| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: openmpi [arm64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [3.0.1.real-4] (kubuntu) | 00:08 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: openmpi [armhf] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [3.0.1.real-4] (kubuntu) | 00:12 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: openmpi [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [3.0.1.real-4] (kubuntu) | 00:29 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted openmpi [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [3.0.1.real-4] | 01:08 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted openmpi [armhf] (cosmic-proposed) [3.0.1.real-4] | 01:08 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted openmpi [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed) [3.0.1.real-4] | 01:08 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted openmpi [arm64] (cosmic-proposed) [3.0.1.real-4] | 01:08 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted openmpi [s390x] (cosmic-proposed) [3.0.1.real-4] | 01:08 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted openmpi [i386] (cosmic-proposed) [3.0.1.real-4] | 01:08 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: clipper [s390x] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1.20160809-1] (no packageset) | 03:24 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: clipper [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1.20160809-1] (no packageset) | 03:25 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: clipper [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1.20160809-1] (no packageset) | 03:26 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: clipper [i386] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1.20160809-1] (no packageset) | 03:26 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: clipper [arm64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1.20160809-1] (no packageset) | 03:29 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: clipper [armhf] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1.20160809-1] (no packageset) | 03:29 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: weechat [s390x] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1-2] (no packageset) | 03:39 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: weechat [i386] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1-2] (no packageset) | 03:40 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: weechat [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1-2] (no packageset) | 03:40 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: weechat [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1-2] (no packageset) | 03:41 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: weechat [armhf] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1-2] (no packageset) | 03:42 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: weechat [arm64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [2.1-2] (no packageset) | 03:43 | |
| === tacobat` is now known as tacobat | ||
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted clipper [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1.20160809-1] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted clipper [armhf] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1.20160809-1] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted clipper [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1.20160809-1] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted weechat [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1-2] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted weechat [armhf] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1-2] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted weechat [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1-2] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted clipper [arm64] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1.20160809-1] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted clipper [s390x] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1.20160809-1] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted weechat [i386] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1-2] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted clipper [i386] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1.20160809-1] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted weechat [s390x] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1-2] | 07:36 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted weechat [arm64] (cosmic-proposed) [2.1-2] | 07:36 | |
| Laney | juliank: nice | 08:05 |
|---|---|---|
| LocutusOfBorg | Release Team, the Debian haskell transition should be mostly over, and I would like to drop llvm 3.7 from our world... | 08:11 |
| LocutusOfBorg | can you please tell me when it is convenient to do my manual syncs? (please don't whitelist it right now, I prefer to sync in the right order to avoid useless rebuilds and infra time) | 08:12 |
| Laney | juliank: fixed the image script too | 08:40 |
| juliank | Laney: nice | 08:45 |
| Laney | copied sil2100's email typo again :D | 09:26 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: debhelper (bionic-proposed/main) [11.1.6ubuntu1 => 11.1.6ubuntu2] (core) | 09:34 | |
| sil2100 | E-mail typo? | 09:52 |
| sil2100 | Which one ;p? | 09:52 |
| * sil2100 does a lot of typos | 09:52 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted debhelper [source] (bionic-proposed) [11.1.6ubuntu2] | 09:54 | |
| Laney | sil2100: I typoed your email address in a ticket the other day | 09:57 |
| Laney | and then juliank copied and pasted that | 09:57 |
| Laney | and today I just copied it again | 09:57 |
| Laney | /o\ | 09:57 |
| apw | Laney, if that is the worst thing that happens today, you should grab it with both hands | 09:58 |
| Laney | haha | 09:59 |
| Laney | apw feeling particularly upbeat today | 09:59 |
| juliank | apw: at least all those pesky germans have a holiday today, so no trouble from that country... | 09:59 |
| apw | juliank, always on the day you need one of course ... | 10:00 |
| Laney | getting good service on my SRUs | 10:01 |
| Laney | high five to the team! | 10:01 |
| * juliank doesn't really feel like holiday today | 10:01 | |
| apw | Laney, that is because you make them small and easy to review :) | 10:01 |
| Laney | Niels pinged me and said "take this commit plz" | 10:01 |
| Laney | it was easy through and through | 10:01 |
| apw | LocutusOfBorg, in bionic we have a sync of virtualbox-ext-pack at 5.2.10-4 and an upload (after that) at 5.2.10-3ubuntu18.04.1 -- i assume you only want the latter ? | 10:03 |
| Laney | can you do syncs as SRUs? | 10:05 |
| Laney | if the dsc has LP-Bugs-Fixed maybe? | 10:05 |
| Laney | s/dsc/changes/ but then it won't have one... | 10:05 |
| apw | you can technically, they tend to make people very sad; they would be a sync-from-ppa in that case often | 10:06 |
| LocutusOfBorg | apw, I would appreciate the sync, but if infra/policy disallows that, SRU versioning is fine | 10:32 |
| LocutusOfBorg | they are technically the same | 10:32 |
| apw | LocutusOfBorg, oh that version hit cosmic already, so that makes the answer simple | 10:42 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected virtualbox-ext-pack [sync] (bionic-proposed) [5.2.10-4] | 10:49 | |
| ddstreet | sil2100 i uploaded t/x/a for lp #1701023, if you have time to review/approve them, then we can let that sit in -proposed for enough time to get it widely tested | 11:22 |
| ubot5 | Launchpad bug 1701023 in vlan (Ubuntu Artful) "(on trusty) version 1.9-3ubuntu10.4 regression blocking boot completion" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1701023 | 11:22 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: faumachine [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/none) [20180503-1] (no packageset) | 11:34 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed [amd64] (trusty-proposed/main) [3.13.0-148.197] (core, kernel) | 11:58 | |
| ahasenack | hi, should we mark the dovecot dep8 armhf tests as flaky, https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/dovecot/cosmic/armhf, or cam someone hand me an armhf box to further debug this? | 12:35 |
| LocutusOfBorg | apw, since this is a downloader, a copy-back of the binary from cosmic to bionic works too :) | 12:37 |
| LocutusOfBorg | it is binary identical I would say | 12:37 |
| LocutusOfBorg | anyhow, let me know what is your best way | 12:37 |
| LocutusOfBorg | in the meanwhile the new vbox is out, so cosmic will have an higher version in 12h | 12:38 |
| enyc | LocutusOfBorg: all virtualbox versions will be harmonized, resistance is futile???? | 12:50 |
| LocutusOfBorg | enyc, you will be assimilated. | 12:51 |
| * enyc thwarts LocutusOfBorg with a fatal memory protection violation | 12:51 | |
| enyc | Last I checked, virtualbox 5.1 was being a pain, audio/microphone nonsense, etc etc... | 12:52 |
| * LocutusOfBorg borg have improved their NPE handling, after assimilating M$ | 12:52 | |
| enyc | maye thats' all fine now in -5.1, and its' now virtualbox-5.2 being a pain | 12:52 |
| LocutusOfBorg | who knows? :) | 12:53 |
| LocutusOfBorg | seriously, it should be work correctly now | 12:53 |
| slashd | o/ sil2100, could you please approve the bionic upload of 'ubiquity' for LP: #1751252, if you have a moment ? | 12:58 |
| ubot5 | Launchpad bug 1751252 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Bionic) "[regression] ubiquity crashed in debconf.py:104 with ValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: ''" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1751252 | 12:58 |
| sil2100 | slashd: hey! Sure | 13:27 |
| slashd | sil2100, thanks | 13:29 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted ubiquity [source] (bionic-proposed) [18.04.14.1] | 13:32 | |
| ddstreet | sil2100 o/ if you have time could you review/approve the t/x/a uploads for lp #1701023 | 13:56 |
| ubot5 | Launchpad bug 1701023 in vlan (Ubuntu Artful) "(on trusty) version 1.9-3ubuntu10.4 regression blocking boot completion" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1701023 | 13:56 |
| sil2100 | ddstreet: on it! Will just finish this one pyvmomi | 13:58 |
| ddstreet | thnx! | 13:58 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted vlan [source] (artful-proposed) [1.9-3.2ubuntu5.17.10.1] | 14:12 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted ifupdown [source] (artful-proposed) [0.8.16ubuntu2.1] | 14:17 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted vlan [source] (xenial-proposed) [1.9-3.2ubuntu1.16.04.5] | 14:19 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted ifupdown [source] (xenial-proposed) [0.8.10ubuntu1.4] | 14:21 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted vlan [source] (trusty-proposed) [1.9-3ubuntu10.6] | 14:23 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed [amd64] (trusty-proposed) [3.13.0-148.197] | 14:24 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed-hwe [amd64] (xenial-proposed/main) [4.13.0-42.47~16.04.1] (kernel) | 14:46 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed [amd64] (artful-proposed/main) [4.13.0-42.47] (core, kernel) | 14:47 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted ifupdown [source] (trusty-proposed) [0.7.47.2ubuntu4.5] | 15:04 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed [amd64] (artful-proposed) [4.13.0-42.47] | 15:19 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed-hwe [amd64] (xenial-proposed) [4.13.0-42.47~16.04.1] | 15:20 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed-azure [amd64] (bionic-proposed/main) [4.15.0-1011.11] (kernel) | 16:44 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed-azure [amd64] (xenial-proposed/main) [4.13.0-1017.20] (no packageset) | 16:45 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed [amd64] (xenial-proposed/main) [4.4.0-125.150] (core, kernel) | 16:49 | |
| bdmurray | cyphermox: Do you think bug 1437353 has been verified? | 16:50 |
| ubot5 | bug 1437353 in maas-images "UEFI network boot hangs at grub for adapter 82599ES 10-Gigabit SFI/SFP+" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1437353 | 16:50 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed-lts-xenial [amd64] (trusty-proposed/main) [4.4.0-125.150~14.04.1] (kernel) | 16:51 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed-azure [amd64] (xenial-proposed) [4.13.0-1017.20] | 16:52 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed [amd64] (xenial-proposed) [4.4.0-125.150] | 16:52 | |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: Hi. Want to do that seed conversion? | 16:53 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed-azure [amd64] (bionic-proposed) [4.15.0-1011.11] | 16:54 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed-lts-xenial [amd64] (trusty-proposed) [4.4.0-125.150~14.04.1] | 16:55 | |
| === blackboxsw is now known as blackboxs | ||
| === blackboxs is now known as blackboxsw | ||
| bdmurray | rbalint: Could you SRU verify bug 1758963? | 17:15 |
| ubot5 | bug 1758963 in update-manager (Ubuntu Artful) "Please don't ship empty directories in the source package" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1758963 | 17:15 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: kbackup [s390x] (cosmic-proposed/none) [18.04.0-1] (no packageset) | 17:15 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: kbackup [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed/none) [18.04.0-1] (no packageset) | 17:17 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: pal2nal [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/none) [14.1-1] (no packageset) | 17:19 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: kbackup [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/none) [18.04.0-1] (no packageset) | 17:20 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: kbackup [i386] (cosmic-proposed/none) [18.04.0-1] (no packageset) | 17:20 | |
| bdrung | tumbleweed, thanks for taking care of distro-info-data | 17:51 |
| tumbleweed | bdrung: np. infinity did the heavy lifting anyway | 17:52 |
| tumbleweed | hope you're ok with the debian relase date guessing bit... | 17:53 |
| bdrung | yes | 17:57 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: kbackup [arm64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [18.04.0-1] (no packageset) | 18:01 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: kbackup [armhf] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [18.04.0-1] (no packageset) | 18:03 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted kbackup [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [18.04.0-1] | 18:06 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted kbackup [armhf] (cosmic-proposed) [18.04.0-1] | 18:06 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted kbackup [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed) [18.04.0-1] | 18:06 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted kbackup [arm64] (cosmic-proposed) [18.04.0-1] | 18:06 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted kbackup [s390x] (cosmic-proposed) [18.04.0-1] | 18:06 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted kbackup [i386] (cosmic-proposed) [18.04.0-1] | 18:06 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted faumachine [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [20180503-1] | 18:08 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted pal2nal [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [14.1-1] | 18:08 | |
| cascardo | can someone help get s390-tools from xenial-proposed to xenial-updates (and xenial-security)? | 18:22 |
| infinity | cascardo: Releasing. | 19:00 |
| cascardo | infinity: thanks | 19:23 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: I finally got around to creating the CosmicCuttlefish wiki page. Do you have a draft release schedule somewhere, or should I copy over the one we were working on a few months ago? | 19:37 |
| infinity | tsimonq2: I'll put one up. | 19:38 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: OK. | 19:39 |
| infinity | tsimonq2: If we're doing ReleaseTaskSignup again, maybe we should replace A1/A2/B1 with lines asking for community volunteers to advocate testing weeks. | 19:39 |
| infinity | tsimonq2: Which should be much more lightweight. Just sending mails to all the lists, making sure project leads are awake, that sort of thing. | 19:39 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: I agreed to do that for this cycle to get a process going. | 19:40 |
| infinity | tsimonq2: Then you can sign up for all of them! ;) | 19:40 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: But for next cycle though. | 19:40 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: OK. :D | 19:40 |
| infinity | tsimonq2: And sign me up for Beta and Final, obviously. | 19:40 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: Yep. It's now just "Beta", aye? | 19:40 |
| infinity | Yeah. | 19:40 |
| tsimonq2 | OK. On it. | 19:40 |
| infinity | "Final Beta" was a silly name anyway. | 19:40 |
| flocculant | tsimonq2: I#ll take a week later in the cycle | 19:40 |
| infinity | Just the only way to communicate that is was B2 for some and B1 for others. | 19:41 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: Let's see how it plays out. | 19:41 |
| infinity | Really, B1 should have just been A3. That would have been less dumb. | 19:41 |
| tsimonq2 | Yeah. | 19:41 |
| infinity | But it's in the past now, so yay. | 19:41 |
| tsimonq2 | I agree. | 19:42 |
| flocculant | well - we'll unlikely participate early in the cycle | 19:42 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: So, you aren't alive at the beginning of the cycle? | 19:42 |
| tsimonq2 | That's pretty much what's needed. | 19:42 |
| infinity | "Requirements to drive testing week: Breathing; access to email."? | 19:43 |
| flocculant | tsimonq2: actually it depends on how soon we land gtk3 xfce stuffs | 19:43 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: That. :P | 19:43 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: Then tell us that. | 19:43 |
| tsimonq2 | It'll be pretty lax, I think. | 19:44 |
| flocculant | tsimonq2: tell who? and why? | 19:44 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: I'll put out an email to ubuntu-release at the end of May with details ahbout the testing week, buut it'd be good to check in with flavors too. | 19:45 |
| * tsimonq2 grrs at ConnectBot. | 19:45 | |
| flocculant | maybe we should try and set up some sort of frequent inter-flavour session/contact | 19:46 |
| flocculant | perhaps on https://community.ubuntu.com | 19:46 |
| tsimonq2 | That's the idea here, ish. | 19:46 |
| flocculant | I'd say irc - but timezones ... | 19:46 |
| flocculant | nothing to onerous - but at least a talking shop | 19:47 |
| tsimonq2 | Yeah. | 19:47 |
| tsimonq2 | Of course. | 19:47 |
| flocculant | up to now - the only time we talk is at set times in the 6 months | 19:48 |
| tsimonq2 | And that's not good, in my opinion. | 19:48 |
| flocculant | and that's ' you doing this milestone or not' | 19:48 |
| flocculant | yup - agree, I'm all for us talking to each other more | 19:49 |
| tsimonq2 | Speaking of cross-flavor things... | 19:49 |
| flocculant | about the only people I regularly talk to are you, wxl and random people from studio | 19:49 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: Where were we at irt seed things? | 19:49 |
| flocculant | oh - and valerie :) | 19:49 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: Right. It's a mess, I agree. | 19:49 |
| wxl | tsimonq2: p.s. congrats on the DMB election btw | 19:50 |
| flocculant | hi wxl | 19:50 |
| tsimonq2 | wxl: Thanks. | 19:50 |
| wxl | hey-o flocculant :) | 19:50 |
| flocculant | tsimonq2: I'll mail -release about ^^ nowish | 19:51 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: Go right ahead. | 19:51 |
| flocculant | I will ;) | 19:52 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: I'll put Beta at 09/27 and Release at 10/18 for now. Season to taste. | 19:53 |
| tsimonq2 | (On the release task signup page, which is pretty much done, by the way.) | 19:54 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: What are Xubuntu's thoughts on axing i386, by the way? | 19:55 |
| flocculant | no real thoughts currently - people take time away in the week(s) post-release | 19:56 |
| tsimonq2 | OK. | 19:56 |
| teward | tsimonq2: very real consideration: flavor-agnostic, Wine 64-bit sometimes *just doesn't work* for some Windows apps, and Wine i386 is needed for the 32-bit wineprefixes. | 19:57 |
| teward | while that's not justification to totally destroy i386 globally, it's one consideration point | 19:57 |
| teward | (since it was brought up in the email chains) | 19:58 |
| wxl | i think someone already brought that up on the maililng list, teward | 19:58 |
| wxl | steam is apparently an issue, too | 19:59 |
| teward | wxl: Wine was mentioned, but not specifically detailed | 19:59 |
| * wxl nods | 19:59 | |
| teward | the rest of the discussions spun off to flavors, download/install ratios, etc. | 19:59 |
| teward | the core part of *my* concern is, if we axe i386, we need to axe wine, since IIRC their 64bit version has an immediate dependency on the i386 version as well | 20:00 |
| wxl | given bug 1 that might be an issue :) | 20:00 |
| ubot5 | bug 1 in Ubuntu Malaysia LoCo Team "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1 | 20:00 |
| teward | mmm | 20:00 |
| tsimonq2 | Is there any hope for amd64 support upstream? | 20:00 |
| wxl | it's an issue with windows apps, tsimonq2 | 20:01 |
| teward | tsimonq2: less an "upstream support" question more a "Windows Apps Are Cosmic Pains In The..." | 20:01 |
| teward | i could finish that sentence but you know me well enough to complete the phrase your self. | 20:01 |
| tsimonq2 | Pain in the Cuttlefish? | 20:01 |
| tsimonq2 | :P | 20:01 |
| Bashing-om | i386 media attention: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-i386-Dropping-Discussion . | 20:04 |
| tsimonq2 | Softpedia was first. | 20:04 |
| tsimonq2 | And, technically, they're more accurate on this one. | 20:04 |
| Bashing-om | tsimonq2: Noted :) | 20:04 |
| tsimonq2 | https://buff.ly/2KOVOzL | 20:05 |
| teward | tsimonq2: wxl: I don't disagree with 32bit support being that much harder to maintain, but I disagree in theory about dropping i386 in the short/mid term | 20:06 |
| teward | I haven't replied yet because my email is being screwy, but my opinion is if we *don't* cut i386 immediately, we cut it out sometime between now and next LTS | 20:06 |
| flocculant | tsimonq2: except for the blog title which include xubuntu ... | 20:06 |
| teward | even if the next 2 releases have i386, and the remaining ones don't, that'd at least give a year for some 32-bit-only things to be done. | 20:07 |
| wxl | tbh i'm split about whether or not to remove it | 20:07 |
| tsimonq2 | flocculant: Right, that's kinda clickbait. :P | 20:07 |
| wxl | the meltdown issue is a big concern, imho | 20:07 |
| flocculant | teward: at the moment flavours are really only talking about stopping images building - nothing else | 20:08 |
| infinity | teward: Dropping 32-bit *installers* has no bearing on wine32, since you can (I certainly do) run wine64 and wine32 on a 64-bit install. | 20:08 |
| teward | flocculant: infinity: one of you want to clarify on the chain about that? | 20:08 |
| teward | I'm for dropping 32bit installer images. | 20:08 |
| teward | i'm against droppping x86 as a repository arch | 20:08 |
| teward | and i don't see the clear distinction in the thread | 20:09 |
| tsimonq2 | teward: We either do it now or at the beginning of the 20.10 cycle. | 20:09 |
| teward | (which is a repeat problem of the prior discussion of 32bit support way back when in the Server team's discussions) | 20:09 |
| infinity | I haven't been following the thread, but yes, it should be about dropping installers first. Then a second discussion about dropping the arch. | 20:09 |
| teward | tsimonq2: clarify *your* intentions then: do you mean *total* x86 dropping, or just installer dropping, over the next cycle or two? | 20:09 |
| infinity | Personally, I'd like to drop both armhf and i386 on the floor before 20.04, but I might not win that argument. | 20:09 |
| teward | because this is something we need to clarify in the thread to focus the discussion | 20:10 |
| teward | and as soon as I unscrew my email (your email might be screwed too I didn't check) i'll drop a note to the list for clarification | 20:10 |
| teward | tsimonq2: i think you meant 20.04 cycle there, because 20.04 is (probably?) going to be an LTS, and it doesn't make sense to drop i386 *after* an LTS if it's going to be supported for 3-5 years anyways | 20:11 |
| teward | I'm all in favor of a phaseout if we and upstreams can resolve the remaining dependency issues | 20:11 |
| teward | (again, in the thread, clarification required) | 20:12 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: I agree with i386. I disagree with armhf because I Like Pie. (Or Pi, whatever, but Pie is good too. :P) | 20:14 |
| tsimonq2 | teward: No, after 20.04. I don't want to abandon users on unavailable upgrade paths. | 20:15 |
| teward | infinity: if you had a say, would you want to drop i386 *after* 20.04, or before? | 20:15 |
| teward | on the premise that we'd have to support i386 for an additional 5 years if we kept it in 20.04 | 20:15 |
| infinity | tsimonq2: The Pi1 can't run Ubuntu anyway and the Pi3 is arm64-capable, so armhf-versus-Pi only matters for the Pi2. | 20:15 |
| Odd_Bloke | It would only be an additional 2 years; we're on the hook for 18.04 anyway. | 20:16 |
| tsimonq2 | infinity: Ah. | 20:16 |
| teward | Odd_Bloke: s/2 years/3 years/ ? | 20:16 |
| teward | (not sure your math works out as stated?) | 20:16 |
| infinity | teward: If it was entirely up to me, I'd drop all 32-bit before 20.04. It's getting harder and harder to shoehorn modern bloaty software on 32-bit systems. And i386 has other awful things going for it, most notably a lack of upstream kernel interest in actually fixing security bugs. | 20:16 |
| infinity | Odd_Bloke: You can make that same argument every 2 years. :P | 20:17 |
| Odd_Bloke | Doesn't make it any less valid. ;) | 20:17 |
| Odd_Bloke | teward: 18.04 will be supported until 2023, 20.04 would (presumably) be supported until 2025. It's only an extra 2 years. | 20:18 |
| teward | Odd_Bloke: I think we'd have to loop in the security team on this for their viewpoint, especially if it gets harder and harder to get viable security patches in. | 20:18 |
| teward | oh, i have a question to ask you too infinity, but it's more to gauge opinion on something, and can be done after our discussion here. | 20:18 |
| Odd_Bloke | "only" is perhaps a little too diminutive. :p | 20:19 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: horizon (bionic-proposed/main) [3:13.0.0-0ubuntu1 => 3:13.0.0-0ubuntu1.1] (openstack, ubuntu-server) | 20:19 | |
| tsimonq2 | sarnold: Hi. ;) | 20:19 |
| teward | Odd_Bloke: i could make the same argument then, but at some point we have to kill it, and if come 2 years from now the same argument is used again to support not dropping it, you're in a cycle of "Yeah we'll just continually support this" | 20:19 |
| teward | which is AFAICT what we're running into now? | 20:20 |
| Odd_Bloke | From a cloud images POV, we already don't produce images for i386. | 20:20 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: horizon (artful-proposed/main) [3:12.0.2-0ubuntu1 => 3:12.0.2-0ubuntu1.1] (openstack, ubuntu-server) | 20:20 | |
| tsimonq2 | sarnold: You responded on the mailing list in 2016; what do you think about u32-bit from a security team POV? | 20:21 |
| tsimonq2 | s/u3/3/ | 20:21 |
| Odd_Bloke | (Well, we do for Openstack and LXD, but not for the clouds themselves.) | 20:21 |
| teward | infinity: do you have the power to unhold my message to -devel-discuss? Apparently I forgot to select my @ubuntu.com address in my send aliases, so it sent as my bare email :/ | 20:26 |
| cjwatson | wxl: KPTI on i386 is being worked on, FWIW - it's true that it's been later than x86-64, but I don't expect that particular thing to be a long-term problem | 20:39 |
| cjwatson | (I don't have the links right now, but I saw them floating around in some thread on LWN) | 20:39 |
| wxl | cjwatson: that's good to know. that was the one thing that concerned me the most. | 20:40 |
| wxl | tbh i don't really use i386 anymore (i do have some testing machines, but not for production), so i often just don't pay attention. | 20:40 |
| cjwatson | One of my other concerns is that nobody has ever put the effort into productising sidegrades, so it's something of a screw-you to continuous upgraders (on 64-bit-capable hardware, anyway). | 20:40 |
| cjwatson | I mean, it *can* be done; I've done it I think three times. But it's an expert manoeuvre right now, and it doesn't have to be. | 20:41 |
| sarnold | at some point Very Important Pacakges like firefox and chromium just plain won't build on 32 bit systems | 21:13 |
| sarnold | and we'll find out in the middle of two and a half LTS releases that we can't support e.g. firefox armhf or firefox i386 any more | 21:14 |
| sarnold | I think the *politest* thing for the users is to stop i386 at an LTS boundary -- e.g., don't do 18.10 i386 or armhf, so that people can't accidentally step beyond the support curtain | 21:15 |
| sarnold | of course people *love* their raspi and similar, and it'd be shame to say goodbye to those users, but it's getting hardr to fit in the address spaces available, and *far* harder to build on them | 21:16 |
| Ukikie | Mmmm, sidegrades. I did one earlier this year on a headless system, the thought of doing it on my netbook (at the time of installation was unaware it did 64bit) with xorg/xfce and a whole lot more packages isn't very appealing. | 21:28 |
| cjwatson | It's certainly harder with a pile of desktop packages installed, yes | 22:02 |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: libpam-x2go [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [0.0.2.0-2] (no packageset) | 23:15 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: libpam-x2go [s390x] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [0.0.2.0-2] (no packageset) | 23:15 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: libpam-x2go [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [0.0.2.0-2] (no packageset) | 23:18 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: mpl-scatter-density [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [0.3-2] (no packageset) | 23:18 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: libpam-x2go [i386] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [0.0.2.0-2] (no packageset) | 23:19 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: libpam-x2go [arm64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [0.0.2.0-2] (no packageset) | 23:23 | |
| -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: libpam-x2go [armhf] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [0.0.2.0-2] (no packageset) | 23:23 | |
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