[13:55] <alkisg> KitsuWhooa: do you have any hypothesis on which generations this affects? I'm thinking of disabling pageflip in all of nvidias, but maybe there are some generations unaffected?
[13:58] <KitsuWhooa> alkisg: no idea unfortunately. I tested mx200, mx400, mx440, fx5XXX and they all had the same issue 
[13:58] <alkisg> Thanks; I'll try to test with some newer one if I can find
[13:58] <KitsuWhooa> My guess is all of them that don't use dri3/glamor
[13:58] <alkisg> Ah
[13:59] <KitsuWhooa> I think I have a pcie one somewhere, but I can't test at the moment 
[13:59] <alkisg> That that makes more sense, if all were affected, more people would have noticed
[14:00] <KitsuWhooa> I wonder if it's an exa issue 
[14:00] <KitsuWhooa> NoAccel would've fixed it though if that was the case 
[14:00] <KitsuWhooa> Also, alkisg, is there any way to not get X to replace its log file on segfault? 
[14:01] <KitsuWhooa> In ltsp
[14:01] <KitsuWhooa> And how would I go about stopping whatever starts x automatically 
[14:02] <KitsuWhooa> I was hoping it'd be lightdm but it's not 
[14:02] <alkisg> LTSP is using LDM, our own display manager,
[14:02] <KitsuWhooa> Couldn't find any ldm services 
[14:02] <alkisg> to go to text mode by default, try SCREEN_07=shell, with no other screens active,
[14:03] <alkisg> ltsp supports many xorg/screens, so it has its own management service, ltsp-client-core, you don't need that, just disable the ldm screen
[14:04] <alkisg> So, SCREEN_07=shell, then run xinit, then mate-session, then check xorg.log
[14:04] <KitsuWhooa> Alright, I'll do that later. Thanks 
[14:04] <alkisg> np, thank you too
[14:04] <alkisg> Btw, ldm doesn't have this problem, I don't know if it's because it's not using double buffering?
[14:05] <alkisg> Or maybe it's using wwm, and this isn't using compositing...
[14:05] <KitsuWhooa> Yeah, I noticed that 
[14:05] <KitsuWhooa> Probably because it doesn't do any compositing, yeah 
[14:05] <alkisg> I wonder if other flavors do have that issue... I'm guessing gnome and kde, but not lxde...
[14:07] <KitsuWhooa> A bit unrelated, but since I don't have a riva tnt2, would you be able to install the X/nouveau debug symbols (assuming Ubuntu has them), run X under gdb and get a full backtrace? (bt full)
[14:07] <KitsuWhooa> That might be a bit easier to track down and fix 
[14:08] <KitsuWhooa> Assuming it worked originally with the same driver 
[14:08] <KitsuWhooa> I kinda doubt gnome and kde would be fast enough on such old cards 
[14:08] <KitsuWhooa> Or even support compositing. These cards are OpenGL 1.X IIRC
[14:13] <alkisg> KitsuWhooa: I think it's the same issue that's causing tnt2 to follow some code path that segfaults, and if that original issue is solved, tnt2 won't segfault either,
[14:13] <alkisg> and I'm not very accustomed to gdb, and the schools just started and have a lot of needs, so it'll take me a while...
[14:14] <alkisg> I'm thinking of pushing a workaround for now, and revisit this later when things settle down, e.g. in a month or so
[14:14] <KitsuWhooa> That could also work, yeah 
[14:14] <KitsuWhooa> I wonder if I can find one of those cards locally. Or maybe I have one and don't know it 
[14:15] <alkisg> If you think you can fix this, then maybe I can set up a pc here for that, and give you remote root access?
[14:15] <KitsuWhooa> I can't promise anything but I can try 
[14:16] <alkisg> Great. Will do this within the week, maybe wednesday.
[14:16]  * alkisg is having some python2to3 related issues to solve atm, more urgent... :/
[14:17] <KitsuWhooa> If X crashes after the login screen, I might need vnc too 
[14:18] <alkisg> epoptes-client --connect ip-of-kitsuwhooa => gives both console and vnc :D
[14:18] <KitsuWhooa> Somehow python2 is still being used 
[14:18] <KitsuWhooa> Here's to hoping it eventually gets dropped from enterprise too 
[14:18] <KitsuWhooa> Excellent. I assume I need to install epoptes on my desktop, but that's not an issue 
[14:19] <alkisg> Or just xvnc4viewer -listen; or I can give you ssh; or vnc, really not an  issue for me, I have public ips etc
[14:20] <alkisg> There's also this trick: ssh client; export $(/usr/share/epoptes-client/get-display) => sets up xauthority and display so that you have access to xorg
[14:20] <alkisg> We'll find many ways, np there
[14:20] <KitsuWhooa> I'm asking so that I can have my end set up by then, but good to hear 
[14:21] <alkisg> If you happen to have a public IP or port forward etc, then setting up epoptes is much more effective
[14:21] <KitsuWhooa> I do, yeah 
[14:21] <alkisg> Great, let's do it this way then
[14:21] <KitsuWhooa> Alright, I'll look up the docs later
[14:21] <alkisg> apt install epoptes should be enough
[14:22] <KitsuWhooa> I was thinking port-wise
[14:22] <alkisg> Port 789
[14:22] <KitsuWhooa> Alright 
[14:23] <alkisg> And I think 5500 for vnc
[14:23] <alkisg> I can "send you" a vm if you want a quick test, when you're ready
[14:24] <KitsuWhooa> I'll probably be in a few hours 
[14:24] <alkisg> ok
[14:24] <KitsuWhooa> I'll highlight you and we can go from there 
[14:24] <alkisg> Great
[14:42]  * alkisg guesses that one way to check for an nvidia card would be: if [ -d /sys/module/nouvaue ]; then X_OPTION_01=...pageflip off...
[14:42] <alkisg> *without the typo, of course...
[14:53] <alkisg> Whoops, no, it's too early at the point when init-ltsp.d runs, the module isn't yet loaded :(
[14:54] <KitsuWhooa> Newer cards that use nouveau would also be picked up by that 
[14:54] <KitsuWhooa> My suggestion would be to make a blacklist with pci dev ids
[14:59] <alkisg> You said something that I understood like "only dri2 cards affected"; do you think that might also affect non nvidia cards that use dri2 instead of 3? Are any of these common for me to check with? I do have lots of cards...
[15:01] <alkisg> (correction, lots and lots of *old* cards :D)
[15:04] <alkisg> Looking at the pci-ids from https://envytools.readthedocs.io/en/latest/hw/pciid.html, it looks like a lot of work to blacklist the correct ones
[15:05] <alkisg> Using ranges wouldn't be easy either as they have non-graphics cards in that pci ids space as well...
[17:15] <KitsuWhooa> alkisg: I seem to have epoptes set up
 You said something that I understood like "only dri2 cards affected"; do you think that might also affect non nvidia cards that use dri2 instead of 3? Are any of these common for me to check with? I do have lots of cards... <-- I'm not sure, we'd need to see what nouveau does
[17:20] <alkisg> KitsuWhooa: if you want a test, pm me your ip...
[17:21] <alkisg> (to connect a vm to you via epoptes-client)
[17:21] <KitsuWhooa> done