[03:55] <n3pla2000> Weird thing... I get an error report in lubuntu, but never a told whet it is. A pop up dialog asks if I want to report the error or cancel. Everything seems to work, however when copying files, I see no progress dialog, and vlc and some other program appear without window frames around them. No maximize, minimize, or exit buttons, title bar or left
[03:55] <n3pla2000> hand program logo. Can this be fixed?
[03:58] <wxl> n3pla2000: re: error tracker, whoopsie is weird at times but don't worry, it's aggregating data https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ErrorTracker
[03:58] <wxl> n3pla2000: regarding other issues, which version of lubuntu?
[03:58] <n3pla2000> Also the error message appears at random times, not the same time I start vlc or other programs. Firefox, and others have window frames, including controls
[03:58] <wxl> could be background daemons
[03:59] <n3pla2000> wxl human or bot?
[03:59] <wxl> i'm a bot please don't think i'm intelligent
[03:59]  * wxl rolls his eyes so far in the back of his head they look forward
 wxl's a living being :P
 but details are important sooooooooo :P
[04:00] <wxl> oh come now don't give away my secrets
[04:01] <wxl> i'm gonna get an oscar for this caliber of acting
[04:01] <n3pla2000> how do I determine what the error is? has to be a log somewhere
[04:01] <wxl> you can try looking if anything is in /var/crash to start
 what wxl doesn't know is I control his thoughts as he's been assimilated into my collective :P  (Sorry I like to joke with wxl a bit, ignore me :P )
[04:04] <n3pla2000> see one for two no window controls around some programs in lubuntuprograms, and one I do not recognise... _usr_bin_mandb.6.crash
[04:05] <wxl> having a crash in the manual page database sounds exceptionally strange
[04:05] <wxl> what version of lubuntu do you have?
 @wxl [<wxl> having a crash in the manual page database sounds exceptionally strange], not too unusual if you have an OOM situation during installs, but it is definitely unusual.
[04:07] <wxl> there's always exceptions to the rule but that just smells bad to me
[04:08] <wxl> you usually have files in /var/crash that haven't been properly processed. you can run `ubuntu-bug /var/crash/_usr_bin_mandb.6.crash` to take care of that. then it will stop bugging you.
 i'm curious what other crashes are present there though
 since you indicate that there's other ones around some of the other lubuntu programs
[04:08] <n3pla2000> 18.04
[04:08] <wxl> ah the ancient version yay
[04:09] <wxl> what is the value of $XDG_SESSION_DESKTOP /
[04:14] <n3pla2000> typed ubuntu-bug command in and got a dialog that actually explained it was a mandb error. and was able to hit send. previously got error messages without explaination but could still send. can the lack of dialog boxes or file copies or the like of window frame work around some windows be caused by what ever crashed mandb?
[04:14] <n3pla2000> hold will get XDG_SESS....
[04:14] <wxl> unlikely
[04:15] <n3pla2000> Lubuntu
[04:16] <n3pla2000> only had three now have more: _usr_bin_deluge-gtk.1000.crash  _usr_bin_mandb.6.crash   _usr_bin_mandb.6.uploaded_usr_bin_gnome-mpv.1000.crash   _usr_bin_mandb.6.upload
 nah, actually, the mandb files indicate uploads.
[04:17] <n3pla2000> not worried about deluge aware of why it crashed
 which is not unusual for when you do the `ubuntu-bug` command on the crash file
[04:18] <n3pla2000> pretty sure why gnome-mpv cashedr
[04:18] <wxl> you can delete the mandb ones
[04:18] <wxl> what does /etc/alternatives/x-window-manager point to?
[04:20] <n3pla2000> no such file or directory
[04:21] <wxl> did you type that wrong, because that's pretty remarkable
[04:21] <n3pla2000> may be a problem with cd command
[04:22] <wxl> how long have you had this install?
[04:22] <n3pla2000> openbox
[04:24] <wxl> what theme name are you using if you do something like `grep -A 3 \<theme\> ~/.config/openbox/lubuntu-rc.xml`?
[04:24] <n3pla2000> week or two ubuntu and kubuntu was so slow I could listen to an entire song after selecting a program and still not have it appear on screen, chose lubuntu not machine is responsive
[04:25] <wxl> have you always had such problems?
[04:25] <wxl> i.e. the window decoration issues
[04:26] <n3pla2000> no window decoration problems in other "buntus" or suse, just slower than molasses in winter
[04:26] <wxl> i'm talking about since you started lubuntu
[04:27] <n3pla2000> Mikachu
[04:27] <wxl> ah ok so you are using some weird theme. you can ask whoever cursed you with that for support :)
[04:28] <n3pla2000> when I first used vlc it has window decorations, but some where along the lines they stopped
[04:28] <n3pla2000> Mikachu was pre-installed, and looked nice
[04:28] <n3pla2000> it looks nice around my browser right now
[04:29] <wxl> um
[04:29] <wxl> Lubuntu doesn't not preinstall Mikachu
[04:29] <n3pla2000> every program I am using right not has window decorations
[04:29] <n3pla2000> I did not install it
[04:29] <wxl> then what's the problem again?
[04:31] <wxl> Mikachu is an option, but we don't have it installed by default
[04:31] <wxl> i've never tested it so ymmv
[04:31] <n3pla2000> no window decorations around some programs, looks more like no windows around them. Means I can not move a program to another part of the screen
 alt+space
 and use the menu
[04:32] <wxl> you say every program you use has window decorations but then you say you don't?
 also can readd decorations that way hopefully
[04:32] <wxl> in any case i would restore the openbox configuration
[04:32] <wxl> the defaults are in /etc/xdg/openbox/rc.xml
[04:34] <n3pla2000> must right click application on the kicker to get menu, and it had no move feature. alt+space option did show move, but no window decorations
[04:35] <n3pla2000> ok I used alt+space to move the program vlc
[04:35] <n3pla2000> the window decorations were off the screen
[04:36] <n3pla2000> how do I keep them from going off screen like that
[04:36] <wxl> don't move them there?
[04:36] <n3pla2000> obviously NOT a window decoration problem after all
[04:36] <n3pla2000> did not move it there
[04:37] <n3pla2000> it appears that way when the program opens... that is why I though the window decorations were not workig
[04:37] <wxl> well the window decorations don't just separate from the window…
[04:38] <wxl> they're not a separate element. they're intricately tied to the window itself
[04:38] <n3pla2000> not but I have seen programs with out windows decorations before... happened when a gtk program opened and somethin was missing from gtk
[04:38] <wxl> perhaps we're having a misunderstanding? try a screenshot
[04:41] <n3pla2000> tried using keyboard to do screen shot, no result. may not have screen shot installed
[04:41] <wxl> use `scrot`
[04:42] <n3pla2000> scrot failed
[04:43] <n3pla2000> anyway problem is resolved. It is simple opening programs with the title bar off screen
[04:44] <n3pla2000> no window should be allowed to open partially off screen
[04:45] <wxl> i've certainy never seen one that does, but like i said, we might be talking about two different things
[04:45] <wxl> anyways, glad all is resolved. good night
[04:46] <n3pla2000> thanks guys... sometimes I think programmers forget some basic things, having a program open partly of fully off the screen is something that guarded against
[04:47] <n3pla2000> mine was opening with the title bar and decorations off screen and could only close it using the kicker / taskbar entyr
[04:48] <wxl> until you can show me a picture, i can't really help you any further
[04:48] <wxl> scros is the screenshot utility in lubuntu, which i know also works
[04:48] <wxl> scrot i mean
[04:48] <n3pla2000> I no longer need it. scrot did not work
[04:48] <wxl> it's quite possible given all the strange issues you're having that you have a bad install. if you didn't check the validity of your installation media, that may be the problem
[04:48] <wxl> you might have all sorts of problems lurking around
[04:49] <wxl> and furthermore the theme you're using is entirely untested by us, so there's that. you could easily restore the default configuration to determine whether or not that's the problem
[04:49] <n3pla2000> I burned it to a thumbdrive. same as I used to install other OSes and they work fine
[04:50] <n3pla2000> Yeah, musthave been tested by someone, came with my installation
[04:51] <wxl> that means nothing if you didn't check the installation media itself, i.e. ensure that you copied the exact right installation image and that there were no copy or download errors
[04:51] <wxl> if you didn't check, you simply cannot verify that you have a proper installation
[04:51] <wxl> i'm telling you the Lubuntu team has never tested that theme. we only ever tested the Lubuntu theme.
[04:51] <wxl> the rest come with openbox and openbox has been pretty much undeveloped for a long, long time
[04:58] <n3pla2000> Artwix-boxed, Bear2, Breeze-ob, Clearlooks, Clearlooks-3.4, Clearlooks-Olive, Lubuntu Arc, Lubuntu-dark-panel, Lubuntu-default, Lubuntu-small, Mikachu, Natura, Nightmare, Nightmare-01, Nightmare-02, Nightmare-03, Onyx, Onyx-Citrus, Orang, Syscrash are all listed in the Openbox Configuration Manaer
[04:58] <n3pla2000> Manager
[04:58] <wxl> yep, they come from openbox
[04:59] <wxl> and openbox hasn't been developed in a long time as i said
[04:59] <wxl> look at the versions.. they are all 3.6.1 https://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=openbox
[04:59] <n3pla2000> Please note Mikachu is in that list, I have NOT installed any additional themes, just selected one
[04:59] <wxl> and it's been that way for nearly half a decade https://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/o/openbox/openbox_3.6.1-8/changelog
[05:00] <wxl> i have no reason to believe that theme isn't part of your problem
[05:00] <wxl> i also have no reason to believe that your installation isn't fundamentally broken
[05:02] <n3pla2000> so what is the PRESENT lubuntu
[05:02] <wxl> you're asking what version is openbox on now or are you asking the current version of lubuntu?
[05:02] <n3pla2000> version number
[05:02] <n3pla2000> Lubuntu
[05:03] <wxl> 19.10 with 20.04 soon on the way
[05:05] <n3pla2000> I would rather use KDE Plasma, but I let the installation choose what display manager to use since KDE is very heavy. Never used Openbox before, but Lubuntu is supposed to be light weight, so I assumed it would use a light weight display manager by defaul
[05:05] <n3pla2000> so 19.10 is present so 18.04 is not really that out dated
[05:06] <wxl> we stop supporting it early next year
[05:06] <n3pla2000> I chose 18.04 because I am using Kubuntu 18.04 on other machines
[05:06] <wxl> we're currently not using LXDE but LXQt
[05:06] <wxl> every single application is different
[05:07] <n3pla2000> is there an 18.04 version of LXQt
[05:07] <wxl> so i would refer to them as dramatically different and 18.04 outdated because LXDE is really lacking any good support. they haven't made any development at all in quite a long time
[05:07] <wxl> i would call LXQt in 18.04 as a little rough around the edges
[05:08] <n3pla2000> Great! never heard of LDQt when I looked for a light weigh alternative. I never get the latest version, usually 1 version back as often new versions need bug fixes more than older ones
[05:09] <wxl> yeah well in this case, the opposite is true
[05:10] <n3pla2000> just got a error: System Program Problem Detected Do you want to report the problem now? No details:
[05:10] <wxl> like i said, can't be sure you don't have a broken system
[05:11] <wxl> you are having some incredibly weird problems that seem to be difficult to explain in another way
[05:11] <n3pla2000> nothing seems to be malfunctioning before/during/after such a report
[05:14] <n3pla2000> gnome-mpv seem not to use window decorations... it has it's own close button, and is moveable without them
[05:16] <wxl> it sure does
[05:16] <n3pla2000> what can cause mandb to crash
[05:16] <wxl> a rather unsatisfactory large amount of gnome packages are like that
[05:16] <wxl> i've never seen such a problem before ever
[05:17] <n3pla2000> any guesses
[05:18] <wxl> here's the current bugs in it https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/man-db
[05:18] <wxl> were you even using the manpages?
[05:19] <n3pla2000> no. not during reported crash, or even since booting up
[05:19] <wxl> then no idea
[05:21] <n3pla2000> tried man ls to see if it would list ls man page... worked fine
[05:22] <wxl> like i said, you are having fundamental problems that are inexplicable
[05:24] <n3pla2000> have a few kde and gnome specific programs installed... all work, prefer synaptic pkg manager
[05:25] <wxl> i wouldn't say that having *ANY* problem installed should cause man-db to have an issue UNLESS there's a fundamental problem in the manpage of a particular program
[05:26] <wxl> `mandb -d` might be instructive
[05:26] <wxl> also `mandb -t`
[05:31] <n3pla2000> "/usr/man" appears to be missing... what chown and chmod should it be set to
[05:33] <n3pla2000> mandb -t gives no report
[05:34] <wxl> that's no big deal
[05:34] <wxl> sounds normal to me
[05:34] <wxl> so who knows
[05:34] <n3pla2000> yeah but what about missing "/usr/man" directory
[05:36] <wxl> it's normal
[05:37] <n3pla2000> also reports: path directory /snap/bin is not in the config file
[05:37] <n3pla2000> needed? I do not yet have any snaps
[05:38] <wxl> nope
[05:38] <wxl> totally normal
[05:39] <n3pla2000> don't care for snaps prefer deb files, or other self installing machine files from vendors
[05:40] <n3pla2000> rpms aren't bad either pain to install of debian based systems, great on red hat/fedora
[05:42] <n3pla2000> Some one need to invent a pkg manager everyone can get behind, one that understands deb, rpm, snap...
[05:43] <n3pla2000> vlc is practically the defacto media player
[05:43] <wxl> well that's why so-called universal packages exist, i.e. snap, flatpak, appimage
[05:43] <wxl> in any case, this is offtopic. if you have no support needs but want to chat, see #lubuntu-offtopic
[05:45] <n3pla2000> yeah, not so universal... I like synaptic because it tells me everything and anything about the software, what it is doing... well I was thinking of going anyway... L8R
[22:44] <CamelRiderZ> hey guys is it recommeneded to use os-uninstaller to remove windows 10 ?
[22:44] <wxl> if you're trying to replace it with lubuntu, just use the installer to erase the disk and install lubuntu
[22:45] <CamelRiderZ> i already have lubuntu and win10
[22:45] <CamelRiderZ> i want to remove win10 without messing anything up
[22:46] <wxl> format the partition
[22:46] <CamelRiderZ> with gparted in a live usb ?
[22:46] <CamelRiderZ> wxl: do i need to make a boot repair after ?
[22:46] <wxl> assuming they're on the same target drive and that's the drive you're running on, you would need live media, yes
[22:47] <wxl> you installed lubuntu second?
[22:47] <CamelRiderZ> ye
[22:47] <wxl> and it boots to lubuntu by default?
[22:47] <CamelRiderZ> no
[22:48] <CamelRiderZ> i can see the grub
[22:48] <CamelRiderZ> to choose between win and lubuntu
[22:48] <wxl> and if you let it run, does it pick lubuntu?
[22:48] <CamelRiderZ> ye
[22:48] <wxl> ok then no boot repair required per se
[22:48] <wxl> but after you've rebooted into lubuntu you might want to `sudo update-grub` to get it to forget windows
[22:48] <CamelRiderZ> okay i still feel like am gonna mess something up
[22:48] <CamelRiderZ> gonna try now
[22:50] <wxl> ^ good advice
[23:02] <CamelRiderZ> wxl back,  i removed the C partition and there was two NTFS partions sizes 450 and 350m which i also deleted
[23:06] <CamelRiderZ> updated grub and it directly booted into lubuntu, is there anything else i need to do ?
[23:07] <wxl> nope you did it
[23:07] <CamelRiderZ> whew
[23:16] <lubuntu_> hey
[23:16] <wxl> ho
[23:16] <lubuntu_> wxl it is me ,camelrider again sorry
[23:17] <lubuntu_> after deleting the C Partition i am left with an unallocated space that i can't add to other partitions
[23:17] <lubuntu_> and it is above the partition table not inside it
[23:17] <wxl> pics?
[23:19] <lubuntu_> https://imagebin.ca/v/5BtyfAo22yAm
[23:22] <wxl> oh my crazy extended partitions
[23:22] <lubuntu_> ._.
[23:23] <wxl> so i think this will still work
[23:23] <wxl> but you should go backup everything
[23:23] <wxl> don't skip that
[23:23] <wxl> then go back to the live media and you should be able to resize the extended partition
[23:24] <lubuntu_> you think what will work
[23:24] <wxl> yeah
[23:24] <lubuntu_> no you didn't say anything
[23:24] <lubuntu_> i am in the live media , what will work ?
[23:24] <wxl> i know it will work with standard linux fs
[23:24] <lubuntu_> ?_?
[23:24] <wxl> first go backup everything
[23:24] <lubuntu_> do you mean i should create a new partition
[23:24] <lubuntu_> instead of resizing ?
[23:25] <wxl> i've done a lot of successful resizing but it runs the risk of losing data
[23:25] <lubuntu_> you don't understand , ican't resize
[23:25] <lubuntu_> when i try to resize any partion i can't
[23:26] <wxl> are any of them mounted?
[23:26] <lubuntu_> no i am in the live usb
[23:26] <wxl> (yes, that's the lock symbol)
[23:26] <wxl> unmount them
[23:26] <lubuntu_> wait what
 or did you use xfs which can't be shrunk
[23:27] <wxl> swaps automount
[23:27] <lubuntu_> they're all unmounted
[23:27] <wxl> so you have swap mounted and since you have some logical partition in your extended partition mounted, the extended partition is mounted
[23:27] <wxl> so there's no lock icon next to any of the partitions, right/
[23:27] <lubuntu_> only on swap
[23:27] <wxl> un mount it
[23:28] <lubuntu_> you mean swapoff ?
[23:28] <wxl> and unmount the extended partition if it doesn't do it when you unmount swap
[23:28] <wxl> yeah same diff :)
[23:29] <lubuntu_> lock is off now
[23:29] <lubuntu_> but i still can't resize
[23:29] <wxl> let's see the pic
[23:29] <lubuntu_> wait should i resize the entire extended thing ?
[23:30] <wxl> yes
[23:31] <lubuntu_> here is the pic
[23:31] <lubuntu_> https://imagebin.ca/v/5Bu272hr5Fgj
[23:36] <wxl> https://gparted.org/display-doc.php?name=moving-space-between-partitions
[23:38] <lubuntu_> i am extending right now
[23:38] <lubuntu_> but it is taking so long
[23:38] <wxl> yes, it does take a long time
[23:38] <wxl> don't ask me why :)
[23:38] <lubuntu_> they're literally moving the 72gb
[23:38] <lubuntu_> now i pray that i don't get a power outage
[23:39] <wxl> https://askubuntu.com/questions/177882/shrinking-file-system-taking-a-lot-of-time-is-this-normal
[23:39] <wxl> tl;dr defragging XD