[06:37] <Scary_Guy> https://github.com/dimitri/el-get/issues/474 comedic gold
=== havenstance1 is now known as havenstance
[16:50] <doubledev> Afternoon everyone
[16:50] <doubledev> anyone know a place that is hiring?
[16:53] <jrwren> Pillar in Ann Arbor.
[16:53] <jrwren> Ithaka in Ann Arbor.
[16:53] <doubledev> jrwren: that is too far of a drive for me. I am in Macomb Township.
[16:53] <jrwren> move?
[16:53] <doubledev> thanks for that suggestion though
[16:54] <doubledev> HAHA!  just bought this house and my wife's job is up this way too. That would be too far of a drive for what she is getting paid.
[16:54] <doubledev> Can I work remotely at Pillar?
[16:55] <jrwren> I have no idea.
[16:55] <jrwren> I don't follow Macomb Co. jobs because I'm not a fan of the suburban wasteland that it is. :p
[16:55] <doubledev> haha
[16:56] <jrwren> autobooks is hiring.
[16:57] <jrwren> but they are looking for Senior level folks with some .net/sql experience.
[16:58] <jrwren> if you are willing to comute to detroit, there is tons of cool jobs.
[16:58] <jrwren> Optomi is hiring.
[17:07] <doubledev> jrwren: thank you.  I will look into them
[17:11] <cmaloney> Ford is always hiring
[17:12] <jrwren> helluva commute though.
[17:12] <cmaloney> yeah
[17:13] <cmaloney> And I have opinions on Ford's hiring process
[17:13] <cmaloney> not complementary ones
[17:14] <doubledev> cmaloney: what was your experience?
[17:15] <cmaloney> Well, for one position I applied for they put me through a timed reading comprehension test
[17:15] <cmaloney> and a timed percentages test
[17:15] <cmaloney> and a timed culture fit test
[17:16] <cmaloney> the best I could come up with is they wanted someone who was a complete toady who did fractions like a machine and had a photographic memory
[17:16] <doubledev> are they looking for speedy gonzales for everything
[17:16] <doubledev> haha
[17:17] <doubledev> nice
[17:17] <cmaloney> I hope they can build their little friend someday
[17:17] <cmaloney> The second was with a contracting house that demanded I send thiem my drivers license (I refused) and then reformatted / rewrote my resume for the job even though it's CC-BY-NC_ND licensed
[17:18] <cmaloney> so they literally stripped out my license and copyrighted my resume
[17:18] <cmaloney> we had ... words.
[17:18] <cmaloney> But the girst was I felt I couldn't trust them to have my best interests at heart
[17:19] <cmaloney> because they ignored my desires
[17:19] <jrwren> the drivers license bit is illegal as an EOE, you could report them.
[17:19] <cmaloney> They claimed it was a Ford requirement, but in the end they didn't need it
[17:19] <cmaloney> that was before the resume re-write
[17:20] <cmaloney> What's awesome is my formative years as a computer professional were with Ford
[17:20] <cmaloney> as a contractor
[17:21] <cmaloney> So being told (in the first case) that I wasn't even worthy of an interview really stung
[17:22] <cmaloney> Nevermind that they got 8+ years out of me in one way or another
[17:22] <cmaloney> 13+ years in the auto industry. Just say no, kids.
[17:23] <jrwren> I did.
[17:27] <cmaloney> heh
[17:28] <cmaloney> I mean, I learned Perl and did some interesting web-based project
[17:28] <cmaloney> but when they didn't know what to do with you they didn't promote an environment of growth
[17:28] <cmaloney> and it was easy to get lost in there
[17:33] <doubledev> So don't go into automotive industry, got it!  ;)
[17:34] <cmaloney> If you value your soul you'll find something else
[17:35] <rick_h_> doubledev: what kind of work are you looking for?
[17:35] <doubledev> haha, i think i sold that a while back ago, but will steer clear of it.  :)
[17:36] <doubledev> rick_h_: Well, I would like to stick with developing, but I wouldn't be opposed to moving into a support management role or quality team type of work.
[17:37] <doubledev> or even a deployment team role
[17:37] <jrwren> devops is all of those.
[17:42] <doubledev> I don't think devops would be good, just briefly looking at job descriptions and requirements.
[17:43] <jrwren> i must be only person outside of google who actually likes devops
[17:43] <doubledev> i am not saying I wouldn't like it, but don't think i am qualified for it
[17:47] <brousch> I like devops. I get to do all the things
[17:49] <jrwren> zactly!
[17:50] <jrwren> none of that - throw-it-over-the-wall-and-point-blame crap.
[17:50] <jrwren> and none of that - IT won't let us crap either.
[17:50] <jrwren> OWN IT ALL
[17:50] <cmaloney> Yep
[17:52] <greg-g> all of the: 24/7 pager duty :)
[17:52] <greg-g> (yes, because it makes you make better software!)
[17:55] <cmaloney> hell yeah
[17:55] <cmaloney> I don't want to be up at 3am trying to fix shit
[17:55] <cmaloney> Been there, done that, got the T-shirt
[18:02] <jrwren> actually it does!
[18:02] <jrwren> because you stop writing and designing things that can go down.
[18:02] <jrwren> 24/7 pager duty THAT NEVER GETS USED
[18:02] <jrwren> because you are finally forced to understand the platform on which you run and write to it... or... you don't, and you get called all the time. your fault.
[18:03] <jrwren> bonus if you define your own SLA such that it can always wait until morning. :)
[18:06] <greg-g> yeah... that SLA wouldn't fly here :P
[18:07] <jrwren> then you can afford to hire 24/7 support people.
[18:08] <jrwren> hired on 3-4 continents such that all hours of the day are covered by peoples regular working hours.
[18:08] <jrwren> if you can't do one or the other then something isn't being valued correctly.
[18:13] <greg-g> indeed :)
[19:23] <cmaloney> I like the SLA where it gets fixed when I get around to it