[06:33] <didrocks> good morning
[06:55] <duflu> Hi didrocks
[07:02] <Laney> meow
[07:02] <Laney> forgot about the security reboot that was scheduled :<
[07:20] <Laney> weird being the first one on!
[07:21] <duflu> Laney, morning. Actually didrocks has been in for about 50 min.
[07:21] <duflu> And not counting asia
[07:33] <Laney> hey duflu
[07:33] <didrocks> hey Laney, duflu!
[07:33] <Laney> You get a ... 1 minute timeout before you count as "not here" to me :P
[07:33] <Laney> hey didrocks!
[07:33] <Laney> what's the news?
[07:34] <didrocks> hot weather, fighting ears noise, discovering more and more ghost issues in whoopsie/apport
[07:34] <didrocks> the usual :)
[07:34] <didrocks> yourself?
[07:35] <Laney> ghosts in the code?????????????????
[07:35] <duflu> Laney, no news. Also inner ear problems but that's not
[07:35] <duflu> news
[07:35] <Laney> :(
[07:35] <Laney> you can mention olds too
[07:35] <didrocks> Laney: yeah, things are broken for a long time that nobody noticed
[07:36] <Laney> heh
[07:36] <Laney> sounds familiar
[07:36] <duflu> Seems we haven't had workable images for a while: http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/daily-live/
[07:37] <duflu> In fact, longer. 20180530 is the last usable one I know of, but not downloadable
[07:38] <duflu> In theory anything from 20180626 onward should be OK, when it's ready
[07:38] <Laney> Builds have been failing for a while and should be fixed by https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/live-build/3.0~a57-1ubuntu36
[07:38] <Laney> was in j_ibel's report yesterday
[07:39] <Laney> actually https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/live-build/3.0~a57-1ubuntu35 mainly
[07:41] <duflu> No worries. As with everything I just move to an unrelated task that's not blocked
[07:42] <duflu> Laney, how is Tuscany(?) treating you?
[07:50] <Laney> duflu: Good - these guys know how to cook/eat :-)
[07:50] <Laney> probably bad for my waistline
[07:50] <Laney> and it's a great environment to work in
[07:50] <Laney> surprisingly good 4G too
[07:51] <duflu> It looks terrible. https://www.google.com.au/search?q=tuscany&tbm=isch
[07:52] <Laney> although UK is actually hotter than here this week /o\
[07:52] <duflu> Probably good. You don't want the Italy version of hot
[07:52] <Laney> https://photos.app.goo.gl/i3dDPQ4hRpNAhWA68
[07:56] <duflu> jibel, koza has canceled his attendance again. And the others are not online yet. Any BT questions?
[08:00] <willcooke> morning
[08:00] <willcooke> duflu, looks like koza isnt around for the BT meeting
[08:00] <duflu> willcooke, yeah I was just saying. And nobody else is online/answering
[08:00] <duflu> Morning willcooke!
[08:01] <willcooke> duflu, in which case, can I ask you about palm detection on Bionic
[08:01] <willcooke> on my Thinkpad X270 is pretty much non existent
[08:01] <duflu> willcooke, let me dig up the test command(s). I forget..
[08:01] <willcooke> in that it frequently moves the mouse, selects text, etc etc
[08:02] <didrocks> hey willcooke
[08:02] <willcooke> morning didrocks
[08:03] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[08:05] <willcooke> hi seb128
[08:05] <seb128> hey willcooke, how are you today?
[08:05] <didrocks> hey seb128
[08:05] <duflu> Hi seb128
[08:05] <seb128> hey didrocks duflu
[08:05] <duflu> willcooke,
[08:05] <duflu> sudo apt install libinput-tools
[08:05] <duflu> sudo libinput measure {touch-size | touchpad-pressure}
[08:05] <duflu> will show you if/when libinput ever detects palm. Usually only one of those commands is supported. Maybe none.
[08:06] <willcooke> thanks duflu I will play with that
[08:06] <duflu> Surprisingly many touchpads don't detect size so palm detection is impossible
[08:07] <duflu> Although some approximate it by reporting pressure, which physically is sometimes measured from size :)
[08:08] <duflu> willcooke, if you just find the default thresholds are wrong then that's a config file change we can get in upstream
[08:08] <willcooke> $ sudo libinput measure touch-size
[08:08] <willcooke> Using SynPS/2 Synaptics TouchPad: /dev/input/event5
[08:08] <willcooke> Error: device does not have ABS_MT_TOUCH_MAJOR
[08:08] <willcooke> so doesnt support that one
[08:08] <duflu> Yeah, that's common
[08:08] <willcooke> woah
[08:08] <willcooke> but
[08:09] <willcooke> the second one... worked just fine a few minutes ago
[08:09] <willcooke> and it looks like I should tweak the settings just a little bit
[08:09] <willcooke> but now....
[08:09] <willcooke> IndexError: list index out of range
[08:09] <duflu> willcooke, sounds like it's trying to remember number of fixes touching and lost count
[08:10] <duflu> -fixes -fingers
[08:11] <duflu> Actually that might explain a bug I was going to log today
[08:11] <duflu> Before the LCD failed so I lost interest in reporting the touchpad issue
[08:11] <willcooke> duflu, broken screen?
[08:12] <duflu> willcooke, yeah it was a custom build of my own. Will fix it later
[08:12] <willcooke> bad luck
[08:13] <willcooke> duflu, so how do I make touchpad-pressure work again?  I'm confused
[08:13] <duflu> willcooke, sounds like the state is stuck independently of the tool. So I don't know other than rebooting. Maybe 'sudo rmmod psmouse ; sudo modprobe psmouse'
[08:14] <willcooke> Looks like I need to reboot, will try that later on and play with the settings
[08:14] <willcooke> thanks duflu
[08:15] <willcooke> FWIW, I think it's a very specific issue with a combination of where the touchpad is located on the laptop and where I put my hands
[08:15] <duflu> willcooke, no worries, but maybe try touching a few fingers and releasing to reset?
[08:15] <willcooke> I very slightly cover the bottom right corner
[08:16] <willcooke> duflu, aha!  Yes, placing my palm in the "right" place has made it work again :)
[08:16] <willcooke> yikes, that tool is fragile :)
[08:16] <duflu> willcooke, sounds like the kernel state got stuck counting the wrong number of fingers. Because it will see a large palm as potentially multiple touches :(
[08:17] <duflu> Not being able to sense the size
[08:19] <willcooke> so looks like the default is 130
[08:19] <willcooke> and for me, something around 120 is better, and maybe even a little lower
[08:19] <willcooke> can I over ride that locally easy enough?
[08:19] <duflu> willcooke, it's surprisingly difficult. Let me find the docs
[08:19] <willcooke> and then I can post on the hub and ask people to test it
[08:19] <willcooke> duflu, thanks
[08:20] <willcooke> yesterday when I was working outside on a google doc is was annoying the crap out of me
[08:20] <willcooke> it kept selecting text, and then as I typed it would overwrite the selected text
[08:23] <duflu> willcooke, https://wayland.freedesktop.org/libinput/doc/latest/udev_config.html#hwdb  and  https://wayland.freedesktop.org/libinput/doc/latest/palm_detection.html
[08:26] <willcooke> thanks duflu
[08:26] <willcooke> I running xorg, does that matter?
[08:26] <willcooke> I would have thought that "Disable-while-typing" would have solved the problems Im seeing, so I wonder if that's a bit broken too
[08:26] <duflu> willcooke, so long as you're using libinput and don't have the synaptics driver installed then the docs apply
[08:27] <duflu> to all libinput users, including Xorg
[08:27] <willcooke> ack
[08:32] <pitti> bonjour tout le monde !
[08:32] <didrocks> bonjour pitti, comment ça va ?
[08:32] <pitti> didrocks: sorry that you didn't make it to the foundation board
[08:33] <willcooke> duflu, the docs talk about using list-quirks, but that only exists > 1.11 I think.  I'll go hunting for the old docs
[08:33] <didrocks> pitti: well, I was mostly expecting it, I at least tried to be helpful for the past 6 months, which is already something :)
[08:33] <pitti> didrocks: ça va bien, merci ! j'attends avec impatience le match de football cet àpres-midi :)
[08:33] <pitti> didrocks: et toi ? comment vas-tu et le petit Martin ?
[08:33] <didrocks> le football, c'est ce jeu qui se joue avec un ballon, c'est ça ? :p
[08:33] <Laney> hey pitti!
[08:34] <duflu> willcooke, the first link is all the docs. It only fails to mention the file to edit: /lib/udev/hwdb.d/90-libinput-model-quirks.hwdb
[08:34] <didrocks> pitti: Martin va très bien, merci! Il commence à essayer de marcher. Moi, j'ai toujours mes problèmes d'oreilles qui me pèsent, mais bon…
[08:34] <didrocks> pitti: et toi, quoi de neuf ?
[08:34] <duflu> then do the udevadm commands
[08:34] <pitti> didrocks: yes, where the players try to checkmate each other with as few puts into the hole as possible
[08:34] <pitti> hey hey Laney!
[08:35] <seb128> salut pitti, comment ça va ?
[08:35] <didrocks> heh :p
[08:36]  * pitti donne l'équipe du bureau une accolade
[08:36]  * seb128 hugs pitti back
[08:36] <pitti> OOI, did you hear much feedback about the g-shell switch in bionic?
[08:36]  * pitti is rather far away from the desktop pixel world these days
[08:37]  * didrocks hugs pitti back
[08:37] <pitti> my GTK is called CSS these day
[08:37] <pitti> s
[08:37] <didrocks> heh & angular I guess :p
[08:37] <pitti> OMG no - react (but neither are pixels)
[08:37] <didrocks> transition was smooth, got good feedbacks in general
[08:38] <didrocks> ah nice! ;)
[08:38] <pitti> R.I.P. Unity, but nice to hear
[08:38] <didrocks> Unity is still in the repo, with some community members helping on it, it's great to see that :)
[08:38] <seb128> pitti, seems a mix of "good job" and of "Give me back Unity/k, I'm done, I'm switching to other OS/linux desktop/distro..."
[08:39] <pitti> seb128: right, *all* these other OSes that offer unity!!11!
[08:39] <seb128> haha
[08:40] <seb128> well, most of them are rather on the line of "Unity was the only desktop around I found usable, your new thing isn't nearly as nice so I'm not going to use that" which is fair enough
[08:40] <seb128> tbh I share a bit that view :/
[08:40] <seb128> give me back the space of the decoration and menus for maximized windows!
[08:41] <pitti> yeah, that's the bit I really liked
[08:41] <seb128> (which is also the point most my friends who upgraded is telling me about)
[08:41] <seb128> are*
[08:41] <pitti> minimizing the chrome to just the top bar
[08:42] <seb128> oh, well, at least there is work to do and we manage to improve things and users seem to be glad for that :)
[08:42] <pitti> right, and on top of that much better relations to gnome
[10:16] <willcooke> woot.  pulseaudio-dlna works nicely
[10:16] <willcooke> the deps don't look very pretty though
[10:16] <willcooke> but might be fun
[10:27]  * ogra_ wishes one could say the same about vlc :P
[10:28] <willcooke> ogra_, wassat?  vlc not sending over dlna?
[10:28] <ogra_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libupnp/+bug/1571199
[10:28] <willcooke> oh :(
[10:28] <willcooke> does the snap have the same issue?:
[10:29] <ogra_> yep
[10:29] <ogra_> uses the same libpnp from the archive i guess
[10:29] <ogra_> *libupnp
[10:30] <willcooke> bah
[10:33] <willcooke> hm.  Looks like the usual vlc blaming libpnp and libpnp saying that vlc needs to be updated
[10:33] <ogra_> well, the deb with the removed distro patch works fine ...
[10:33] <ogra_> (the libupnp deb that is) ...
[10:33] <ogra_> i doubt it is vlc's fault
[10:35] <ogra_> (but i dont think the debian patch that closed the debian bug actually fixes the issue)
[11:02] <alexarnaud> Trevinho: andyrock: What's the roadmap for patch review on Compiz? Do you plan to do that this week or later?
[11:03] <andyrock> alexarnaud: before 4th July :)
[11:03] <alexarnaud> OK :)
[13:05] <didrocks> Laney: does the snap seeds for iso building enable selecting a particular channel?
[15:51] <Laney> didrocks: no, you have to use the ubuntu series thing, that is required by the specification
[15:52] <didrocks> Laney: ah, so basically foo snap will be pulled in cosmic/stable channel by default?
[15:52] <didrocks> (on the cosmic image)
[15:53] <Laney> I don't remember the exact name
[15:53] <Laney> and there's some fallback thing or something
[15:53] <Laney> like I don't think you actually have to publish there but the channel needs to exist
[15:53] <didrocks> is there a place where I can see this to check the name?
[15:53] <Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuSeededSnaps
[15:53] <didrocks> I guess it should be the case for our default GNOME snaps, no?
[15:54] <Laney> it has to be the case or the iso fails to build
[15:54] <Laney> but if nothing published there, you get the version from stable
[15:54] <didrocks> per-Ubuntu-series branch?
[15:54] <didrocks> hum, the branch is the last of the tripplet
[15:54] <didrocks> I thought that track was supposed to be that one
[15:55] <didrocks> kenvandine: mind shedding some lights? Where do you publish our snaps? ^
[15:55] <didrocks> Laney: I want communitheme to be per release, that's why I want to know where to publish it ;)
[15:56] <kenvandine> didrocks, i create a track for it
[15:56] <kenvandine> and we have to close it as well
[15:57] <didrocks> kenvandine: what's the naming convention ubuntu-<version>?
[15:57] <didrocks> kenvandine: basically, we are pulling from ubuntu-18.04/stable?
[15:57] <kenvandine> i think ubuntu-18.10/stable
[15:57]  * kenvandine checks
[15:57] <didrocks> kenvandine: do you always go to the forum to have the track opened?
[15:58] <kenvandine> no
[15:58] <kenvandine> snapcraft release gnome-3-26-1604 62 stable/ubuntu-18.10
[15:58] <kenvandine> snapcraft close gnome-3-26-1604 stable/ubuntu-18.10
[15:58] <kenvandine> for example
[15:58] <didrocks> so, ti's a branch name…
[15:58] <kenvandine> yeah
[15:58] <kenvandine> i had it backwards :)
[15:58] <didrocks> who decided to use branch name rather than track name?
[15:58] <didrocks> because normally, tracks are for this, no?
[15:58] <kenvandine> slangasek i guess
[15:58] <kenvandine> he's the one that designed it
[15:59] <didrocks> hum, I need to speak to him ;)
[15:59] <didrocks> to understand why
[15:59] <kenvandine> don't think we want to change it now
[15:59] <didrocks> I'm unsure how I can share creds easily with people also in that order :/
[15:59] <didrocks> yeah, it's just making things… harder
[15:59] <didrocks> well, it's 6PM, going to EOD, I'll ask tomorrow
[15:59] <kenvandine> good night!
[15:59] <didrocks> thanks for hints!
[16:07] <didrocks> I guess the only reason for this is to avoid requesting tracks opening for all snaps when a new release is out
[16:11] <Laney> it's for issuing updates if you need to per release
[16:12] <didrocks> interestingly, as we can't switch channels, I wonder how the 18.04 -> 18.10 update is working
[16:12] <didrocks> kenvandine: any idea?
[17:12] <willcooke> night all
[17:14] <Laney> why does the theme need to be per release though?
[17:14] <Laney> you can version per gtk version within the theme itself if you need to
[20:35] <sergiusens> kenvandine: Laney (and didrocks whose not here), the use of a branch is beacuse if the branch is closed it defaults to the risk it was opened against. If a preinstalled snap is set to track <risk>/ubuntu and <risk>/ubuntu is closed, it will track <risk> and if ever the release team or whomever need to do something to update a critical snap, they can release to <risk>/ubuntu and users would pick it up.
[20:53] <Laney> sergiusens: Yeah I know that. It does feel slightly weird that we used ubuntu-$version, since it's not like we can upgrade the branch when people upgrade their distro release (right?)
[20:53] <Laney> so I'm not really sure what an update like that would look like
[21:35] <sergiusens> right, the suggestion there was indeed to create tracks, for LTS; but it was a suggestion, not a requirement iirc