| alkisg | Hi, is it possible to install chromium-browser without snap in 20.04? I'm guessing "no", but shouldn't at least the debian package be offered in universe? | 06:29 |
|---|---|---|
| dax | not from ubuntu repositories, i have no idea whether it's a PPA somewhere (and wouldn't recommend it if it were) | 06:34 |
| alkisg | Thank you dax; I'll search where I can file a bug report for it; I don't see any reason to block a specific debian package from reaching ubuntu users, unless it's just to force snap... | 06:34 |
| dax | it's deliberate behavior, and filing a bug report seems like a waste of time | 06:35 |
| alkisg | The official excuse is "we don't have resources to provide security updates", but that isn't valid for packages in universe, afaik | 06:36 |
| alkisg | I'm not asking them to put it in main, so I think that specific concern hasn't been voiced | 06:36 |
| lotuspsychje | since 19.10 chromium is a snap right? | 06:37 |
| alkisg | Maybe; I'm not really following non-LTS releases | 06:37 |
| alkisg | (heya lotuspsychje btw :)) | 06:37 |
| alkisg | Found it: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium/+bug/1855594 | 06:38 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1855594 in chromium (Ubuntu) "Sync chromium 78.0.3904.108-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] | 06:38 |
| tarzeau | dax: i'm building my own .debs of it for ubuntu meanwhile | 06:39 |
| alkisg | tarzeau: if you have them in a PPA, we'd prefer them to google's chrome, until this ubuntu mess gets properly resolved :) | 06:40 |
| tarzeau | dax: it's causing problems for computers that run the browser for days, weeks, months (with it's updates breaking running versions in memory) | 06:40 |
| tarzeau | alkisg: i've been reporting that since 19.04 when they started the shit | 06:40 |
| alkisg | I think this ^ issue is the way to go | 06:41 |
| tarzeau | alkisg: we use reprepro with our own webserver, so no PPA sorry | 06:41 |
| lotuspsychje | there IS a 20.04 opinion going on recently, maybe we should mass vote chromium back into the repos? | 06:41 |
| alkisg | I've been thinking about that for months too, but today I though this solution, and someone else had thought it before me... | 06:41 |
| tarzeau | lotuspsychje: it's a company, they don't care | 06:41 |
| alkisg | lotuspsychje: I certainly will; I have the voting tab open :) | 06:41 |
| alkisg | tarzeau: companies of course care about both users and contributors | 06:41 |
| tarzeau | i've been thinking to migrate our workstations back to debian because of that reason | 06:41 |
| alkisg | E.g. I produce a lot of software and make sure its runs fine on ubuntu; if ubuntu stops caring, then I'll stop caring too | 06:42 |
| tarzeau | ubuntu hardly produces a lot of software, they copy packaged software from debian and rebuild it | 06:42 |
| lotuspsychje | alkisg: i also understand tarzeau chromium going snap for his users, isnt very convient (auto-updates) | 06:43 |
| alkisg | Why would the debian package auto-update? | 06:43 |
| lotuspsychje | the snap auto updates | 06:43 |
| alkisg | Didn't tarzeau say that he's not using the snap version? | 06:43 |
| alkisg | Also, if a sysadmin installs the snap, then it autoupdates for each user separately?! | 06:44 |
| lotuspsychje | yeah i mean before it was going snap, he used the repo one for his users | 06:44 |
| tarzeau | we remove snap and netplan, and gnome-software | 06:44 |
| tarzeau | and patch gnome-control-center | 06:44 |
| alkisg | Yeah same here; except, using mate, so no gnome* at all | 06:44 |
| alkisg | I think that bug above is the correct place to focus our concern; I'll tell my users to comment there | 06:46 |
| lotuspsychje | good idea | 06:46 |
| tarzeau | alkisg: liked (also affects me, and 1000+ users) | 06:47 |
| lotuspsychje | im really a big fan of leaving the users the choice | 06:48 |
| tarzeau | i'm a fan of consistency, stability, and the tools one needs to get work done | 06:50 |
| * alkisg sees no point in having 2 package managers | 06:50 | |
| alkisg | If .deb has something wrong, then work to resolve that or completely replace that | 06:50 |
| tarzeau | alkisg: i agree | 06:51 |
| alkisg | Also I don't like the snap design, I think the deb design is a lot superior | 06:51 |
| lotuspsychje | i think the main goal with snaps, is they want easy maintain their software, and it doesnt react the same way as the deb ones | 06:52 |
| lotuspsychje | the you get the mass complaints | 06:52 |
| tarzeau | i wouldn't mind if they replaced snap with spack | 06:52 |
| tarzeau | https://spack.io/ | 06:52 |
| === pavlushka_ is now known as pavlushka | ||
| * alkisg just answered the survey, noting this issue as well as others | 07:46 | |
| tarzeau | +1 | 07:48 |
| tarzeau | what were your other issues? | 07:48 |
| tarzeau | alkisg: so will you stop making ltsp ppa, and only do everything with official packages? https://ltsp.org/docs/ppa/ | 07:50 |
| alkisg | tarzeau: heh, for example another of the issues I reported was "make it easier for upstream/motu to provide backports", which is basically what I'm solving with the ppa | 07:50 |
| tarzeau | ah it's just backports, not the recommend pkg (it's clear for debian, not so much for ubuntu) | 07:51 |
| alkisg | No, the ppa won't go away, as the ltsp nature is sensitive to other package upgrades, and it needs frequent updates | 07:51 |
| tarzeau | but suppose i have 20.04 (unreleased) i can go with the official package i guess | 07:51 |
| alkisg | Of course, and in debian bullseye too | 07:51 |
| alkisg | You won't get ltsp-binaries, but you'll only lose memtest that way, nothing important | 07:51 |
| alkisg | Example, a systemd/netplan update made clients not work a few months ago; an ltsp update in the ppa fixed that | 07:52 |
| alkisg | Without the ppa, you'd just be stuck with unbootable clients | 07:52 |
| alkisg | (that was for ltsp5) | 07:52 |
| alkisg | I might stop the ltsp ppa and switch back to only using the greek schools ppa though in the distant future, we'll see | 07:53 |
| alkisg | (greek schools ppa = ubuntu only, while ltsp ppa = debian too) | 07:53 |
| tarzeau | when there's no more ldm, what does it look like by default? | 07:53 |
| alkisg | Like normal ubuntu, e.g. gdm, lightdm... | 07:54 |
| tarzeau | (i haven't set up 19 yet, our apprenticeship will do with 20.04) | 07:54 |
| tarzeau | and rdp is also still supported and kiosk mode (autologin)? | 07:54 |
| alkisg | Maybe we should be talking in #ltsp about these... | 07:54 |
| alkisg | Autologin, yes. No screen scripts anymore; they're to be replaced by user sessions | 07:55 |
| alkisg | So you can define /usr/share/xsession/something.desktop that does whatever you like | 07:55 |
| tarzeau | ah i see, ok that's great | 07:55 |
| tarzeau | alkisg: are annoyed by https://popcon.ubuntu.com/ not being up to date/wrong? | 07:58 |
| alkisg | Nah, this is opt-in, its results aren't accurate anyway | 07:58 |
| alkisg | I'd love to see the server stats though | 07:58 |
| alkisg | E.g. "how many downloads of the xxx.deb package on each update?" | 07:59 |
| tarzeau | it should have a big fat red blinking warning: this data is outdated, there's certainly not more i386 ubuntu users than amd64 | 07:59 |
| alkisg | In greece we have 10000 i386 PCs and 1000 amd64 :P | 08:00 |
| alkisg | E.g. school labs with ltsp and nine 64bit clients, and one 32bit, use i386 arch... | 08:00 |
| tarzeau | and that's debian based? | 09:00 |
| tarzeau | or ubuntu? (asking because of the i386 bit) | 09:00 |
| alkisg | Most are ubuntu so far, so up to 18.04 | 09:01 |
| alkisg | Many schools got new computers, so for 20.04 we'll probably switch to amd64 | 09:01 |
| === Seveas_ is now known as Seveas | ||
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!