/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2018/07/09/#ubuntu-discuss.txt

jgkhas anyone got an update on ubuntu 18.1000:33
oerheksjgk, join #ubuntu+1 for next release00:34
daftykinslike what? it's releasing in october00:34
jgkany information on what they are planing new designs or just security updates00:35
daftykinsnon-LTS do not just have security updates no00:37
jgkany new features00:37
oerheksthey have up2date info, https://blog.ubuntu.com/2018/05/18/desktop-plans-for-18-1000:37
oerheks!cosmic00:37
ubot5Ubuntu 18.10 (Cosmic Cuttlefish) will be the 29th release of Ubuntu.  Release annoucement at https://markshuttleworth.com/archives/152100:37
jgkthanks00:38
daftykinsguess that's someones homework done? ;)00:39
oerheksyeah .. got paid in donut-holes00:41
daftykinsxD00:42
guivercsorry [[again]] tomreyn - overtyping you again02:02
tomreynguiverc: nah thats fine02:02
tomreyni'm only slightly motivated to help him ;)02:03
tomreynand your questions are fine02:03
guiverc:)  not got yer crystal ball ??02:03
guiverc(or ability to read his/her mind)02:04
daftykins:>02:05
tomreynits in the laundry02:06
guivercwell done tomreyn - you fixed something :)02:23
tomreynsomething or soemthing else.02:24
tomreynpoor lefty02:33
tomreyni'd help you, but i just cant type right now since i keep laughing so much.02:34
daftykinso002:35
daftykinssounds like i'm missing an amusing one :>02:35
tomreyntwo02:36
tomreynmtdms was asking how to install php5 yesterday. i pointed him to sury's PPA. maybe it was too complicated, though. he's now back with effectively the same question.02:39
leftyfbtomreyn: never suggest php5 :)02:47
leftyfbI wouldn't suggest 12.04 either guiverc02:47
guiverci thought the pay-to-use (ESM) would scare people to upgrade to a supported version02:48
leftyfbIf they have an application that is critical to get going and only works on php5, I'd suggest running 14.04 in a container with only that application in it. Until the application is upgraded to php7 or replaced of course02:49
leftyfbguiverc: people aren't smart enough to worry about it being supported and will just install 12.04 because someone told them it comes with php502:49
leftyfbwhile the entire time they had no business worrying about php5 to begin with02:49
guivercokay - i'd have suggested 14.04 but didn't see php5 available in any supported release (outside 12.04esm)02:50
leftyfb14.04 has php5 by default02:51
leftyfbI have some ancient software running on it in containers02:52
tomreyni also pointed out that 14.04 has php5, and that it is supported for <1y02:55
tomreynjust like today, they could not really explain why php7 was not an option02:56
leftyfbmisunderstanding02:58
leftyfbas usualy02:59
leftyfbusual*02:59
leftyfbok, that's my queue to go to bed :)02:59
leftyfbcyas02:59
guivercyeah users are a dumb lot  (i talk from experience; I'm one of em); I missed your 14.04 php5 ref (was busy looking at packages.ubuntu.. & still missed it..)02:59
guivercnight leftyfb02:59
guiverc& thanks  leftyfb02:59
lordievaderGood morning06:08
ducassegood morning, folks06:15
lotuspsychje_hey lordievader ducasse06:17
lordievaderHey ducasse06:17
lordievaderHow are you doing?06:17
lordievaderMorning lotuspsychje_06:17
=== lotuspsychje_ is now known as lotuspsychjer
=== lotuspsychjer is now known as lotuspsychje
ducassehi lordievader - all good here, thanks, and you?06:19
lordievaderDoing ok here06:21
lordievaderHow are you lotuspsychje_ ?06:21
ducassebusy day ahead?06:21
lotuspsychjeall good here lordievader you?06:22
lordievaderHave to review a bunch of papers, so yes -.-06:22
=== EriC^ is now known as EriC^^
BluesKaj'Morning folks10:16
oerhekshi bl10:16
oerheks{tab}10:16
oerheksBluesKaj :-D10:16
BluesKajhi oerheks :-)10:17
lotuspsychjehey there BluesKaj10:17
BluesKajhi lotuspsychje10:17
BluesKajlotuspsychje, got your message, btw10:21
lotuspsychjehey EriC^^10:21
EriC^^hey lotuspsychje10:23
BluesKajhi EriC^^10:33
EriC^^hi BluesKaj10:39
lotuspsychjemain back in sleep :p10:39
BluesKajodd, #ubuntu seems to have no activity at all10:40
lotuspsychjemaybe its the weather too10:41
lotuspsychjesunny= everyone out10:41
lotuspsychjeonly a few fools sit on irc lol10:42
BluesKajit's too early to sit outside here, still only 13C10:43
lotuspsychjeoh10:44
lotuspsychjefreshy breakfast nice10:44
lotuspsychjebbl lunch here10:49
oerhekswait, we have a troll11:01
BluesKajyup, seems he talks about his pc as if all th elements and HW is installed then not11:03
oerheksfixing own issues, demanding a guest to change his name11:04
BluesKajnot dealing with him anymore11:04
oerhekswell, lets try preventing to do damage to others11:04
daftykinsaww, do we have to?11:06
daftykinsmorning all \o11:06
BluesKaj'Morning daftykins11:06
BluesKajthis hans guy has enough skills to make his IP as unreachable so he's probly just playing games here to amuse himself11:10
daftykinsnah usually it's just a sign of an ISP that blocks traceroute on some level11:12
BluesKajdaftykins, I tried both traceroute and https://www.ip-tracker.org/locator/ip-lookup.php11:13
BluesKajusually one of those will show a result11:13
daftykinsmeh :)11:13
oerhekshe is drunk, or on drugs11:21
leftyfbCity          Tønsberg11:24
leftyfb          Country         Norway11:24
leftyfb           State          Vestfold11:24
leftyfbIs that what you're looking for?11:24
oerheksi am looking for that amdgpu deb :-D11:25
daftykinslong live nvidia!11:26
* daftykins ducks11:26
* oerheks sharks11:27
daftykinseep11:27
BluesKajleftyfb, what did you use to get his IP?11:40
BluesKajor you used your ubuntu membership to look more deeply into this guy...I get it11:44
daftykinshehe11:44
leftyfbBluesKaj: whois11:56
leftyfb [hans_] (~hans@ti0016a400-1365.bb.online.no): realname11:56
leftyfb* [hans_] #ubuntu11:56
leftyfb* [hans_] rajaniemi.freenode.net :Helsinki, FI, EU11:56
leftyfb* [hans_] is using a secure connection11:56
leftyfb* [hans_] is logged in as Hans_Henrik11:56
leftyfb* [hans_] End of WHOIS list.11:56
leftyfbthen do a 'host ti0016a400-1365.bb.online.no'11:56
leftyfbthen I have a script that uses ip-adress.com to lookup geo location11:57
BluesKajoops my mistake ...had the wrong hans when I whoised11:57
BluesKajthis the one I got  [Whois] Hans is ~woodstock@blackbird.headcrashers.org (Don "Elvis" Woodstock)11:58
BluesKajhate those underscores on nicks11:59
oerhekssudo apt install amdgpu12:00
oerheks:-D12:00
BluesKajleftyfb, https://www.ip-tracker.org/locator/ip-lookup.php?ip=ti0016a400-1365.bb.online.no12:01
BluesKajI use that tracker because it's fast and seems accurate ...use it to test my vpn IPs etc12:03
BluesKajaltho it has java problems with it's map now and then12:06
* BluesKaj has to learn to use its instead of it's when it's possesive :-)12:21
blackflowthough you can't really trust the geoip database. it's best effort with no guarantees on validity12:31
BluesKajblackflow, like I said, "seems accurate" , but it hasn't led me into dangerous waters yet12:36
blackflowI guess it depends. in my experience, it's more wrong than correct.12:43
daftykinsit's really funny when websites try to geoIP us here on the island12:48
daftykins"hey, check out these things from <place_x>" uh yeah nobody says that :>12:48
BluesKajdepends? i haven't been steered wrong when comparing the results of that tracker with traceroute ...trust is a relative term, depending one's experience and opinion12:53
lotuspsychjehey guiver_d13:27
blackflowBluesKaj: I guess it has more to do about the region. More "important" one could be more accurate. For all the lookups I did, they were mostly wrong.13:32
BluesKajblackflow, how did you know they were wrong?13:33
blackflowbecause I knew the physical location of those IPs that I checked.13:35
blackflowand other sources. For example, Tele2, when their entered our market (Croatia), it took them a year or two before their IPs stopped locating to Sweden. I know that because they're one of my backup providers.13:36
blackflow*they13:36
blackflowI can only expect accuracy to reduce as we deplete IPv4 and subnets get sold and fragmented.13:38
blackflowwhich reminds me, I have to reactivate the tor exit node blockage on our firewalls...13:40
BluesKajseems isolated to your part of the world blackflow, haven't had the same experience here in Canadaat all13:43
blackflowpossible. I mean, our branch of T-Com won't even consider residential IPv6 yet, so yeah...13:45
tomreyn:-/14:35
tomreynno residential ipv6 still? that's way too late.14:35
tomreynipv4 IS depleted.14:35
daftykinssaw a piece claiming adoption is at <20% still14:36
blackflowthe worse part was I asked them if they had any plans about ipv6, and they said they had none.14:36
daftykinsand is even showing signs of levelling off14:36
tomreynwell have plans when they check their balances / calculations. although telecoms are the beasts, got the most ipv414:37
tomreynat&t still got WAY too many14:37
blackflowIoT is the way out of the ipv4 shackles. as bad as IoT is otherwise.14:38
tomreynhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_assigned_/8_IPv4_address_blocks#List_of_assigned_/8_blocks14:38
tomreynyes, that'll be the first and last time that iot actually does good14:40
daftykinsi wonder if afrinic is still in turmoil14:40
tomreynstill a RIPE colony14:41
tomreynbut shhhh14:41
blackflowlol14:50
blackflowAPNIC has no moar ipv4, and I hear AFRINIC is  heh.... ripe with unused ipv4 blocks :)14:51
blackflowfun times anyway. some people will get fired, if they haven't already. eg, those who decided by themselves that 1.1.1.1 is a good _testing_ range despite it NOT being RFC 1918.14:52
blackflowand yesterday I found out 128.0.0.0/8 was being used like that too14:52
daftykinsyeah but the afrinic folks just dumped their 'leader' due to sexual harrassment drama14:53
tomreynthere are also those who think RFC1918 reserves all of 192.0.0.0/8 and 172.16.0.0/815:21
tomreynthere are also those who think RFC1918 reserves all of 192.0.0.0/8 and 172.0.0.0/815:22
tomreynwell, same thing15:22
lotuspsychjehey pragmaticenigma15:26
pragmaticenigmahello15:26
daftykins\o15:27
lotuspsychjefresh from the press: https://blog.ubuntu.com/2018/07/09/minimal-ubuntu-released15:43
* lotuspsychje gonna buy an umbrella for protecting things fall out the heavy clouds15:50
daftykins>:D15:52
lotuspsychjelucky for me its minimal :p15:52
tomreynnot as fresh from the press: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1779827 - still relevant, though.15:55
ubot5Ubuntu bug 1779827 in linux (Ubuntu) "failure to boot with linux-image-4.15.0-24-generic" [Critical,In progress]15:55
lotuspsychjetomreyn: related to that hwe guy from today?15:56
tomreynyes15:56
lotuspsychjeppf said was better to downgrade to .2315:57
tomreynthe link was posted in #ubuntu-kernel arlier today15:57
lotuspsychjeaha15:57
tomreynapparently you need to downgrade or install haveged, but i haven't finished reading, yet15:57
lotuspsychjereally looking forward to .1 now15:57
lotuspsychjealot of stuff will get solved15:58
lotuspsychjethey better be ready for our unity guys :p15:58
tomreyn:)15:58
tomreynit's unfortunate that this kernel went into 18.04 proper. with 16.04 and hwe-edge it's ok to break, i guess, but not the latest lts default kernel.15:59
daftykins>8\/15:59
tomreynit doesn't always happen, though, so it's not so easy to test for,16:00
pragmaticenigmabad weeknd for me... primary system had the /var partition go bye-bye ... :-(16:03
tomreyn:-/16:03
tomreynwb, though. how did this happen?16:04
daftykinsyou might say it dropped a 'log'16:04
pragmaticenigmanot sure... I use my machine as a media server... I was playing back videos on it all evening the night before... when I woke up the next morning the drive and quick working and /var was completely empty. Reboot no longer works, as /var is needed to boot and won't mount or be recognized in bios16:07
daftykinsyee-ouch16:08
daftykinsmechanical disk gone bye bye?16:08
tomreynpragmaticenigma: is /var on a different disk than the rest, though? if it's just another partition then bios wouldn't matter there.16:11
daftykinsthink it was just the wording, sounds like it's the disk that's no longer seen at all16:11
pragmaticenigmaYes, /var was a separate physical disk. so /home /root /opt /etc are all recoverable16:12
tomreynand if your /var is on the same disk as other partitions you depend on then you should definitely check its concistency (start with 'smart' data) before the rest gets to fall apart as well.16:12
tomreynoh ok16:12
pragmaticenigmacoincidentally. I was preparing to back up the system in preparation for 18.04.01 to upgrade from the current 16.04.01 on that machine... If only I had been a little further along16:14
daftykins:<16:14
daftykinspragmaticenigma: i swapped over some hardware on Friday in a clients server and saw the onboard NIC wasn't supported under 14.04, so i just did a clean 18.04 install right then :D16:15
pragmaticenigmaI have a new drive for the system... upgrade from the now broken 2TB to a brand new 4TB16:16
pragmaticenigmanow the fun of deciding how to partition it16:16
tomreynconsider raid-1 (now or next time) if you have enough sata ports, this can save the headache of having to restore backups (which always happens at the wrong time).16:20
lotuspsychjepragmaticenigma: wich brand failed?16:25
daftykinsthey all fail :D16:27
tomreyn:) sooner or later, for sure16:28
pragmaticenigmairrelevant... I have no idea how long I even had that drive... at least more than 5 years16:30
lotuspsychjeghoti: welcome, i think we have a channels trigger somewhere16:30
lotuspsychje!channels16:30
ubot5A list of official Ubuntu IRC channels, as well as IRC clients for Ubuntu, can be found at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InternetRelayChat - For a general list of !freenode channels, see !alis - See also !Guidelines16:30
ghotilotuspsychje: thanks.16:30
lotuspsychjeanyone knows the trigger for the ubuntu channels?16:31
daftykins!irc16:32
ubot5A list of official Ubuntu IRC channels, as well as IRC clients for Ubuntu, can be found at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InternetRelayChat - For a general list of !freenode channels, see !alis - See also !Guidelines16:32
tomreyn!botabuse :-P16:33
ghotiAh, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/ChannelList would seem to be the channel list, but it's not clear whether this is in sync with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/IrcTeam/Scope .16:33
tomreynif you wanted to learn about #ubuntu-ops, reading the guidelines would have sufficed.16:34
ghotitomreyn: thanks, but that wasn't my goal.16:35
ghoti... I'm looking for a recommendation, and perhaps some discussion of the relative merits, of window managers for use in digital signage.16:35
lotuspsychjeghoti: software reccomends fit also in discuss16:35
lotuspsychjeor offtopic16:35
tomreynghoti: digital signage, signing what how?16:36
ghotiofftopic scares me a little, with the "touchy subjects" list on the Guidelines page. :)16:36
daftykinstomreyn: screens in shop windows, for example16:36
daftykinswhy have a WM at all? you just need a program starting with X :>16:36
ghotiSignage, as in a big screen TV, or four of them in a video wall configuration, alternating between rendered HTML and videos in mplayer.16:36
tomreyndaftykins: :-P16:36
ghoti(not necessarily mplayer, but that's what I've used before.)16:36
tomreynoh, you were serious16:37
tomreyni was thinking crypto16:37
ghotiunderstandible, if that's closer to your focus. :)16:37
daftykinstomreyn: would i lie to you? ;)16:37
tomreynmost likely not!16:38
ghotiAt any rate .. I've found that twm seems to prompt for window placement even if I use `-geometry`; I wonder whether a tiling wm would make sense, as it would be more likely not to assume I want mouse interaction, but I've only used spectrwm.16:40
ghotiOther recommendations I see are for fluxbox, blackbox, openbox, but I'm hoping someone might be able to lend me a little perspective before I go on my own time-conusming journey.16:41
daftykinssurprised there isn't an off the shelf solution yet given the number of folk i see talking about signage setups16:42
daftykinsonly ever see it done badly such as at my local supermarket with a huge update prompt coming up from a Windows taskbar xD16:42
tomreyni've never done this, so can't really recommend anything. other than ensuring you have a nyancat screensaver,16:47
daftykins:D16:47
tomreynif i was going to build a new solution nowadays, i'd probably look into whether this can already be achieved with wayland first of all. then realize its too early for that, and fall back to X, spend 6 hours searching the web, try 5 different solutions, and find that all of them suck one or the other way.16:50
daftykinsYOLD!16:50
* daftykins hides16:50
tomreynthat's just a guess, though.16:50
tomreynoh look, mr. worth-a-shuttle got you covered https://www.ubuntu.com/internet-of-things/digital-signage16:52
tomreynactually i did somehting like digital signage years ago. ended up spawning just a web browser in full screen mode and controlling the web pages it shows with a frameset and meta refresh. there are probably better way to do this nowadays (websockets or something).17:03
tomreynhttps://xibo.org.uk/ is an open source system, but they discontinued the ubuntu players17:04
pragmaticenigmatomreyn: The current leading FOSS digital signage project still does that from what I last saw a year ago... simple is the best approach17:14
tomreynpragmaticenigma: which one is that?17:16
pragmaticenigmaI think it's this one... I lost the link with the harddrive crash17:16
pragmaticenigmahttp://www.binaryemotions.com/digital-signage/raspberry-digital-signage/17:16
pragmaticenigmathe screen shots look familiar, but I don't remember it being donation ware17:18
tomreynit says GPL on the bottom of theis page.17:19
ghotidaftykins: there's an off-the-shelf solution geared towards raspberry pi called "screenly" which is built on raspbian with uzbl as the browser. But that won't work for me for a variety of reasons...17:20
tomreynhttp://www.binaryemotions.com/wp-content/uploads/rds-admin.png looks a bit old and incomplete.17:20
pauljwhi everyone17:33
hispeed_msomeone here :)19:06
hispeed_mhellooo19:07
lotuspsychjehispeed_m: whats going on?19:07
hispeed_mdrinking a beer and get a emby .pfx certificate to work19:07
hispeed_mmade with beer :D ^^ and in your house what's up?19:07
hispeed_mbenelux :D? you're still in at soccer championship19:09
lotuspsychjehispeed_m: this channel is for ubuntu discuss, perhaps you might find more glory in #ubuntu-offtopic ?19:09
hispeed_mwooops yes :D i joined both, sorry :D19:10
lotuspsychjefrom silent main to active support today19:40
pragmaticenigmalotuspsychje: ??19:41
lotuspsychjepragmaticenigma: this morning was pretty dead19:41
lotuspsychjepragmaticenigma: now its rolling :p19:42
lotuspsychje!uwn19:42
ubot5The Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter may be found at: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter19:42
lotuspsychjenew episode is out19:43
lotuspsychjehave a read guys19:43
lotuspsychjetnx to the uwn guys19:43
pragmaticenigmalotuspsychje: only rolling because as one gets help, more believe they can get help too?19:43
lotuspsychjepragmaticenigma: hmm yeah good idea, or..timezones switch :p19:44
lotuspsychjethink its also weather related and release related19:44
pragmaticenigmarelease?19:45
lotuspsychjelike bionic release, more support needed for example19:45
pragmaticenigmayeah, but that release was a couple months ago19:53
lotuspsychjepragmaticenigma: what do you think of 18.04.1 and xenial lts upgrades? big storm or not?19:53
pragmaticenigmaminimal... those who were patient enough to wait will be in good standing19:54
pragmaticenigmaioria is a champ... I couldn't do that level of hand holding19:55
lotuspsychjelol19:56
lotuspsychjeim done too19:56
lotuspsychjetoo much is too much19:56
lotuspsychjeand i dislike dualboots anyway19:57
pragmaticenigmaas do I... I use separate drives, and use the bios to switch which drive boots19:59
pragmaticenigmaI install all OS's without the other drives connected... then when done, connect all drives, set which one is default if I miss the bios prompt19:59
lotuspsychjeim too oldskool, want 1 Os on 1 machine20:07
pragmaticenigmaI havne't done a dual boot in a very long time... I've been perfectly happy using VMs inside a host20:13
Trident_BarclayI managed (mainly with the help of ubuntu room) to get dual boot ubuntu with windows 10 at last21:14
ducasse!yay21:17
ubot5Glad you made it! :-)21:17
Trident_Barclay:D21:18
Trident_BarclayWindows 10 and my bios made it hard21:18
Trident_Barclaybut we got there21:18

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