[00:00] <EriC^^> badr_: "update-initramfs -c -k all"
[00:00] <IniGit> !screenshots
[00:00] <badr_> cat: /proc/cmdline: No such file or directory
[00:01] <IniGit> !pastebinit
[00:01] <IniGit> !pastebin
[00:03] <EriC^^> IniGit: what's the rsync stuff exactly?
[00:04] <IniGit> EriC^^: Something like that: sudo rsync -aEhhHv --delete --stats --progress <mount-point> <mount-point>
[00:04] <IniGit> but I haven't finished that part
[00:04] <EriC^^> IniGit: i can't think of anything else that might be causing that except if something is using the drive, but you said after putting sleep it worked, there's a slight chance that it was a coincidence, like the times you had sleep in you weren't doing "cd /mountpoint" in another terminal or something, just a theory
[00:05] <IniGit> EriC^^: The following also sometimes reports the drive is busy error: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/HrqrFY37cV/
[00:06] <IniGit> umount: /mnt/gernot/DevLinuxBackup: target is busy.
[00:07] <EriC^^> IniGit: ok, type "lsof +D /mnt/gernot/DevLinuxBackup"
[00:08] <EriC^^> badr_: type "ls /proc" in the chroot, does it list stuff?
[00:09] <badr_> bin    home	       lib32	   null		    root  sys	   vmlinuz.old boot   initrd.img      lib64	   opt		    run   tmp cdrom  initrd.img.old  lost+found  proc		    sbin  usr dev    install.txt     media	   RemoteMouse.exe  snap  var etc    lib	       mnt	   rm.svg	    srv   vmlinuz
[00:10] <IniGit> lsof: WARNING: can't stat() fuse.gvfsd-fuse file system /run/user/1000/gvfs
[00:10] <IniGit>       Output information may be incomplete.
[00:10] <IniGit> that is all I get from that command
[00:11] <EriC^^> badr_:  something isn't right, open another terminal and type "ls /proc"
[00:11] <IniGit> I assume that mount returns a success and that something then happens after mount and that you cannot instantly unmount until that thing is done
[00:11] <jmc> IniGit: Do you try change directory before try umont?
[00:11] <EriC^^> badr_: dont paste the output here cause the bot will temporarily quiet you
[00:11] <IniGit> jmc: What you mean? Why should I do that?
[00:12] <badr_> ok
[00:12] <EriC^^> IniGit: if you "cd /mnt/....linuxbackup" in any terminal it wont umount
[00:12] <badr_> i paste to you private?
[00:13] <EriC^^> IniGit: make sure no terminals have that as current dir, and also in your script you're not cd'ing there at any point as jmc suggested
[00:13] <EriC^^> badr_: no, use http://paste.ubuntu.com
[00:14] <IniGit> EriC^^: No I have no temrinal open that has that directory open
[00:14] <EriC^^> IniGit: try "sudo lsof /mnt/gernot/DevLinuxBackup"
[00:14] <badr_> okay
[00:15] <IniGit> I always get this warning and nothing else form the lsof command:
[00:15] <IniGit> lsof: WARNING: can't stat() fuse.gvfsd-fuse file system /run/user/1000/gvfs
[00:15] <IniGit>       Output information may be incomplete.
[00:15] <jmc> IniGit: do you using sudo umount....?
[00:15] <IniGit> yes
[00:16] <badr_> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/rByFr44Mzw/
[00:17] <EriC^^> badr_: ok, type "exit" then type again "ls /proc"
[00:18] <EriC^^> badr_: i think there must have been a typo in the "for command" earlier
[00:18] <IniGit> It's also hard to reproduce the error now
[00:18] <pragmaticenigma> IniGit: Your topic might be better handled in a channel dedicated to bash scripting. As far as umount right after mount. Mounting a device takes time. Unless specified bash doesn't wait for the previous command to finish.
[00:20] <EriC^^> i thought bash would run commands sequentially after each is done if "&" wasn't used
[00:20] <EriC^^> something; somethingelse , somethingelse only runs after something finishes, it makes sense, cause echo $? will always exist
[00:20] <EriC^^> i think you're wrong there pragmaticenigma
[00:20] <badr_> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/b2SXhBMkcg/ :she give me that
[00:21] <IniGit> It really seems that I get the error only after the device is idle for a while
[00:22] <EriC^^> IniGit: i'd ask in #bash as pragmaticenigma suggested
[00:22] <IniGit> Sometimes when you access a device that was idle it takes longer
[00:22] <pragmaticenigma> EriC^^: It executes sequentially, it doesn't not necessarily wait for each command to finish before execution of the next
[00:22] <IniGit> ok
[00:22] <IniGit> oh
[00:22] <IniGit> then this is the answer
[00:22] <EriC^^> pragmaticenigma: but then how does sleep something; something else work
[00:23] <pragmaticenigma> ugh... sorry for that "doesn't not" should be "does not" (it's been a long day)
[00:24] <pragmaticenigma> EriC^^: A topic for another channel
[00:24] <EriC^^> indeed it is :)
[00:24] <EriC^^> https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/184502/bash-how-to-run-a-command-after-the-previous-finished
[00:25] <EriC^^> it does wait for them to finish
[00:25] <pragmaticenigma> I think in this case, mount hands back focus leaving the kernel to finish the rest of the mount request
[00:27] <EriC^^> the program has to give an exit code though to bash
[00:29] <EriC^^> badr_: type "sudo umount -R /mnt"
[00:29] <pragmaticenigma> EriC^^: that's what I was trying to say. "mount" tells the system, here do this. "mount" executes in userspace, and tells kernelspace to do something. Once mount tells kernelspace to do something, it assumes it completed and exits
[00:29] <IniGit> it can happen because something is accessing it
[00:29] <IniGit> ask your OS channel how to find out what ;)
[00:29] <IniGit> :D
[00:29] <EriC^^> pragmaticenigma: but how does it know if it succeeded to mount or no? does it get the success from that after its been mounted, then pass that back to bash as a return 0
[00:30] <pragmaticenigma> EriC^^: Because it may only care that kernelspace accepted the command as it was provided it
[00:31] <badr_> EriC^^:https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/g34dj4PCRp/
[00:31] <badr_> give me that
[00:31] <EriC^^> pragmaticenigma: it's a possibility i guess
[00:33] <EriC^^> it's starting to make more sense once i factor in the idle drive stuff, anyways curious to know for sure what it is
[00:34] <EriC^^> badr_: type "mount" and paste the results
[00:34] <pragmaticenigma> My theory is this. Mount takes very little time to actually mount the device. As IniGit mentioned, it is likely other processes are triggered after the mount takes place to interrorgate the device, thus having a lock on the resource. Adding a sleep command appears to delay the process long enough that the system is done with the new device and has released its locks
[00:35] <IniGit> pragmaticenigma: There may be no better solution then sleep then
[00:35] <IniGit> pragmaticenigma: I mean no fast solution ^^
[00:36] <pragmaticenigma> IniGit: I assume once you finish out your script it may become a non-issue
[00:37] <badr_> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/JYHxd6Rzfj/
[00:39] <IniGit> pragmaticenigma: why?
[00:39] <IniGit> I mean the worst thing is that it does no rsync
[00:39] <IniGit> I think
[00:39] <EriC^^> badr_: can you type "history | grep proc" and paste the output?
[00:40] <pragmaticenigma> IniGit: what do you mean no rsync?
[00:41] <IniGit> pragmaticenigma: I mean when it says it is busy --- idk what happens then?
[00:41] <badr_> EriC^^:https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/thQtwPvhGN/
[00:41] <IniGit> thinking error that busy stuff may only matter for unmount
[00:42] <IniGit> ok that means the worst case is that it does not unmount
[00:43] <pragmaticenigma> IniGit: rsync is a program, are you thinking about a device sync?
[00:44] <IniGit> pragmaticenigma: yes, but I do not want to copy everything everytime only changes
[00:44] <IniGit> and no incremental backups or so
[00:44] <IniGit> just mirror
[00:45] <EriC^^> badr_: seems there's a typo
[00:46] <EriC^^> badr_: i'm not sure why there are files in /mnt/proc right now, since it's supposed to be empty, but anyways, type "sudo mount -B /proc /mnt/proc"
[00:46] <badr_> EriC^^:where?
[00:46] <EriC^^> then type "sudo mount -B /sys /mnt/sys"
[00:46] <pragmaticenigma> IniGit: There are whole host of tools already designed to do that, why re-invent the wheel
[00:47] <EriC^^> badr_: the typo it's supposed to be the whole line, "for i in /dev /proc /sys; do sudo mount -R /mnt /mnt$i; done" with the stuff after the first ";" too, but nevermind we can do them individually
[00:48] <IniGit> pragmaticenigma: it should be simple
[00:48] <IniGit> my script is simple
[00:48] <pragmaticenigma> IniGit: If it were me, I would setup your rsync script to run on a schedule, having the script check if the device is mounted and only performing the rsync if the device is found. Auto mounting on a schedule isn't something I'd personally recommend as you never can be certain if the device is in use
[00:48] <IniGit> complexity in backups is the worst
[00:49] <badr_> EriC^^:https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/5sj3wtJW3g/
[00:49] <pragmaticenigma> IniGit: also you're more likely to have data corruption with auto mounting and unmounting a device
[00:49] <SuperLag> If you want a more current Python than what comes with the distro stock, what is the safest way to do that?
[00:49] <IniGit> I have ensured that the device is not mounted at startup and that it will not appear in Nautilus
[00:49] <pragmaticenigma> !latest | SuperLag
[00:50] <EriC^^> badr_: ok, type now "sudo chroot /mnt"
[00:50] <IniGit> pragmaticenigma: I just have to make the script more robust
[00:50] <EriC^^> then type "update-initramfs -c -k all"
[00:50] <IniGit> I'm working on it
[00:51] <pragmaticenigma> IniGit: The problem is, more robust means more complex, allowing for more things to go wrong. Simplify your script, leave the mounting and unmount as user triggered. Let your backup be the only thing scheduled with a check for the mount being available
[00:52] <pragmaticenigma> IniGit: There are so many flags to pay attention to for what you are doing. I don't believe you have even begun to scratch the surface.
[00:52] <OerHeks> SuperLag, the most less obscure ppa for python deadsnakes could bring in 3.7.2-1
[00:52] <OerHeks> !info python3 bionic
[00:52] <pragmaticenigma> !info python3 cosmic
[00:52] <OerHeks> https://launchpad.net/~deadsnakes/+archive/ubuntu/ppa
[00:53] <badr_> EriC^^:this is the result https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/BXbwWRqnwN/
[00:54] <OerHeks> https://docs.python.org/3.7/whatsnew/3.7.html
[00:55] <EriC^^> badr_: hmm, this is odd
[00:55] <EriC^^> badr_: type "exit" then type "ls /proc; ls /proc/mnt"
[00:56] <EriC^^> seems like it's not mounting /proc in /proc/mnt
[00:57] <EriC^^> badr_: actually, you can reboot into the OS using an older ubuntu kernel that has the initramfs still
[00:57] <badr_> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/WFnkkDkNy3/
[00:58] <EriC^^> badr_: when you go to grub, press on advanced > 4.15.0-39-generic
[00:58] <EriC^^> boot that kernel it should boot without a problem
[00:58] <EriC^^> then we can fix it from the install without chrooting
[00:59] <badr_> EriC^^:ubuntu 16.04?
[00:59] <EriC^^> yes
[01:00] <IniGit> thank you all. I'm out for today. cu
[01:02] <badr_> ok i go to download him and try again
[01:03] <EriC^^> badr_: no i mean
[01:04] <EriC^^> badr_: the ubuntu you have installed right now, go to grub as usual
[01:04] <EriC^^> then press on advanced options  then choose the ubuntu with initrd.img-4.15.0-39-generic  next to it
[01:05] <SuperLag> OerHeks: thank you
[01:06] <badr_> how i do that
[01:08] <FastZ> Anyone in here have experience using etckeeper?
[01:10] <FastZ> I was setting up a new ubuntu server at work today and saw etckeeper mentioned at the end of the ubuntu server guide online and thought it was interesting. have never used it though and was curious what anyone's experiences with it were like.
[01:10] <OerHeks> https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/serverguide/etckeeper.html.en
[01:10] <OerHeks> etckeeper manages /etc be stored in a git, mercurial, bazaar, or darcs rep
[01:11] <FastZ> Yeah, I read about what it does and how it works already. Have you ever used it before, OerHeks?
[01:12] <OerHeks> i have not used this myself, it is more a tool for devel ?
[01:13] <FastZ> it seems to be a version control solution for the /etc directory. I admit I haven't been able to do too much more reading on it past basic setup intructions.
[01:14] <FastZ> maybe it is more useful for dev systems.
[01:14] <FastZ> i was thinking it could be useful to resolving problems caused by other admins making changes to /etc contents that result in something breaking
[01:23] <tomreyn> FastZ: etckeeper is pretty useful, not only for collective sysadmin, also if you forget things yourself.
[01:23] <pragmaticenigma> FastZ: It's a tool used by many, in many cases it help speed up the process of configuring multiple machines to a standard set of options. Please understand that if you would like to discuss tools and features of Ubuntu, #ubuntu-discuss is a much better place to hold such conversations.
[01:24] <tomreyn> it doesn't help if you break the system entirely, though, and it is not a replacment for intrusion detection software  (if you want such)
[01:25] <FastZ> right on, and thanks pragmaticenigma.
[01:26] <FastZ> putting that channel on my autojoins
[01:38] <EriC^^> badr_: hold shift when the pc boots you should get grub
[01:46] <devslash> hi
[02:19] <pragmaticenigma> Hello devslash ... do you have a support question?
[02:34] <Wonny> why does my ubuntu start with the screen rotated 90 degrees?
[02:35] <OerHeks> yes, please tell us, how did you do that?
[02:50] <epicmetal> Wonny: I've seen that, too. Not sure of the cause, I'm guessing driver issues.
[03:17] <conjo> hello all
[03:18] <conjo> can anyone tell me if there is a fightcade irc channel anywhere in the wildiness (linux based questions) thank you in advance
[03:19] <conjo> or alternatice platform re support chat etc
[03:19] <Bashing-om> !alis | conjo
[03:21] <conjo> thank you very much
[03:21] <conjo> are you aware of a noob friendly guide for use
[03:23] <OerHeks> changing your name on #freenode might help
[03:23] <conjo> why
[03:24] <conjo> its my nickname
[03:24] <conjo> (conyo right)
[03:27] <conjo> im trying to install fightcade with the following script and am encountered this error "wine 0352j?
[03:29] <conjo> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXb3EKWsInQ
[03:30] <nebuless> is it possible to install hardware drivers on a portable/bootable Ubuntu on a USB flash drive?
[03:34] <Bashing-om> !wine | conjo
[03:35] <conjo> https://pastebin.com/s7YFxjAb
[03:35] <tomreyn> nebuless: generally, yes, there is no difference in whether oyu install ubuntu to an installed or removable drive.
[03:36] <conjo> Bashing-om, thanks i have run sudo apt-get install wine. ... stable
[03:36] <nebuless> tomreyn, is there a way to go past the 6gb limit?
[03:37] <tomreyn> nebuless: i don't know this limit, what do you mean?
[03:37] <conjo> but in the .sh install script (posted link to script just now) i think there is a reference to wine without specifying version or stable/beta
[03:38] <nebuless> Ubuntu itself claims it needs 2 GB of storage on the USB drive, and you’ll also need extra space for the persistent storage. So, if you have a 4 GB USB drive, you can only have 2 GB of persistent storage. To have the maximum amount of persistent storage, you’ll need a USB drive of at least 6 GB in size.
[03:38] <conjo> i think i can fix the script by editing and inscluding a version number and the word stable but would like to get advice as to whether i am on right track
[03:38] <tomreyn> nebuless: oh, you're referring to a usb live / install system with persistence. i'm referring to an actuall installation to a usb attached storage.
[03:38] <conjo> please have a look at my pastebin for the install script
[03:39] <tomreyn> nebuless: is there a reason why you wouldn't want a full installation?
[03:39] <nebuless> oh, i meant just a portable ubuntu OS with my files on it on a USB flash
[03:39] <nebuless> i wish i could afford a dedicated machine but i only have one, need windows for work, and it's way too slow for virtualbox
[03:40] <tomreyn> nebuless: both variants are portable.
[03:40] <conjo> Bashing-om, please help your nick gives the impression you are able to answer (im a noob re linux and bash
[03:41] <Bashing-om> conjo: I have no wine experience .. best help is in the #winehq channel :(
[03:41] <conjo> Bashing-om, the line im refering to is near the top of the doc (ubuntu install
[03:41] <nebuless> what's the difference between an actual installation to a usb attached storage and a live install on a usb flash drive? I thought usb flash drives behaved the same as usb attached storage
[03:42] <tomreyn> nebuless: if you have more storage available on the storage windows is installed on you could also dual boot. flash storage (USB key) is not very long lived / reliable.
[03:42] <nebuless> i can't repartition right now
[03:43] <tomreyn> nebuless: the ubuntu installer can do the repartitioning for you.
[03:43] <nebuless> thanks for the help tomreyn
[03:43] <nebuless> g2g
[03:43] <tomreyn> good luck!
[03:43] <conjo> nebuless, i suppose one will just run from the usb and the later will install to a usb pluged into the pc but not the one the iso is on
[03:44] <tomreyn> !persistent | nebuless
[03:49] <tomreyn> nebuless: this is how i'd do it https://askubuntu.com/questions/16988/#54388
[03:54] <nebuless> tomreyn so i if i burn the install .iso that's also a LIVE (not persistent) Ubuntu that i can carry around?
[03:54] <tomreyn> nebuless: wait, aren't you gone? ;-)
[03:54] <nebuless> lol someone was at the door :)
[03:55] <nebuless> but the install .iso that everyone uses to install ubuntu also doubles as a live cd (forgetful live)
[03:55] <nebuless> ?
[03:55] <nebuless> i'm going to use rufus and go with your dual-boot suggestion
[03:55] <nebuless> fingers crossed
[03:56] <tomreyn> nebuless: by default the live / install iso does not have persistence. there are utilities to create a live / install usb drive which does have persistence. but you can also do a full ubuntu installation to a usb connected storage and thus gain the most flexibility (incl. persistence).
[03:58] <tomreyn> the best thing to do is to invest 50 usd and buy a small ssd and install it in your computer or connect it via usb 3.0+, and install ubuntu on that, though.
[04:01] <nebuless> my laptop only has space enough for one hard drive at a time
[04:01] <nebuless> is dual boot better on separate drives?
[04:01] <tomreyn> does it have an optical drive?
[04:01] <nebuless> no :(
[04:01] <klaminite> i believe the pendrive installer suite allows you to set persistence
[04:01] <tomreyn> dual boot is less painful on two drives. but it's not a requirement, no.
[04:02] <klaminite> Also if you have a dedicated hard drive for each operating system (if thats what you're asking) then yes, you have to edit grub iirc
[04:03] <tomreyn> nebuless: you can get a portable ssd which you connect via usb, but it shoiuld be usb 3 at least or it'll be slow.
[04:14] <oceanquake> Hi all.  I'm trying to build an initramfs for a system with some luks volumes listed in crypttab.  The key files that crypttab refers to are in fact on an encypted rootfs.  Yet, I get the warning: "cryptsetup: WARNING: <vol>'s keyfile <keyfilename> is not on an encrypted root FS, skipped."  What check is getting tripped here?  I am trying to perform this initramfs setup while chrooted prior to rebooting into a new installation.
[04:15] <oceanquake> Suggestions on how to tell cryptsetup, "yes, in fact these key volumes are on an encrypted root fs"?
[04:15] <oceanquake> key files rather
[04:27] <tomreyn> oceanquake: there used to be this https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=842951 - which ubuntu version are you running there?
[04:27] <kinghat> what is going on here? i have to post an image because i cant copy the text. this is in VBox and it does the same thing with ubuntu desktop in VM: https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/b4aw4k3N/image.png
[04:29] <tomreyn> kinghat: what you are looking at there is the video output of a VM, showing a terminal. you don't copy + paste from a video output.
[04:29] <kinghat> heh i mean i get those odd conditions when updating.
[04:30] <kinghat> then run udpate again, then upgrade and everything seems fine. until there are more updates.
[04:30] <tomreyn> kinghat: use a virtual serial console or install ssh and connect through that if you want to copy and paste. or make sure the VM has internet connection and use !pastebinit
[04:31] <tomreyn> you are not the only one installing updates on this system, that's going on.
[04:31] <rdj22222> I upgrade to 18.04, and now I seem to be a bit screwed. I was able to boot a couple of times through recovery mode, but now I can't even get into the grub menu. I just get in a restart cycle
[04:32] <tomreyn> kinghat: also the info on available / pending updates in the motd is not always current.
[04:33] <tomreyn> rdj22222: did the installation report any errors?
[04:34] <tomreyn> rdj22222: which changes did you make between when when you were able to get to recovery and now where you can't even get to grub? how old is the storage, has it previously has data loss?
[04:35] <kinghat> i was wondering more about the errors
[04:35] <oceanquake> tomreyn: I just found that, thanks!  I'm running 18.04 (KDE neon).
[04:36] <tomreyn> oceanquake: hmm i'd expect this to be fixed in the cryptsetup which comes with 18.04, though. but this is all i could find.
[04:37] <oceanquake> tomreyn: I was able to find the conf file he mentioned with KEYFILE_PATTERNS and when I altered that, it seemed to work
[04:37] <rdj22222> tomreyn: it didn't report any errors. the only problem I had installing was that I didn't have enough space, so I had to purge whatever I could to get the necessary 4gb
[04:38] <rdj22222> I thought the problem might be that it's loading an older kernel now, so I changed GRUB_DEFAULT. otherwise nothing. booting in recovery mode wasn't very stable either. I got home today and the computer wasn't responsive
[04:38] <tomreyn> kinghat: locking issues occur when multiple processes are running dpkg (in a way which requires locking) in parallel.
[04:38] <tomreyn> kinghat: the other process may be unattended-upgrades, for example
[04:38] <tomreyn> oceanquake: cool, good luck.
[04:39] <kinghat> ah. i have only ever seen this in virtualbox.
[04:41] <oceanquake> tomreyn: thanks again for the earnest help.  given all the manual steps, I'm sure I fat-fingered or overlooked something, but hopefully this setup boots.
[04:42] <tomreyn> rdj22222: i'd say boot from live / recovery, run fsck on all file systems and inspect the SMART data
[04:42] <tomreyn> rdj22222: whats the hardware, which exact version did you install - 18.04.0 or .1?
[04:43] <tomreyn> oceanquake: yw, i hope so, too
[04:44] <rdj22222> it's a Dell XPS 15 9560, and I don't know which ubuntu version I installed. whichever one I was prompted to install.
[04:51] <tomreyn> rdj22222: apparently this comes with an NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050, this may be why you could not boot initally.
[04:51] <tomreyn> well boot yes but no graphical desktop
[04:52] <tomreyn> tech specs https://www.dell.com/support/manuals/us/en/19/xps-15-9560-laptop/xps-15-9560-setupandvideo/specifications?guid=guid-4a715843-271e-4d93-b41c-66a245385203&lang=en-us
[04:52] <klaminite> I don't understand how an nvidia card could render a system without a graphics interface
[04:53] <tomreyn> wlel, there is not much documentation availabel to produce free drivers, and the proprietary ones weren't ready by the time ubuntu 18.04 released.
[04:53] <rdj22222> I had my old version of ubuntu working fine
[04:55] <tomreyn> was there a question hiddne in this statement?
[04:56] <tomreyn> rdj22222: i guess you could reinstall and next time you end up on the recovery menu you can install all pending updates and run "sudo ubuntu-drivers autoinstall" and reboot
[04:58] <klaminite> wait people can see these messages right?
[04:59] <rdj22222> klaminite: yes
[05:00] <rdj22222> tomreyn: I'm trying to boot off an old usb now, oddly enough without success. I am leaning towards downloading a new one and reinstalling
[05:01] <tomreyn> rdj22222: be sure to make a backup first if there's any data you haven't backed up, yet
[05:02] <rdj22222> hah
[05:02] <rdj22222> thankfully I did backup my important files
[05:02] <rdj22222> hopefully the computer is fine, and all this costs me is time
[05:02] <klaminite> Are you getting kernal errors? I usually do get kernal errors when I mess up my USB installs.
[05:03] <rdj22222> nah, just after the Dell image it clicks off and restarts. that's as far as I get. I can't even consistently get into the kernel selection menu
[05:04] <tomreyn> rdj22222: did you change bios settings lately?
[05:05] <rdj22222> no
[05:05] <rdj22222> I'm a lazy user, I don't change things much
[05:06] <tomreyn> rdj22222: in case you're uefi booting, there seems to be a firmware bug affecting linux booting which the latest bios update fixes: https://www.dell.com/support/home/us/en/19/drivers/driversdetails?driverId=F86F9&osCode=WT64A&productCode=xps-15-9560-laptop
[05:06] <tomreyn> "1. Fixed a potential issue with binary image measurement using the Linux UEFI shim boot loader."
[05:07] <rdj22222> thank you
[05:10] <tomreyn> based on previous bios upgrades changelogs, you should be on version 1.11.0 (08/29/2018) at a very minimum (for security reasons) but this newer one (1.12.1, 10/23/2018) may help with uefi boot issues
[05:31] <rdj22222> I'm not really sure how I should partition this for a new install. there's a 1tb drive and a 32gb ssd. should the boot loader go on the ssd?
[05:31] <rdj22222> I could just leave the partitions the same as what I chose last time
[05:34] <boblamont> I have a file that is written to by a form to have one of two strings in it. I'd like to regularly check that file, and depending on the string, copy the contents of one of a pair of files into a fourth file. I'd like to set up a cron job or similar to repeat it every 10-15 seconds or so. Can I do that? And if so, would doing it that often put a burdensome on the system?
[05:45] <rdj22222> I don't see why you couldn't
[05:49] <bindi> cron doesn't do sub-1min
[05:50] <bindi> you should use inotify to see when the file changes
[05:50] <boblamont> it's a relatively lightbindi: is there an alternative?
[05:50] <bindi> like pyinotify for python
[05:51] <bindi> but why don't you run the script from the form submit in the first place?
[05:57] <boblamont> The form has 2 options, A and B, which get written to file 1. If A is selected, I want all changes to file 2 to be immediately copied to file 4 until the next time B is selected, at which point I want all changes to file 3 to be imediately copied to file 4, like a railroad switch. Does that make sense?
[05:59] <bindi> not sure how this is #ubuntu related anymore, go ask some programming channel of your choice, and do it in the form directly, you're over-complicating it
[05:59] <bindi> no reason to write A/B and poll for changes and read the A/B switch and then do something depending on that, when you could just directly select A -> do whatever, select B -> do whatever
[06:00] <boblamont> the sources for files 2 and 3 are different. 3 is constantly written to automatically, but 2 is done with human interaction.
[06:09] <lotuspsychje> !bionic
[08:25] <afx_> Hello ! How can I add a language dictionary for spell checking  to evolution ?
[08:49] <Lost_in_Terminal> g'day I'm looking for help getting virtualbox working receiving error modprobe: FATAL: Module vboxdrv not found in directory /lib/modules/4.20.0-042000-generic after running sudo modprobe vboxdrv
[08:50] <BurekzFinezt> might be wrong but you need VBox kernel modules for 4.20. you upgraded your kernel via ukuu, right?
[08:53] <ducasse> Lost_in_Terminal: vbox might not work with that kernel, use a supported ubuntu kernel
[08:53] <Lost_in_Terminal> > BurekzFinezt  that could be it,  kernel updated from http://kernel.ubuntu.com
[08:53] <BurekzFinezt> basically what ducasse said, Lost_in_Terminal
[08:54] <BurekzFinezt> i'm not sure is there any workaround tho, so i can't help you with that, but you could always downgrade kernel
[08:54] <Lost_in_Terminal> > ducasse > BurekzFinezt  bugger, I dropped back to an old kernel to try and that failed too... how do I find the last supported vbox kernel?
[08:55] <Lost_in_Terminal> thanks for your time and help :)
[08:55] <ducasse> Lost_in_Terminal: try an official ubuntu kernel, which release is this?
[08:55] <BurekzFinezt> i think that depends on ubuntu repos. unless you wanna hack away
[08:55] <Lost_in_Terminal> 18.10
[08:56] <ducasse> !info linux-image-generic cosmic
[08:56] <ducasse> Lost_in_Terminal: ^^
[08:57] <Lost_in_Terminal> ducasse, sweet thanks, swear that was one that I tried to go back to, but I'll give it another go :)
[08:59] <Lost_in_Terminal> cheers, thanks for your help!
[09:01] <GreatEmerald> Even if I put "persistent" in the kernel command line when booting, /cow doesn't get mounted and I don't see anything in dmesg, is there any way to tell what's going on?
[09:38] <IniGit> hi
[09:39] <IniGit> I want to execute a script on shutdown and I read a stackoverflow post that says – place it in /etc/rc6.d/, but that does not work
[09:39] <IniGit> Is this method not valid anymore in 18.04?
[09:43] <badr_> Hi
[09:44] <ramsub07> Hi, I have added my key to ssh-add. But still whenever I'd want to SSH, I am using user@ip_address format. How do I further simplify this to ssh <some_name> ?
[09:45] <geirha> ramsub07: you can add a host entry for it in .ssh/config
[09:45] <ramsub07> example?
[09:46] <BurekzFinezt> add an alias, should make things 100x easier. you can bind a whole command to a single word
[09:47] <badr_> EriC^^:are you here?
[09:47] <geirha> ramsub07: E.g. with these three lines: Host some_name<newline>    Hostname actual.host.name<newline>    User user<newline>    # running   ssh some_name   will do  ssh user@actual.host.name
[09:48] <ramsub07> Perfect, thanks!
[09:48] <Tin_man> ramsub07, here is an example >>https://nerderati.com/2011/03/17/simplify-your-life-with-an-ssh-config-file/
[09:50] <GreatEmerald> Even if I make a partition labelled "casper-rw", all I get is it mounted on /media/ubuntu/casper-rw, but there is no /cow
[09:51] <fichero> hi, if I dd some HDD entire disc to ISO and then dd if=iso to usbdrive will that work just as well generaly?
[09:51] <fichero> or it won't be as if I if=HDD of=USB directly?
[09:51] <SwedeMike> fichero: yes, it's the same thing.
[09:52] <SwedeMike> fichero: I do that all the time.
[09:52] <fichero> thanks friend
[09:53] <ducasse> fichero: you won't make an .iso with dd unless the source is already in iso format, though
[09:54] <HyP3r> hello, I want to create a test-access point for the development of my/our iot devices. We are using the latest version of ubuntu 18.04. Now the problem is that we want to use directly hostapd to create an access point (with that we can configure the parameters of the wifi more precisely). hostapd is working really good but I want to use dnsmasq as DNS and DHCP Server
[09:54] <HyP3r> dnsmasq is using the port 53 to listen on dns request
[09:54] <fichero> ducasse: what!
[09:55] <HyP3r> But the current Version of Ubuntu uses systemd-resolved for resolving dns, which is also listening on 53
[09:55] <HyP3r> So how can I fix this problem?
[09:55] <HyP3r> I think systemd-resolvd should be uninstalled and /etc/resolv.conf used directly. Is that correct?
[09:55] <fichero> anywey I'm trying to dd an HDD that is 200GB but the used space is 20GB at most. and I wanna put into a 64GB usb drive. will the empty space used won't allow me to fit it into the 64GB drive?
[09:58] <ducasse> fichero: dd will also copy the empty space, so that won't work
[09:59] <fichero> ducasse: i've seem tutorials that help but is there one you recomend that won't dd the emtpy space?
[10:00] <ducasse> fichero: afaik clonezilla might do it
[10:00] <fichero> ducasse: k cool
[10:02] <fichero> is a chinese program lol according to google
[10:03] <ducasse> seems it's developed in taiwan
[10:05] <fichero> hope is small too
[10:06] <fichero> there's clonezilla live too like a salvage pen drive?
[10:07] <ducasse> i believe so
[10:07] <Ool> clonezilla from taiwan (wikipedia)
[10:19] <fichero> can software updater gui do the autoremove that terminal comand does?
[10:19] <MrCrackPotBuilde> im trying to create a symbolic link so i only need to type testing-app --version rather than /path/to/testing/app --version in the man ln it says to use -s so i typed ln -s /path/to/testing/app testing-app but it doesnt seem to work
[10:19] <MrCrackPotBuilde> am i doing something wrong
[10:23] <Ben64> MrCrackPotBuilde: yes, that just makes a symbolic link in the current directory, that wouldn't allow you to just run "app"
[10:23] <yossarianuk> hi - is anyone aware - is there any benefit to be gained from using blk-mq scheduler on a SATA SSD drive ? (i.e non NVME)
[10:23] <MrCrackPotBuilde> Ben64 what is the correct way to make a link ??
[10:23] <Ben64> you made a link
[10:23] <IniGit> how can I know which scripts are executed at shutdown? Is there a log or so somewhere? I tried the following and it didn't work and now I want to know why: https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/276780/why-is-a-script-in-etc-rc6-d-not-run-on-reboot#
[10:24] <IniGit> https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/276780/why-is-a-script-in-etc-rc6-d-not-run-on-reboot
[10:24] <IniGit> without the # at the end
[10:24] <ducasse> MrCrackPotBuilde: try ./testing-app
[10:25] <MrCrackPotBuilde> lol im a dumbass sometimes thanks ducasse
[10:25] <MrCrackPotBuilde> completely forgot about the ./
[10:26] <ducasse> MrCrackPotBuilde: link it to somewhere in your PATH
[10:26] <MrCrackPotBuilde> ah that i can not
[10:26] <MrCrackPotBuilde> that was the first thing i did
[10:26] <MrCrackPotBuilde> at the bottom of bashrc export path path blah blah
[10:26] <MrCrackPotBuilde> but nothing happened at all
[10:27] <MrCrackPotBuilde> it seems the application doesnt like the export path
[10:27] <MrCrackPotBuilde> ah
[10:27] <MrCrackPotBuilde> no when i move dir
[10:27] <MrCrackPotBuilde> it no longer works
[10:28] <Ben64> right, because it was in whatever directory you were in, you'd need it in PATH for it to work everywhere
[10:28] <MrCrackPotBuilde> how could i put it into path
[10:28] <ducasse> try linking it into /usr/local/bin
[10:31] <MrCrackPotBuilde> that worked thanks Ben64 and ducasse
[10:31] <ducasse> np
[10:52] <muhaha> Any alternative to heirloom-mailx, where can I specify SMTP host,credentials as argument? I need simple oneliner. Thanks
[10:52] <badr_> how to copie my file from ubuntu he can't to start  ,boot files of [Ubuntu 16.04.5 LTS] are far from the start of the disk
[10:54] <HyP3r> I have now disabled systemd-resolvd and installed dnsmasq my aim is now that network manager is configuring the resolv.conf directly so dnsmasq can read from that and provide dns and network for the WIFI.
[10:54] <HyP3r> But the strange thing is that network manager is always settting nameserver to 127.0.0.53. Why?
[11:01] <fichero> ducasse: still, clonezilla wants to create 200GB on my 16GB pen drive. says drive is too small, source image is 200gb reported
[11:02] <BluesKaj> 'Morning folks
[11:04] <ducasse> fichero: there should be a resize option, but i've never tried this
[11:05] <eugenio> Hi all, I'm updating a 18.04 server, but the network seems to be very slow. I want to reboot the system and restart the update. The question is: is safe to stop the apt-get update with ctrl+x? May I damage the apt-get system? In case of yes could I stop, reboot and relaunch the apt-get with problems?
[11:07] <maetthew> Anyone know of a tool that monitors laptop battery and logs it somewhere. I'm suspecting my battery is starting to get faulty, been noticing drops from 50% to 20-30% quite quickly.
[11:11] <fichero> I'm doing sudo ddrescue if=/dev/sdj of=/dev/sdi
[11:12] <fichero> and the app says inpt file not found
[11:12] <fichero> what am i doing wrong? I have lsblk saying right now sdj is there and 2 partitions
[11:12] <fichero> and sdi is there too with no partitions
[11:14] <ducasse> fichero: read the ddrescue man page, carefully. i think those arguments are wrong.
[11:14] <maxzor> Hello, anyone managed to record desktop with vlc?
[11:14] <fichero> okey
[11:19] <maxzor> recordmydesktop is fine, vlc no clue
[11:19] <boblamont> I have script I'm trying to run at boot, and I put this in crontab @reboot /usr/bin/php /var/www/html/wriu.org/public_html/staff/nownow.php but after a reboot, the script didn't run
[11:22] <Badr> you don't have any idea guys?
[11:30] <fichero> does anyone here knows if ddrescue hangs when there's an error rather than saying something
[11:35] <Goop> Does Ubuntu natively show emojies now?
[11:50] <SeTunTun> hello. I am trying to encrypt my home directoy in ubuntu 18.04 with ecryptfs-migrate-home -u user
[11:51] <SeTunTun> it fails. Maybe because i am the unique user of the system. Is there any way to do this?
[11:54] <ducasse> SeTunTun: you need to run it as another user (root) while your user is completely logged out
[11:58] <SeTunTun> my user is the user i created in the installation process. ia assume it is the root. Should i create another administrator?
[11:58] <ducasse> SeTunTun: there already is a separate root user, it just hasn't got a password set
[12:03] <SeTunTun> really? how do i access that root user?
[12:04] <Ben64> probably would be easier to make a new user
[12:04] <Ben64> don't have to mess with setting a root password that way
[12:07] <SeTunTun> right, I was thinking about that Ben64
[12:07] <SeTunTun> Thanks guys!
[12:16] <Amnesia> question, I'm trying to create a cosmic chroot, but debootstrap is stating that the InRelease file has expired: E: InRelease file http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/cosmic/InRelease is expired since (Wed, 09 Jan 2019 00:00:00 +0100)
[12:17] <Amnesia> does anyone have a clue what's goin on?
[12:20] <LaRose_Bleu> that sounds like a problem
[12:24] <Amnesia> LaRose_Bleu: indeed:)
[12:40] <Cheez> Amnesia: i wonder if it's the signing key for the gpg sig that has expired or something?
[12:40] <Amnesia> prolly
[13:00] <LaRose_Bleu> whats the prettiest terminal?
[13:00] <lotuspsychje> LaRose_Bleu: mine :p
[13:00] <LaRose_Bleu> lotuspsychje: yuk
[13:02] <seven-eleven> is ntp by default installed on ubuntu?
[13:02] <lotuspsychje> LaRose_Bleu: join #ubuntu-discuss to talk about polls and best-offs
[13:03] <seven-eleven> oh looks like ubuntu used timedatectl from systemd
[13:04] <[twisti]> how can i get the location of a script file inside the script ? the reason im asking is i want to be able to do "/some/path/to/where/the/script/is/script.sh" from anywhere, and then be able to call a second script that is in the same directory from the first script
[13:04] <[twisti]> is that possible ?
[13:10] <leftyfb> [twisti]: $0 will give you the location of the script
[13:22] <[twisti]> thanks
[13:31] <sonOfRa> $0 will give you the invocation; if /some/path is on your $PATH, and you invoke script.sh; and it's in /some/path/script.sh you will only get "script.sh"
[13:31] <zap0> how do i find where all the network share folders data is kept?
[13:31] <sonOfRa> If you invoke it with the full path, it will return the full path
[13:37] <cryptodan> zap0: how are you connecting to the share?
[13:37] <Badr> Eric^^: thank you very much for your help although I could not run my system ubuntu or restore my files
[13:37] <Badr> I really appreciate your efforts
[13:37] <zap0> from Windows machine, using Window Explorer.
[13:39] <cryptodan> zap0: then its a samba share right click on the mapped drive and see if it has the path and ip address
[13:44] <zap0> i don't know what 'mapped drive' means.
[13:44] <zap0> can you tell me where the data is kept?
[13:45] <cryptodan> zap0: a mapped drive is how you mount a windows share in windows
[13:45] <LaRose_Bleu> mapped drive is a drive on a network elsewhere
[13:45] <cryptodan> and the ip address or hostname would be listed in the path properties
[13:47] <vincent-> Hello. One simple question. I'm about to install Xubuntu 18.04 on an SSD and I was wondering if the installer will allow me to create F2FS partitions. Thanks.
[13:55] <vincent-> Nevermind, it seems there isn't any big difference in terms of performance between EXT4 and F2FS, and the first one is more reliable/stable/mature.
[15:02] <jeblad> Anyone knows why the grub menu suddenly is gone? I wonder if it is on my other 4k-display.
[15:03] <visone> howdy
[15:06] <lordcirth> visone, hello
[15:13] <visone> lordcirth: hi¡
[15:13] <visone> how it´s goes¡
[15:17] <lordcirth> visone, good thanks, but chatting is off-topic here. #ubuntu is the support channel. #ubuntu-offtopic exists for chat
[15:22] <SeTunTun> hello could anybody help me with a doubt? what is SPICE agent?
[15:23] <lordcirth> SeTunTun, https://spice-space.org/
[15:24] <SeTunTun> lordcirth, I visited it but i'm afraid i don't understand it. Can i delete this servce?
[15:24] <lordcirth> SeTunTun, do you use virtual machines, or remote desktop? If not, it should be safe to delete
[15:27] <tomreyn> spice-vdagent is part of the ubuntu-desktop package. removing one will remove the other, but then ubuntu-desktop is just a meta package, you don't strictly need it.
[15:29] <karrot> hi, I'm using this digitalocean guy (not on a digital ocean machine) to try to create a vnc server that I can ssh tunnel into and run an xfce desktop
[15:29] <karrot> https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-install-and-configure-vnc-on-debian-9
[15:29] <SeTunTun> thanks tomreyn
[15:29] <karrot> the problem is, in step 3, I connect to my ssh server with another port, not 22, and I don't know how to put that information. into the command in digitalcoean command in step 33
[15:29] <karrot> ssh -L 5901:127.0.0.1:5901 -C -N -l sammy your_server_ip
[15:30] <karrot> my port for ssh is 3345... so i'm curious where I could put that in to that command?
[15:30] <tomreyn> SeTunTun: you're welcome. next time you ask about a package, it will make it easier if you can find out the package name. but as you see it worked this time around. ;-)
[15:33] <tomreyn> karrot: you add "-p 3345" somewhere between "ssh" and "your_server_ip"
[15:33] <karrot> anywhere shouldn't matter?
[15:33] <tomreyn> karrot: ...but not before a word which starts without a dash
[15:34] <karrot> I tried ssh -L 5901:127.0.0.1:5901 -C -N -l sammy -p 3345 your_server_ip
[15:34] <karrot> and it hangs like a mofo
[15:34] <karrot> but, I guess that can be another probelm :(
[15:35] <tomreyn> did you restart the ssh server after chaning the port?
[15:35] <tomreyn> *changing
[15:36] <karrot> I never changed the port for ssh
[15:36] <karrot> it's been that way before I added the vncserver
[15:36] <tomreyn> karrot: actually, this command is meant to "hang there", due to the -N option
[15:36] <karrot> ahhhhhhh
[15:36] <karrot> now I understand
[15:36] <karrot> ohhhh
[15:36] <karrot> tomreyn: you saved me many headaches my friend!
[15:36] <karrot> much is owed to you
[15:37] <tomreyn> ;-)
[15:37] <tomreyn> it'd been a good idea for the tuitorial writer to point this out
[15:38] <tomreyn> karrot: and be aware that ubuntu doesn't always work like debian. which ubuntu version are you using?
[15:38] <karrot> lol, it just says do that. command then connect trhough your vnc
[15:38] <karrot> I'm actually using raspbian
[15:39] <karrot> I just didn't want to admit it wasn't an ubuntu affair for fear of people thinking I'm abusingt his channel
[15:39] <tomreyn> well then you shuldn't be asking your questions here
[15:39] <karrot> ahhhh, I'm sorry, I had no where to turn
[15:39] <karrot> I am really thankful you helped me though
[15:51] <leftyfb> Ubuntu 18.04 with multiple vpn profiles in network manager. The vpn profiles are named very specifically but cutoff after 10 characters in the GUI. This is a silly limitation. Anyone have a solution or workaround?
[15:52] <tomreyn> maybe number them and have a simple script to look up the names for those numbers.
[15:53] <tomreyn> i doubt there's going to be an option to switch for the display length
[15:53] <Callek> ...I'm on cosmic and using multiple monitors -- the dock itself seems to frequently get out of sync (I have the setting enabled to display the dock on all displays) -- it has more frequency to get out of sync when I disconnect the external monitor and later reconnect it... it manifests as "only apps open at the point it goes out of sync stay visible on the
[15:53] <Callek> secondary monitor, and no new ones get added to the dock, the activity icon (for open windows) will still change, and it will still react to right click and left click on secondary monitor, but if I open a new app or close an unpinned app, the icon list doesn't change)...
[15:53] <Callek> I'm interested if anyone knows of any bug, or a recommendation on where to file or what info would be useful in a bug filed
[15:53] <tomreyn> leftyfb: which gui actually?
[15:53] <leftyfb> tomreyn: the default, gnome
[15:54] <leftyfb> tomreyn: it's really silly that it cuts off the naming like that
[15:54] <Callek> I'm using the "default" window manager, which iirc is gnome3 - and I have autorandr installed if that makes a difference (to assist when I travel to offices and use a different external monitor)
[15:54] <leftyfb> tomreyn: renaming with numbers isn't a good solution
[15:54] <Callek> the external monitor is connected by hdmi and I'm on hidpi displays on both screens (200% zoom in settings)
[15:57] <tomreyn> leftyfb: you could use nmtui-connect instead, but i see your point.
[15:58] <leftyfb> tomreyn: Also not the option we were looking for. It blows my mind that these things make it past QA
[16:05] <sungy> Hi?
[16:05] <sungy> Anyone can hellp with systemd?
[16:05] <sungy> Cant seem to disable a service
[16:06] <tomreyn> leftyfb: i dib't see anything related in "gsettings list-recursively org.gnome.nm-applet"
[16:06] <leftyfb> tomreyn: I looked there as well
[16:08] <tomreyn> leftyfb: and there is no gsetting for it https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/network-manager-applet/blob/master/org.gnome.nm-applet.gschema.xml.in
[16:08] <tomreyn> !details | sungy
[16:09] <leftyfb> sungy: sudo systemctl disable <service_name>
[16:11] <sungy> hi leftyfb: Yes ive trieded every way to disable it normallly, but when I boot it comes back
[16:11] <leftyfb> sungy: which service?
[16:12] <sungy> Its for openvpn and I can see two entries' in the output of  this command "systemctl --type=service --state=active list-units"
[16:14] <leftyfb> sungy: pastebin please
[16:16] <BluesKaj> sungy, check /etc/init.d for an openvpnauto script
[16:17] <leftyfb> sungy: what version of ubuntu?
[16:21] <sungy> Hi leftyfb many thanks I made a pastebin here - https://pastebin.com/G06t18A5
[16:22] <sungy> Its especially strange because the es10 and es14 files dont actually exist any more so I dont know how those services are getting started
[16:26] <sylario> Hi
[16:27] <sylario> has team viewer been removed from the software available in the
[16:27] <sylario> I do not know the english name of the 'logiteque'
[16:28] <sylario> in the graphic GUI to install software. In 18.04
[16:28] <friendlyguy> hi there! i am wondering about network configuration on ubuntu 18.04.1, the dns-server listed in resolv.conf isnt what the dhcp server is handing out.
[16:28] <leftyfb> sylario: teamviewer was never available in the default repos. You get that from their website and is unsupported here.
[16:28] <hggdh> sylario: repository?
[16:28] <friendlyguy> is it ignoring dhcp option 006?
[16:28] <sylario> I am not sure the GUI to install is named repository
[16:28] <leftyfb> friendlyguy: it points to your local machine which runs systemd-resolved for caching
[16:29] <leftyfb> sylario: if you want teamviewer, go to their website
[16:29] <friendlyguy> ah, okay
[16:29] <friendlyguy> thanks sylario
[16:29] <sylario> ok thanks I am doing that
[16:29] <leftyfb> friendlyguy: nmcli device show |egrep -i "domain|dns"
[16:29] <friendlyguy> erm, sorry leftyfb :)
[16:29] <friendlyguy> thank YOU
[16:30] <sylario> I am doing remote support but I rarely use the graphic interface or a vanilla Ubuntu
[16:30] <aqd> where should I submit patches to disable nasty stuff in commercial packages such as spotify? I made a preload so to block ports and "zygote". Is there somewhere on ubuntu for program specific preload? (not /etc/ld...preload)
[16:30] <friendlyguy> that looks much better
[16:30] <friendlyguy> :)
[16:31] <aqd> could extend that for chrome and other broadcasting apps as well, damn them i don't want firewall
[16:31] <leftyfb> sylario: then use ssh
[16:32] <sylario> @leftyfb : It's behind a NAT router
[16:33] <leftyfb> sylario: port forwarding? Make a remote server for creating reverse ssh tunnels. Run tmate manually
[16:33] <leftyfb> sylario: also, vpn
[16:33] <sylario> I am not sure i can explain to a non tech user how to create a reverse SSH tunnel
[16:33] <tomreyn> aqd: use open source software.
[16:34] <aqd> is there an alternative to spotify??
[16:34] <tomreyn> aqd: not if you insist on the vendor lock in, i assume
[16:35] <aqd> but I dont want chromium's port 5353 anyway, they shouldn't open any port
[16:35] <leftyfb> sylario: try tmate
[16:35] <aqd> .........
[16:35] <tomreyn> aqd: have you tried chromium-browser, the package that is in ubuntu?
[16:35] <aqd> i'm using that
[16:36] <tomreyn> aqd: you said "chrome"
[16:36] <aqd> okay not google's binary. i suppose they package the nasty updater as well
[16:37] <aqd> hm maybe binfmt can help with per-program preloading?
[16:37] <tomreyn> aqd: if there is a problem with chromium-browser in ubuntu, please file (requires launchpad.net credentials) a bug using: ubuntu-bug chromioum-browser
[16:38] <Badr_> i want to recover my  date https://paste.ee/p/ZJGFp can you help my?
[16:40] <tomreyn> Badr_: start by reading the file README.txt. type "less README.txt", press'q' to quit it.
[16:42] <friendlyguy> i am wondering if someone can help me with domain joining a ubuntu 18.04.1 machine? i am following the following tutorial: https://bitsofwater.com/2018/05/08/join-ubuntu-18-04-to-active-directory/
[16:44] <friendlyguy> realm discover our.domain.local looks "good", but when i try to get a kerberos ticket... "Cannot contact any KDC for realm our.domain.local while getting initial credentials"
[16:45] <friendlyguy> i verified dns resolution is working correctly, i can ping the kdc
[16:54] <Badr_> tomreyn :https://paste.ee/p/oStT0
[16:54] <Badr_> look that
[17:00] <tomreyn> Badr_: interesting
[17:01] <tomreyn> i think you want to ecryptfs-recover-private
[17:01] <tomreyn> http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/bionic/man1/ecryptfs-recover-private.1.html
[17:03] <Siecje> How can I disable a user from automatically being logged in?
[17:03] <Badr_> yes i want
[17:03] <Badr_> my document
[17:04] <sylario> ok, I managed to makje the user download Team viewer
[17:04] <tomreyn> Badr_: note that ecryptfs is kind of (i haven't found this mentioned on the release notes) deprecated nowadays. see the 18.04 !releasenotes
[17:04] <sylario> and please do not advise to use tmate when the remote user barely manage to install tviewer
[17:04] <tomreyn> Badr_: oops i meant to write: note that ecryptfs is kind of deprecated nowadays. see the 18.04 !releasenotes
[17:05] <lotuspsychje> Siecje: disable automatic login
[17:05] <Siecje> lotuspsychje: How?
[17:05] <Badr_> ok
[17:06] <lotuspsychje> Siecje: system options/details/users
[17:06] <tomreyn> Siecje: you can use the user management GUI your desktop environment provides
[17:06] <Badr_> thank ypu :tomreyn
[17:06] <Siecje> tomreyn: I'm using Cinnamon, and I don't see anything.
[17:07] <tomreyn> Siecje: which graphical login manager (desktop manager) do you use?
[17:07] <lotuspsychje> Siecje: don't you have users settings in cinnamon?
[17:07] <Siecje> How do I check?
[17:08] <Siecje> Okay I found the user in /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf
[17:08] <Siecje> Thanks
[17:24] <hillman7> Hello. I am very confused. My wifi stopped working on 18.04 and I'm not at all sure why. It's a regular wifi network with a captive portal, but network-manager doesn't seem to load the captive portal anymore (just tries to go to nmapplet.gnome.org or something similar)
[17:24] <hillman7> I can connect to other networks just fine (tethered to my phone at the moment)
[17:25] <lotuspsychje> hillman7: whats your chipset brand please?
[17:25] <hillman7> sorry the url is "nmcheck.gnome.org"
[17:26] <hillman7> lotuspsychje: Network controller: Intel Corporation Wireless 8265 / 8275 (rev 78)  (ie. ilwifi)
[17:26] <cryptodan> captive portal?
[17:27] <hillman7> I've tried restarting network manager and rebooting, forgetting the wireless network
[17:27] <lotuspsychje> hillman7: your system fully up to date?
[17:28] <hillman7> I think autoupdates are on nightly
[17:29] <lotuspsychje> hillman7: allright, want to share your dmesg please, maybe we can find something there
[17:29] <hillman7> just updating now to be sure
[17:30] <lotuspsychje> allright, tnx for checking hillman7
[17:30] <hillman7> goign to reboot to get a clean dmesg
[17:30] <lotuspsychje> ok
[17:37] <hillman7> lotuspsychje: https://pastebin.com/PmyPAtbm
[17:37] <hillman7> note that I accidentally typed the password wrong once in there, so there will be a failed authentication
[17:38] <cryptodan> hillman7: what is this captive portal you speak of?
[17:39] <hillman7> cryptodan: it's what you call it when a public wifi connection forces you to log in
[17:39] <cryptodan> oh the website that pops up asking you pay for faster speeds or continue with standard speeds?
[17:39] <hillman7> gnome has some sort of script that pops up a window with the portal in it, or it loads in your browser
[17:39] <hillman7> not for speeds, just for access at all
[17:40] <cryptodan> simply open your browser and it should access it
[17:41] <hillman7> brb trying something else
[17:42] <lotuspsychje> hillman7: try also: tail -f /var/log/syslog and disable/enable wifi again
[17:43] <hillman7> lotuspsychje: I see a lot of this in syslog: systemd-resolved[766]: Using degraded feature set (TCP) for DNS server x.x.x.x
[17:43] <Siecje> My mouse scroll wheel barely works.
[17:44] <Siecje> sometimes it scrolls up when I scroll down. Most of the time it doesn't do anything
[17:44] <pragmaticenigma> Siecje: I would recommend trying a different mouse to see if it is a hardware issue.
[17:45] <lotuspsychje> hillman7: i dont see anything unusual in your dmesg, could you share the tail
[17:47] <cryptodan> hillman7: what browser do you use on your install and does it have any ad blockers or anything like that enabled?
[17:48] <hillman7> no ad blockers, vanilla firefox
[17:48] <hillman7> this has worked fine for months until today
[17:49] <cryptodan> hillman7: try disabling ipv6 in network manager and see if you can connect
[17:52] <hillman7> have there been any recent updates to network-manager?
[17:52] <lotuspsychje> hillman7: i didnt see some on my system, but you could check your dpkg log
[17:53] <adrian_1908> hillman7: can you repeat the problem (connection issues?), just joined.
[17:55] <lotuspsychje> adrian_1908: <hillman7> Hello. I am very confused. My wifi stopped working on 18.04 and I'm not at all sure why. It's a regular wifi network with a captive portal, but network-manager doesn't seem to load the captive portal anymore (just tries to go to nmapplet.gnome.org or something similar)
[17:55] <lotuspsychje> adrian_1908:  Intel Corporation Wireless 8265 / 8275 (rev 78)  (ie. ilwifi)
[17:55] <adrian_1908> ^ Thanks. Yeah, would have recommended the ipv6 thing as well first thought.
[17:56] <hillman7> lotuspsychje: here's the system log: https://pastebin.com/vQmHF6eD
[17:56] <hillman7> that's just me turning off/on wifi again
[17:56] <hillman7> not the AP with the issue
[17:56] <hillman7> the AP with the issue seems to "connect", but I can't access the internet or the captive portal
[17:57] <lotuspsychje> hillman7: i just noticed dbus updates in my dpkg log, perhaps related?
[17:57] <hillman7> god I hope not
[17:58] <cryptodan> hillman7: in a browser type this in http://192.168..x.1 of course with thre missing number and not sure why you edited it.
[17:58] <hillman7> this is the message in the captive portal box when I try to connect to the bad AP: "Error resolving “nmcheck.gnome.org”: Name or service not known"
[17:59] <hillman7> sorry I'm slow to reply, I'm switching wifi networks often to try to test things
[18:00] <hillman7> trying to do it fast enough so I don't disconnect
[18:00] <Xard> some people have been complaining about hdmi sound starting delay, but i'm not only getting that if I try to use hdmi audio, but also latency of the amount of delay which means almost two seconds of audio latency... though "pacmd list-sinks" reports the latency around 20ms or so despite that. Restarting pulseaudio with -k after swithing to hdmi audio fixes the issue though (on 18.04)
[18:02] <hillman7> test
[18:02] <cryptodan> pass
[18:02] <hillman7> test2
[18:02] <cryptodan> pass2
[18:02] <hillman7> ty
[18:03] <Sir_Andrei> Hello
[18:03] <hillman7> going to try another reboot brb
[18:04] <Sir_Andrei> People, idk if this is the right place to ask..., but well
[18:04] <Sir_Andrei> I wanna install Lubuntu 18.04 on a computer given to my brother by the uruguayan gov.
[18:04] <Sir_Andrei> The problem is they have a BIOS which doesn't allow to disable UEFI Boot.
[18:05] <Sir_Andrei> And they only allow to install systems signed by them.
[18:05] <Sir_Andrei> What's my way in this case?
[18:08] <Siecje> pragmaticenigma: I've had this mouse issue before in the past with a different mouse.
[18:08] <pragmaticenigma> Siecje: What did you do then to fix it?
[18:08] <hillman7> phone is running out of juice :/
[18:09] <slee> hi, anyone else having update issues?
[18:09] <hillman7> thanks for your help guys, but I have no idea what's going on. Gotta disconnect unfortunately.
[18:09] <lotuspsychje> Siecje: did you try mouse on different flavors, then cinnamon?
[18:09] <lotuspsychje> hillman7: come back when you have more time ok
[18:09] <cryptodan> hillman7: when you are connecting to the public wifi have syslog tailing and look for the gateway ip of the ap and see if you can use the ip address in a browser and connect that way
[18:09] <vivid> so i need to build some i386 packages for bionic.  these packages cannot be built on launchpad due to licensing conflicts.  I notice there is no i386 installer for a virtual machine.  what is the suggested method of building i386 packages for bionic?
[18:10] <Siecje> lotuspsychje: Yes it was happening on KDE.
[18:10] <hillman7> cryptodan: will do, thanks
[18:10] <lotuspsychje> slee: could you pastebin: sudo apt update && sudo apt full-upgrade please?
[18:10] <pragmaticenigma> Sir_Andrei: Does it have the option to disable "Secure Boot"
[18:12] <Siecje> lotuspsychje: Hmm I get a bunch of warnings and errors https://dpaste.de/5KPL
[18:13] <slee> lotuspsychje, https://pastebin.com/h8RbAZ48 -- the url for the repo it states failed....i can paste the url in a browser for the deb and it prompts me to download it
[18:14] <lotuspsychje> Siecje: that update command was not for you
[18:15] <Sir_Andrei> pragmaticenigma: no, the computer have the option, but it only allow to "Enable" BIOS... sorta weird...
[18:15] <Sir_Andrei> It's an American Trends Inc
[18:15] <Sir_Andrei> American MegaTrends Inc*
[18:15] <lotuspsychje> slee: maybe try to select another mirror in software&updates
[18:17] <pragmaticenigma> Sir_Andrei: You will have to contact the manufacture to see if there is a BIOS update to unlock that feature. Else, you will have to look at the instructions for installing Ubuntu/Lubuntu using UEFI mode
[18:18] <slee> lotuspsychje, thanks, tried several mirrors awhile ago, all failed, just tried another randon one, worked fine, thanks
[18:18] <lotuspsychje> welcome slee
[18:19] <ducasse> Sir_Andrei: will 'enable bios' let you boot in legacy mode?
[18:19] <lotuspsychje> slee: maybe report this to #ubuntu-mirrors also
[18:19] <pragmaticenigma> ducasse: I'm guessing that the machine being given from a gov't office, is likely locked down for security
[18:23] <lotuspsychje> slee: nvm, i reported it
[18:26] <slee> lotuspsychje, sorry, was on other boxes updating, great, thanks again
[18:26] <lotuspsychje> np
[18:33] <cambazz> hello, how can i see which wireless mode my wireless card connects to the router? specifically i want to make sure that it is 802.11ac
[18:33] <cambazz> iwconfig shows a bit rate.
[18:33] <cambazz> but not mode.
[19:15] <IniGit> hi
[19:16] <IniGit> when my service should only do something on shutdown, but nothing on boot, can I leave that statement from my [Service]: ExecStart=/bin/true
[19:16] <IniGit> or do I have to set something at ExecStart=
[19:16] <IniGit> Ideally I do not want that it does anything on startup but only something on reboot and shutdown
[19:18] <TJ-> IniGit: that's not the way to do it; if you wish a service to run only on shutdown you should make it a Wants of the shutdown.target
[19:19] <TJ-> IniGit: you'd be better off asking about this in #systemd channel
[19:19] <IniGit> TJ-: ok thx
[19:20] <TJ-> IniGit: also see "man 5 systemd.unit" where ti talks about Wants and a <service>.wants/ directory and drop-in files
[19:29] <toastintheshell> I'm having trouble figuring out why desktops other than stock gnome won't load after install
[19:30] <toastintheshell> no issues running #apt-get install xfce4
[19:32] <TJ-> toastintheshell: did you install the relevant <de>-session package ?
[19:32] <toastintheshell> tried switching dm to lightdm and not switching dm from the stock one, tried instead doing it via #apt-get install xfce4, tried lxde, and others, none seemed to work
[19:32] <toastintheshell> hm, let me see
[19:32] <TJ-> toastintheshell: install "xfce4-session"
[19:34] <toastintheshell> TJ-: looks like it was included in "apt-get install xubuntu-desktop"
[19:35] <TJ-> toastintheshell: in which case, at the greeter log-in, there should be a cog-icon on the taskbar that allows you to choose which session to use for the log-in
[19:35] <toastintheshell> I have a test machine I've been using to try to duplicate this setup on, and there were no issues logging into other DEs
[19:36] <toastintheshell> Yeah so when I switch DEs in the menu it tries to start, black screen, reverts to lightdm
[19:37] <toastintheshell> someone suggested removing ~/.Xauthority, but that didn't do the trick. Interestingly the file was recreated after going back into Gnome
[19:39] <TJ-> toastintheshell: the reason for removing .Xauthority usually is it got owned by root, which prevents the user from being able to replace it
[19:40] <toastintheshell> TJ-: I see, yeah it's not owned by root
[19:42] <TJ-> toastintheshell: so you're able to choose the XFCE session but the user's login fails ?
[19:42] <badr_> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/KsrRvzYhq8/  How to close that?
[19:44] <TJ-> toastintheshell: it could be user-specific config conflict. I'd recommend creating a new test user and logging into that. IF that works, it confirms there's something in the regular user profile causing it
[19:44] <tomreyn> badr_: it hints on it bottom left: ctrl-x
[19:44] <toastintheshell> TJ-: yes, Gnome desktop works normally, xfce desktop fails, xubuntu desktop fails, lxde desktop fails (I tried more, all identical issues)
[19:44] <tomreyn> ^ = Ctrl there
[19:45] <badr_> tomreyn: reatnow i can to read README.txt
[19:45] <tomreyn> badr_: sorry?
[19:45] <badr_> why?
[19:46] <tomreyn> badr_: pleasae rephrase your question.
[19:47] <badr_> how to recvre my data?
[19:48] <malwar3hun73r> anyone used zfs on ubuntu?
[19:49] <toastintheshell> TJ-: and following the exact same steps on another machine with from the same install media does not reproduce the issue
[19:49] <tomreyn> badr_: did you notice what i wrote about ecryptsfs-recover-private above?
[19:50] <badr_> for me?
[19:51] <tomreyn> badr_: this is the manual for the "ecryptfs-recover-private" command: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/bionic/man1/ecryptfs-recover-private.1.html
[19:52] <tomreyn> badr_: using this command (available form the "ecryptfs-utils" package) you should be able to recover your ecryptfs encrypted data.
[19:53] <tomreyn> there is also ecryptfs-mount-private if there is no need to recover the data
[19:53] <badr_> tomreyn: ecryptfs-utils ;command not found
[19:53] <tomreyn> basically that's what the README file you opened in the editor states
[19:54] <tomreyn> badr_: ecryptfs-utils is a software package name, it is not a command you can run
[19:54] <tomreyn> !info ecryptfs-utils
[19:54] <tomreyn> !search ecryptfs-mount-private
[19:54] <tomreyn> !search ecryptfs-recover-private
[19:57] <ducasse> !find ecryptfs-recover-private
[19:57] <badr_> https://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-to-mount-an-encrypted-linux-home-directory-to-salvage-data/  :i think that is easy
[20:00] <strangerr> where is the current official documentation for configuring openldap? i mean the one that isnt eleven years out of date, which is the first relevent search result https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/serverguide/openldap-server.html.en
[20:01] <badr_> ecryptfs-mount-private ERROR: Encrypted private directory is not setup properly
[20:04] <strangerr> maybe when shuttleworth gets back from space, he can get around to updating some documention
[20:05] <tomreyn> strangerr: there are man pages which should be current,
[20:06] <toastintheshell> So in sumary, lightdm and gdm have no trouble logging into gnome DE, but any other selected DE fails to start
[20:07] <strangerr> tomreyn: which man explains how to update official lts server guides?
[20:11] <badr_> strangerr:you speak with me?
[20:13] <boblamont> I set up a script to run on reboot in my crontab, like this @reboot /usr/bin/php /var/www/html/wriu.org/public_html/staff/nownow.php but it didn't run after a reboot
[20:25] <collinanderson> how do i inline add to PATH in bash? PATH=/usr/lib/chromium-browser/ echo $PATH isn't working
[20:27] <teward> collinanderson: `export PATH="/usr/lib/chromium-browser:$PATH"`
[20:27] <teward> oh INLINE nevermind
[20:27] <collinanderson> yeah...
[20:27] <collinanderson> i'm just trying to do it without polluting my environment, because i only need it for one command.
[20:28] <teward> you can still run `export PATH=...` and then just close and reopen your session
[20:28] <teward> tbhat won't change the persistent path
[20:28] <teward> at least, not permanently.  But you should probably still include the rest of PATH in there otherwise things'll not work anyways :p
[20:30] <collinanderson> thanks
[20:34] <badr_> !info ecryptfs-utils she don't run :tomreyn\
[20:36] <ioria> badr_, may i ask you what are you doing ?
[20:40] <badr_> ioria: i want to recover my data  https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/KY4p4W236n/
[20:41] <Sbur3> Any suggestions to watch different programs on Kodi?
[20:42] <ioria> badr_, are you on livecd ?
[20:42] <OerHeks> Sbur3, more a Q for #kodi
[20:42] <badr_> yes
[20:42] <Sbur3> OerHeks thx. and that includes series?
[20:43] <badr_> liveusb
[20:43] <repz> Hi there, is there an easy way to change / manage plymouth theme without doing it manually?
[20:44] <ioria> badr_,  just home encrypted ? nothing else ?
[20:44] <badr_> yes
[20:45] <ioria> badr_,  what happens if you run       sudo ecryptfs-recover-private ?
[20:47] <badr_> ioria: that https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/RZJqc9SqqQ/
[20:48] <ioria> badr_,  and it quits ?
[20:51] <badr_> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/5zvhz4d8tj/
[20:52] <ioria> badr_,  umount /mnt/recover  and paste sudo parted -l
[20:54] <badr_> ioria: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/8Q46RNSW32/
[20:54] <ioria> badr_,  sudo umount /mnt/recover
[20:56] <badr_> lol
[20:56] <ioria> badr_,  are you jocking ?
[20:56] <badr_> ioria: no
[20:57] <badr_> ioria: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/VSpqSfvqFV/
[20:58] <sayi> hi, looking for good step by step guide on how to build latest squid server /or a ver that supports TLS/MITM on ubuntu 18.04?
[21:02] <abe> i accidentally blew away my /var/lib/gdm3/.config/pulse/client.conf file and broke my sound - could someone on 18.04 share theirs?
[21:07] <genii> abe: You should be able to just copy over the client.conf from /etc/pulse/ directory
[21:08] <genii> ( which gets installed from the libpulse0 package)
[21:13] <OerHeks> sayi, "squid server  that supports MITM " ??
[21:13] <badr_> ioria: i wirite lo but i copied the commed without read him?
[21:13] <badr_> ioria: i wirite lo but i copied the commed without read him
[21:15] <abe> genii: ah okay thanks. that's actually what i had done to "blow away" the file originally (i copied, then added a couple lines which i've since deleted). but i also modified /etc/pulse/default.pa so maybe i actually broke things there
[21:39] <IniGit> hi
[21:39] <IniGit> does somebody know, will the following only list mounted filesystem or also entries from some files like fstab or so:
[21:40] <perplexity> is there an existing ubuntu pkg build for bash 5?
[21:40] <IniGit> findmnt --evaluate UUID=<uuid>
[21:40] <IniGit> ?
[21:40] <perplexity> or how can i access such files via apt-get at the command line without editing my sources.list
[21:42] <OerHeks> perplexity, no bash5 packages available yet, build it from source?? http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/bash/
[21:42] <OerHeks> it has just been released
[21:43] <perplexity> yep exactly what ill have to do
[21:43] <perplexity> OerHeks, any specific install path i should use for such packages being installed locally
[21:43] <OerHeks> maybe make a PPA out of it, to share with others?
[21:43] <perplexity> i need to learn ubuntu's fs heirarchy
[21:43] <OerHeks> !build
[21:45] <tomreyn> IniGit: only mounted, based on my testing (and it's not difficult to test).
[21:48] <IniGit> tomreyn: I also tested it, but I thought maybe there is something that I missed to test and I should ask people who know Ubuntu better then me and probagbly know the code :)
[21:49] <IniGit> I plan to dig into source files soon after I know C a little bit better
[21:52] <tomreyn> IniGit: i have not checked the source code, either, and am not sure i know ubuntu better than you do. ;-)
[21:56] <IniGit> tomreyn: :)
[21:57] <IniGit> I think I should use the  /etc/mtab file
[21:57] <IniGit> to be sure
[22:03] <TJ-> IniGit: default without options is --kernel (so mounts only)
[22:03] <IniGit> TJ-: Good to know thank you
[22:09] <IniGit> TJ-: SO there is no difference wheter I use --mtab or the default when I only want mounted partitions?
[22:09] <TJ-> IniGit: that depends if mtab has been updated
[22:11] <IniGit> TJ-: Is it normally updated correctly like file that --kernel references?
[22:11] <IniGit> TJ-: Or are there potential issues with mtab?
[22:12] <IniGit> And should I better use the default?
[22:12] <TJ-> IniGit: depends - not if the /etc/ is on a read-only FS
[22:12] <TJ-> IniGit: also the mtab content may differe from what the findmnt process sees in-kernel due to namespaces
[22:14] <IniGit> TJ-: I'm not so familiar with that chroot namespace stuff, but I assume that this is only the case when I alter something right and by default both should give me the same result when /etc/ is ro?
[22:17] <TJ-> IniGit: if your command were running in a container it may not see a consistent view depending on how the container is configured, so if you need to be bullet-proof you need to consider that kind of issue
[22:18] <IniGit> TJ-: Does that mean I should use what – mtab?
[22:20] <TJ-> IniGit: mtab is a file that may not be correct, kernel would be my preferred source of authority
[22:20] <IniGit> TJ-: ok thanks
[22:23] <aldcor> what the hell is reality?
[22:23] <leftyfb> aldcor: This is an ubuntu support channel. Feel free to chat in #ubuntu-offtopic
[22:26] <repz> Hi there, is there an easy way to change / manage plymouth theme without doing it manually?
[22:28] <aldcor> leftyfb, hehe i know :)
[22:31] <OerHeks> repz, not really, https://askubuntu.com/questions/1046370/how-to-change-boot-splash-screen-in-18-04
[22:32] <repz> sad in 2018 :(
[22:40] <repz> Or any way to see all of them at a glance ?
[23:49] <Glorfindel> Hello, how does one find the UUID of a device?
[23:50] <snowgoggles> Glorfindel: blkid
[23:51] <Glorfindel> so basically badr_ is trying to follow this: https://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-to-mount-an-encrypted-linux-home-directory-to-salvage-data/ to recover data, and I am asking the questions for them as the don't speak very good english
[23:51] <Glorfindel> though I think they could manage :)
[23:51] <Glorfindel> badr_: can you run the command snowgoggles shared?
[23:53] <badr_> Glorfindel: yes this is well