 The Librem 5 smartphone coming up in January will be running their FOSS (free, if you buy the phone, or free-free, I'm not sure haven't looked)
 The schedule is not "Coming in January"
 Company is called Purism
 I wouldn't expect too much from the librem camera
 Sorry that's the last thing I heard from their press release a month ago.
 When is it you think?
 @JoeFilmmaker, You can try to port to a newer phone I guess
 Are there ports ongoing for recent phones? How hard is it to do a port if there’s already Android drivers on, say, XDA?
 Why aren’t there newer phones? Is it because ports are so hard? Because people don’t own the hardware? I’ve heard this but it seems odd to me that this is the real reason.
 I'm going to be honest, it's very difficult until https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-touch/issues/494 is cracked
 My guess Joe is that the Nexus 5, etc are well understood in both sw and hardware, making development of UT more straight forward.
 Oh yes - HALium. Once that’s there then it should become much easier to do new ports, right? So the question I guess is how close is HALium and how hard will a port be once it’s done. I’ll read the Qualcomm issue mentioned above. Hope it’s not them trying to thwart FOSS.
 @JoeFilmmaker, ....I only just realized the meaning behind halium's name. *headdesk*
 You have to build a stable product incorporating a relatively recent OS before having the bandwidth to be able to break down and understand a more recent device.  Just my guess
 Yeah it sure is a cute name!
 @Flohack might there be a simple way to move a set of translations from one language to another? We've gotta move zh_Hans to zh_CN on the docs.
 Or rather, a way that doesn't make Weblate explode
 You’ve got a pretty good name there as well @Lyokanthrope
 Hah, thanks.
 Lyo, you've exposed the secret, now you must die
 (Photo, 220x220) https://irc.ubports.com/yzQetNsg.png
 I can expose way more secrets than that
 For example, did you know that marius never sleeps?
 The beast?
 Er
 No
 Marius
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/md3GEZ2s.webp
 Oh. i'm not the hippest guy in the engineering lab :)
 Well, welcome. We're all normal people with exceptionally normal lives
 @UniversalSuperBox, Totally.
 Any of you guys UBports coders? Done a port or know ‘em well?
 I've attempted to port a few phones
 I seem to have really bad luck though :V
 What went wrong? Have you done OS coding work before? Is the code reasonably clear and well organized?
 I used to work in the Unix kernel so I’m not exactly a newbie - but that was almost 30 years ago!
 Eh, I'm not a programmer, just a tinkerer really. I understand a lot of the internals but I'm not great at working with it.  … As far as what went wrong, it's often been issues with getting graphics working on my ports or something, seems to be the biggest hurdle overall. Lately it's just been the fact that CAF is in a weird sp
[00:36] <ubptgbot> ot with Halium right now.
 Yeah - from what you guys sent it sounds like Qualcomm broke binary compatibility without providing a runtime way to check for it. Bummer.
 How long did it take you to get an almost-working port done?
 Uhm. Last port I started was the LG G5 and getting that booting was just a night or two..but I couldn't get any graphics working on Halium for the life of me.  … Before that was the Nexus 6 which took like a week to get it booting and tests working, did get graphics working under Halium rootfs and plasma mobile but haven't had
[00:42] <ubptgbot> any luck with UBports.
 @JoeFilmmaker, I don't do ports but my bits are all throughout the system
 And they are exquisite, of course
 Thanks Lyo. Hi Rodney. I’m a Unix dev from 30 years ago who’s now a filmmaker. But I’m tired of Apple/Google and am thinking of trying to do a port to - ironically I guess - either the pixel 2 or S7 or 8. ‘Cause I want a kick-butt camera. Any tips for getting up to speed in the source tree?\
 Gotta go but look forward to any replies!
 s7 and s8 ports have been started
 @JoeFilmmaker, Caf. Good luck booting it. also here is the porting group- https://t.me/ubports_porting
 Pixel doesn't have an amazing camera
 @rupansh, None of those devices are CAF (assuming he's talking about Exynos Samsungs)
 @dohbee, Yeah it's actually pretty mid ranged hardware wise, it's the software that makes it great
 Midrange phone at a maximum-range price
 I wouldn't go that far
 Well I was talking about the camera sensor
 Iirc it's true same sensor found in some of the mid ranged Motorola devices
 [Edit] Iirc it's the same sensor found in some of the mid ranged Motorola devices
 As with most of us I am completely fed up with $1000 phones every year also.  I have turned to OPO 3T, 5T, and soon to be 6T, unless my endless research pulls the next low-cost, high quality, medium-to-high performance phone to my screen
 I pretty much always buy phones either as open box or used these days
 last phone I bought new was the Nexus 5x, never again
 I liked my 5X
 I liked it at first
 But I abused the Google Fi deal
 Activated the phone and canceled immediately
 But the overheating, the really awful battery life compared to the Z3C I had before and the redmi note 3 I had after (which I kinda wish I kept in retrospect), the stuttering...bleh.
 the only redeeming qualities of that phone for me were the camera and screen
 It's still easier to hold than the glass back behemoths
 oh yeah
 the actual build was rather nice
 and it was servicable I guess
 But actually using the phone was miserable
 Hi guys and gals
 Is there any issue installing 16.04 on a N5 that I should be aware of?
 It's kinda taking a lot...
 ... of time?
 Yes, sorry
 @UniversalSuperBox, Please can you elaborate ?
 are you stuck at the bootloader or do you get to the recovery screen?
 Ubports recovery screen. The installer on my computer is still on "Flashing images..." with a full orange bar
 @matv1, Well alright, they are planning for a january launch.
 ok, then I dont know. My problem was that the computer lost contact with the phone, so I got stuck at the bootloader
 I did not see January. Last I saw was later in the year.
 @The_Reverend, Thanks anyway. Maybe I'm just not patient enough
 They are still saying january on the site though. But you obviously hear a bit more then us mortals :)
 I'm not nearly important enough to get into "more than us mortals" territory
 I know when you know
 Hey Mathjs, I appreciate the upgrade to 'mortal'!
 Haha
 I was wondering though, is ubports set to receive one of those dev kits?
 Well, phosh is in git. You could theoretically run on another device before librem release
[03:18] <ubptgbot> Biju Joseph was added by: Biju Joseph
 What's the point for rc in every Wednesday when no bug is debugged and no new features
 because things are still being worked on
 Hotspot still not working
 so because the bug you care about isn't fixed means they shouldn't do anything else?
 I'm sorry
 That was a little rude on my part, I'm sorry. I'm just trying to say is that there's still a lot of work going on, commits to every part of the project almost every day.
 If the bug you've been watching hasn't been fixed, check the issues tracker
[03:57] <ubptgbot> yatix was added by: yatix
[05:27] <ubptgbot> matteomutti was added by: matteomutti
 @John_athan, Yesterday I switches from RC to devel and then the hotspot worked ;) (Bacon)
 @BlueKenny, How about camera and video problem
 @John_athan, Alot is fixed, if you would like see more fast the fixes go to dev ;)
 @John_athan, What is the matter with this ?
 I am using Hammerhead
 @John_athan, But hotspot can be fixed on both I think but don't know
 @dohbee, Hi Rodney. I was talking about the Pixel 2. At least with native OSes the Pixel 2 and S8 have the best image and video quality according to most of the tests I’ve seen. I’m a filmmaker and the phone is the camera I always have with me so I want it to be as good as possible. Quality comparable to the latest Google
[05:56] <ubptgbot> , Apple, and Samsung phones is what I’m hoping for. Of course they do an awful lot in software so that may not be possible. Filmic Pro does an awful lot itself though and runs on Android so maybe it would do well Image quality wise.
[07:09] <ubptgbot> Krysier was added by: Krysier
 is there gimp on ubports?
 You can install gimp with libertine but it,s not that usable on 16.04
 Hi @yatix @matteomutti & @Krysier, welcome! Check out https://ubports.com/telegram-welcome to get you up to speed. … There are language focus groups available too 👍
 (Photo, 1920x1152) https://irc.ubports.com/0PXtPKzM.png
 On meizu mx4, 15.04 but it,s a bit hard to use on the phone
 You can make the ui bigger but you have to add a line in Xdefaults in container
 Default dpi is 72 and them phone sceens are > 300
 still impressive that it works though
 I think it,s using xmir
 yeah must be
 16.04 is still using an old version on mir, i think with the latest upstream mir stuff will work better, maybe
 actually i think xmir is broken on the newest version (the wayland shift broke it)
 but that's the 18.04 desktop branch
 Wayland/xwailand instead of mir/xmir
 mir there is a wayland compositor
 so it's xwayland / mir then i guess?
 18.04 uses wayland but xwayland branch is nit yet finhed/merged
 i'd be running unity8 on my tablet when that's fixed
 @UniversalSuperBox, Done. Works a bit shoddy though. One can't navigate to the page mentioned. Only use the direct link.
 or, spamming bug reports ;)
 +1 for reporting bugs 😃
 +2 for fixing bugs 😜
 +3 for supporting UBports with a donation lol
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/2WWtQHrr.webp
 I know the struggle, brother !
 But yeah most people including me don,t have the skills to fix bugs so reporting, donating, sharing blog posts, helping other people helps
[08:23] <ubptgbot> Hirenmob was added by: Hirenmob
 Sup hirenmob
[08:58] <ubptgbot> Mensah was added by: Mensah
[10:24] <jaydemir> is there any way to get browser audio to run in background?
 maybe stop the browser from suspending? … you can do it in UT Tweak Tool
 it's not just the audio though, it'll be the whole app that won't suspend and continue to run in the background
[10:38] <jaydemir> makes sense. I'd like to do some streaming audio in the background but it seems like all my options are just web apps
[10:38] <jaydemir> (I literally just installed this morning for the first time)
 I am not sure though if it'll still work when locked
 have you tried Cloud Music? it works good when I tried it before...not sure now :)
[10:45] <jaydemir> I just installed that. Where is it getting music from?
[10:52] <jaydemir> I really am liking the OS though. How active is the development?
[10:56] <jaydemir> the home screen does freeze a lot whenever I swipe over. It's probably the only thing I'm having issues with atm
 not sure what its provider but it seems like an Asian one
 the development is pretty much active 👍
 did you install 16.04 or 15.04?
 @jaydemir, There's a bug with the scroll momentum, developers are fixing it
 @JoeFilmmaker, The camera is still the same 12mp thing that's in the pixel though. It didn't change. Maybe it's better for video at 1080p or something though
 @jaydemir, For best experience or daily use i recommend you to install vivid version
 @John_athan, Again, for the Nth time, please report issues in GitHub, and stop being short, rude, and demanding about them
 https://fitwhilehome.com/product/adjustable-dumbbell-bundle/?utm_campaign=DumbbellBundle&utm_source=social&utm_medium=fb&utm_term=&utm_content=fb
[11:04] <jaydemir> I'm actually not sure which version. I just fumbled with the latest ubports installer until it worked
[11:05] <jaydemir> reboot seems to have fixed the issue
[11:06] <jaydemir> it shows 15.04 r3
[11:06] <jaydemir> it's a nexus 5
 @jaydemir, Go to system settings>about>OS
 Oh ok
 Cool then
 You are in the stable channel
 Xenial is not yet ready for daily use. Less for nexus 5
[11:08] <jaydemir> doesn't seem like it supports x11 apps but pithos would have been cool to have
[11:10] <jaydemir> does this version of ubuntu touch come with the continuum-like feature?
 You canrun x11 apps with libertine
 (Photo, 1920x1152) https://irc.ubports.com/cbzapr0o.png
[11:17] <jaydemir> nice. When I try to run sudo apt-get install pithos I get a few errors though
[11:17] <jaydemir> W: not using locking for read only lock file /var/lib/dpkg/lock
 Fwd from UBports News Channel: Liberapay is experiencing some turbulence, but don't panic! If you're using Liberapay to donate to UBports, this blog post post explains everything you need to know. https://medium.com/liberapay-blog/liberapay-is-in-trouble-b58b40714d82
[11:17] <jaydemir> E: Unable to write to /var/cache/apt
[11:18] <jaydemir> E: package lists or status file could not be opened
[11:18] <jaydemir> is there a considerable amount of tweaking that needs to be done to use apt?
 In 16.04 libertine is integrated in system settings, so it,s quite easy to use
 jaydemir: `sudo mount -o remount,rw /`
[11:21] <jaydemir> welp, goodbye Android!
[11:21] <jaydemir> I've been thinking about de-googling for a while and Windows phone wasn't going to cut it haha
 @neothethird, Jan, I'm wondering why not offering crypto currency based donations ? … No third party involved that might cause problems here.
 @coinee, we already accept bitcoin :) ubports.com/donate
[11:23] <jaydemir> so I was able to install pithos and I got libertine from the store. Any other steps?
 @neothethird, oh crap, missed that, great, thx !
 @coinee, well, thank you :)
 jaydemir: here's a guide, but after ota-4 it'll be a lot easier https://docs.ubports.com/en/latest/userguide/dailyuse/libertine.html
[11:24] <jaydemir> Nice! I'll be sure to give that a read
[11:25] <jaydemir> is running a desktop from the phone still a thing?
[11:25] <jaydemir> M$ calls it continuum, not sure if its called the same thing in the ubuntu world
 jaydemir: yes, but not every device has hdmi out. So if you have a nexus 4 or 5, you can use a slimport adapter, if you have a bq m10, they have micro hdmi out. Other devices only have wireless, they work with miracast adapters.
 it's called convergence mode in our world
[11:27] <jaydemir> slimport adapter can be bought on amazon or something I assume
 @jaydemir, jep, i will recomend the offical slimport one btw. but others should work just fine
[11:28] <jaydemir> official slimport one?
 @neothethird, Afaik MX4 doesn't work with miracast either - at least it did not the last time I heard about it. Or has this changed?
 There is also unity8 for x86 on ubuntu 16.04, 18.04 and maybe arch and debian in the future
 @jaydemir, https://www.amazon.com/Analogix-Semiconductor-SP6001-BlackBerry-SlimPort-enabled/dp/B015DJ4QYI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1531481380&sr=8-2&keywords=slimport
 it's made by Analogix Semiconductor, the company behind simport itself
[11:30] <jaydemir> NICE
 @zubozrout, i'm not aware of that. The big difference here is that miracast is an open protocol that needs to be supported by the software, for slimport you need special hardware. But there might be a porting issue on the MX4, i'm not sure
[11:30] <jaydemir> I can throw away all my computers and just use my nexus 5! :D
 Ummm....
 jaydemir: haha, hold on to your computers for now, but we sure want to get there at some point :D
[11:31] <jaydemir> lol
[11:31] <jaydemir> yeah. Would have been nice to see ubuntu touch on the nextbit robin but I just got rid of mine
[11:32] <jaydemir> decent spec bump, super cheap and easy to unlock
[11:32] <jaydemir> its basically a better nexus 5x
 but does it have hdmi out? (slimport, displayport etc)
[11:32] <jaydemir> true
[11:32] <jaydemir> its got usb C
[11:33] <jaydemir> next best thing I'd imagine
 @neothethird, This is not the source I've read about this originally but it mentiones the issue behind its inavailability for MX4: … https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/msg19666.html
 @neothethird, [Edit] This is not the source I've read about this originally but it mentiones the issue behind its unavailability for MX4: … https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/msg19666.html
 @zubozrout, hmm, that's a pity
 jaydemir: there's a million usb c standards though, and not all of them support video signals
 anyways, if you want to look into porting, halium.org will get you started
 @neothethird, [Edit] This is not the source I've read about this originally but it mentiones the issue behind its unavailability for MX4: … https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/msg19666.html … Edit: oh, this is the link: https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/04/meizu-mx4-ubuntu-convergence-support :)
 @jaydemir, Don't use apt.
 usb 3.1 supports displayport
[11:37] <jaydemir> does convergence mode need to be installed in any way or is it out of the box?
 but usb-c might be 2.0, some vendors do that
 @jaydemir, Ootb. It's a native feature, assuming the hardware has necessary bits
 yeah it's native, just connect it and magic happens
[11:41] <jaydemir> yay
 @mariogrip, I don't think that's necessarily true.
 @dohbee, it is for all qualcomm chips at least
[11:42] <jaydemir> I'm stoked to try all this out. I think the biggest thing is GPS navigation. If it works well enough this might be a permanent switch
 @jaydemir, Unav works pretty well
 @jaydemir, unav is pretty awesome for navigation, i use it often
[11:44] <jaydemir> awesome
 any reason X11 apps look so ugly on Libertine screenshots? I mean stock GTK+2 style and window borders
 @NotKit, its as minimal as it gets, no themese are installed in the chroots
[11:50] <antonlan> @mariogrip; @dohbee: Hello you both, one Question I have in this case: is there already the possibility in Unav to use it offline (with local stored maps)? .. and Btw.: Thank you for all of your great work for Ubports !!!!
 @mariogrip, Theme is there, but no settings daemon running and such. No session to set up all the magic bits
 @antonlan, I don't know
 @antonlan, I think you can store offline maps, not 100% sure, but will check
 yes you can have offline maps http://unav.me/offline/
[11:55] <jaydemir> uh oh. My OS was last updated 5/25/70
[11:55] <jaydemir> its like 48 years out of date :c
[11:56] <jaydemir> I should be on Ubuntu 63.04 by now. What gives
[12:12] <jaydemir> Anyways I'm taking off. Thank all of you for the help!
[12:14] <antonlan> @mariogrip; @dohbee: Okay, thank You for this information.., @mariogrip: see You tomorrow at the Q&A (I watch every Q&A with interst!)
 @jaydemir, Issue with timekeeping at update
 UT way ahead of time
 since '70
 Is RN4 is supported
 @sharan33333, No
 https://community.ubuntu.com/t/this-week-in-mir-13th-july-2018/7014
 mir 0.32.1 released
 why do we use Mir though?
 Not using Mir would mean rewriting a good chunk of unity 8
 @popescu_sorin, Reported that it breaks unity8
 Somehow
 https://github.com/ubports/unity8-desktop-install-tools/issues/35
[15:17] <ubptgbot> GLOBD was added by: GLOBD
 Fwd from dohbee: making unity8 not use mir directly basically amounts to "rewrite everything" which is not a terribly amiable goal to keep things active and moving
 @rupansh, Because it's not dead
 I see
 (Sticker, 512x246) https://irc.ubports.com/qLKamn80.webp
 I wonder what's the future of mir...it's now mainly developed for embedded systems right? IoT?
 I think some desktops are planning to use it as a springboard for making a Wayland compositor (MATE and others)
 Anyone porting for the mt6595 and mt657x
 The Mir project goal hasn't changed: it is still a library for writing shells across a wide range of form factors. (Admittedly Canonical's willingness to pay for Mir development is based on IoT products, but that isn't in conflict with other uses.)
 @WorldNetsKe, Mtk
 sad
 @rupansh, Then I'll have to give a try
 @WorldNetsKe, mt6797 here
 which device and what kind of sources do you have?
 Redmi Note 2 is possible...
 oh, I misread mt65xx with mt67xx
 @NotKit, TECNO A7, had sometime ago tested on cyanogen
 with custom kernel?
 you need kernel source code and be able to rebuilt it
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/Yy7zSPJX.webp
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/JN88Pf7m.webp
 @NotKit, The only custom ting I have is the recovery
 @popescu_sorin, kid got your phone?
 @popescu_sorin enough flooding
 @WorldNetsKe I guess you'd better get another device for porting then
 @NotKit, Thanks @NotKit. I will
 it's hard to do anything without kernel sources, as UBPorts would require completely different kernel options compared to Android stock one
 oh sorry, telegram on the phone froze
 @vanyasem, 😢
[15:58] <ubptgbot> Koutav Pal was added by: Koutav Pal
[16:09] <ubptgbot> Photojoe4 was added by: Photojoe4
 Has anyone had luck using Spotify on their Nexus 5?
 hmm interesting i was wondering why halium ca't be built on top of the stock android kernel
 where to find proxy settings?
 ut 15.04 r24
 @Kirill, they aren't there
 @vanyasem, do you need to configure proxy manually through the terminal? will the desktop teams do it?
 you could ask in @ubports_ru
 becase well your issue is directly related to Russian internet censorship
 or you could move to Belarus, it's always an option
 for so many years, the Linux community has not changed, that will not ask ... the answer is no... all the time where the send😂
 funny.
 UBPorts Telegram really needs that option though
 @dohbee, If I report there that issue will be deleted for duplicate , I will complain because I am using it
 @John_athan, if an issue is a duplicate, it may be closed as such. no reason to complain. it means the issue is already there.
 if you think it's a problem that your issues are marked duplicate, perhaps you can do a better job of checking  existing issues before opening a new issues
 in any case, it is no reason to rudely demand attention for your issues, over those of others
 The level of entitlement...
 @John_athan, how much do you patron to the ubports?
 @John_athan if the issue is reported, asking about it again will not make the fix come faster. This is your last warning to be respectful and follow normal processes for bug reporting. I can't believe I have to say that.
 @Gorsh2, please don't "help" by adding to the problem with such comments
 @vanyasem, why do you feel like your personal issues are the most valuable out there?
 And now we can move on. :)
 @John_athan, [Edit] how much do you patron to ubports?
 What's the point for deleting duplicate when the issue is not solved. I have complained about WiFi toggle problem but two iterations passed but  problem gets increased  … WiFi is not detecting any modemd
 Duplicate issues clog up the bug tracker and will be out-of sync if the bug is actually fixed (the original issue was closed but the duplicates weren't)
 continuing to create new reports for the same issue because it hasn't been fixed, doesn't make it get fixed faster
 it makes it get fixed slower, because devs have to deal with you filing the same issue multiple times now
 if you've reported an issue, someone will get to it when they have time to do so. and if they ask for more info in the report, the place to discuss it is in the report's comments, not in here
 I am not worrying about bug fixes , but worrying about new bug from every new rc
 I'm sorry that the product you are getting for free which is made by (mostly) volunteers isn't to the level of quality that you expect. You can help fix that by: … - Following the proper issue-tracking guidelines: https://docs.ubports.com/en/latest/contribute/bugreporting.html … - Bringing more developers into the project
[17:09] <ubptgbot> … - Donating or contributing to UBports in other ways
 The Nexus 5 wireless issue has been fixed. I'm not sure if a new RC has been shipped since that happened, though. The fix is in devel.
 @UniversalSuperBox, But iam spending "my time" with it and reporting about it
 "The nexus 5 wireless issue" being https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-touch/issues/731
 @John_athan, then report the issues in github following the issue reporting guidelines. telegram is not an issue tracker
 and if you want to contribute by testing, it would be better to do so on devel rather than rc
 @dohbee, I want to double check whether I have that issue or others like me have that issue
 @John_athan, I understand, but I'd appreciate if you followed the proper guidelines and searched for duplicates prior to reporting bugs. I've just wasted 10 minutes that I could have been using to make Ubuntu Touch better to join this discussion.
 @John_athan, If the bug is reported then yes, others have that issue
 I understand the motivation with that, though.
 To answer your original question again, yes, the issue with the Nexus 5 not finding any wi-fi networks is fixed. The problem is that the hardware state wasn't reflected in the interface. The modem was turned off but the interface said it was on.
 @dohbee, Ok.
 (Photo, 800x586) https://irc.ubports.com/CO7F47wZ.png The suspense of 99% completion
 Lol :D, don't you know that with every progress bar the last remaining second is the longest one :)
 @rupansh, Another reason, because the mighty @alan_griffiths is supporting our project although he doesnt need to bother with it, and we praise him for such contributions: https://github.com/ubports/mir-1/pull/3
 That one is even more extreme, look at the count of commits! https://github.com/ubports/mir-1/pull/2
 Another reason is because it is so fun to say (use Russian accent) 'MIR!"
 miRRRRR
 yes!!!!
 that!
 And Wayylaaand?
 Mierde!
 BOOM!
 that too!~
 @wayneoutthere, Feels bad to be born with speech defect that prevents me from saying hard r correctly
 yes, you would miss many good Ubuntu words
 @wayneoutthere, It's a strong woodsy name.
 haha
 Not tinny at all.
 @wayneoutthere, мир
 @ar7ch, труд май
 Something I wrote a while back to this post: … https://plus.google.com/+MarkShuttleworthCanonical/posts/7LYubpaHUHH … "The biggest problem I see is that most opensource developers don't understand and therefore don't appreciate Object-oriented programming (C++) and they produce ugly C code, sometimes utilizing custom features that
[18:12] <ubptgbot>  brings their C closer to C++, increasing the overhead and decreasing readability. Why not use C++ directly then? That is for example the case of Wayland." … I am not a great programmer but I've also heard this from other people. The code Canonical produce is of a high quality in comparioson to most other OpenSource projects unfortunately :(. Possi
[18:12] <ubptgbot> bly the only huge exception I know of is Qt which is also written in C++ and has mostly positive feedback. So I would say this is another (for me huge) plus point for Mir. … Please note I have nothing against pure C but if the projects gets more complicated developers tend to extend C to work more like C++ (this is what I dislike).
 [Edit] Something I wrote a while back to this post: … https://plus.google.com/+MarkShuttleworthCanonical/posts/7LYubpaHUHH … "The biggest problem I see is that most opensource developers don't understand and therefore don't appreciate Object-oriented programming (C++) and they produce ugly C code, sometimes utilizing custom featur
[18:12] <ubptgbot> es that brings their C closer to C++, increasing the overhead and decreasing readability. Why not use C++ directly then? That is for example the case of Wayland." … I am not a great programmer but I've also heard this from other people. The code Canonical produce is of a high quality in comparioson to most other OpenSource projects unfortunately :(
[18:12] <ubptgbot> . Possibly the only huge exception I know of is Qt which is also written in C++ and has mostly positive feedback. So I would say this is another (for me huge) plus point for Mir. … Please note I have nothing against pure C but if the project gets more complicated developers tend to extend C to work more like C++ (this is what I dislike).
 [Edit] Something I wrote a while back to this post: … https://plus.google.com/+MarkShuttleworthCanonical/posts/7LYubpaHUHH … "The biggest problem I see is that most opensource developers don't understand and therefore don't appreciate Object-oriented programming (C++) and they produce ugly C code, sometimes utilizing custom featur
[18:13] <ubptgbot> es that brings their C closer to C++, increasing the overhead and decreasing readability. Why not use C++ directly then? That is for example the case of Wayland." … I am not a great programmer but I've also heard this from other people. The code Canonical produce is of a high quality in comparioson to most other OpenSource projects unfortunately :(
[18:13] <ubptgbot> . Possibly the only huge exception I know of is Qt which is also written in C++ and has mostly positive feedback. So I would say this is another (for me huge) plus point for Mir. … Please note I have nothing against pure C but if the project gets more complicated developers tend to extend their C code to work more like C++ (this is what I dislike).
 @zubozrout, What is this in context to?
 i think that's a lot of bumpkis
 @UniversalSuperBox, presumably "why do you use mir?"
 oh
 Mir vs. Wayland, yes
 When they love C++ so much why they used Go at all SCNR 😆
 And Python
 And also Vala
 and also C
 and also cmake
 and also bash
 Well, it is C++ in 89.8%
 javascript, blah blah
 oh, you meant Canonical in general?
 It is one thing to develop a simple app and another thing to work on a large scale project like Mir. It wouldn't work really well written in JS or Bash :)
 Sure, but I assume that the leading Wayland compositors are also written in a rather high-quality way
 KWin and Mutter do some crazy things too, it's just that they aren't really built for "Other people using them" requirement
 you could write a compositor in javascript if you want i guess
 perhaps not practial, but could be done
 Really, the leading reason to use Mir is that Unity8 already uses Mir, switching would be a herculean task.
 I am not saying they are not of a high quality (in that it works) - I simply don't understand why they avoid C++ is if is even easier to work with it anyway.
 [Edit] I am not saying they are not of a high quality (in that it works) - I simply don't understand why they avoid C++ is if is even easier to work with anyway.
[18:19] <ubptgbot> Javier was added by: Javier
 @zubozrout, C was chosen because it provides the ability to support more languages through bindings
 it's a dumb question though
 "why did these people who have been writing objectified C for 20 years, choose C for yet another project"
 I wouldn't say it's a dumb question, perfectly valid
 But that's the answer
 Well, I would like to know the answer to that :D. But yeah, the bindings suppport is probably a good point.
 anyway, as i understand, the plan for that crowd is to eventually move to Rust for everything
 I am hacking again live a bit, viewers, comments welcome: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VShheplNol8
 In any case Mir is mostly written in C++ for which Canonical has my deep admiration if that wasn't obvious from the conversation :). And I am not spamming anymore with this - this is a topic better suited for a conversation over a beer or something rather than here :). </spam>
 @Flohack, Change the title to "Bald Brazzers guy hacking UBports"
 You will get 10 times more views
 loool
 Monetarization
 yess
 @zubozrout, inb4 "Did somebody say beer?" :P
 huh why are scripts deleted
 damnit now its subdir xD
 @UniversalSuperBox, you don't have one in hand right now?
 @dohbee, I could, but the only ones in this house are >1y old
 @zubozrout, eh, i just find discussions about which language is better than which other language to be inredibly flawed and pointless. beer doesn't help
 This is not about language - this is about them hacking C to work like C++ (that's my only point)
 @UniversalSuperBox, some age pretty well
 Miller Lite
 Is beer on topic? Who am I kidding, it's an open source community.
 @zubozrout, they didn't though.
 @UniversalSuperBox, oh, i'm sorry.
 @UniversalSuperBox, How about the UBports Beer Group?
 i guess i will have to get on with that other app i started then
 I'd become a patron of you on Liberapay, but
 too soon
 @TomasOqvist, create the chat NOW
 i have some things to discuss
 Why not do it in @ubports_OT?
 because we need a focus group
 LOL
 Anyone having a Jenkins template for script debs?
 @vanyasem, are you wayne?!
 with not 3 archs in parallel build
 @Flohack, Take our template and remove the extra architectures?
 @Flohack, is the debian/control not "Architecture: all" ?
 @UniversalSuperBox, Ah good idea where is ours 😆
 oh i guess it'd still build on all if you don't have it configured not to
 Every Git repositories
 [Edit] Every Git repository
 @vanyasem, https://t.me/ubp_beer
 They don't change much. :P
 pffffft
 @TomasOqvist, it's a channel
 not a chat
 it's like a news feed
 @vanyasem, you can announce beer only
 it just posts your untappd check-ins
 @vanyasem, Oh, I don't know how to set up chats. But isn't a channel much better?
 @TomasOqvist, no, only admins can post to channels, it's a news feed, not a place for people to talk
 🍺🍺🍺
 @vanyasem, you need a supergroup
 Which you can have after you create a group
 @vanyasem, aha, see what i can do
 @TomasOqvist, delete the channel and create a group :P
 @vanyasem, Here we go: https://t.me/joinchat/A1pvYEmpZXGhsA9EoYH_LQ
 no
 make a proper handle for it
 and a proper link
 sorry, how to?
 back to the chat
 i was trying to explain
 AND FAIL
 damnit Jenkins and me will never be friends
 @Flohack, 😂
 No its again deb changelog format
 miohmioh
 @vanyasem, t.me/ubp_beer_group
 @Flohack, just use dch.
 The problem is some of Debian's crazy versioning
 you mean the problem is people don't know how to version things?
 or the native package vs not, thing?
 Yeah, 0.7.0.289123628359623461298-0debian1-0ubuntu0 makes jenkins-debian-glue very upset
 you have two dashes in that?
 T'was an exageration
 meh it failed again
 Last time I helped Dalton, maybe this time Dalton can help me
 well i mean, multilpe dashes is generally very bad
 gbp:error: Can't determine upstream version from changelog
 what is the darn upstream version supposed to be
 Reset the versioning altogether again
 Back to basics
 upstream version is everything prior to the last `-` in the version string
 Why we are then able to use + ??? ubports-qa-scripts (0.1+ubports1) xenial; urgency=medium
 Just tell me what I should use 😆
 -ubports1?
 it depends on source format
 Anyway we are upstream
 Can I use a plain one?
 if `debian/` dir is part of upstream source, it should technically be a 'native' package, where you just have only the upstream version in the changelog
 so would be just (0.1) or (0.17) for example
 Ok let me try
 (or 0.1+ubports1 is still entirely the 'upstream' version)
 but your `debian/source/format` file should be `3.0 (native)` for that
 iirc
 0.1 doesnt work
 https://github.com/ubports/qa-scripts/blob/xenial_-_deb-packaging/debian/changelog
 source is 3.0 (quilt) wtf
 right, so it will require a `-` in the version for `3.0 (quilt)`
 so `0.1-0ubports1` would work for example
 switched to native
 now it works thx
 I mean we are upstream, no need for that xD
 Anyone came late I am streaming live my work on https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-touch/issues/688
 aaand drumroll...
 and florian ends up on one of the many "craziest moments on twitch!" videos
 lol
 Rather as sleeping pill
 Damn now freight complains
 If freight is complaining you've really done something terrible
 lol
 maybe because it creates an _all.deb?
 sounds freightening
 @dohbee, ugh
 no idea
 @UniversalSuperBox, freighters gonna freight
 Guys/gals, can't change the ringtone in N5-vivid
 Vivid?
 15.04
 Right, just that I haven't heard that one on Vivid. Or Xenial for that matter.
 I'm comparing to the same screen in my N4 and there's a few options missing
 I'll reboot and see if it comes back
 Nevermind: it came back.
 @Gorsh2, I've just change the ringtone in my N5 (vivid). Works perfectly fine 👍
 IIRC when you set a custom ringtone, the previous custom one is removed
 Good to know
 I'm still using the same though
 the "close encounters" melody
 :)
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/0H0gAlWH.mp4
 5 commits later
 (Photo, 342x479) https://irc.ubports.com/M4RcAh7k.png
 lol
 Pfft, that's nothing
 (Photo, 608x103) https://irc.ubports.com/KzP2lDSf.png Tadaaa
 You did it !!
 Yesss
 Extremly satisfied
 Here, this is for you 🍺
 Thx
 :)
 My live screencast can be turned into a tutorial: How to bring a new package under UBports CI
 step 1) be a ubports group admin
 :P
 :D
 You mean bc I committed directly to our org?
 Step 2: Get upset
 Instead of my own repo?
 @Flohack, well yeah, arbitrary people can't use ubports CI i hope
 Kind of. As soon as they PR us for a package we have set up, Jenkins will do it
 Er?
 SO you can spam PRs for packages we own ^^
 Oh.
 No, you can't change the Jenkins file.
 well right, if the repo is already set up to do that
 one can't add arbitrary new repos to it
 No need to change the Jenkins file
 Create 400 branches with small changes
 Jenkins will freak out
 400 PRs sorry
 That's not really importing a new package, though?
 well it will just queue them
 and obviously not what your video is about
 @UniversalSuperBox, No. You are right thats not what ppl can do
 I have to cut out the part of the livecast xD
 @dohbee, Kinda DoS for us ^^
 yeah, but a lot of trouble for no real gain, for someone to do that
 on the other hand, 400 valid PRs for ubports stuff, would be a good problem to have :)
 ^^
 You can pretty much automate that. Problem is none of the kids out there have a real gain and yet 1000s of services get attacked in each second
 well you can automate job deletion in jenkins too
 but still, automating crating so many branches and PRs that appear valid, on github, is not likely something anyone is going to really bother with
 otherwise i guess travis and circle and all these other CI things would be having the problem constantly
 probably more interesting projects on github for someone to try and DoS if they were goint to do so that way, i guess
 hmm maybe Github makes rate limiting
 for certain operations
 That attack vector is both unlikely and low-impact
 exactly
 To all the new people here, welcome! Check out https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome to get your UT journey started
 Never before have I been happier to see an error. 🙄
[21:46] <ubptgbot> billyrubin1 was added by: billyrubin1
 *-st
 Well hello there
 whats up with the git servers
 Explain?
 Its syncing at 150KB/s on a server that usually syncs at 20MB/s
 It's just github being github
 Sometimes 20MBps sometimes 20KBps
 @dohbee, wash your mouth out with soap
 @wayneoutthere, Hey wayne! are you out there?
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/2MqfVmrt.webp
 @mariogrip, who wants to know?
 @wayneoutthere, just me, no NSA this time
 How may I serve you today?
 any devs you need me to push?
 @wayneoutthere, Just wanted to know if you have a good day, and if you are enjoing the fresh feeling of xenial
 you kow what?  i don't have it.
 i don't know how to get it. HA!
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/1S6InEDf.mp4
 can i click and say 'ok' yet?
 @wayneoutthere, you dont have a good day? :(
 i'm rolling 8bit Vivid
 @wayneoutthere, jan s installer is funky good
 i kind of want to try it.  but i feel nervous like a first date
 @wayneoutthere, well, the xenial date will not let you down :)
 i also haven't seen star wars so maybe I should keep it on vivid forever
 but soon you can press a nice button in the system settins to get the new cool xenial, when we move the devel channel to xenial you can do that. hopefully this weekend
 i'll resist it! there we go.  I'll be a Xenophobe
 Er
 I don't think that word means what you think it means
 oh
 then i'll delete it. ha
 i recall something ugly with that word but i didn't wikipedia it
 [Edit] i'll resist it! there we go.  I'll be a ___________
 bye
 well it just says "Someone afraid of aliens." on duckduckgo
 [Edit] i'll resist it! there we go.  I'll be a xenophobe
 i put it back
 oh, wikipeda says something different :P
 the word seems fine
 yeah, it's fine
 oh wait
 it changed to a 'racist' haha
 it just means be afailt for something different or someone different
 [Edit] it just means be afraid for something different or someone different
 i'm married to an Asian so i'm absolved
 yeeeah, it's fine, we know you are a awesome good man! :D
 there is no good man
 but thanks for the pat on the back, buddy
 now make xenial happen on my OTA
 haha soon tm :D will ping u once magic happens
 give marketing at least a days notice puleeeeze
 @wayneoutthere, will do
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/jARzz0sV.png Ship it.
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/Iil7Groo.null
 @RoyOnUbuntu, please don't post random executables without context
 Hello, this is my app tryout including site.
 Ah.
 Sorry but it sended without a txt option
 That's alright. You can post it again
 But getting it in the store would be better
 Greetings and ok i understand now
 (Photo, 530x107) https://irc.ubports.com/SZlq6lHH.png Hi! Can someone help me? … I am trying to SSH into my Ubtouch (Nexus4) but always get "Connection refused".
 I am missing something?
 Well for one, you won't be able to ssh to root
 `phablet@`
 Have you run `android-gadget-service enable ssh` on the device?
 Have I to set a password for 'phablet', right?
 @UniversalSuperBox, Not yet. I will try it.
 @Gilmars, No, it's the one you use to log in.
 Unlock
 @UniversalSuperBox, ssh enabled and still getting "Connection refused". … I will reboot the phone.
 (Photo, 470x77) https://irc.ubports.com/N7LATLmz.png Well...  … Can't connect. haha
 You're 100% sure that that's the IP of the phone
 Yes.
 This is the Nexus 4 IP
 `sudo status ssh`
 😭
 @UniversalSuperBox, Already did it... ssh enable
 sudo status service ssh
 No, that'll show if the service is running
 You need an ssh key no?
 ps axu |grep ssh says that ssh is running
 @dohbee, I will try it.
 @dohbee, Yes, actually
 And `.ssh/` must be mode `700`, its contents `600`.
 You have to generate a key on your PC, and copy the pub key to phone, in `~/.ssh/authorized_keys`
 @UniversalSuperBox, I will check.
 @dohbee, Thanks