[16:04] <studio-user163> Hello,  the Tunderbolt 3 no worked on ubuntu studio 18.04, have install bolt and bolt debug but my soundcard in not found, help me please, have realy need of this fonction beacause I receive artists in 3 day Thanks Matthieu,
[16:15] <m_ad[m]> check in Software & Updates to see if it finds Additional Drivers. If not i'm not able to help any further since i'm not familiar with Thunderbolt at all.
[16:18] <OvenWerks> studio-user163: looking at: https://thunderbolttechnology.net/blog/thunderbolt-3-usb-c-does-it-all I see lots about video and so far nothing about audio... I'm confused. Do you have more details?
[16:19] <m_ad[m]> i said to look in Software & Updates on your Ubuntu Studio install, there's a tab with Additional Drivers which checks for missing drivers that might need to be installed
[16:22] <studio-user163>  Thanks for your answer, well I know there is a procedure to execute with boltd (form deaemon) but I start on linux and I'm lost..
[16:24] <m_ad[m]> did you check Software & Updates for additional drivers yet or not?
[16:29] <studio-user163> yes i come to do Thanks but, my souncard always no work,   was related to intel and intel and the creator of thunderbolt so his must have a link
[16:29] <OvenWerks> you have a thunderbolt audio device?
[16:30] <studio-user163> yes  y  have
[16:31] <studio-user163> is discrete 4 from antelope
[16:32] <OvenWerks> alsa for thunderbolt is still very early days.
[16:33] <studio-user163>  too early ?
[16:37] <m_ad[m]> it's still in it's early stages of development is what OvenWerks meant i guess
[16:37] <OvenWerks> I don't know to be honest.
[16:41] <studio-user163> Ok thanks for all we are cool :)
[16:42] <OvenWerks> It does seem to have a USB port have you tried that
[16:43] <studio-user163> yes USB Port worked but have too more latency
[16:44] <OvenWerks> How much is too much?
[16:45] <OvenWerks> USB2 has enough speed to have reasonable latency for pretty much any use even with 32 channels
[16:48] <studio-user163> realy ? in MAO  he says to himself than beyond to 10 ms latency not is good, and my i am at 23ms..
[16:48] <OvenWerks> you should be able to get 5ish ms
[16:48] <OvenWerks> ya 23 is too high.
[16:49] <OvenWerks> at about 20 ms my playing as a bass player suffers.
[16:49] <OvenWerks> (timing wise)
[16:50] <OvenWerks> This only true for live use as a guitar effect or synth (though for synth use it can be a bit higher)
[16:50] <studio-user163> haha normal,
[16:50] <OvenWerks> for recording with proper monitoring much higher latency is fine.
[16:51] <OvenWerks> Recording with 43ms works fine for example.
[16:52] <OvenWerks> so long as monitoring of the inputs happens before the computer.
[16:52] <OvenWerks> (most audio devices allow this if they are made for computer DAW work)
[16:52] <studio-user163> yes but for live singing 23ms is complicated
[16:53] <OvenWerks> Again, what is your exact use? are you using this on stage or in a studio?
[16:55] <studio-user163> Studio  my use is purely studio
[16:55] <OvenWerks> I was not able to look at a manual for your device on line so I don't know that well.
[16:55] <OvenWerks> so you should not be monitoring through the audio device.
[16:56] <OvenWerks> you want to hear prerecorded material from the computer, but the audio you are recording should be monitored before
[16:56] <OvenWerks> In my case (I have older stuff) I use an external mixer.
[16:57] <OvenWerks> but your audio device should have a mixer built in
[17:00] <studio-user163>  I do not understand everything but basically it does not matter if I record at 23ms (my soundcard lock at 44100Hz and 1024 buff) in my daw have melange but no in my audio device
[17:01] <OvenWerks> they do advertize "expert monitoring" so you should be able to do local monitoring. at the input
[17:04] <OvenWerks> The thing to remember about latency, is that the audio device is not the roadbloack to latency. Many audio plugins (VST and LV2) require higher latency just so they have enough data to work with at a time.
[17:04] <OvenWerks> Also, as latency goes down CPU usage goes up.
[17:05] <OvenWerks> Many people record raw with no effects at lower latency and then mix with a higher latency
[17:10] <studio-user163> Ok thanks i understand but if  record only the voices but if that I did my treatment in parallel so no active plugin 23ms in native is too much or not?
[17:12] <OvenWerks> There are two ways of monitoring: all audio goes through the computer and daw. or the input audio is recorded by the daw but not monitored through the daw. Rather it goes directly to the monitors from the audio IF and so has zero latency.
[17:12] <OvenWerks> For best results you want to use the second method.
[17:13] <OvenWerks> So you have instrument in and listen to direct instrument out. You also listen to Daw out but only the material you are playing along with.
[17:13] <OvenWerks> Not what you are recording.
[17:14] <OvenWerks> The DAW, if it is any good at all, compensates for the latency with no input from the user.
[17:14] <OvenWerks>  so when you play back what you have just recorded it is in time with everything else.
[17:19] <OvenWerks> Most people do studio recording with latency up around 45ms but use external monitoring either with the audio device itself (which it looks like you should be able to do) or an external mixer.
[17:20] <studio-user163>  431/5000 Ok thank you very much for the time you have spent me I did not understand everything but I will watch tutorials on latency to better understand this principle, I think the latency was something that only limited by the hardware, and that it was not something that we could do the impasse, I have a last question if I reduce latency on my Daw I do not risk to have clipping?
[17:20] <OvenWerks> I use a mixer because I happen to have one and because my audio device is line in only and so I need the mixer to give mic pre
[17:20] <OvenWerks> latency and clipping are not related
[17:21] <OvenWerks> latency and under/overruns are related (also called xruns)
[17:23] <OvenWerks> With a 24 bit device, just record with the level about -15 or -20 and you will never have clipping. boost the level inside the daw and normalize the final.
[17:23]  * OvenWerks is going to have breakfast with his Yf
[17:23] <OvenWerks> back later...
[17:26] <studio-user163> Ok good beakfast thanks for all you use what as device  ?
[18:37] <OvenWerks> I have a Delta 66 (PCI). It can reliably do .7ms at 48000 sample rate with the right system tweaks... however, when you add the internal latency inside the delta 66 it is 1.7. There is 1 ms from the adc to the PCI bus. I have an ART USB device where it is .65 ms or so. All devices have some internal latency. So the number that qjackctl or Ardour gives you is just the latency the computer
[18:37] <OvenWerks> introduces, not the total
[18:38] <OvenWerks> USB is limited to 1 ms or higher (2ms at least in practice) because it's clock is 1ms.
[18:44] <OvenWerks> I know a number of people that get 2ms latency from their USB devices (32/3) but generally it takes tweaking. I find for anything less than about 3 ms I need to turn hyperthreading off, "Boost" off, set the governor to performance. Choose the USB port with care (one that is not sharing irq with anything else), set that USB port with a higher priority, turn cron off, etc.
[18:46] <OvenWerks> Having a USB mouse with the same priority or using the same USB port can give xruns when you move the mouse as an example.