[00:00] i mean gtk has a future (not a particular bright one if you ask me, but whatever) but lxde really doesn't [00:01] any reference for your point of view? [00:02] yeah, they don't fix their bugs, development is almost halted to a stand still, and they're not gtk3 compliant [00:02] i still use lxde for 18.04 for reliability esp on old box [00:04] oh noted, afaik the gtk3 is a toolkit for developing the lxde ... then lxde still use old gtk … cmiiw [00:05] gtk3 is the latest version of the toolkit that lxde is built on, but lxde doesn't use it [00:06] what's the main reason? [00:07] well A. it's hard, especially when you want to make it low-resource usage and B. their main developer left. see also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GTK#Criticism [00:09] looks like an one man show [00:10] also fyi GTK4 is on the horizon [00:10] so they're way behind the times [00:12] Hong Jen Yee, developer of LXDE (the GTK version of which will be dropped and all efforts focused on the Qt port[30]), expressed disdain for version 3 of the GTK toolkit's radical API changes and increased memory usage, and ported PCMan File Manager (PCManFM) to Qt. PCManFM is being developed with a GTK and with a Qt backend at the [00:12] same time.[31] [00:12] @ShiBonCip [Hong Jen Yee, developer of LXDE (the GTK version of which will be dropped and al …], that's why i got two kind of pcmanfm [00:12] on 16.04 box [00:14] 64% complete on GTK4 https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/milestones/1 [00:18] they just released 3.96.0 earlier this month, so they're running out of numbers quickly XD [00:18] @ShiBonCip [on 16.04 box], looks like here i have gtk3 installed …

 … ii  libgtk-3-0:amd64                              3.18.9-1ubuntu3.3                                         amd64        GTK+ graphical user interface library            ii  libgtk-3-bin                                  3.18.9-1ubuntu3.3
[00:18]                         amd64        programs for the GTK+ graphical user interface li … brary

[00:19] ```ii libgtk-3-0:amd64 3.18.9-1ubuntu3.3 amd64 GTK+ graphical user interface library ii libgtk-3-bin 3.18.9-1ubuntu3.3 amd64 programs for the GTK+ graphical user int [00:19] erface li … brary``` [00:19] @wxl [ they just released 3.96.0 earlier this month, so they're running out of nu …], that's means they are still developing [00:20] well they could do .991 [00:21] heh yep [00:23] also the gtk developers are insane. proof: https://blogs.gnome.org/desrt/2016/06/13/gtk-4-0-is-not-gtk-4/ [00:24] tl;dr "GTK 4" doesn't land until about 18 months after the release of 4.0, as 4.6 [00:28] ahhh ic ... that's why pidgin is overthrown from the irc client because of this GTK things [00:30] LXQt uses Qt. so we've worked hard at trying to use Qt apps. [00:30] theming is way easier that way too [00:31] @wxl [ LXQt uses Qt. so we've worked hard at trying to use Qt apps.], make sense [00:32] btw /dev/sdb1 1.6G 1.6G 0 100% /media/chika.tambun/Lubuntu 19.04 amd64 ... the disk complain abt read only ... is it normal? [00:33] afaik the disk capacity is over 10Gb [00:33] depends on how you mounted it but you won't be writing to it very easily if it's 100% full XD [00:33] sdb represents the DISK, but sdb1 represents a PARTITION of that disk [00:36] strange partition after usb-disk-creator [00:36] it's just 32GB usb flashdisk [00:37] wonder is it still bootable [00:43] @ShiBonCip [strange partition after usb-disk-creator], is it normal? [00:47] @ShiBonCip [strange partition after usb-disk-creator], last time for installation from usb disk ... what's the tool for creating the installer wxl? === lubuntu is now known as Guest82173 [06:23] hi. i have nettop acer ao725 with lubuntu 18.04. On boot the touchpad is disabled and i need press Fn+F7 to enable it. how to enable touchpad at boot ? === caribou is now known as Guest23822 [16:49] d/back [16:49] oops [16:50] fail, wxl. :P [16:50] @ShiBonCip i use `dd` :) [17:35] when i press f11 terminal enters fullscreen but when i click view the rectangle is not filled blue [17:35] it is only filled blue if i click fullscreen from the menu item there. [17:35] is this a bug or a feature? [17:45] version? [17:50] wxl: QTerminal 0.9.0 [17:50] so lubuntu 19.04 then [17:50] 19.10 i think [17:50] you're using the unreleased development version? [17:51] * sappheiros checks how to check ubuntu version [17:51] ohhhhhh [17:51] lsb_release -a [17:51] 18.10 i guess i meant ... lol since it's not october yet ... i'll try that command now, thanks, sorry [17:51] 18.10 is EoL. you need to upgrade to 19.04 [17:52] oops. i think i hit ctrl+shift+t and instead of opening a new tab it closed weechat returning to prompt ... yes, 18.10 cosmic. [17:53] i tried full upgrade clicking in muon package manager -- why can't i upgrade to 19.04 through the muon package manager "full upgrade" button? [17:53] thank you for alerting me to this new release [17:58] you prefer we use LXQt rather than 18.04 LTS's LXDE, right? [17:58] i mean, would it help you develop it if we did? [17:59] (i have 32-bit computer) [18:01] sappheiros: muon's for updating packages, not updating versions of the whole os. [18:01] and yes, you should use lxqt. lxde is dead in the water any way you cut it. [18:02] are the developers happy about this? or does it feel like "all that work has been made obsolete"? [18:02] !32-bit | sappheiros [18:02] ugh [18:02] !32 [18:02] !32bit [18:02] Lubuntu 18.04 LTS is the last version to support 32-bit processors & will be supported until 2021. Support is highly limited, as we no longer provide images nor test packages for 32-bit. No other Ubuntu flavor offers 32-bit support. Discussion has been had to remove 32-bit packages from the archive. If `grep lm /proc/cpuinfo` succeeds, use 64-bit. [18:02] that [18:02] oh, darn. [18:03] last i read, i think from the lubuntu.me site, "32-bit users are needed, and development may cease if there aren't enough giving feedback" [18:03] i'm going to have a party when 18.04 support ends [18:03] lol [18:03] i am so happy to wash my hands of lxde [18:03] so then the decision was made after all, huh? ... [18:03] oh really? [18:03] uh yeah, it's on the blog [18:03] https://lubuntu.me/sunsetting-i386/ [18:03] thanks [18:04] so should i _downgrade_ from 18.10 to 18.04 so that when i have problems, asking for help will at least be officially-sanctioned? [18:04] to put it another way, is there a higher risk of wasting time asking for 18.10 help as a 32-bit user? [18:05] > Lubuntu 19.04 and future versions will not see a release for the i386 architecture [18:06] but ... i'm using it now ...? [18:06] aoeutnaoehu [18:06] sorry [18:06] 18.10, not 19.04, something seems wrong with my brain [18:07] * sappheiros reads https://lubuntu.me/taking-a-new-direction/ [18:07] you're wasting time using 32 bit no matter how you look at it [18:07] wxl: i cannot afford a new computer [18:07] but we will not be releasing any images/isos of lubuntu any more [18:08] i'm having a second problem now where opening a new tab instead erases the current terminal tab, closing weechat and returning me to the prompt [18:08] there are still 32 bit packages in the archives, so if you keep upgrading, you'll be ok...... until they're removed. that talk has been going on for a while, but it's coming soon for sure. [18:08] well you should upgrade to a supported release (19.04) and then come back if you have problems [18:09] from your perspective, it doesn't matter whether i askd for help with 18.10 or 18.04? [18:09] 18.04 is supported. 18.10 isn't. [18:09] or i shouldn't ask for help at all until i upgrade to 19.04? [18:09] okay. [18:09] thank you for clarifying. [18:09] BUT lxde is only as supported as it can be [18:09] augh lol [18:09] for example, i know of a problem with the file manager crashing that requires upstream support and there is none [18:10] sounds like lxqt 18.10 is no longer supported, 18.04 lxde is supported but you'd rather not [18:10] i issued a bug report about it and haven't even received a response. [18:10] ah [18:10] gotcha [18:10] upstream means debian people? [18:10] the way to look at 18.04 is it's basically stuck the way it is, bugs and all [18:10] upstream means the developers of lxde [18:10] oh. [18:10] which are a really, really, really small group [18:11] what should i do with my 32-bit computers once i can afford a 64-bit Raspberry pi? [18:11] should i keep for win xp and win 7 OS? [18:11] or can those be run on wine? [18:12] well don't get confused.. a 64-bit pi can't take a "64-bit" ubuntu image [18:12] waaaaaaaat [18:12] 64-bit in our case means intel/amd, not arm [18:12] thank you for telling me ;_; [18:13] we do have a lubuntu pi image but it's way behind. [18:13] and we don't fully support it exactly as it's created through a project by the developer of mate [18:13] i would also not use xp as it's a security problem [18:14] and windows 7+ are resource hogs, so that's probably not great for you [18:14] i'd say save up, really [18:14] well, there are a few software that require xp, or win 7 respectively -- i would not use web browsers with them [18:14] sappheiros, antiX OS < check out. [18:14] wxl I think you mean vista+ [18:14] i wouldn't even hook xp to the internet, period [18:15] lynorian: true, but i don't think vista is supported anymore is it? i guess windows users don't ever seem to care XD [18:15] thanks for the advice ... ... so how does someone get a cheap linux laptop for their child? i thought $35 raspberry pi + lubuntu was the way to go [18:15] it's cheap, but it requires a specialized os. [18:16] you can't just put anything on it. [18:16] i'd say to check in with your local electronics recycler. i know the one by me you could even earn a laptop (and not a half bad one) just by donating some of your time [18:16] and you get to learn valuable skills along the way [18:22] 'k thanks ... ... ... i was hoping to get my sister to get her son a cheap linux laptop to play GCompris suite on and get into coding [18:22] but seems cheap $100 laptops on amazon.com get you stuck with a 32-bit dell d620 that everyone hates ... ... and basically i have no idea how to get a cheap laptop for that purpose -- maybe there are no cheap laptops, only expensive ones that broke in a minor way given to repair shops, if that's what you implied [18:23] or they're donated [18:23] mm. as for me, i wanted a cheap laptop i could take in public and not worry if it gets stolen [18:23] at our recycler, they often get donations from corporate entities [18:23] oh wow [18:24] my work has even repurposed such machines [18:24] seems only big cities have those? [18:24] i think it's only the cities where people are interested in running such a program XD [18:24] most i know hate "agenda 21, new world order trying to make everyone live in big cities", but it seems better as far as i can tell ... [18:24] oh [18:44] it's still actually not clear to me whether i should downgrade to 18.04. do you have an opinion on which (18.04 or 18.10) works _better_ for 32-bit? i think you recommended 18.10 because it was lxqt and you felt lxqt worked better than lxde [18:45] and i think i remember it running faster indeed [18:45] i think 18.10 also has the menu bar -search-to-find-app feature and that 18.04 lacked this option [18:45] isn't that correct? then, i should stay with 18.10 even though it's no longer supported, i think [18:46] but does it follow that i should stop asking here and #ubuntu for assistance? [19:16] sappheiros: nope, upgrade to 19.04 and you're good [19:17] lol that seems deliberately vague [19:17] upgrade to 19.04 and we'll keep supporting you here [19:17] it will provide you a better experience overall [19:17] i understand that, but my question is which OS would be better for me to use until i can upgrade [19:17] unless you mean 32-bit is okay for 19.04 [19:18] is it possible to install 19.04 on 32-bit? [19:18] stay with what you have. don't downgrade. that's just a waste of time [19:18] yes and no. there's no image for 19.04 but you can upgrade your 18.10. [19:18] i often do muon package manager's full upgrade [19:18] is that what you mean? [19:18] that's an upgrade of packages, not an upgrade of versions [19:19] https://manual.lubuntu.me/D/upgrading.html [19:24] thanks. i'll backup my files and try the upgrade, perhaps next month. === lubuntu is now known as Guest40619