=== simonquigley is now known as tsimonq2 === paride is now known as paride|off [18:58] o/ [18:58] o/ [18:58] o/ [18:59] o/ [19:01] Guess that's a quorum, I think it's my time to chair, right? [19:01] Upcoming: Łukasz, Teward, Rafael, Dan, Robie, Eric [19:01] yep [19:01] #startmeeting DMB meeting [19:01] Meeting started Mon Aug 10 19:01:50 2020 UTC. The chair is sil2100. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. [19:01] Available commands: action commands idea info link nick === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | be nice | DMB meeting | Current topic: [19:02] #topic Review of previous action items === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | be nice | DMB meeting | Current topic: Review of previous action items [19:02] #subtopic rafaeldtinoco to check edubuntu seed <-> pkgset relationship (generation) and if edubuntu pkgsets can be dropped (carried over) [19:02] I think this is duplicated [19:02] ddstreet: ^ did you have this also ? [19:02] (last item) [19:03] Ah, indeed [19:03] rafaeldtinoco yeah i think that's a new one on my action list [19:03] ddstreet: any progress? Or should we carry over? [19:03] new from last mtg [19:03] no progress sorry, plz carry over [19:04] Ok then [19:04] #subtopic rafaeldtinoco to create, for now, a small "what-to-do" for pkgset changes in -devel (document exceptions inclusion for DMB team) (carried over) [19:04] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers/SeedsAndAutomatedPkgsets [19:04] and its a Makefile now [19:04] this is the "quick what to do" [19:04] it will get better (as the long standing item) [19:05] for now you can consider done [19:05] Ok, thanks! I'll have to read that up - today I quickly wanted to use it but it errored out when I tried running `make fetch` [19:05] just ping me [19:05] But I didn't look into the details, need to try again [19:05] sure thing [19:05] I was too busy with pointy-release stuff [19:06] #subtopic rafaeldtinoco link team delegation from dmb kb page when reading ddstreet updates (carried over) [19:06] rafaeldtinoco: nicely done - thanks! [19:06] Is that linked to from anywhere? [19:06] that is this item ^ [19:06] and no, where should I like it ? [19:06] (it will get bigger and more detailed) [19:06] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard/KnowledgeBase is the general starting point for DMB-internal docs [19:06] ok [19:06] (internal as in not relevant to anyone but active DMB members, but public of course) [19:07] sil2100: mark this as carried over then., it will be done next meeting [19:07] rbasak: tku [19:07] Sure o/ [19:07] o/ [19:07] #subtopic DMB to vote at next mtg(s) on controlling the membership access for the OEM enablement metapackages [19:08] I was distracted during the previous meeting, sorry. [19:08] But AIUI, there's nothing being done here yet, except to define a packageset? [19:08] Yeah, so I'm reading the previous meeting logs now [19:09] I think we agreed that we would just be creating a packageset and delegating the management of those permissions to ubuntu-archive, correct? [19:09] As a first step towards making this self service for that team, I'd like [19:09] to ask the DMB to consider making a packageset for this purpose. [19:09] Initially it'll have no uploaders apart from ~ubuntu-core-dev, so we're [19:09] considering the set itself only right now. [19:09] Is this something we should vote on? [19:09] this is the core part for now [19:10] we will have people applying for upload rights later [19:10] iirc [19:10] Ok, so only voting on creating the packageset for now with core-dev as members, without team delegation? [19:10] i would set the team ready [19:10] just so we dont need AA later [19:11] this way we can manage permissions as they apply [19:11] Create a team maybe, and add only ~ubuntu-core-dev to it initially [19:11] yep [19:11] then we are good to go for applications [19:12] Do we want to define the initial packageset contents formally? [19:12] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard/KnowledgeBase#Personal_packagesets_and_glob_expansions is prior art for "glob-based" packagesets [19:12] There, the formal packageset contents was defined in the packageset description using the glob pattern [19:12] yep [19:13] m tells me [19:13] that packageset permissions can be added if a source package exists [19:13] *anywhere* (i.e. in a PPA), not just in Ubuntu. So there would be a [19:13] script which enumerates a staging PPA and adds packages found there [19:13] which match the glob 'oem-*-meta' to the packageset. [19:13] Yeah, so the glob here would be oem-*-meta [19:13] they want source packages to come automatically from a staging ppa [19:13] Ok, so let me formulate the vote then [19:13] rafaeldtinoco: I would prefer to require the glob to be driven from the archive, not from a PPA [19:14] I'm not sure a packageset containing a package not in the archive would work anyway [19:14] rbasak: what are the cons ? [19:14] ah i see [19:14] that was a concern for me also rbasak, driving the packageset from a ppa is essentially opening a backdoor into the archive [19:14] It's confusing, because the DMB's remit relates to the archive only [19:14] you mean an upload for a source that we dont have [19:14] yep [19:14] And also what ddstreet says [19:14] The process would be: [19:15] Get a core dev or MOTU sponsored upload into the archive [19:15] Get an AA to do the NEW review [19:15] Ask the DMB to run the script to update the packageset using the glob pattern [19:15] In that order [19:15] Are we ready to vote on the base part? [19:16] what is the NEW review ? [19:16] rbasak: ^ [19:16] sil2100 is there specific wording that we're voting on now? [19:16] sil2100: I think we are all +1 on this, currently discussing the implementation [19:17] #vote Creation of a new canonical-oem-metapackages packageset and owning team for the glob expansion of oem-*-meta, initially having ~ubuntu-core-dev as the only member [19:17] Please vote on: Creation of a new canonical-oem-metapackages packageset and owning team for the glob expansion of oem-*-meta, initially having ~ubuntu-core-dev as the only member [19:17] Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname) [19:17] (we need a formal vote) [19:17] Did I get this right? [19:18] +1 assuming that the glob expansion will be performed from archive packages only [19:18] +1 assuming that the glob expansion will be performed from archive packages only received from rbasak [19:18] +1 for pkgset and team creation [19:18] +1 for pkgset and team creation received from ddstreet [19:18] +1 [19:18] +1 received from sil2100 [19:18] +1 for both [19:18] +1 for both received from rafaeldtinoco [19:18] #endvote [19:18] Voting ended on: Creation of a new canonical-oem-metapackages packageset and owning team for the glob expansion of oem-*-meta, initially having ~ubuntu-core-dev as the only member [19:18] Votes for:4 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0 [19:18] Motion carried [19:18] Ok, motion carried, yes, we can proceed with implementation details [19:18] ;) [19:19] sorry, had in my head this was already voted previously [19:19] thanks [19:19] i think at the last mtg we said it would be better to defer the specific pkgset operation to ubuntu-archive or ubuntu-sru team, is that right? and dmb would only manage team membership? [19:19] I don't think it was, as the action item was to vote on it now [19:20] ddstreet: we did say that [19:20] but never agreed [19:20] Yeah [19:20] im thinking if that would be easier for them [19:20] i do agree with rbasak on the concerns around the implementation, but maybe that's best for a different team to work out? [19:21] AIUI then, we'd define the glob expansion (ie. define the script that does the glob expansion) but ~ubuntu-archive or ~ubuntu-sru would actually run it? [19:21] If that's considered useful, then sure [19:21] im ok with that [19:21] i'm ok either way [19:21] rbasak: would that be a burden for the sru team ? [19:21] thinking on what would be best for all (SRU team and this new team) [19:22] Same here, I don't think it's that much of a deal to actually need to be delegated though [19:22] if its just running a script [19:22] i can do it with the weekly pkgset [19:22] The SRU team aren't used to managing packagesets or running recognising weird edge cases to run appropriate scripts [19:22] pkgset <-> seed sync [19:22] i can run both together [19:22] do we have a "production" place [19:23] to land those things ? [19:23] I'm not refusing to do it on behalf of the SRU team or anything, but I'm not sure it's going to be helpful. In practice it'll end up getting missed I think [19:23] I'd say let's leave it under our control for now [19:23] sounds like rafaeldtinoco is taking an action item to add it to the tooling then? :) [19:23] rbasak: that is understood [19:23] ddstreet: its ok for me.. i was just wondering [19:23] is my home the best place to run cron jobs ? [19:23] I'm with sil2100. Let's leave it under our control for now. [19:23] should I deploy it somewhere ? [19:23] We don't have a good place to cron it from [19:24] ok, it will continue here then [19:24] We could start by just responding to a ping from an uploader who is stuck [19:24] And then go from there [19:24] Ok, let's put some action items [19:24] Who wants to take the actual team and packageset creation? [19:24] I'll take it [19:24] cool. i can do the scripting [19:24] and crontabing [19:25] if needed (or should we wait applicants first ?) [19:25] #action rbasak to take care of the canonical-oem-metapackages packageset and owning team creation [19:25] ACTION: rbasak to take care of the canonical-oem-metapackages packageset and owning team creation [19:25] rbasak: guess it needs the TB, right? [19:25] (I always forget) [19:25] rafaeldtinoco: personally I'd wait until managing it manually becomes painful [19:25] But I have no objection if you want to run ahead with it [19:25] manually it is [19:25] Yes - packageset creation will need the TB. We have a process for requesting that [19:25] so we can all get used to it [19:25] I think we all have enough on our plates that it's best not to put additional scripting work ;) [19:25] sil2100: yes! [19:26] Ok, I think we have this sorted out then [19:26] #subtopic slashd to add Yaru to the desktop set for focal [19:26] I don't think slashd is here with us today? [19:26] Does anyone know if that is done? [19:27] looks like it's not done yet [19:27] and slashd is out today [19:27] Ok, let's carry that one over then [19:28] Last action item is a duplicate, and we discussed it already [19:28] We have no applicants today, so let's move to AOB [19:28] #topic AOB === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | be nice | DMB meeting | Current topic: AOB [19:28] Anything to discuss otherwise? [19:29] I take that as a no! [19:30] Ok, I guess we can finish [19:30] #topic Select a chair for the next meeting === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | be nice | DMB meeting | Current topic: Select a chair for the next meeting [19:30] That would be Teward, but I guess he's not here today [19:30] #endmeeting === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds: Please leave swords by the door | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | be nice [19:30] Meeting ended Mon Aug 10 19:30:47 2020 UTC. [19:30] Minutes: http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2020/ubuntu-meeting.2020-08-10-19.01.moin.txt [19:30] Thanks everyone! [19:30] sil2100: tku! [19:30] thanks! o/ [19:30] I'll update the Agenda now [19:30] o/ everyone [19:30] have a gn/good day [19:31] o/ [19:31] Don't let the thunderstorms kill yall [19:49] sil2100: nope not here because Hospital [19:49] appendicitis [19:50] they got the thing out but i am in recov until tomorrow [19:50] still 'alive' barely though