 In a previous post, I reported on keyboard+touchpad failing to get focus (?) when the lid/display are closed and re-opened.
 I extended the search to include the big Foss flavor.
 The problem persists in both Kubuntu and the Gnome FE (Foss).
 Does this indicate the problem lies beneath the FE, or does it exist in both KDE and GnomeX?
 I cannot say.
 How serious is it? First, the action is natural; Interact, close the lid, open the lid, interact...
 What is the workaround?  I cannot find one.
 Alternative? The touchscreen stays operational. The system is functional, but no KB, no TP.
 Recovery?  Reset/reboot the computer.
 Can I enlist help in forwarding this issue to the "proper authorities"?
 Thanx
 Another Question Follows
 In another post, on another issue, I reported the screen mouse being "stuck" after a click event.
 I have seen it on KDE, but not on GNOME. but the problem seems to be intermittent.
 IOW, it can seem to be "gone" in KUbuntu, or suddenly (rarely) appear in Foss.
 Somehow, in my mind it seems to be associated with me switching to/from the touchscreen to HW KB + TP and back.
 but I have little data to support this assertion.
 The problem is there and is irritating at best.
[00:48] <valorie> "in FOSS"?
[00:48] <valorie> unsure what you mean, @first_sheemon
[00:49] <valorie> everything in Kubuntu at least is FOSS
[00:49] <valorie> GNOME itself is FOSS
[00:49] <valorie> ubuntu is for the most part FOSS
 Sorry, I mean the default, gnome FE Ubuntu .iso
 I got my terminology mixed up. 😣
[00:50] <valorie> the problems with resume are hard to pin down since so many processes are involved
[00:50] <valorie> I never sleep this laptop so I have little to add
[00:51] <valorie> re: mouse click event causing a freeze - dunno, don't use a mouse
 Exactly.  This is why I am asking this august bastion of knowledge😊
[00:51] <valorie> but again, it could have something to do with Plasma, but probably not
[00:52] <valorie> btw KDE is the community who makes the software
[00:52] <valorie> the DE is Plasma
 Please educate me:  Input device can be anything.  On the display screen, the little, changing arrow which represents X idea where "it is" was called "mouse pointer" or something else.  What shall I call it, then?
 Yes, true, and the library used to be called QT. Thanx for the reminder.
[00:57] <valorie> well, QT is quicktime
[00:57] <valorie> the toolkit is Qt
[00:57] <valorie> subtle difference
 Qt is nice, dependency tracking is easier for Qt projects is easier
[00:58] <valorie> yes, input device can be anything, but I've never noticed a freeze in a click event
 Missing dep? Google Qt5 <dep name>
[00:58] <valorie> on any of my laptops
[00:58] <valorie> for years
[00:59] <valorie> "mouse pointer" is as good as anything to call it I guess
 Once I figure out how to make deb packages for DE's I need like 7 shell scripts (for every shell I use) so no matter what I don't have to do it myself anymore
 Try and imagine an end user attempting a report of the problem.  This is who/what I am.  I know what I see.  My challenge is to interface with very technical people.  to that end I am in intensive learning mode, but trying all the while to remember my original goal.
 i have another one, last for today.
[01:04] <valorie> @first_sheemon I remember
[01:04] <valorie> when I first began using linux, I knew nothing
 When one drags an app from the Application Launcher (KUbuntu 20.04, current) to the root window,
 a symlink is created from {wherever the application is installed} to ~/Desktop/${appname}.desktop
 This causes the appropriate icon to be displayed, etc. ...
 Well, not always.  At least in the case of 'strawberry' after 'clementine',
 where nothing showed up at all until this user logged out, and logged in again.
 In that instance, a strawberry per attempt were installed on the screen.
 Yes, the proper warning [of duplicate effort] was issued, misinterpreted, and ignored.
 The net issue was the failure of the user to 'trust' the operation.
[01:07] <valorie> hmmm, unsure that I understand the issue
[01:08] <valorie> but I would ask in #kde where the specialists are
[01:09] <valorie> they will want to know the Plasma version which in 20.04 is 5.18.4
[01:10] <valorie> keep in mind almost all of KDE channels are active during euro-working hours
 Let me try again.
 I see an application listed in the launcher.  I like it so much  want it on the root window (improper term? The X window where a photo of  my grandchildren is displayed, and on which ?/Desktop objects become clickable wigets, etc.)...
 I drag the listing from the launcher onto the root and let go.
 Normally, one will see a new icon labeled as expected.  Under some yet undefined conditions, this new icon is not displayed. Thus, the expected outcome is not visible.  This is the problem.  Sidebars include:  The ~/Desktop file (symlink, but not necessarily that) is created.  The icon will display, without further user input) after logout/login.
 I know I am missing something, but what?
[01:30] <valorie> what you are calling the root window I think is called the desktop
[01:30] <valorie> usually
[01:31] <valorie> clemintine is not KDE software -- that could be the difference
 @first_sheemon one of the simplest things to do is record a screencast. i do that quite a bit when i do bug reporting, so if people dont understand the text, they can see it visually
[01:32] <valorie> you might find it easier to just pin the apps you really like to your taskbar
[01:33] <valorie> to do that you right-click on it in the taskbar and choose "pin"
[01:33] <valorie> I used to drag things onto the desktop, but I never do anymore now that I can pin to the taskbar
 Yes, at the app  level. In the X domain, it is the window for which there is no parent window.  just like in the Unix FS, the mountpoint of everything has a parent node ID.  It has aNULL pointer invthe parent.  By convention it has itself for '..'.  Same concept.
 Oh, there can be multiple desktops contained by (inheriting from) the root.  So you are right, unless an object is "sticky", ad nauseum...
[01:36] <valorie> right, those are called workspaces in KDE-land
[01:36] <valorie> or Activities, depending on whether you use Activities or not
[01:37] <valorie> it all gets very confusing
 Workspaces they are.
[01:37] <valorie> but "root window" conveys the wrong thing, because ROOT is a special think in l/unix
 Activities...  Are these mapped into processes (or threads)?
[01:38] <valorie> we get around in in Ubuntu by using sudo instead
[01:38] <valorie> they are mapped by the user to whatever they use them for
[01:38] <valorie> say you use the same computer for both work and a hobby like digital painting
[01:39] <valorie> you could create a Work activity and tie all the applications, etc. to that (in as many workspaces as you want/need)
[01:39] <valorie> and another for Art, with Krita, the gimp, etc.
 Yes, thank you.  but in what domain?  Root of filesystem is very different from uid 0, traditionally named 'root'.  I have seen a Unix system before, at least once 😉
[01:40] <valorie> and yes they can be started and stopped
[01:40] <valorie> what domain what?
[01:40] <valorie> I'm saying don't use the term 'root window' because it conveys something you don't mean
[01:41] <valorie> it's called the desktop
[01:41] <valorie> if you are using activies you can have the Work desktop and the Art desktop
[01:41] <valorie> for instance
[01:42] <valorie> for those who do not use Activities (I don't) there is just the desktop
[01:42] <valorie> all I have there is a slideshow of images
 Domain as in a [named] group of related objects. Not TCP/IP domain names, nor Unix domain sockets, which are examples of "domains".
[01:43] <valorie> right, and "activities" is the KDE term/software for those
[01:44] <valorie> because domain usually means freenode.net, ubuntu.com, kubuntu.org, etc.
[01:44] <valorie> unix sockets have domains?
[01:44] <valorie> interesting
[01:45] <valorie> afaik all flavors and all distros use "desktop"
[01:45] <valorie> I guess on a phone it is called your 'home screen'
 Freenode.net is a name of entity in the Internet DNS, normally associated with attributes such as IP address, etc.
[01:50] <valorie> yes
[01:51] <valorie> and someone bought and paid for the right to use that domain name
[01:52] <valorie> there are other meanings for "domain" -- I'm just trying to say that if you use the common names for things when describing an issue, it will be more readily understood
 sure Unix sockets have a domain, "Unix Domain Sockets" 😉.  I do not know when to stop.  But seriously, the name was very unfortunate.  It was meant to be descriptive as in "Sockets that exist only within the host", but... Oh, who cares anymore.
[01:54] <valorie> lol
[01:54] <valorie> I'm just trying to give you advice
[01:55] <valorie> about how to best describe an issue
 And I do appreciate it.  Really!
[01:55] <valorie> cool!
[01:56] <valorie> it took me years to learn all this stuff, growing up without computers
[01:57] <valorie> and naming things is difficult, like writing a good headline /title for a complicated article
 Exactly.
[01:58] <valorie> and the most common terms are not necessarily the most logical, or even the best
[01:59] <valorie> but the point is to convey meaning
 This is relevant here.  The first question I posed was "Where is the Glossary?"  Just like overloaded objects.  The meaning of a name is context dependant.
[02:05] <valorie> I learned a lot just reading IRC channels of interest
[02:05] <valorie> seeing the questions ask, and what the best answers were
[02:05] <valorie> learned what the links are to learn more about "x"
[02:06] <valorie> eventually I was able to help other beginners
[02:06] <valorie> IMO being new is a super-power
[02:06] <valorie> you see the places where things are hard to find, incomplete, or just wrong
[02:07] <valorie> and eventually perhaps learn to fix them, or find those who can
[02:07] <valorie> then it's time for a fresh batch of newbies to take over that part of the job
 i have a special talent for stumbling where others dance.😜
 The number of "issues" I collected just against Clementine and/or Strawberry is already in the dozens.
[02:13] <valorie> \o/
[02:13] <valorie> I think that's awesome, and some issues might be old
[02:14] <valorie> and easy to fix!
[02:14] <valorie> bug reports are great contributions
[02:15] <valorie> btw if you report them "upsteam" say to Clementine, and then in launchpad by `ubuntu-bug clementine`
[02:15] <valorie> in the commandline
[02:15] <valorie> then you can link the upstream bug report in the LP report
 Yes, but the challenge was and still is the complexity of the interface.  it is still intimidating and difficult to master.  Once you aclimate, you lose the ability to see the wall.  You just let others bruise their noses, wondering "Can't they see it?" All the while forgetting the bruises on your own nose..
[02:24] <valorie> I remember the bruises
 How do I check spelling [inline], like Android does? I see the input buffer underlines my typos, so it is aware of the contents
[02:24] <valorie> in telegram? dunno
 good!
[02:24] <valorie> I use an IRC client called Konversation
[02:25] <valorie> and it does have a spell checker, but I don't use it
[02:25] <valorie> if I can't remember I just start typing into google
[02:25] <valorie> lol
[02:25] <valorie> otherwise, people can usually decipher in spite of typos
 I used to "hate" Android. now I am learning to appreciate certain of its aspects.
[02:28] <valorie> eh, it's a tool
[02:28] <valorie> nothing is perfect
 I beg to differ.  Just look at the reaction to my meager entries.  No, I am not offended at all.  I appreciate every bit of help I get.
[02:29] <valorie> that's rare, or at least more rare than I wish it was
 Oh, not 'nothing', just us.
[02:29] <valorie> I'm always eager to learn
[02:29] <valorie> I meant android isn't perfect
[02:29] <valorie> not fully free, for instance
[02:30] <valorie> but so far, the best phone operating system for me
 The second attribute that differentiates us is the desire to learn as adults.
 Eh, just a glorified Linux, with a heavy dose of Redmond added.
[02:32] <valorie> yep
 The interior of Android is horrible.  The use of every square milimeter of screen is admirable.
 The corporate greed is the material of books.  Thee pervasiveness is downright scary.
[02:41] <valorie> yep, really happy to see the Plasma Mobile effort
[02:41] <valorie> the team has been working with all the other FOSS phone and tablet devel teams so they have made a lot of headway
 2 items:
 1. How do I get to see the latest and greatest?
 2.  in Telegram, typos are underlined red.  Right click is supposed to show list of words.  It does not. still searching...
[02:58] <valorie> latest and greatest what? that's the crucial question
[02:59] <valorie> if you like the latest KDE software, then don't stick to LTS, and add the Kubuntu backports PPA
[03:00] <valorie> that said, K/Ubuntu is more about stability than it is about the latest
[03:00] <valorie> Arch and Gentoo are the distros which focus on the newest everything
 I stand corrected.  the bleeding edge of UI, including issues like I am trying to present here.
[03:01] <valorie> KDE neon is a project that provides the latest KDE software on an Ubuntu LTS base
[03:01] <valorie> you could run neon unstable in a VM to check things out
 Gentoo still around?  Wow!
[03:01] <valorie> where VM=virtual machine
[03:02] <valorie> oh yes
[03:02] <valorie> I have a friend or two who are devels there
[03:02] <valorie> a lot of the really old distros are still around
[03:03] <valorie> of course many more died out
[03:04] <valorie> linux from scratch is still around, but it's very behind
[03:04] <valorie> for instance
 wget && make configure && make install were a great advance once.  The Baaad old days.
[03:06] <valorie> right, I like apt
[03:07] <valorie> it knows what and what is not installable
[03:07] <valorie> but I have built from source before, especially when I was part of the amarok team
[03:07] <valorie> for testing
 Please cdo not grt me drgged into this conversation ...
[03:08] <valorie> lol
 i start shivering at the thought. Not really, but close.
[03:09] <valorie> sec
[03:13] <valorie> when I was testing amarok, it wasn't that hard
[03:14] <valorie> now that there are tested packages, not so hard
[03:14] <valorie> the ecosystem is more complicated these days however
[03:15] <valorie> I began with Mandrake, and it was all I knew
 Fell asleep - cost of health, lack of sleep
 Telegram on Desktop - Linux has no spelling correction
 i have correction on telegram for linux
 check under settings > advanced and see if you have these settings enabled :
 welcome @anotherus3r
 Am I going to be corrected again?
 Good morning Yousuf.
 Not on 20.04 amd64, Kubuntu.
 I did not check under Gnome.  Should be there.
 Sort of here, your name is underlined in red 😉when I type it.
 How do I capture screen dump?
 Weirdly, for me (Australia) UbuntuDDE is the first, the Ubuntu proper. Seeding since thursday night European time. (re @troyBORG: Nope Xubuntu
 Then Mate
 followed by Kubuntu)
 Telegram 2.0.1
 Is ALSA still alive?  I see some apps with some functionality hanging around...
 Foget that last Q.
 ALSA is a PulseAudio client (still competability mode?)
 Yep.
 whelp I think I am close
 to a deb package
 grrr @ upstream devs
 adding a new broken unit test to a bugfix release!
 @RikMills can you help me with something? Just debian/rules... for now
 what am i doing wrongt :
  (edited)what am i doing wrong :
 what is the error?
 wait hold on I am stupid

 I figured out my stupid
 ok
 I forgot I needed debhelper
 ummm.. yes :P
 what is difference between lubuntu.net and lubuntu.me
 one is offering lubuntu 20.04 lts other is not
 One its official the another is not (re @.: one is offering lubuntu 20.04 lts other is not)
 lubuntu.me is the official one
 and official is... ?
 ok
 thanks
 going to install
 thank you again
 Thanks Kai (re @KaiLoveLinux: lubuntu.me is the official one)
 Good Morning Y'll,
 automount?
 When rebooting the system, one expects the SD card (with a FS on it 😉 to be remounted, or at least mounted someplace.
 Not so with 20.04. The SD card has to be ejected and re-inserted.
 BTW, how does the automounter decide that I am the owner of the SD card?  Hint: it mounts it in /media/sheemon/<some ID>.  Is the assumption made based on me being logged in at the console?
 it gets better; for Clementine to see the mount as valid, clementine has to have focus when the card is being re-inserted.
 Dies somebody use ZFS with the new Ubuntu 20.04 release?
 on root or?
 I use it since 16.04 I think, with lxc/lxd.
 problem was performance, btrs was better. But now zfs has TRIM, so...
 Yeah.
 Trim is now by default ? So it can run well (re @MrkiMike: on root or?)
 I haven't tried it on root, and I think it's experimental only on 20.04
 Trim was not supported with ZFS, until 0.8.something
 in eoan you had zfs 0.8.1 and in focal it's 0.8.3, so those both support trim
 sounds interesting :) (re @MrkiMike: in eoan you had zfs 0.8.1 and in focal it's 0.8.3, so those both support trim)
 Who posted that picture earlier that showed Ubuntu Cinnamon with the Focal logo with an orange glow, and a gray background?  If so can you share that image please?
 It might of not been in here.  Gah  I wish I remember where I saw it.   I just thought it came with it so I didn't save it at the time
[16:47] <lotuspsychje> @troyBORG: maybe it was shown on unixporn?
 I think maybe it was this that I saw....
 https://youtu.be/XCQ5fx-zqfA?t=111
 But I want the Fusa as this...
[16:53] <lotuspsychje> https://www.reddit.com/r/Lubuntu/comments/fer319/lubuntu_2004_lts_remix_wallpaper_from_ubuntu_2004/
[16:53] <lotuspsychje> dont find orange though
[17:01] <lotuspsychje> @troyBORG: what about this one https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUw1AcNWkAES3YT.jpg
[17:02] <lotuspsychje> or https://cdn.shortpixel.ai/client/q_lossy,ret_img,w_860/https://ubuntucinnamon.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/LivePC.png
 Just threw this together in GIMP.... :
 The glow might be a little to intense.  But whats ya think?
[17:13] <lotuspsychje> i like it actually
[17:14] <lotuspsychje> the color that is, cause i was never fan of the ubuntu animals wallpapers myself

 I prefer subtle 😂
 Very nice! I think the glow effect looks great! (re @troyBORG: )