[00:50] <ubptgbot> gamakatz was added by: gamakatz
 Welcome, @joshuld and @gamakatz! Check out ubports.com/telegram-welcome to get you started and feel free to ask any questions you may have in here or in the Welcome & Install room! Most people are asleep about this time but things typically pick up fairly early in the morning (EST). I'm going to go to bed soon as well but I'll try t
[01:20] <ubptgbot> o help if I can in the meantime! 🙂
 [Edit] Welcome, @joshuld and @gamakatz! Check out ubports.com/telegram-welcome to get you started and feel free to ask any questions you may have in here or in the Welcome & Install room! Most people are asleep about this time but things typically pick up fairly early in the morning (EST). I'm going to go to bed soon as well but I'l
[01:20] <ubptgbot> l try to help if I can in the mean time! 🙂
 invalid
 whops, trying to search
 anyway, building a scope for 16.04 and getting " Unable to start app 'commandfu.mateo-salta_commandfu_1.5': Invalid app ID: commandfu.mateo-salta_commandfu_1.5"
 Is there any date post which updates to 15.04 will be stopped ?
 @UniversalSuperBox, look in `/userdata/system-data/var/lib/apparmor/clicks` and check the apparmor profile exists and matches what is being used in the aa-exec call
 @JBBgameich ^^
[06:42] <ubptgbot> Matthiasmickelat was added by: Matthiasmickelat
 hi @Matthiasmickelat o/
 @UniversalSuperBox, [Edit] look in `/var/lib/apparmor/clicks` and `/var/lib/apparmor/profiles` and check the apparmor profile exists and matches what is being used in the aa-exec call (minus the click_ prefix)
 Has Jan Sprinz quit Telegram?
 no I see him in other groups
 I see, cheers!
 Hi @popescu_sorin
 i Have an opo and bq4.5 with ut
 noice!
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/XL7XXBbz.webp
[07:47] <ubptgbot> maddaddam was added by: maddaddam
 @Matthiasmickelat, There are new UBports splash screens for both 😎
 @maddaddam, Hello Maarten. You can check here for an introduction to UBports … https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome
 @Stereofont, Thanks Lionel
 @theReadOnly, 15.04 is EOL and that's why the project is transitioning to 16.04. That means no more OTAs for vivid
 EOL = end of life. A dead parrot
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/knyOo0Iq.mp4
[09:11] <ubptgbot> DonClementeVonRihimannii was added by: DonClementeVonRihimannii
 Good MORNING
 A very good morning to you
 A link for UBpirts stuff is here … https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome
 [Edit] A link for UBports stuff is here … https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome
 And thanks. I will stay out of the way of cetaceans …
 Sorry. Odobenus
 😎
 @DonClementeVonRihimannii, What?? It's 19:30!!!
 That's a long morning indeed
 Here on the internet we make sure it's aways morning for somebody.
 :)
 Here it is morning.. … Central Europe
[10:05] <ubptgbot> Peder was added by: Peder
 Helli Peder. You can fund out more about UBports on … https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome
 @deedend, it's 13:06
 @G_Raffe, that's my man :P
 @G_Raffe, No, 20:06!
 12:10 here wtf
 06:08 here :V
 So we got guys from all over the world here, nice=)
 7:11, you're all Fake News
 Is there a separate group for questions about convergence? (12:12 here)
 @svtv93, No. Though there are some Libertine enthusiasts
 Broadly, we have evolved and old fixes are broken somewhat. 16.04 offers an opportunity to regain that functionality but maybe using new mechanisms
 @svtv93, You can ask all questions here. But before, visit our tracker https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-touch/issues and search if you find your problem already ;)
 Glad to report that after 2 weeks of 18.04 gnome on laptop, that i now dislike it with a passion. … Was a bit worried beforehand that I would like it but we can all relax now. Back to Unity it is!
 just thought i drop this before y'all have to read about it phoronix :D
 This is veering OT but isn't Unity available on Bionic if you've upgraded from Xenial with Unity included?
 i tried using gnome for a couple months on 16.04 last year, when the announcement was made, but alas i could not stand it
 @TartanSpartan, no upgrade required. it's in universe so you can just install it if you want
 Well there you are @matv1
 even on upgrade though, you will have to manually switch back to lightdm, and select unity at the login screen, as the session name changed, due to the previous change in defaults
 (and yeah, it's OT material)
 I dissagree and totaly expect this bombshell to land in the next Q&A but will leave off now ;)
 and thanks for that tip. hadnt thought of it really
 Trashing Bionic is always on topic 😂
 The other bionic, maybe
 @Stereofont, bionic is the worst thing
 i've heard musl is good for digestion
 Let's rebuild the entire archive with bionic libc
 i think that joke would have had them rolling in the aisles over in Halium
 No... I think there would be more pitchforks than anything
 haha
 just watched the Q&A session, and i have never seen a nice community roadmap to be honest
 or even a closed source vendor one
 in my workplace, planning goes either by 2 weeks (a scrum sprint), 3 months (a program interation), or by the year (too far away to really plan)
 maybe that'd be a good way of structuring?
 The q&a looks like a fun thing to participate in
 @rogieroudshoorn, You think so?
 @rogieroudshoorn, Agreed
 Nah
 feel free to share one :)
 @Wiz, Well could you provide some additional context then?
 No
 Moving on, then
 Haters gonna hate
 @vanyasem, ^. That's a legit context
 on topic, what are you considering to use your roadmap for?
 or what would you want to have in there?
 Well, that's the problem, see.
 Lots of people ask for one
 Ubuntu for every device
 But I don't know what they want
 Ez porting i mean
 Wiz, you're not helping
 I gave you a hint
 I'm really not looking for specific points that should be in the roadmap. I'm more interested in the process that successful communities use to create and publish one.
 And what our community wants ours to look like
 I wanna see oreo halium
 That's not a problem of mine
 @VeryOriginalUsername, Well that's Halium's roadmap :P
 Treblized devices could support ut
 @UniversalSuperBox, Ikr 😛
 @VeryOriginalUsername, this guy reads my mind :P
 @UniversalSuperBox, No, because ubuntu also work with halium
 theyre concatenated.
 @mariogrip, Would be nice to play with treble
 is halium still our long-term bet? mainline seems to be hip
 @vanyasem, Treble is a trouble
 But it's such a nice vision that all android devices in the future (google requires treble on devices coming out with oreo) could run ubuntu
 @vanyasem, But i dont have any devices that support it officially
 @UniversalSuperBox consider wiz a spammer
 Or a troll
 Mhmm. I was going to give him one more try before a ban
 @vanyasem, Thats not fair from your side
 @vanyasem, @mariogrip ideas?
 treble is nice, I just hope vendors make use of it, so far not many do
 @mariogrip, Isn't it mandatory for oreo+ android devices? that means everything that hits the market now ought to support it ...
 Treble is for ez porting wihich is my point
 i dont expect cheaper devices to jump on that train anytime soon
 A roadmap is really to create a sense of discipline and to force a critical examination of the way forward. It is not a definition of what will actually happen in the future
 @rogieroudshoorn, they still provide the existing hal api, there is no saying you "need" to use treble
 so it's mandatory to support it, but not to actually use it?
 nice
 @mariogrip, Xiaomi 2017 devices have treble ported
 Check xda
 In a military battle there us a mock-up of strategy but when it actually starts, everything is thrown away and based on the real development of events
 @VeryOriginalUsername, nice, i have always liked xiaomi :D
 @VeryOriginalUsername, OP5T too iirc
 @mariogrip, Well i might just buy a new phone. What would you suggest
 https://forum.xda-developers.com/project-treble/trebleenabled-device-development
 First google link; could not contain everything
 so a moto G6 for instance should support it
 just a well-known fairly cheap device range
 @vanyasem, im a fan of devices with hdmi out :) i would say op6 but i was a bit sad that it does not support it
 If a device *is coming out* with oreo out of the box (not necessarily after update)  it has to support treble, otherwise no google certification
 https://www.google.pl/amp/s/www.xda-developers.com/list-android-devices-project-treble-support/amp/
 Here's a more complete list
 @VeryOriginalUsername, sure, but not all vendors have certification anyway, there is many uncertifaced devices out there
 is there somewhere I can look to see what changes in the nightly xenial devel build? I'm waaaay behind in r387 and we are upto r393.  What improvements have occured in 388 389 390 391 392 and 393 - I've only a limited monthly data allowance 😉
 @mariogrip, I don't think any major vendor would omit that
 Maybe some chinese/indian/youNameIt minor ones
 @UniversalSuperBox, https://cardanoroadmap.com  Maybe this? Parallel blogs about the vision for each element
 In which file do I need to put … ```qputenv("QT_SCALE_FACTOR", "2"); ``` … for QQC" projects?
 It is not a project plan. We don't need eleven spindles in chrome vanadium to a tolerance of 0.013% by 27 September
 honestly, a roadmap right now doesn't make a whole lot of sense for ubports
 Don't get hung up on format or content.  It is about clearing minds and binding the organisation, not setting out precise intentions
 or maybe even just to order the massive amount of work that's ahead
 Kirigami succeeding or failing could set us on quite different tracks. We are discovering, as much as we are planning
 there is way more work than people to do it
 So collaboration, inventiveness, borrowing, compromise
[12:57] <bshah> Kirigami? context?
[12:57] <bshah> :)
 Kirigami comes very close to working now
 The extreme practical limitations are also a source of strength
 maybe in a guerilla war
[12:58] <bshah> @UniversalSuperBox, working on? I mean well sure it works :P
 Seven Samurai - Kurosawa
 16.04. JBB has built the gallery and we're just fighting with apparmor to get it running.
 but i don't think we need to start quoting Sun Tzu just yet
 on ubuntu touch
[12:58] <bshah> @UniversalSuperBox ah
[12:59] <bshah> if you need any help let me know
[12:59] <bshah> :)
 @UniversalSuperBox, it sounded more like an issue with the click, and the profile not getting created for some reason
 @DanChapman, there is a `org.kde.kirigamigallery_kirigamigallery_5.45.2.json` file in `/var/lib/apparmor/clicks`. Looks like the same thing in the desktop file.
 or if created, not loaded into the kernel
 Okee... So how would I check that
 is there a kirigami gallery file in `/var/lib/apparmor/profiles/` ?
 the json isn't the profile itself
 There is not
 does that directory exist, i'm going off memory and don't recall if it's correct
 Yep, that directory exists
 and it's populated with profiles from other clicks?
 Yep!
 ok, so the profile indeed didn't get created
 what's the contents of the json file?
 ```{ …     "policy_groups": [], …     "policy_version": 16.04, … }```
 hmmm does it require to have at least one policy?
 I don't think it does. but...
 it shouldn't
 did you install it via CLI?
 Yes
 and no errors/warnings from that?
 No
 weird
 How would I get apparmor to reload those profiles?
 hmm, you could maybe try to run the click hook manually for that app, but i don't recall exactly how to do that
 iirc there's another thing which rebuilds all profiles, which we had to run sometimes for OTAs, which resulted in longer initial boot time after the ota
 but i don't recall what it was exactly either
 Aha!
 `aa-clickhook --force` will regenerate all profiles iirc
 `sudo aa-clickhook org.kde.kirigamigallery_kirigamigallery_5.45.1`
 Now there's a profile, but it still doesn't run
 Progress
 Aha, apparmor denied access to `/usr/bin/env`
 At least I think that's what that message means
 ah is it python?
 https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/pBmDn8Cpk2/
 No, it's QML
[13:13] <bshah> /usr/bin/env o.O
 that is indeed what that means
 I'm a smart!
 :P
 is the Exec= a shell script?
 or trying to call /usr/bin/env directly?
 `Exec=env QT_QUICK_CONTROLS_STYLE=Material qmlscene contents/ui/ExampleApp.qml`
 yerp
[13:16] <bshah> uh
[13:16] <bshah> call kirigami2gallery ?
[13:16] <bshah> instead of qmlscene?
 That binary isn't in the click
[13:17] <bshah> ah.. click
[13:17] <bshah> okay
 I'm sure a build change would bring it around?
 Going off of this stuff: https://github.com/JBBgameich/kirigami/tree/ut
[13:18] <bshah> are click supposed to contain binary files?
 or could make a small shell script which runs qmlscene with that env var
 They can
 i guess it's already an armhf-only click though, as i guess it contains some c++ libs
 Any idea, how to scale Kaidan?
 `QT_SCALE_FACTOR=2`
 In its envrionment
 Which file? Already tried main.cpp and desktop file. No effect 😐
[13:21] <bshah> @UniversalSuperBox, if kirigami is built with -DBUILD_EXAMPLES=ON it should install kirigami2gallery example
 I think we're building the examples directly
 Hey, bshah and @JBBgameich, I got the app working! :D
 Cool!
 Scaling is still interesting, but we knew that
 Also the keyboard avoidance is just a bit too high
 @UniversalSuperBox, 👍
 @UniversalSuperBox I replied to your message on Matrix. The diaspora* account is UBports@diasp.ca or, and I prefer this as it's a clickable URL, https://dia.so/UBports
 Yep, saw that
 @UniversalSuperBox, Just wanted to make sure
 Set it on the latest Q&A description
 @UniversalSuperBox, Awesome
 Lowercase also works
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/4Nsgupd2.null
 I contacted @mzanetti regarding Bluetoot File Transfer app.  He is busy elsewhere so I took the chance and migrated the vivid build to xenial.  Works a treat. I can transfer files back and forth using bluetooth on 16.04. Install and give it a try.
 */Bluetoot/Bluetooth/
 🙌
 @fourloop2002, Can you talk with him about being the maiontainer for that? Then you can put it in the openstore
 Sure I'll ask him
 Does it work on Nexus 5? That seems to be the most challenging for Bluetooth
 Yes I'm on Nexus 5 hammerhead devel r393
 From the openstore is not it possible to unload nada.hay algun problem?
 @Geminis65, What OpenStore? web or app? vivid or xenial?
 (We can follow the conversation in the Spanish group)
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc.ubports.com/3IFMGH01.png
 Building natively on your Ubuntu Touch device, step 1
 heh
 maybe that's why my nexus 5 doesn't work as well any more
 (not really, i mostly did such things on the nexus 4)
 (Photo, 735x501) https://irc.ubports.com/1KkL6pC9.png mmmm toasty nexus 5
 i was trying to find some place where i could actually buy one of the linaro d02 server boards (theoretically supports 2 CPUs with up to 64 total cores).
 Tried building with -j4 on my OPO once and it rebooted
 I always use -j3/2 now 😂
 I'm building with -j8 and the N5 is pretty okay with it
 But you are dissipating the heat ;)
 i don't think that block fo aluminum is really doing much :)
 It's getting warm to the touch for sure
 @UniversalSuperBox, with xperia m4 in twrp i literally boiled water on it
 😆
 That's safe
 well, phone *was* waterproof
 thankfully sold it :p
 @VeryOriginalUsername, lol, the ol' switcheroo
 galaxy note 7, for when you need to start an emergency camp fire in the rain
 I'm still waiting for someone to ask when we're gonna put Ubuntu Touch on the Galaxy Note 7
 @dohbee, More like when you're a terrorist
[15:36] <gehidore> when are you going to put ubuntu touch on the galaxy note 7?
 @UniversalSuperBox, When are we gonna put UT on galaxy note 7?
 damn it
[15:36] <gehidore> there someone asked it...
 Damn you were faster
[15:36] <gehidore> although... what can I do to help with bullhead?
 You've got one handy?
[15:36] <gehidore> yar
 One moment
[15:37] <gehidore> I only have  half a moment to spare
 waits for note to load
 Well, here's a loose collection of notes on it: https://nc.daltondur.st/s/P4qcHRt4YDSm9QN
[15:38] <gehidore> spiffy, i'll look at them at lunch... for now... building some more shis
[15:38] <gehidore> shits too
[15:39] <gehidore> really... javascript to download a text file -_-
 I don't know why it doesn't just show the whole preview. grr.
 can someone link me ubports kernel checker?
[15:39] <gehidore> anywho back to work with me, I'll look at the file I downloaded
[15:39] <gehidore> in about 2-4 hours
 Sounds good
 I'm a little confused about how "location" works in UT. I just tried it with the uNav App and openstreetmap in the browser and the results were somewhat different. uNav took some time and then found my location pretty well. But openstreetmap in the browser first showed a really large blue circle around the location of my DSL p
[15:52] <ubptgbot> rovider but then after a longer period of time that uNav found my real location.
 So basically: how can I be sure that GPS works or not? I'm on FP2 (xenial).
 did osm in browser pop up a dialog asking for access to location data?
 It begins with a rough estimate from IP mapping then homes in
 @dohbee I figured out why we can't manually put in pt
 pt <> pt_PT
 ` QLocale("pt").name();` yields `"pt_BR"`
 So I think that the workaround is the only way forward... I don't know what's going to happen with regular gettext translations though
[17:29] <ubptgbot> reverie99 was added by: reverie99
 what in the actual f
 @reverie99, Hello Jean. There is more about UBports here … https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome
 @dohbee, I was hoping you knew
 well, i suppose i shouldn't expect any better, given we're mixing gettext stuff with Qt, and it's not a 1:1 match with how things work
 I guess that pt_PT will fall back to pt when need be
 ?
 For gettext, that is
 i think so, yeah
 So the day name workaround, while not great, might just be what we have to do
 Or else @ixavier might come and beat me up and that's just no good. :P
 this is awful
 Are you describing this situation or all software?
 TFW even the standards org can't get things right
 yes
 I'm actually not seeing the "Likely language" information in the CLDR
 Or the default thing
 the likely language thing makes no sense
 if i select pt_BR then it's pretty bloody likely that i want pt_BR, and if i select pt instead of pt_BR then it's pretty well likely i don't want bloody pt_BR
 Well, not really
 Because if you select `en` you probably want `en_US`
 We trust you :D
 "C" is the only locale. problem solved.
 It's just that we're expecting pt_PT to be the likely language and Qt says no
 @dohbee, ++
 no, it's that "likely" makes no damned sense, and qt is trying to be clever, and it's not
 this is how you end up with stupid bugs like that one in firefox where it keeps setting my spell check language to en_AU, even though my system language is set to en_US
 I think that we're the ones who are misguided here, though.
 Sure it sucks that Unicode decided to use kinda short names instead of actually short name
 [Edit] Sure it sucks that Unicode decided to use kinda short names instead of actually short names
 i mean, sure, they're short compared to words like deoxyribonucleic maybe
 Because Monday is "Segunda-feira"
 But shortened it's just "segunda"
 I guess "feira" stands for day
 Fair, actually
 Yes
 But also day. :P
 Except that Sabado and Domingo don't play ball
 No, because they're special
 Why? Iunno
 Shomer Shabbaos!
 I think this would be the point where you'd ask the Canonical Design team what to do
 To deal with day names being longer than three characters
[18:05] <ubptgbot> Arulraj Chandrasekaran was added by: Arulraj Chandrasekaran
 ironically, one of the former designers is portuguese
 He could have fixed it all up right quick!
 she, but probably not
 @Arulraj Chandrasekaran, Hi Arulraj. Have a look at the link for UBports info … https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome
[18:06] <ubptgbot> <Arulraj Chandrasekaran> Redmi
 @Arulraj Chandrasekaran, Redmi likewise
 @dohbee, Hmm. Well, I notice that there's a lot of space in between days in the indicator. Maybe we can solve this in a way that doesn't involve hacking stuff.
 Like calculated padding. That's a thing, right?
 I'm about to find out.
 remove the calendar widget
 problem solved!
 While effective, I quite like the calendar widget
 And calendar-app is broken too
 well, reduced problem set is still moving forward ;)
 Shall I close this now? https://github.com/ubports/system-settings/pull/56
 tbh the indicator widget could probably always use narrow format
 sure, since qt is broken
 @Arulraj Chandrasekaran, Have you a question?
 I have a OnePlus3, is it possible to run a custom Linux distrib on it ?
 @reverie99, Not yet but it is likely to be added to the UBports list this year
 @reverie99, If you mean a. iso then no, since Ubuntu Touch is not a desktop flavour
 it depends on what you mean by "linux distro" and "install" too
 but that's a bit off topic for this group
 @UniversalSuperBox, In GNOME shell it is shortened to 3 letters always. Like sexta-feira becomes simply sex.
 This may be one of those places where GTK does things better / correctly
 Thanks for your answers, sorry, I'm a system developer, trying to figure out, linux compatibility with differents handsets. Ubuntu Touch is a great project
 @reverie99, We have a French group also, which may interest you?
 @UniversalSuperBox, gtk+ just uses gettext, so depending on who you ask, probably not better/correct either
 https://t.me/UBports_French
 @Stereofont sure! how do you know?
 your name is pretty french sounding :)
 obviously 🙈
 @dohbee, ROFL
 btw thanks guys
 Welcome
 If you have skills relevant to porting, maybe you can speed the work on OnePlusThree
 Look at the Halium project for background on that
 @Stereofont, 3 people work on it
 please no
 [Edit] please no more
 Hows the op3 port going?
 @vanyasem, Too complicated with more?
 @PhoenixLandPirate, watch the last QA
 @Stereofont, it will make a mess full of merge conflicts
 I don't think that more eyes is a bad thing
 I listened to it but I guess I must have been zoned out at that point?
 @PhoenixLandPirate, it was supposed to be a surprise
 but i asked about it and ruined it
 so marius explained that in detail
 Heck, me must go back
 any ideas on can i use omnirom trees instead of lineage?
 Anything is worth a try at least once
 I think they are quite similar
[18:57] <matlock> gnome will likely port gnome-software-center to gnome mobile, ditto kde discover, if ubuntu touch copied gnome-software-center you could include snap plugin in g-s-c, insert your own snap repo, offer curated ub-touch ready linux and android apps (via anbox) on ubuntu touch
 lineage tree isn't a hard requirement. it's just a known working place to start from
 there is no "your own snap repo"
[18:58] <matlock> a curated mobile app store, with both Linux apps and Android apps, made easy because Anbox has already been ported to Ubuntu touch
 there's no need for gnome-software either. we had working snap install over a year ago, back when snaps were going to be a thing
 wait
 is sailfish made like UT with halium
 so it has a rootfs
 What?
 hm
 snaps are no longer a thing supported by canonical on the phone, so doesn't make any sense to support snaps on the phone
 consider u have a xyz device
 you have halium on it
 i mean, sailfish obviously has a rootfs and android kernel and whatnot
 would starting sailfish os be matter of putting a rootfs like you'd do with ut
 but no, it's not built in the same way as UT
 or something more
 No, because Sailfish images have both Android and Sailfish in the same tree
 And they run Android's init alongside their own
 sailfish is closer to being an android ROM than UT is
 i cracked open an xperia x sailfish image
 and system part looks like android
 and then it has this in a separate image
 (Photo, 162x139) https://irc.ubports.com/0s0LoDyW.png
 would replacing that with ubuntu work or am i too excited
 I don't think that would work
 yeah i think not
 although now i'm feeling nostalgia for LILO
 noooo....
 boot root
 ah, installing slackware from a stack of floppies.
 (Photo, 1078x1018) https://irc.ubports.com/awBjF6hV.png
 I fixed it!
 :P
 why does it have half of next month in it?!
 Because it's wrong
 obviously
 he's living forward
 wait does everything have to be built with arm32
 or only the rootfs it 32bit
 hmm?
 like should i change my device's architecture in trees to arm from aarch64
 @VeryOriginalUsername, you can use 32 bit trees with 64 bit rootfs
 if you apply the libcompat patch
 same as you can install a 32 bit system on your 64 bit pc
 kek i didn't know a 64bit rootfs exists
 eh
 the rootfs is 32-bit
 i made a typo
 some devices have aarch64 kernels
 @VeryOriginalUsername, [Edit] you can use 64 bit trees with 32 bit rootfs
 @vanyasem, corrected now
 @VeryOriginalUsername, experimental build existed at some point, but i still made a typo there
 yeah, the aarch64 rootfs work was never finished
 should be possible to create one, but i expect there will be some problems still
 i just started saving for a n5
 have around 1% already 😆
 sony devices are such a pain in the ass to work with afaics
 :(
 @VeryOriginalUsername, the elephone trunk guy used omnirom tree as a base
[19:38] <ubptgbot> Tudorel Stirbu was added by: Tudorel Stirbu
 afaics
 @Tudorel Stirbu, HI Tudorel, welcome! Take a look to https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome to get you up to speed
 @Tudorel Stirbu, We have many language groups btw
 Hello Lionel
 Messi 😁