 I mention it because applications like Chrome, Firefox, VS Code, Konsole and Kate don't require Shift. I was very confused and tried the number pad + until I finally tried Shift. It's extremely inconvenient. @ItzSwirlz I did not think you were in any way responsible. But since I didn't know which terminal app was used in Cinnamon, I brought it up.
[02:47] <Eickmeyer> @Zachariah Sure, other applications do that, but you can't expect every application, written by different authors, to behave exactly the same way. And knowing how the GNOME devs operate, they'd probably reject the idea that their defaults are in any way wrong and even be offended.
 So it's the GNOME terminal. Ok. Thanks for clarifying. I just wanted to figure out which module it was and see if it was a known issue.
 i plan to submit a bug report for the xfce terminal to improve its handling of this
 Did a fresh installation of Ubuntu 20.04 LTS
 Facing an issue and would like your guidance.
 Steps to re-produce the error:
 1) Connect to a hidden WiFi network
 2) Restart computer, NetworkManager does not auto-connect
 3) As per my understanding, this bug is identified and reported with 1542733
 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-applet/+bug/1542733
 4) The workaround which works for me is "nmcli c up id SSID"
 To avoid applying this workaround everytime after Ubuntu reboot or a router reboot, please advise if there's any fix already made available for Ubuntu 20.04.
 Thank you in advance.
[09:14] <lotuspsychje> tomreyn jphilips Eickmeyer requested an apport-collect on bug #1880325
 Did a fresh installation of Ubuntu 20.04 LTS
 Facing an issue and would like your guidance.
 Steps to re-produce the error:
 1) Connect to a hidden WiFi network
 2) Restart computer, NetworkManager does not auto-connect
 3) As per my understanding, this bug is identified and reported with 1542733
 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-applet/+bug/1542733
 4) The workaround which works for me is
 CLI: "nmcli c up id SSID"
 GUI: Remove SSID from Known Networks and Connect again
 To avoid applying this workaround everytime after Ubuntu reboot or a router reboot, please advise if there's any fix already made available for Ubuntu 20.04.
 Thank you in advance. (edited)
[09:23] <lotuspsychje> @pc: this bug seems to have closed by seb128 and says fix released, is your system up to date?
 @lotuspsycheje: Yes, Ubuntu 20.04 fresh installation + software update is done and is updated with latest as of May 23rd.
[09:42] <lotuspsychje> @pc: could you pastebin your dmesg please?
[13:18] <jphilips> lotuspsychje: i've pinged the bug reported
 @Eickmeyer the reporter is getting this error
 Forwarded from TomaTuBono: Error :
 That'll happen when you run apport-collect as root. Why is he running it as root? It's meant to be run *as the user*. (re @philipz: )
 @lotuspsychje Please find the dmesg output just before the workaround command was executed: nmcli c up id SSID
 https://pastebin.com/Znx8nene
 I asked him the same question and he said running it as non-root also resulted in the same error. (re @Eickmeyer: That'll happen when you run apport-collect as root. Why is he running it as root? It's meant to be run *as the user*.)
 @philipz Part of the problem, I see, is that he uses su to change to root which means he's changed the root password. His system is essentially corrupt.
 Ubuntu systems are configured so that one never uses the root account directly.
 If one changes the root password, then it keeps applications, such as apport, from doing correct bug information collection.
 @wimpress mate has no daily images?
 oh, builds are still failing :(
[16:47] <lotuspsychje> tnx for the ping jphilips
 Hi folks. How would one go upgrading from zesty (17.04) to bionic, at least? I can't go to artful (17.10) as it is no longer available, and I'm almost sure that changing zesty->bionic in /etc/apt/sources.list and running apt-get dist-upgrade would just creatre mayhem
 old-releases.ubuntu.com ftw
 update manager wants to go to bionic as artfull is no longer supported
 anyone knows how to trick it into going to artful?
 Not possible, Artful is long-since EOL. The repos are simply not available. (re @MrkiMike: anyone knows how to trick it into going to artful?)
[20:30] <Eickmeyer> !eolupgrades | @MrkiMike
[20:36] <Mmike> yup, that EOLUpgrades was last edited on 2018-05-30, so it's almost 2 years old, doesn't mention anything about zesty upgrades
[20:36] <Eickmeyer> Mmike: Doesn't matter, it covers ALL EOL upgrades.
[20:36] <Mmike> it doesn't
[20:36] <Eickmeyer> Yes, it does.
[20:36] <Mmike> when I run 'do-release-upgrade' it chooses bionic, not artful
[20:36] <Eickmeyer> Well, you need to follow the instructions.
[20:37] <Mmike> and it says  that upgrading from zesty to bionic is not possible
[20:37] <Eickmeyer> Artful is EOL. You CANNOT upgrade to Artful. Period. It's not possible.
[20:37] <Mmike> you also can't upgrade from zesty to bionic
[20:37] <Mmike> so, what do I do - reinstall?
[20:38] <Eickmeyer> You need to go in and edit the sources.list file. That's what that instructs you to do. And if you're not going to do what is being told BY A DEVELOPER (me), then you're just being antagonistic.
[20:38] <Mmike> Eickmeyer, why do you assume I didn't do what is stated there?
[20:38] <Mmike> do-release-upgrade is the problem - it tries to upgrade to bionic
[20:39] <Mmike> which it cant
[20:39] <Mmike> can't
[20:39] <Eickmeyer> Then reinstall. Your system is messed-up.
[20:39] <Mmike> no, the instructions are messed up :)
[20:39] <Eickmeyer> THis is why you upgrade *before* EOL.
[20:39] <Mmike> yup, but sometimes you have people who don't do that
[20:39] <Mmike> I think the "problem" is that https://changelogs.ubuntu.com/meta-release states artful is no go, so it chooses the next possible one which is bionic
[20:39] <Eickmeyer> Yeah, but they're warned. You were warned. This is YOUR fault, nobody else's. Pay attention to announcements and release lifecycles, and this doesn't happen.
[20:40] <Eickmeyer> Stop shifting blame.
[20:40] <Mmike> You're not much of a help, Eickmeyer  :)
[20:40] <Eickmeyer> You're not taking hep, Mmike
[20:40] <Eickmeyer> You're just being combative.
[20:40] <Eickmeyer> You're going to have to reinstall. If you've done everything, that's your last option.
[20:40] <Mmike> I'm not. You're telling me to do stuff that don't work.
[20:41] <Mmike> I think there might be one option more.
[20:41] <Eickmeyer> What's that?
[20:41] <Mmike> That's why I'm asking is there a way to make do-release-upgrade force upgrade to artful, not to bionic
[20:41] <Eickmeyer> There isn't.
[20:41] <Mmike> that's a shame
[20:41] <Eickmeyer> The repo for artful simply no longer exists.
[20:41] <Mmike> I'll see if I can make it
[20:41] <Mmike> it does, come one
[20:41] <Mmike> what kind of dev are you
[20:41] <Eickmeyer> No, it doesn't.
[20:41] <Mmike> Eickmeyer, wanna bet?
[20:41] <Eickmeyer> !ops
[20:42] <Mmike> there is old-releases.ubuntu.com which has all the old packages from old repos
[20:42] <Eickmeyer> The repo for Artful doesn't exist. I don't know how to make that any more clear. It's gone. Archived.
[20:42] <Mmike> zesty is there, so is artful
[20:42] <Eickmeyer> You can get the ISO from there, but you CANNOT upgrade to it. Period.
[20:43] <Eickmeyer> old-release.ubuntu.com exists for archival purposes *only* not as a usable repo.
[20:45] <Mmike> but it is usable repo and it can be used in situations like this
[20:45] <Mmike> give me some time and I'll illuminate you
[20:45] <Eickmeyer> Then do it, but you're on your own. If you knew the answer, then why did you ask?
[20:45] <Mmike> because I hoped that smart DEVs would have some handy hack up their sleves
[20:45] <Mmike> Instead of typing 'period' all the time.
[20:46] <Eickmeyer> And now you're throwing insults.
 Mmike: you need to switch your repos as per https://askubuntu.com/questions/91815/how-to-install-software-or-upgrade-from-an-old-unsupported-release
[20:46] <Mmike> You can safely ignore me, I won't bother you again.
[20:46] <Eickmeyer> Mmike: This channel is for support. Take support questions to #ubuntu. I never want to see you in this channel again.
[20:47] <Eickmeyer> *this channel is NOT for support.
[20:47] <Mmike> ubuntutestingbot, yup, that's what I did, but do-release-upgrade won't play nice. I'll try to see if I can plant my own metadata file.
[20:47] <Mmike> Eickmeyer, ok, ok, my apologies.
[20:47]  * Mmike stops talking
[20:47] <Eickmeyer> Mmike: /part
[20:47] <Eickmeyer> Please
 Yes, Mmike, you are annoying devs! :D
 You have a very similar name. Are you the same person? (re @MrkiMike: Yes, Mmike, you are annoying devs! :D)
 Oh, for the love of ....
 Time to move on folks. Mmike you have the direction - move your questions to #ubuntu.  Thx
 I just did, thnx. (re @fossfreedom: Time to move on folks. Mmike you have the direction - move your questions to #ubuntu.  Thx)
 When is Focal going out of 'devel', in regard to do-release-upgrade?
 My bionic install (which I upgrade from zesty->artful->bionic) says that there is no 'next release', I had to run d-r-u with -d to get it to upgrade to focal
 just tested on this machine too (ubuntumate bionic, fresh installed a year ago), it says there is 'no new release'
[23:50] <kc2bez> !ltsupgrade