[00:47] <ubptgbot> Hanmou was added by: Hanmou
 @mateosalta [ah, maybe we enable a overscroll of sorts to keep the scroll active], lol every time i here "overscroll" i tend to thing of overscroll to navigate and refresh :p
 @UniversalSuperBox [The morph-browser source package includes both the webapp container and the brow …], hmm so the source code for webapp-container is in the morph repo?
 Yes
 cool, was wondering about that, thanks
 and the morph module that you import is there as well
[05:37] <ubptgbot> Spidey_SPIDEY_Spidey was added by: Spidey_SPIDEY_Spidey
[08:10] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> i wish firefox or chrome be compatible with ubtouch
[08:11] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> are anyone tested snaps on ubtouch
 @Oxy Kali [i wish firefox or chrome be compatible with ubtouch], Morph is chromium/chrome
 @Oxy Kali [are anyone tested snaps on ubtouch], Desktop ubuntu != ubuntu touch
[08:17] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> can i install snaps arm64 on ubtouch
 @Oxy Kali [can i install snaps arm64 on ubtouch], No
[08:25] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @amyosx [No], 😔
 no snaps amd flatpaks aren't suppprted yet
 we all wish a lot of things but this is life 😄
[08:29] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @Javacookies [no snaps amd flatpaks aren't suppprted yet], i found snaps arm64 bro
[08:30] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> yeah but i wish devlopers works on snaps ubtouch
 Canonical tried before but they dropped the project without actually finishing it or doing anything substantial
 also, snaps and flatpaks won't magically support other apps
 we still need to fully move to wayland
 otherwise, you can install apps but won't be able to launch them … CLI, sure
[08:32] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> oh okay
[08:33] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> another question bro
[08:33] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> why camera apps don't work on anbox whatsapp
 I don't think anbox apps has hardware access yet
 no one has really worked on anbox although I believe they're looking for one
[08:44] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> okay bro
 @Oxy Kali [yeah but i wish devlopers works on snaps ubtouch], Snap is a packaging format, but that wont make desktop Apps magically work on UT
[08:48] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @Flohack [Snap is a packaging format, but that wont make desktop Apps magically work on UT], 😞
 @Oxy Kali [😞], What snaps would you like to use?
[08:51] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @Flohack [What snaps would you like to use?], brave browser . telegram
 @Oxy Kali [brave browser . telegram], Well even if they could start, they need integration. Exchange for files, downloading, audio and video playback etc. Access to location, other stuff. That does not work like on a desktop, so those Apps wont know how to do it and would not work properly
[08:53] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @Flohack [Well even if they could start, they need integration. Exchange for files, downlo …], okay
 Its the same problem as if you would install a desktop application on an android phone (lets assume its written in JAva). That still would not work ^^
 @Flohack [Its the same problem as if you would install a desktop application on an android …], We have flatpaks on sfos
[08:54] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @Flohack [Its the same problem as if you would install a desktop application on an android …], ah i understand now thanks
[08:55] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @ItsMeShouko [We have flatpaks on sfos], i know but on mi a2 sos have many bugs
 @Oxy Kali [i know but on mi a2 sos have many bugs], Tell me in other group
[08:55] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @ItsMeShouko [Tell me in other group], where
 @Oxy Kali [i know but on mi a2 sos have many bugs], [Edit] Tell me in other group, except autorotation ofc
 @Oxy Kali [where], Lab
 @ItsMeShouko [We have flatpaks on sfos], You don´t have Mir ^^
[08:56] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @ItsMeShouko [Lab], ok
 And trust prompts
 and content-hub
 and apparmor xD
 Ah that’s why
 Well its APIs and integration
 Canonical decided to roll a bit of their own, that has advantages but ofc also disadvantages
 @ItsMeShouko [Morph is chromium/chrome], morph is based on qt web engine afaik
 @just_carlod [morph is based on qt web engine afaik], qt web engine is chromium
 ok I didn't know that
[09:04] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> so morph is chromium
 @Oxy Kali [so morph is chromium], well, morph is using the same web engine than chromium
[09:11] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @flaburgan [well, morph is using the same web engine than chromium], okay
 so it will display the websites the same way
 it isn't chromium as it doesn't have the features built around
[09:12] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> can i add extention
 no, typically that's a feature which isn't available in Morph
[09:12] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> omg
 if you're looking for an adblocker, there is one system wide in the openstore
[09:13] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> i know thank you
[09:14] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @flaburgan [if you're looking for an adblocker, there is one system wide in the openstore], you know how to edit pictures i mean apps
 the Gallery app allows you to crop  and this kind of things I think
 I don't do that with my phone sorry
[09:16] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> okay thanks
 @ItsMeShouko have extracted some logs, if that helps, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1hvGN3IvmRsDMZ1s8obovSilvUNnyyupy/view?usp=sharing
[09:33] <ubptgbot> Slepetc was added by: Slepetc
 @Flohack [You don´t have Mir ^^], A bird told me flatpak apps  do work on ut but no osk in, probably no trust prompts, content hub and such either :p
 :P
 I think OSK and Wayland integration are the problems, I personally can live without content-hub and trust prompts
 @NotKit [I think OSK and Wayland integration are the problems, I personally can live with …], Personally yes, but we are telling users that we are a very secure OS with privacy in mind, that implies you need central control over which data an App can collect, and how data exchange is made so that one App cannot see any data of another app
[12:45] <ubptgbot> . In traditional desktop this will alway be a problem. Access there is granted for the user, not the application, and thats bad if you have a lot of 3rd party apps.
 @Flohack [Personally yes, but we are telling users that we are a very secure OS with priva …], While true of "traditional" desktops the direction of travel is fixing these security issues. (But there is user resistance to snaps and flatpak because this can be inconvenient.)
 @alan_griffiths [While true of "traditional" desktops the direction of travel is fixing these sec …], Users. Oh my. 😆
 Don't get me started. 🙃
 @alan_griffiths [While true of "traditional" desktops the direction of travel is fixing these sec …], So you mean snaps and flatpack should have conduits or interceptors where those requests could be controlled?
 in my opinion, I'd rather have support for other apps without the security features than nothing at all. Look at the store, there's a lot of unconfined essential apps there that we use anyway. Of course, this also reminds us there's a lot of things to do in those regards 😅
 @Javacookies [in my opinion, I'd rather have support for other apps without the security featu …], Automatic loosening of security is bad, you should always be prompted that smth is going to escalate ^^
 we can always put a red flag warning just like the unconfined apps in the store
 I just don't think we can survive without supporting other linux apps or packaging formats
 @Javacookies [I just don't think we can survive without supporting other linux apps or packagi …], ++
 agree, I want freedom to choose what to run even if it is unconfined
 @Javacookies [I just don't think we can survive without supporting other linux apps or packagi …], You know as soon as that is solved, people will complain about other things, like usability, performance, font scaling, weird colors etc. There are 100s of breaking points that in the end could mean "please do it like Mobian, but with Ubuntu
[13:23] <ubptgbot>  name on it" means just have it like a normal PC, with apt hoooray and no security checks, and, of course, you can run your loved web servers on the phone 😆
 @Flohack [You know as soon as that is solved, people will complain about other things, lik …], I personally don't think having an option to be like Mobian is a bad thing
 imagine Pro1 docked with full desktop
 there are compromises everywhere of course, but sometimes it feels UT is getting too defensive about usage patterns "as designed"
 @NotKit [imagine Pro1 docked with full desktop], Its not a matter of if you are working on an HDMI screen or on the local panel, with mouse or touch. Its about philosophy behind. Freedom is nice for experienced people, but having less choices, with more focus on stability, privacy and preventio of dat aloss is important for the majority o
[13:26] <ubptgbot> f non-tech nerds
 iPhone got popular by taking away choices right
 Apple becomes successful for taking away choices and I hate them for that. They're basically cheating to create awesome products 😄
 I understand the focus on non-technical people that originated for Canonical, but there should be also a switch for us nerds, otherwise I don't get what we're even doing here
 [Edit] I understand the focus on non-technical people that originated for Canonical, but there should be also a switch to enable a mode for us nerds, otherwise I don't get what we're even doing here
 [Edit] I understand the focus on non-technical people that originated from Canonical, but there should be also a switch to enable a mode for us nerds, otherwise I don't get what we're even doing here
 @Flohack [Its not a matter of if you are working on an HDMI screen or on the local panel, …], 👍
 i don't think supporting linux apps and packaging formats are necessarily for advanced users. All will benefit from it.
 There will be more complaints but that's always the case anyway regardless of what we do 😅
 @NotKit [I understand the focus on non-technical people that originated from Canonical, b …], I am also a Nerd but I see that Nerds will always have choices of mobile alternatives, and can beat them into shape. I am more concerned about the mass of other people, if you want to get relevant in the mobile space we need to attract more non-n
[13:29] <ubptgbot> erds
 @Javacookies [There will be more complaints but that's always the case anyway regardless of wh …], True lol
[13:29] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> I'm reading all this now - my take on this is that I'm afraid of Ubuntu Touch becoming like Linux on my Asus Transformer Mini tablet right now. On screen keyboard doesn't pop up automatically, different applications different amount of touch support etc. Therefore I would rather not support applications that aren't designed for mobile use
[13:29] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> [Edit] I'm reading all this now - my take on this is that I'm afraid of Ubuntu Touch becoming like Linux on my Asus Transformer Mini tablet right now. On screen keyboard doesn't pop up automatically, different applications different amount of touch support etc. Therefore I would rather not support applications that aren't designed for mob
[13:29] <ubptgbot> ile use and don't use UT toolkits
 @Heng Ye [I'm reading all this now - my take on this is that I'm afraid of Ubuntu Touch be …], Ha he is right 😆
 Lomiri is made for mobile and desktops so that means it'll eventually be used for all linux apps. UT is about convergence so running linux apps should be part of it.
[13:31] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> @Javacookies [Lomiri is made for mobile and desktops so that means it'll eventually be used fo …], Then how do you get the on screen keyboard to pop up on firefox? I don't see any desktop that can do that :)
 having support for non-touch ready apps doesn't automatically mean you should use them
 I think with the pinephone and such, many desktop apps will be usable on mobile anyway, sure not now but for the foreseeable future
 like even if you could install Firefox, why would you do it on phone?
[13:31] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> @NotKit [having support for non-touch ready apps doesn't automatically mean you should us …], yeah, we shouldn't be integrating them into the system like other distros do with desktop
[13:32] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> @NotKit [like even if you could install Firefox, why would you do it on phone?], moar power, with extensions and such.
 but it will make sense to be able to run Firefox on PineTab/when docket/etc
 [Edit] but it will make sense to be able to run Firefox on PineTab/when docked/etc
 @Heng Ye [Then how do you get the on screen keyboard to pop up on firefox? I don't see any …], I believe libretine and xmi already does that, no?
[13:32] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> great!
 it's kind of solvable by GTK+3 Maliit extension
 [Edit] it's kind of solvable by GTK+3 Maliit input method
[13:33] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> @NotKit [but it will make sense to be able to run Firefox on PineTab/when docked/etc], Yeah it makes sense - maybe we can have an option not to display "Non-mobile" applications when not docked/keyboard not connected
 We are talking about the ideal scenarios here. Of course, stability is still more important right now especially with the limited developers 😄
 one thing I'm sure is that I don't like content hub in its current form 😆 … I like the intention but it's currently counter productive 😅
[13:35] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> Something like this in openstore https://puri.sm/posts/specify-form-factors-in-your-librem-5-apps/ maybe
 I'd just want to say that technical problems preventing us from running same apps as Mobian are pretty much solvable without breaking lot of things. But each time this is brought up it goes into philosophical discussions about system design, confinement and so on
 @NotKit [I understand the focus on non-technical people that originated from Canonical, b …], ++ for 1 master switch
 I stand behind the readonly rootfs and confinement but I don't want these to prevent us from supporting other stuffs. It'll be like installing deb and snaps/flatpaks on desktops. Deb is the less secure version but not everyrhing has snap/flatpak vetsion yet. At first, that could happen with click/confinement. But at least users has ch
[13:43] <ubptgbot> oice to use them.
 @Javacookies [I stand behind the readonly rootfs and confinement but I don't want these to pre …], any thoughts on this? https://pt.neko.bar/videos/watch/42fca97f-d240-4360-9359-e5b5c58fe219
 I don't really know much about them to have an opinion 😅 … I just want a single solution that we can all adapt 😄
[14:29] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @Javacookies [I don't really know much about them to have an opinion 😅 … I just want a single s …], i see this poste https://gist.github.com/flexiondotorg/5bf938624e6d912598d5e4bc4e512b56
 @Javacookies [Lomiri is made for mobile and desktops so that means it'll eventually be used fo …], there's no such thing as "linux apps"; android apps are "linux apps"; UT click packages are "linux apps"; all the legacy X11 apps are "linux apps"; steam games are "linux apps"; everything is a "linux app" when you can literally run anything
[14:30] <ubptgbot> on linux
[14:32] <ubptgbot> <S̶̡͎̭̜̖̏̌͌̏͌̍͐̇̽̔́͘̚͠ ͔̮> @dohbee [there's no such thing as "linux apps"; android apps are "linux apps"; UT click p …], No no, rightly everything is a file!
[14:32] <ubptgbot> <S̶̡͎̭̜̖̏̌͌̏͌̍͐̇̽̔́͘̚͠ ͔̮> :3
 whatever those apps are called 😆
[14:33] <ubptgbot> <S̶̡͎̭̜̖̏̌͌̏͌̍͐̇̽̔́͘̚͠ ͔̮> @Javacookies [whatever those apps are called 😆], files. =)
[14:37] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> even windows apps are linux apps when you have wine
[14:38] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> Yeah
 Wine apps are X11 apps from what we need
[14:40] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> I wish all the applications on Ubuntu desktop could be touched
[14:40] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @NotKit [Wine apps are X11 apps from what we need], Running exe
 is serial output is enabled in the kernel?
 @pavelov [is serial output is enabled in the kernel?], - 1 is
[16:00] <ubptgbot> A_T_R was added by: A_T_R
[16:22] <ubptgbot> Nithin was added by: Nithin
[16:59] <ubptgbot> <Benni S> Can I copy & paste betweeen apps
 yes but it's not currently working on the pinephone unless you're in windowed mode if I am not mistakeb
[17:10] <ubptgbot> Petr Krbec was added by: Petr Krbec
[17:10] <ubptgbot> David was added by: David
 On the subject of apps, I'm wondering if there will be an ARM64 version of UBsync
[17:15] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/0y0MkUq5.webp
 I think my jasmine_sprout display dying issue is with lightdm
 @pavelov [I think my jasmine_sprout display dying issue is with lightdm], Basically you didn’t flash stock 9 properly or you flashed incompatible stock 9 rom
 @ItsMeShouko [Basically you didn’t flash stock 9 properly or you flashed incompatible stock 9 …], You mean this one, https://github.com/ubports-xiaomi-sdm660/artifacts/releases/download/v0.1/jasmine_sprout_stock_android9.zip, as a matter of fact I did, 4/5 times and repeated the process, the UBports installer worked with it, otherwise it
[17:32] <ubptgbot> says this jasmine is not supported
 @pavelov [You mean this one, https://github.com/ubports-xiaomi-sdm660/artifacts/releases/d …], Did you flash it to both slots?
 @ItsMeShouko [Did you flash it to both slots?], I flashed it and booted the system, enabled debug mode, only then the UBport autostarts the installer
 @pavelov [I flashed it and booted the system, enabled debug mode, only then the UBport aut …], What about slots?
 @ItsMeShouko [What about slots?], you mean to say that the slob b is left out?
 @pavelov [you mean to say that the slob b is left out?], I think I need to roll out my own flash script
 Then only it would be painless to new users
 @ItsMeShouko [I think I need to roll out my own flash script], because other than recovery and boot loader, the system boots from slot a
 not sure about the rest
 though for installing custom rom, I usually flash twrp to slot b and then the rom flashes itself to both slots
 talking about the custom rom
 @pavelov [talking about the custom rom], https://t.me/shoukolab
 Join here
 I added him
 @just_carlod [I added him], Ok
 @pavelov [talking about the custom rom], Pm me
 @ItsMeShouko [I think I need to roll out my own flash script], installer is able to flash partitions if it can download them from somewhere
 @Flohack [iPhone got popular by taking away choices right], Well
 @NotKit [installer is able to flash partitions if it can download them from somewhere], yeah but we need to flash stock rom via twrp before flashing ut
 can't it be fastboot flashed instead?
 @just_carlod [yeah but we need to flash stock rom via twrp before flashing ut], Dump partitions xD
 @NotKit [can't it be fastboot flashed instead?], unluckly not
 why?
 cause it's zip not script
 but maybe it's possible just I don't know how to do this
 [Edit] but maybe it's possible just I don't know how to do it
 @just_carlod [but maybe it's possible just I don't know how to do it], Send me zip
[18:31] <ubptgbot> <Heng Ye> @just_carlod [cause it's zip not script], I wonder if we can automate booting twrp
 https://bigota.d.miui.com/V10.0.17.0.PDIMIXM/jasmine_global_images_V10.0.17.0.PDIMIXM_20191108.0000.00_9.0_94629a1855.tgz
 we use this https://github.com/ubports-xiaomi-sdm660/artifacts/releases/download/v0.1/jasmine_sprout_stock_android9.zip
 on this rom everythings works
[18:34] <ubptgbot> Kkffuu was added by: Kkffuu
 @just_carlod [we use this https://github.com/ubports-xiaomi-sdm660/artifacts/releases/download …], I changed its name to be human readable I that was my misstake
 @NotKit [https://bigota.d.miui.com/V10.0.17.0.PDIMIXM/jasmine_global_images_V10.0.17.0.PD …], I don't remeber which version it is :(, but maybe there's a way to check it
 @just_carlod [I don't remeber which version it is :(, but maybe there's a way to check it], Flash it
 @just_carlod [I don't remeber which version it is :(, but maybe there's a way to check it], It's miui 10 android 9
 I think
 Yeah V10 9.0
 @xyn_dev [It's miui 10 android 9], mi a2 is not using miui
 btw miui 11 is android 9
 Miui 10 and 11 are both android 9
 Afaik
 yeah my misstake
 I took the link from https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/fastboot-jasmine-xiaomi-mi-a2-fastboot-images.3824849/
 I will check those images
 and make new installer
 People, is anyone willing to finish porting Amazfish app from Sailfish OS? The developer said that he already ported it to desktop / UT components but, he needs a UT app dev to do that final packaging.
 @branja6 [People, is anyone willing to finish porting Amazfish app from Sailfish OS? The d …], @UbuntuAppDevEN
 Thx
 Hello, is there any way to use Jami on UBports?
 @bettehem [Hello, is there any way to use Jami on UBports?], It would need either someone to build 16.04 compatible armhf and arm64 deb's from their source code, in which case some of its functions might work inside a Libertine container OR someone would need to port its code and package it as a click to create a UT native app for it.
 Okay
 I'd be fine with Libertine but sadly it doesn't work on the OnePlus 3 :(
 @bettehem [I'd be fine with Libertine but sadly it doesn't work on the OnePlus 3 :(], It is also possible some of the functions might work with its Android version running under Anbox - but Anbox on IT is in an unstable alpha state right now.
 Best thing would be to contact the Jami developers and ask them to create a native UT version.
 @bettehem [I'd be fine with Libertine but sadly it doesn't work on the OnePlus 3 :(], [Edit] It is also possible some of the functions might work with its Android version running under Anbox - but Anbox on UT is in an unstable alpha state right now.
 Yeah probably
 Although now that it came up, do you have any idea how i could get Libertine working on the OnePlus 3?
 @bettehem [Although now that it came up, do you have any idea how i could get Libertine wor …], I do not.
 Okay, thanks anyway
 @bettehem [Okay, thanks anyway], No problem! And thanks for letting me know about the Jami project - it looks interesting.
 Yeah I only found out about it recently too! Seems pretty cool
[21:08] <ubptgbot> Aki Siika-aho was added by: Aki Siika-aho
 @bettehem [Yeah I only found out about it recently too! Seems pretty cool], It would probably not have video, which would remove a lot of the point of it
 Oh, why so?
 @bettehem [Oh, why so?], It is a general problem in UT
 Oh okay
 @bettehem [Oh okay], It needs a series of changes in system components as I understand it. Not trivial, otherwise it would have been done a dozen times over
 In theory you can have a voice chat in Teleports by sending recordings to each other 😜
 @Stereofont [In theory you can have a voice chat in Teleports by sending recordings to each o …], Haha
 Haha
 Yeah
 Though the most interesting feature of jami for me is the screen sharing possibility, I have been using discord with my friends for that so far, but i really don't like or trust discord, so this is a way better choice
 huh
 is Jami what used to be 'Ring'? their logos look similar
 I think so
 it had some other names, like SFLphone