/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2020/06/05/#lubuntu-devel.txt

kc2bezEickmeyer: It was likely installed on the system already but one of the remixes was having issues with LUKS without it. I didn't totally reinvent the wheel either, I followed debian a bit https://salsa.debian.org/live-team/calamares-settings-debian-packaging/-/blob/master/debian/control00:08
EickmeyerInteresting.00:08
kc2bezIf it really is an issue I can look at removing.00:09
EickmeyerI'm going to roll with it for now and see what happens. I just fixed a bug I had previously fixed (love it when that happens) in the Studio configs, so we'll see what happens.00:09
kc2bezI didn't touch those (or at least I didn't intentionally).00:10
kc2bezApologies for the trouble.00:11
EickmeyerYou didn't, the fix I had previously (blacklisting the file) didn't work.00:12
EickmeyerSo now I'm checking for if it exists.00:13
lubot<tsimonq2> 0.15 landed00:55
lubot<kc2bez> @tsimonq2 [0.15 landed], Fantastic work Simon01:06
lubot<tsimonq2> Thanks :) you too!01:06
lubot<HMollerCl> amazing! good/hard work!01:25
lubot<tsimonq2> It's a team effort :)01:25
lubot<tsimonq2> In the meantime, I have some prototype code at home which refactors the nightly01:26
lubot<tsimonq2> Makes it about 6-10x faster and allows for different config files01:27
lubot<tsimonq2> This puts me really close to starting Qt 6 nightlies01:28
lubot<tsimonq2> And then we can build LXQt against it01:28
lubot<tsimonq2> Then once there's an actual release of Qt 6, we can work with Debian Qt/KDE to get it in Debian01:29
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Eickmeyer[m]Hmmmm... Anybody notice that if you're using luks encryption that it asks for the password before Plymouth loads?01:51
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guivercEickmeyer[m], I assumed that (encryption key first) was to give less detail away (ie. plymouth/lubuntu info not yet seen) but I know nothing about it02:20
Eickmeyerguiverc: Yeah, the issue is that it doesn't give a prompt box and visual feedback (****) without Plymouth. I've actually had emails that people expect that.02:21
guivercI can imagine end-users would like it...  I've opted (i guess) to see it as a security-feature :)02:22
Eickmeyer[m]Well, it's not really. Plymouth is part of initramd which is required to load prior to mounting anything.02:22
guivercI didn't say it was a good security feature... it's less easily giving out details :)02:23
lubot<aptghetto> @Eickmeyer[m] [<Eickmeyer[m]> Hmmmm... Anybody notice that if you're using luks encryption that …], Yes, that is normal and expected. … Calamares encrypts /boot and the LUKS container is unlocked twice. … With Grub, where you have to enter the passphrase and later with a keyfile. … Currently, Calamares does not support FDE with an u04:56
lubotnencrypted /boot partition.04:56
Eickmeyer@aptghetto That's not good. I've been sent emails about that, people want that graphical prompt in Plymouth.04:59
EickmeyerAnaconda (Fedora), YaST (OpenSUSE), and Ubiquity support it. This needs to be fixed.05:00
EickmeyerI mean, it's not a complete deal breaker, but it's less than ideal.05:00
lubot<aptghetto> There is an upstream bug, but no one is working on it.05:01
EickmeyerI just commented on it. https://github.com/calamares/calamares/issues/1311#issuecomment-63926084705:05
ubot93Issue 1311 in calamares/calamares "Add an option to not encrypt /boot" [Open]05:05
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lubot<tsimonq2> ^ expected05:23
lotuspsychjegood afternoon to all12:17
lotuspsychjei have a little question about language-selector-gnome, seems like lubuntu has dropped this due gtk?12:18
lotuspsychjeso is the user supposed to install his own language pack himself now12:19
lotuspsychjei fixxed things manually on a fresh installed lubuntu 20.04 with check-language-support -l nl and installing the packs12:21
=== hggdh is now known as hggdh-msft
wxlEickmeyer: even though it's not super user friendly it *IS* the more secure option. to not have /boot encrypted is to have non-full disk encryption. 16:44
Eickmeyerwxl: I know, but I'm looking out for my users. Either way, looks like they're going to take action and allow it.16:45
wxlEickmeyer: that's not what i read 16:47
wxlEickmeyer: also i think looking out for users would mean looking out for their security first16:47
Eickmeyerwxl: Then why does every other installer allow it?16:48
EickmeyerUbiquity, Anaconda, YaST.... every one except Calamares.16:48
wxlEickmeyer: because they don't consider security a priority16:48
EickmeyerI disagree. I think an unencrypted /boot is completely fine. You're not going to have any sensitive files in there.16:49
wxlthe keys are there, of course16:50
EickmeyerUh, no. The keys should be stored in RAM when the user enters it.16:50
EickmeyerI've seriously had complaints about this.16:51
wxlnot the password16:51
wxlstart here https://github.com/calamares/calamares/issues/1311#issuecomment-57974176416:51
ubot93Issue 1311 in calamares/calamares "Add an option to not encrypt /boot" [Open]16:51
Eickmeyerwxl: Read down, I've already commented.16:51
wxli see that, though it doesn't necessarily directly resolve those particular concerns16:52
EickmeyerOk, then how can we implement a prompt? Grub won't do it, only Plymouth will.16:52
wxleven kkofler's comment after it refers to the issue i bring up16:52
wxlit's literally a question of choosing to actually do full disk encryption or choosing user friendliness and not encrypting /boot, which is a security risk16:53
EickmeyerI have some very low opinions about kkofler. He's constantly being negative in #fedora-kde and is bitter at Redhat for removing KDE from RHEL. He's a very negative person, and I take everything he says with a grain of salt.16:53
wxli understand your personal feelings about him and can relate, but he's not necessarily wrong in his assertions on this issue because of his lackings in social abilities :)16:54
EickmeyerAlso, that's if the EFI partition is /boot. EFI partition should always be /boot/efi. /boot should be a separate partition from EFI.16:54
EickmeyerHe didn't address a separate partition option.16:55
EickmeyerSeems as though Chrysostomus seems to agree with me.16:55
wxlthere's lots of people that agree with the idea16:56
wxl*i* agree with the idea16:56
wxlbut implementing it without compromising security is the problem16:56
EickmeyerThis is a situation where I want user friendliness. My target user base isn't going to know what to do when they recieve no prompt for the encryption password.16:57
wxlin general, compromising a little security isn't a terrible problem but when you're making someone think they're securing their disk but they're really not getting that, it's a problem16:57
EickmeyerAnd they'll be further confused when they enter it and don't recieve (***) when they type.16:57
wxlthat's, honestly, the least of the issues16:58
wxlthe biggest issue is for non-us keyboard users16:58
EickmeyerProbably, but I guarantee I'll get complaints in October if this happens. People going to Ubuntu Studio are looking for user friendlines.16:59
wxlhttps://github.com/calamares/calamares/issues/120316:59
ubot93Issue 1203 in calamares/calamares "Encryption does not work well with non-QWERTY keyboards" [Open]16:59
EickmeyerAnd that's a problem that Plymouth solves.16:59
wxlit's really nothing a manual can't resolve16:59
wxlassuming you don't encrypt /boot, it all works fine17:00
wxlbut that also makes "full disk encryption" a lie17:01
wxlit honestly requires a caveat17:01
EickmeyerWell, technically then, one cannot do "full disk encryption" with UEFI then because the /boot/efi partition must be unencrypted to load the .efi file.17:01
wxli'm the type of person that likes full disk encryption and when i learned all this, it made me rather uncomfortable to know that i actually never had it17:02
EickmeyerI'm OK with partial disk encryption. So long as the sensitive files are encrypted, it's good.17:02
wxl*all* of your users are not going to want to encrypt their disk17:02
EickmeyerRight, but I want to avoid the angry "You broke it" emails.17:02
wxland the ones that do may not actually want what you're advocating for17:03
EickmeyerI've already had emails unhappy about the plymouth theme we included in 20.04 since it doesn't properly give a box for the masked password.17:04
EickmeyerI can't imagine what's going to happen when there's not even a prompt.17:04
wxlyou can make some of the people happy some of the time but you can't make all of the people happy all of the time17:04
EickmeyerI know, I know, but I've been all about improving UX ever since I joined Ubuntu Studio.17:05
EickmeyerFrom that perspective, this is a regression.17:05
wxland from mine, it's an improvement17:06
wxland again, i'm prone to encrypt my disk17:06
EickmeyerEither way, I might chalk it up to "those wanting to encrypt their disk won't care about the UX as much".17:06
wxlyou may want to ask for second opinions from your users that actually have interest in encryption17:06
wxli don't think that would be an unreasonable assumption17:07
wxlthey care (i care) but if security is a priority, there you go17:07
EickmeyerRight, but I think I'd still like the option. We'll see what happens with my comment, it seems to have restarted the conversation.17:08
wxli think it would be nice if they offered the option to not encrypt /boot. it seems relatively simple. i still wouldn't use it, personally, 17:11
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tsimonq2Launching a nightly after deploying that.17:36
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tsimonq2Oh...17:36
tsimonq2Well...17:36
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tsimonq2mmm, that makes sense...17:37
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lubot<kc2bez> It does?17:43
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tsimonq2Working on it.17:44
lubot<kc2bez> I trust you.17:45
tsimonq2OHHHHHHHHHHHH17:53
tsimonq2One line messup breaks the entire thing.17:53
tsimonq2Nice.17:53
tsimonq2There we go, I'll push this changeset then.17:54
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tsimonq2;)17:57
lubot<kc2bez> Thanks dawg ;)17:57
tsimonq2XD17:57
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tsimonq2That should be fixed now.18:36
tsimonq2Once I fix this timer logic, I'll kick off a nightly.18:36
tsimonq2I'm almost there, fwiw.18:36
tsimonq2It's off by a little more than a second but that's about the closest I can get for now.18:45
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-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_nm-tray ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_nm-tray/45/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_libsysstat ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_libsysstat/46/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_compton-conf ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_compton-conf/45/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-policykit ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-policykit/288/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_compton-conf ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_compton-conf/297/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_lxqt-openssh-askpass ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_lxqt-openssh-askpass/46/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_compton-conf ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_compton-conf/297/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_lxqt-policykit ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_lxqt-policykit/46/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-archiver ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-archiver/75/18:49
tsimonq2That's me.18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_lxqt-archiver ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_lxqt-archiver/68/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-runner ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-runner/298/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-runner ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-runner/298/18:49
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] merger_sddm FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/merger_sddm/48/18:50
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] merger_sddm FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/merger_sddm/48/18:51
tsimonq2Ooo, fun one.18:51
tsimonq2Here...18:51
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rCI44d9368d3fff: Don't override cascade if it already exists.] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rCI44d9368d3fff18:53
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rCIMETADATA4bb53fa7cfea: Manually override cascade for SDDM.] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rCIMETADATA4bb53fa7cfea18:54
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rCIMETADATA51dc85a9742d: Add ubuntu/focal to the default merger cascade.] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rCIMETADATA51dc85a9742d18:54
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] jobgenerator just failed after succeeding: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/jobgenerator/624/18:54
Eickmeyertsimonq2 forgot a simicolon or did a 20 GOTO 20.18:55
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rCI5b70b9b93df0: Add cascade to the optional fields so if we manually override it there isn't a…] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rCI5b70b9b93df018:56
tsimonq2hahahahahaha18:56
tsimonq2No, actually I forgot to update the field list.18:56
EickmeyerOhhhhh... XD18:56
tsimonq2Now it should be fine.18:56
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] jobgenerator just succeeded after failing: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/jobgenerator/625/18:57
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] merger_libfm-qt FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/merger_libfm-qt/538/18:57
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] merger_libfm-qt FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/merger_libfm-qt/539/18:58
tsimonq2^ that is a valid failure.18:58
tsimonq2Unfortunately my time today is limited.18:58
tsimonq2However, before I go I'll paste a CI report in here.18:58
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/46/19:08
tsimonq2not this again19:08
tsimonq2ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh19:08
tsimonq2makes sense19:09
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/295/19:14
tsimonq2Total jobs failing: 1619:15
tsimonq2Total packages failing: 519:15
tsimonq2Packages which are failing: calamares sddm libfm-qt lxqt-powermanagement qterminal 19:15
tsimonq2SDDM is just failing because of Lintian problems.19:15
tsimonq2(Well, it's Unstable.)19:15
tsimonq2All of the rest are actual failures.19:16
tsimonq2https://ci.lubuntu.me/ <-- take a look and fix packages if you have time.19:16
lubot<kc2bez> Why did cala start failing?19:16
tsimonq2I think it's a transient failure.19:17
tsimonq2I'll paste the report here again when I get back from work. The nightly should be done by then.19:18
lubot<kc2bez> I will keep my eyes open.19:18
tsimonq2merger_libfm-qt is definitely some fun low-hanging fruit. I enabled merges from ubuntu/focal -> ubuntu/groovy -> etc.19:18
tsimonq2Just in case we need to do SRUs.19:18
tsimonq2At some point in the next several days I'll be making a Backports branch for Focal.19:19
lubot<kc2bez> Cool19:19
tsimonq2I *think* the way I'm going to do that is ubuntu/focal -> ubuntu/groovy -> backports/focal -> ci/stable -> ci/unstable.19:20
tsimonq2Actually, hold on, it's a one line change and I can have CI create it for me.19:20
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rCIMETADATAf68e2499b8f3: Add the backports/focal branch.] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rCIMETADATAf68e2499b8f319:21
tsimonq2There.19:21
tsimonq2There's a solid chance we'll see quite a few duplicate builds.19:22
tsimonq2Bad builds could get spammy.19:22
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] merger_libfm-qt FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/merger_libfm-qt/540/19:22
tsimonq2And nice, I see backports/focal now.19:24
tsimonq2That was easy.19:24
lubot<kc2bez> nice19:24
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/46/19:28
lubot<HMollerCl> I don't get what this mean : …  + git merge --ff-only ubuntu/focal … fatal: Not possible to fast-forward, aborting. … Build step 'Execute shell' marked build as failure19:32
lubot<HMollerCl> in https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/merger_libfm-qt/539/console19:32
tsimonq2Basically what it's saying is, when you're on the ubuntu/groovy branch, you can't merge ubuntu/focal into ubuntu/groovy using the fast-forward merge strategy.19:32
tsimonq2This means it needs to be done manually.19:33
tsimonq2I don't trust CI to do it for itself, so when a merger job fails we need to fix that ourselves.19:33
tsimonq2Locally you can do that but don't specify --ff-only.19:33
tsimonq2Then Git can pick whatever merge strategy it thinks is suitable.19:33
lubot<HMollerCl> i didn't knew there existed different merge strategies19:34
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/295/19:34
tsimonq2https://git-scm.com/docs/git-merge#_fast_forward_merge and on19:35
tsimonq2Yeah, it's interesting.19:35
tsimonq2Git can do all kinds of wonderful things.19:35
lubot<kc2bez> tl;Dr git merge will tell you where the merge errors are.19:36
tsimonq2Right.19:37
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/46/19:43
lubot<HMollerCl> interesting19:44
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/295/19:44
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-build-tools ABORTED: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-build-tools/261/19:44
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/46/20:04
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/295/20:05
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_qterminal FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_qterminal/67/20:20
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/focal_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/295/20:25
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_qterminal FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_qterminal/68/20:25
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_lxqt-powermanagement/46/20:29
-lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [Lubuntu CI] groovy_stable_qterminal FAILURE: https://ci.lubuntu.me/job/groovy_stable_qterminal/69/20:51
=== hggdh-msft is now known as hggdh

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