=== brainwash_ is now known as brainwash
[05:23] <jphilips> was looking in power settings and it mentioned hibernate and battery button being pressed, do keyboards have such buttons?
[09:59] <Unit193> bluesabre: No luck on gsettings backend in Debian, fwiw.  No idea what your feelings are on that though.
[10:48] <bluesabre> jphilips: some do, usually laptop keyboards... but I think there are some old mac keyboards as well that had hibernate buttons
[10:50] <jphilips> when i searched around, it seemed like hibernate was a shortcut key http://i.stack.imgur.com/eIMxT.png
[10:51] <bluesabre> jphilips: I'll have to test that to confirm. During the 20.04 development cycle, when those reports hit, my system never "upgraded" gnome-software to snap-store. But its possible there are some other package combinations that might cause that.
[10:51] <jphilips> with such a little use-case of keyboards have a hibernate or battery button, do we need to keep such settings
[10:52] <bluesabre> If we don't, those buttons on those keyboards cease to work
[10:52] <jphilips> if its a hibernate button, then we should just have it hibernate, not sure why users would want to configure how it works
[10:53] <jphilips> definitely understandable that a user would like to configure what happens with the laptop lid closing or them pressing the power button
[10:53] <bluesabre> https://i.stack.imgur.com/524Oj.jpg
[10:53] <jphilips> yep i saw that pic. so if a user presses it, it should sleep.
[10:54] <bluesabre> I can imagine some folks wanting to disable it, like this person https://askubuntu.com/questions/1103856/how-to-disable-sleep-suspend-hibernate-hp-keyboard-buttons-for-ubuntu-18-04
[10:54] <bluesabre> Sometimes you'd be interested in changing that functionality if your computer has issues with it. Like I don't suspend my desktop because it takes several minutes for it to come back.
[10:55] <bluesabre> I know hibernation has been a tricky thing for Linux for years.
[10:56] <jphilips> i presume hibernate is not enabled by default in xubu like it isnt in ubu
[10:56] <bluesabre> Yep
[10:56] <bluesabre> But I think Fedora enables it
[10:56] <jphilips> do we make it easy for users to enable it if they want that functionality
[10:57] <jphilips> or better yet, do we mention it in our documentation :D
[10:57] <bluesabre> Good qs. I don't think anything makes it easy, and these instructions basically apply everywhere: http://ubuntuhandbook.org/index.php/2017/10/enable-hibernate-ubuntu-17-10/
[10:58] <bluesabre> I haven't tested hibernation in years.
[10:59] <jphilips> one of the things that ubuntu mate does is that it install tlp when it detects that a user is running a laptop
[11:00] <bluesabre> Yeah, we would probably do well to make the hardware support changes the ubuntu-mate team has been doing.
[11:01] <jphilips> are these things implemented in the installer?
[11:03] <bluesabre> I think so... which means they're at least preinstalled on the iso. Probably works similarly to `nvidia-detector`
[11:05] <bluesabre> I can't find a picture, but I believe it was some old business-class HP or Dell laptops that had the battery button.
[11:05] <bluesabre> I saw one when I was younger and thought it was weird :D
[11:09] <jphilips> if its that old, do we really need to be cluttering the UI with things like that. Even windows doesn't do that, which is likely what the HP or Dell laptops came installed with :D
[11:17] <Unit193> bluesabre: Would you mind finding out what's leftover cruft in xfce4-session?  I'm pretty darn sure we can remove the upstart stuff.
[11:21] <bluesabre> jphilips: generally the hardware vendor would include custom drivers for that option. Linux doesn't have that luxury. 
[11:22] <bluesabre> Unit193: yeah, I'll take a look.
[11:24] <bluesabre> jphilips: and removing hardware support options is lame for the people that do use them... but if you wanted to get it removed or rearranged, a bug report would be the way to go.
[11:25] <jphilips> bluesabre: ok
[11:26] <Unit193> (I *think* I can get this syncable, that is)
[11:30] <bluesabre> Neat. :)
[11:45] <jphilips> bluesabre: do you know what the battery button did?
[11:46] <bluesabre> Pretty sure it disabled charging. Leaving a battery plugged in, even at 100% charge, reduces its overall lifetime. It was a way to save your battery without detaching it.
[11:47] <bluesabre> The pre-ultrabook days :)
[11:49] <jphilips> i see a battery button in this video which shows the battery level when pressed, so presume this isnt it - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFMGzArsh94
[11:53] <Unit193> http://paste.openstack.org/show/AkSe9pqYUwkhRWzN4rbY (that upstart post stuff doesn't look right.)
[12:00] <jphilips> so here for dell its a battery health meter - https://www.dell.com/community/Laptops-General-Read-Only/Battery-Button-not-working/td-p/3812381