[00:02] <lyorian> wxl is  this because of the mailto urls that you are doing this or this just got more important
[00:02] <wxl> lyorian: you mean trojita?
[00:17] <lyorian> yes
[00:17] <wxl> lyorian: well, not having an email client at all is a Big Problem™ as far as i'm concerned but yes that inspired me to discover that :)
[00:25] <lyorian> yes
[00:29] <lyorian> I have wished trojita was packaged too
[00:29] <wxl> well i will grant that wish shortly :)
 @wxl [<wxl> well i will grant that wish shortly :)], Bonus points if you find an ITP if there is one, and if there isn't file one, but get it in Debian.
[00:30] <wxl> @tsimonq2: you'll probably need to help with the last bit
 I can
 First let's get it in Ubuntu
 Get it through a full review
[00:31] <wxl> yep
[00:31] <wxl> it's what i'll be working on mostly
 I'm willing to bet you won't get copyright on the first try. It's not your fault though, it's just really freaking horrid to do.
 @tsimonq2 [I'm willing to bet you won't get copyright on the first try. It's not your fault …], wait what?  Getting copyright?  what do you mean by this?
 @q5sys [wait what?  Getting copyright?  what do you mean by this?], debian/copyright needs to be a complete listing of all authors and all licenses for all files.
 ah, so getting a copyright listing for everyone.
 Right
 i was going to say... getting a copyright is actually really easy. you can file online and get one.
 It's a PITA and a waste of time
 @q5sys [i was going to say... getting a copyright is actually really easy. you can file …], its like 35$ a file, and you can file multiple things together in one 'work'.  I do a monthly filing for all my photography work.
 Ah heh
 @q5sys There's a legal way to ratify licenses on things?
 well... license != copyright
 a license depends on a copyright though.
 Right
 but you can copyright any code that you write if you really wanted to.  And it'd be registered with the federal gov as being owned by you. Once that is done you can then allow anyone to use it in any way you deem.  And there is no question as to who is the original owner.
 That's cool, where's the process?
 so as long as you license it so that original attribution is required... no one can claim it's their code.  they can still use it anyway they want, but they can't say "This is mine"
 they have to say "thsi is simons but he's letting me use it"
 Right
 I do multiple photo sessions a month, but I copyright them all togehter in one go per month to safe on cost.
 there's no reason to file 10 times amonth when I can do it all at once.
 and once the 'work' is copyrighted... all parts of it are as well.  so I dont have to do every individual photo.
 @q5sys [I do multiple photo sessions a month, but I copyright them all togehter in one g …], Ah, it's just a filing fee instead of a per item one?
 yup
 Can I do this online? :P
 yup
 :)
 Linky Linky? :)
 for text you'd just have to include all text.  And you can bundle together in a zip.
 so that's saved as a book mark on my photo editing computer back home. (I'm at the TN iX office this week)
 but a simple google search should find it.
 OK thanks
 its probably linked in the faq: https://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-register.html
 if you dont find what you need there... ping me next week and I"ll get you the exact link
 and btw... this puts your 'work' on file with the library of congress.  So there's no question about your ownership.
 What about for programs, which can change?
 programs are text
 so any new changes would have to be filed.  So you'd need to do things on an interval. say once every quarter or whatever
 Ah, got it.
 the best part is that if someone does steal it.  you dont have to prove ownership (like you typically would).  Since you've already proven that.  It goes straight to damages part of a suit.
 Hah, nice
 and since its registered... you dont have to prove value.  It goes straight to the $15,000-$150,000 range per violation.
 Huh
 if you dont register a work and want to sue for copyright infringement, you not only have to prove ownership, but prove damages... ie what you SHOULD have been compensated for the use of your material.
 depending on what it is... its 'worth' maybe $5.
 If you've registered the work, you dont have to prove value.
 the feds already deemits value at a min of $15k (or whatever the minimum is), and any potential damages the violater would have ot pay go up from there based on A) if they profited from it and B) how aggregious their use of the material was
 My full legal name is different from the name in the license, is that still fine?
 you can file under pseudonyms
 Ah
 so lets give an example.  Lets say you write a Qt dock program.  You copyright it and you then license it to be free to use by anyone as long as they name you as the author.
 I take your program change the copyright notice in the license to be my name and then I re-distribute it.   it doesnt matter what I do or dont do with the dock.  I've claimed copyright on something that is yours.
 you contact a copyright atty, and they then mail me and say "Simon owns the copyright on $program, $program is registered with the USCO to Simon.  You have violated copyright law.  You can pay simon $Y amount of money or we'll file a suit in federal court, where you will face fines of $Y*5.
 since you own the copyright and its registered with the library of congress. there is no debate in court on ownership or damages.  it goes straight to how much I have to pay you for violating you copyright.
 I know photographers that have won $50K from a company using a single photo without permission.
 Hah
 since you own the copyright... you have complete control over how your work gets used.
 wxl: ^ do we have anything valuable enough to copyright?
 copyright is what gives the GLP its weight
 derp... GPL
 Otherwise wxl once we have a Lubuntu Foundation we can just have that own the code
 you dont 'have' to register anyting.  by putting it online in a repo you can show ownership from that date forward.
 Oh really?
 registering gives you the benefit of not having to prove value and how much you were damaged by illegal use.
 Have you ever done that before?
 i dont want to have to deal with proving I own the copyright on something.  Becuase a good lawyer will make that drag on for a long time.   which means more money I'd have to spend on an attorney to fight my case.
 35$ is really cheap to get avoid months of attorney fees if I ever need it.
 Right, but have you ever done that with your code? How do I format it?
 ive actually never done it with my code.  But I have done it for other written materials.
 I can help you work through it when I'm back home and not busy with work.
 this week is kinda crazy
 Sure
 @wxl [<wxl> @TheWendyPower feel free to ping either one of us if you need help with th …], Thanks! I'm very new to it. I found some documentation. I'll get to playing with it.
[14:58] <wxl> @TheWendyPower the baked-in solution is kvm (i.e. it's in the kernel) but can be a little trickier to use. i suggest virtualbox/
 @wxl Thank!
[15:08] <wxl> @TheWendyPower the other hint I'll give you: make sure that your CPU support virtualization and that it's turned on in BIOS. that last bit is a really annoying problem if you failed to check it from the get go
 @wxl [<wxl> @TheWendyPower the baked-in solution is kvm (i.e. it's in the kernel) but …], Bah, virt-manager is the best :)
 wxl: Hey, wanna see something cool? Open LO Writer on the daily
 (Photo, 1280x792) https://i.imgur.com/ne84NnM.jpg KDE/Qt5 interface
[17:07] <wxl> whoa
 Looks freaking amazing, doesn't it @acheronuk?
 You could say it's Kool :P
[17:09] <wxl> um, i think *WE* say Qool
 Yeah, though that tabbed view is still experimental.
 The default looks nice as well.
 @tsimonq2 [<reply to image>], They misspelled Klone and Klear :P
[17:55] <wxl> @tsimonq2: bug 1788068 is getting weirder and weirder. Though you say the bug is known upstream, I still can't confirm it.... and apparently it requires removing SDDM to confirm. Maybe you should investigate how this upstream bug relates and link to the bug report?
 @wxl [<wxl> @tsimonq2: bug 1788068 is getting weirder and weirder. Though you say the …], SDDM is a red herring.
 I can bet that right now.
[18:09] <wxl> like i said, i can't reproduce it at all
 But I've only looked at how SDDM does XDG fun, so that's probably it.
[18:09] <wxl> i mean i didn't follow their reproduction instructions because wtf
 I'm willing to bet XDG is messed up.
 Thus putting in there upstream's bad panel.
 So try and repro it.
[18:10] <wxl> they say it works fine in other os lxqt's
 I don't know how other distros do XDG fun but the way we do it is specific to Ubuntu
 Anyway ttfn
 Class
[18:11] <wxl> well when you get back, let's try to figure this out
[18:11] <wxl> OH and they say it works with xubuntu fwiw
 @wxl [<wxl> OH and they say it works with xubuntu fwiw], Xubuntu uses lightdm
 wxl: Have them get all of their XDG vars when using SDDM, then again with stock LightDM
 If it's identical, then I'm confused. But it'll likely have our answer.
 wxl: After school I'll go through and document a spec for how exactly we do XDG settings because it's freaking weird and upstream LXQt sucks.
[19:09] <wxl> @tsimonq2: agaida said something about QSS
 @wxl [<wxl> @tsimonq2: agaida said something about QSS], I'm still betting on settings.
 wxl: Passing idea, shoot it down if you don't like it. GCal/Nextcloud/whatever integration with worldclock's calendar?
 (for events)
 I'm trying to change file asociation in "Preferences -> LXQt configuration -> File asociation" but it didn't work, still jpg and png are open with firefox. However, if a change it with left mouse over file open with, it wokrs
 *works
 Is there something I'm missing?
[20:13] <lyorian> @hmollerCI have you logged out and logged back in again or restarted pcmanfm stuff
[20:13] <wxl> @tsimonq2: i'll see if we can't figure out the settings thing.
[20:14] <wxl> @tsimonq2: re calendar sure. i don't care *that* much but it wouldn't be bad
[20:14] <wxl> @tsimonq2: as an option it would be good
 @lyorian [<lyorian> @hmollerCI have you logged out and logged back in again or restarted p …], There was a "reinicializar" (restart maybe in english) that "apply" teh changes. I think that at least "reinicializar" is not the correct word, better "aplicar" (apply). What says in english?
[20:19] <lyorian> yeah sometimes things don't change like I think lxqt-panel need to be restarted for things to change
[20:20] <lyorian> no the apply changes is the English word that is not what I asked 
 (Photo, 614x523) https://i.imgur.com/n7BPyMk.jpg
[20:21] <lyorian> I meant go to the panel leave and then hit logoout and log back in from sddm
 I think that "reinicilizar" is not the correct word
 That's confusing
[20:22] <lyorian> that could be a translation bug as well
 What says in english?
[20:22] <lyorian> apply
 That's ok
[20:22] <lyorian> oops
[20:22] <lyorian> it says reset
[20:22] <lyorian> so that might be the right word
 translation is ok, but, the word not.
 I mean, I take reset as "revert"
[20:24] <lyorian> I honestly think apply would be a better word
 Who should we ask for a change?
[20:25] <lyorian> honestly upstream
[20:26] <lyorian> deltas from upstream for single word changes are not looked kindly upon
[20:26] <lyorian> oops I think that might be a reset button though I have not used that in a while sorry
 right, that' a reset
 my mistake
 "Restaurar" can fit that
[20:28] <lyorian> the change button is off towards the right side
 "Close"??
[20:29] <lyorian> oops looking at the wrong program derp
[20:29] <lyorian> ignore all I said
[20:31] <lyorian> oh wow how I have not seen that before derp
 but I think that regional settings is ok
 It does what is says
 is file asociation my problem
[20:32] <lyorian> oh you need to log in and out and then it says save or cancel
[20:32] <lyorian> once you close
 @lyorian [<lyorian> once you close], yes
 for regional settings
 but for file asociations is strange
 but it says what it does
 is the change that's tricke
 tricky
 changing with left mouse over a file works inmediatly, changing in "Preferences -> LXQt configuration -> File asociation" might take a log off/log on or pcmanfm-qt restart
[20:43] <wxl> huh
[20:43] <wxl> i can't get it to work at all
[20:44] <wxl> with file association, that is
[20:47] <wxl> oh hm
[20:47] <wxl> maybe i'm wrong
[20:47] <wxl> yep i'm wrnog
[20:47] <wxl> works immediately
[20:48] <wxl> it didn't work for me before because i was testing from w3m and grabbing a png off the internets. probably using xdg-open thus alternatives, thus problems
[20:50] <wxl> or something
[20:50] <wxl>  :O
[20:52] <wxl> @tsimonq2: is there a reason we have both nomacs and lximage-qt?
[20:52] <wxl> so i can do the following:
[20:53] <wxl> TEST A: 1. open falkon to some png to download e.g. https://m.media-amazon.com/images/S/aplus-media/vc/7855224f-a391-4e66-b97a-dde7f795c649._CR188,0,1125,1500_PT0_SX300__.jpg and click download 2. open it rather than save it 3. it opens in what's defined in file associations 4. leave falkon open, change the file association 5. re-download the file -> opens in the right app
 @wxl [<wxl> :O], mm, now it works to me too, maybe I had another fie opne.
[20:53] <wxl> uhhh
[20:53] <wxl> darn wrong link
[20:54] <wxl> tl;dr i used the png png on the wikipedia page for png :)
[20:54] <wxl> TEST B is the same thing except use pcmanfm instead of falkon.. point being is that you can change associations while an app is open and it takes effect immediately
 mm, now it works for me too.
[20:58] <wxl> good
 sorry if it is off-topic but I think is important information
 https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/call-for-testing-ubuntu-with-nvidia-graphic-cards/7774
 wxl: Well, that was a disagreement I had with gilir. I think we should ship lximage-qt but he thought nomacs was more featureful.
 I also really think we need to switch out MPlayer or whatever for VLC.
[21:07] <wxl> jfdi
 How's Trojita?
[21:07] <wxl> still working on it
 @wxl [<wxl> still working on it], Is it in Git yet? :)
 wxl: Also, will you kill me if I try and take a shot at reworking our slideshow? :P We'd just need screenshots from artwork (CC @VikingRedwolf @TheWendyPower) but the problem with it now is it doesn't scale well.
 So maybe dedicate the left 30% to text with a professional background and the right 70% to the screenshot.
[21:10] <tsimonq2> k hai, I'm home.
[21:10] <wxl> @tsimonq2: no it's not in git yet. soon
[21:11] <wxl> i'll do that first thing tonight. i'll add a README with what's been done so far and TODOs and such
[21:14] <tsimonq2> wxl: The couple of things I want to poke at tonight are 1) Talking with upstream and seeing if we can have worldclock default to the time format for the locale and then let the user customize it from there (I might do that in the form of a PR) 2) Do upstream bug reports and discussions on how exactly to implement the calendar thing 3) Switch out those applications 4) Retest LVM with the new 
[21:14] <tsimonq2> release of Cala which has migrated (it completely redid all of that for the better) 5) Revert the casper change for the live instance on only systems with SDDM until we can hunt down that bug report.
[21:14] <tsimonq2> Anything you want to push to the top of that list that's urgent?
[21:14] <tsimonq2> And oh yeah, I'm going to write that spec on how we do XDG.
[21:15] <wxl> here's another weird thing: file-association has libreoffice set to open text files but file properties in pcmanfm-qt wants to open with vim and guess what.. vim wins https://share.riseup.net/#-8qzHMC_WXJZVOtANZiV6Q
[21:15] <wxl> same with desktop files but there's no association https://share.riseup.net/#QulrfvpceAJgU4XXj0yE0Q
[21:16] <tsimonq2> Interesting.
[21:16] <tsimonq2> Wanna chase that by yourself or you want a hand?
[21:16] <wxl> you have any ideas?
[21:17] <tsimonq2> I'd first see where the heck pcmanfm-qt gets that.
[21:17] <wxl> k
[21:17] <tsimonq2> Otherwise not particularly, I'd have to dive into it more.
[21:22] <wxl> you know what's bugging me? i *HATE* our icon for desktop. it's blue, so it makes me think it's the file manager
[21:23] <tsimonq2> ahahahahahahaha
[21:23] <wxl> i actually really like the other icon for the file manager but when you have a file manager window open, it actually shows a blue folder instead
[21:23] <wxl> it's freaking maddening
[21:23] <tsimonq2> Bug Papirus upstream.
[21:45] <tsimonq2> wxl: https://phab.lubuntu.me/w/xdg-implementation/
[21:46] <wxl> @tsimonq2: so if i did /usr/share/xsessions/foo.desktop, i'd do /etc/xdg/xdg-foo/ ?
[21:46] <tsimonq2> wxl: Right.
[22:03] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rSEED5ef782259f8b: Ship VLC instead of SMPlayer, LXImage-Qt instead of Nomacs, and only ship the…] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rSEED5ef782259f8b
[22:33] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rLUBUNTUMETAPACKAGING5b0336a8ed3c: Another metapackage update.] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rLUBUNTUMETAPACKAGING5b0336a8ed3c
[22:33] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rLUBUNTUMETAPACKAGINGc125d31cd3df: Ignore debian/files.] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rLUBUNTUMETAPACKAGINGc125d31cd3df
[22:38] <lyorian> while all this mimetype stuff is something needed for lubuntu default settings to set the default pdf viewer to qpdfview not libreoffice draw
[22:41] <wxl> lyorian: you want to add a task to phab where we can collect this stuff?
[22:49] <lyorian> ok
[23:09] <lyorian> huh wierd it does not do this on the stock vm I just dist upgraded
[23:13] <lyorian> things that are not reproduceable :(
[23:14] <wxl> yeahhhhhh
[23:14] <wxl> well it is development
[23:14] <wxl> things are changing!