError: No module named 'PyQt4'
[19:05] <ErichEickmeyer> Sounds like a bug report needed.
[19:22] <ErichEickmeyer> Or a dependency issue: python3-pyqt4
[21:51] <OvenWerks> In any case, Carla just builds. Just make and it builds. Running make features tells what it wil (or has already) include. If there is something not included... look for the missing dep.
[23:05] <SlidingHorn> so is the -controls application supposed to have a GUI?  It asks me for my admin password and then nothing (when selecting from menu)
[23:07] <OvenWerks> SlidingHorn: that would be the old one
[23:07] <OvenWerks> It should show the GUI with no password.
[23:08] <OvenWerks> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntustudio-dev/+archive/ubuntu/autobuild
[23:09] <OvenWerks> I normally down load the file and install it
[23:09] <SlidingHorn> just add that ppa & install the new version
[23:10] <OvenWerks> I dl just the file so I don't get all the stuff in there :)
[23:10] <OvenWerks> But I think controls is the only active one right now.
[23:11] <SlidingHorn> should I just grab the deb, or do I need the whole source package?
[23:11] <OvenWerks> deb is fine.
[23:13] <OvenWerks> once installed it will not do much till you have logged out and back in.
[23:19] <OvenWerks> I see something else I could change/improve
[23:19] <OvenWerks> (added to NOTES)
[23:20] <OvenWerks> SlidingHorn: I use this on my daily machine. I have used something similar (not as refined) for over 3 years now.
[23:21] <SlidingHorn> required cpufrequtils & libcpufreq0 - got everything installed
[23:21] <SlidingHorn> will check it out in a min
[23:22] <SlidingHorn> watching youtube vids and don't feel like logging yet lol
[23:23] <OvenWerks> I should make it so it doesn't need cpufrequtils as that package doesn't really work right