 hmmmm
[02:41] <ubptgbot> <8BTC Melody> I don't understand sir
 @alera_on [I read the feedbacks above, but I was a little lost.  However, I would like to p …], cool, you can use the logo for your desktop mix that uses lomiri
 arch and manjaro that use lomiri substitute their own logis
[05:41] <ubptgbot> Novan23a was added by: Novan23a
[07:12] <ubptgbot> RadekR was added by: RadekR
[07:27] <ubptgbot> harmonline was added by: harmonline
[07:35] <ubptgbot> xander2m was added by: xander2m
[08:37] <ubptgbot> Sam was added by: Sam
[08:47] <ubptgbot> Nikosm was added by: Nikosm
[09:40] <ubptgbot> wouter182 was added by: wouter182
 For all the people who did read the information about ubports on tweakers.net and search for the dutch user group, the group is @UBports_NL
[09:52] <ubptgbot> Joannis was added by: Joannis
 I don't currently own a supported device, but I've been happily looking forward to working on developing more Linux clients. Does Ubuntu Touch happen to support an emulator?
 Or something like a VM of sorts
 And has anyone here compiled a Swift program on/for Ubuntu Touch?
 @Joannis [And has anyone here compiled a Swift program on/for Ubuntu Touch?], Ubuntu touch supports only .click packages and you should program your app in c++/qml
 @just_carlod [Ubuntu touch supports only .click packages and you should program your app in c+ …], Can I not make a (Swift) binary that links with the C++ QML library?
 And by _should_ I assume you mean that it's possible to do otherwise, but not recommended?
 Hello, I would like to run the entire UBports network through TOR every time the smartphone starts up, do you know how to do that?
 @Joannis [And by _should_ I assume you mean that it's possible to do otherwise, but not re …], Qml is mainly used for UI. You can use many languages for backend. c++ although is the only one that will allow you access all parts of the system. But JS, python, rust, go, ... can be used and are already used.
 @Danfro [Qml is mainly used for UI. You can use many languages for backend. c++ although …], Exactly, that makes sense 🙂
 Thanks to both of you!
 @Elias [Hello, I would like to run the entire UBports network through TOR every time the …], Wouldn't this be the same/similar to the same question on regular ubuntu?
 @nanu_c [Because every app started with qmlscene is called that way and there is no possi …], there is though.
 A thin version of "qmlscene" implementing a qml engine and exposing applicationName and title to a qt quick application is possible. At some point in qt, Window and Settings had properties exposed which could do this, but I'm not sure it was pre or post 5.9
 I would argue that an app should be described by its window title property, for QML apps.
 @Joannis [Wouldn't this be the same/similar to the same question on regular ubuntu?], Ubuntu Desktop is much less limited than Ubuntu Touch, if you have an answer to how to get all the ubuntu Touch network through TOR, I'm more than a taker.
 I don't, unfortunately. I'm really just exploring the idea of getting a new phone to start developing again. I had Ubuntu Touch installed on an old phone a long time ago, but since a Dutch news website just posted an article this has gotten my interest again.
 @Joannis [I don't, unfortunately. I'm really just exploring the idea of getting a new phon …], Go ahead. Always a good choice. 👍🏼
 @Elias [Ubuntu Desktop is much less limited than Ubuntu Touch, if you have an answer to …], Does there happen to be a list of notable limitations?
 For dev, I love UT. I kinda don't love media-hub though.
 What my gut instinct says is that getting a small set of Swift libraries for UT would be a great starting place for getting more app developers involved.
 Imagine Dart and Flutter on UT?
 That'd help a tonne, too
 It's .. actually somewhat trivial to implement, too.
 I would love to write that, but I'm poor and too busy developing paid apps 😭
 @Daniel [A thin version of "qmlscene" implementing a qml engine and exposing applicationN …], So you have a documentation for that?
 @Daniel [For dev, I love UT. I kinda don't love media-hub though.], I think media hub is fine, just needs further development to support more use cases … what I don't like is the content hub. I feel like it has to be redesigned from the ground up. Too bad we don't billions to develop these things 😆
 I .. don't know, if you open Qt Creator and click "New Project", then select "Qt Quick - Empty Project" you get a thin client that, if you modify main.cpp to load argv[1] instead of "qml/main.cpp" would effectively provide the same thing.
 Exposing QApplication properties is relatively well documented, though.
 @Javacookies [I think media hub is fine, just needs further development to support more use ca …], I haven't played with it much, but I have one app where media plays, but I only get audio because of... reasons?
 In the same app I want to save content, and it .. "works", but only to my app's own private content folder. I don't blame content hub for it, I know very well I'm not familiar enough with it.
 @Joannis [Does there happen to be a list of notable limitations?], Ubuntu Touch is not an open linux distribution, you can just do what you want to do, all usable applications are in the openStore. … but that's not the point, if you think Ubuntu Touch has no limitation then feel free to explain me how to get the whole ubuntu touch network t
[10:47] <ubptgbot> hrough TOR. … Because under any linux distribution, it's very easy to install a tool like anonym8 https://github.com/HiroshiManRise/anonym8 to make the whole network switch to TOR.
 @Elias [Ubuntu Touch is not an open linux distribution, you can just do what you want to …], That's not what I'm saying. I'm actually asking for the limitations, because I'm curious.
 I'm not trying to argue for or against your question.
 Background applications aren't really a thing, sometimes calls or SMSs aren't received, many popular services from iPhone and Android aren't yet available, and video playback kinda only works from official apps
 Buuut you should also ask about advantages
 @Joannis [That's not what I'm saying. I'm actually asking for the limitations, because I'm …], Okay, sorry I didn't understand, on Ubuntu Touch it's recommended to use only the tools offered in the openStore, because as soon as you start trying to install other tools, it immediately becomes a gas factory ^^
 @Elias [Okay, sorry I didn't understand, on Ubuntu Touch it's recommended to use only th …], I would be happy to help if I could install UT now. That'll have to wait a little while. I hope someone else in this chat has a solution for you 🙂
 @Daniel [Buuut you should also ask about advantages], I can see a lot of advantages, for myself at least. I've got a large set of Swift libraries that are designed for Linux . And I'm eagerly looking forward to expanding them to client devices, as well.
 @Daniel [Background applications aren't really a thing, sometimes calls or SMSs aren't re …], These'll be solved over time, I'm sure.
 It's a reinforced circle with ecosystems like these. More negative or lack of attention, leads to more. The same goes for more positive or intensive attention.
 I'm sorry
[10:56] <ubptgbot> Levkama was added by: Levkama
 I thought Swift was an iPhone/Apple thing
 Yeah, that's still on the back of many minds.
 What is the easiest programming language to develop applications for UT?
 QML/Javascript
 https://swift.org/download/#releases
 There's quite a few platforms now
 @Joannis [Yeah, that's still on the back of many minds.], Okay, so all you need is a Swift rendering system for your apps/libraries?
 I'm personally not interested in Windows, beyond servers
 @Daniel [Okay, so all you need is a Swift rendering system for your apps/libraries?], Sure
 I'm happy building it myself
[10:58] <ubptgbot> zarcoz was added by: zarcoz
 Saying "Windows Server" to me sounds like "Sushi Icecream", but I know it's a real thing
 @Daniel [Saying "Windows Server" to me sounds like "Sushi Icecream", but I know it's a re …], Yeah, some customers only run Windows server
 Idk, I hate it. But there's a demand
 I'm aware, and I ... don't blame them, for a lot of vendors, it's the only choice
 Intuit still doesn't develop ACCPAC on Linux, I think?
 I've got a partial MSSQL library lying around for that need
 Have you worked with MSSQL?
 Oh, sorry
 Not much, hardly any
 Luckily
 Just the protocol
 That was painful enough
 I read MySQL and.. yeah, me too. Yet I made a living fixing it for like 3 years.
 Don't think MySQL is great though.. I dismissed the entire idea of MySQL being a great system when I dove into the protocol.
 PSQL is a lot better in many ways
 I would argue that Linux-centric services require background knowledge, and MS-centric services you can fumble, google, and click your way through
 @Daniel [I would argue that Linux-centric services require background knowledge, and MS-c …], That's scale, isn't it?
 I like PGSQL I just don't live having to vacuum
 Scale...
 SQL isn't scale.
 Anyways, what I'm interested in is Ubuntu Touch + Swift for ARM
 https://swift-arm.com
 I mean scale in users, not data
 I get that, but bad indexes make fools of SQL admins
 I think you should attempt a port
 Clickable is the buildsystem
 If you visit https://clickable-ut.dev/en/latest/ you can get a primer on how to start.
 I've added you as a telegram contact, do you mind if I reach out to you when I've got an environment to use?
[11:03] <ubptgbot> ihor_shaman was added by: ihor_shaman
 It will seem intense, but A) it isn't, and B) join https://t.me/UbuntuAppDevEN
 Not at all, call me if you want
 My English is decent enough
 Cool
 Although I've only ever developed 5 or 6 UT apps
 Hah, I've done 1 prototype 2 years ago I think
 That's 5 of my 6, no worries
 Not much has changed
 Clickable actually got more stable, and easier to use
 Also, they allow my last name now
 Wat do you mean?
 Oh, my last name is O'Neill
 And you know SQL, that isn't allowed
 HAH!
 @Daniel [Imagine Dart and Flutter on UT?], Allowing UT app development using Swift /dart is great idea 😍. … It will bring lots of mobile developer into UT ecosystem.Please let me know if you need any helping hands .I will be happy to help.
 Will do!
 I'm going to set up a development environment in a few hours
 I'll link it here to you and Daniel if I have a small app working
 Or if I'm stuck
 @Joannis [Does there happen to be a list of notable limitations?], few notable differences of UT compared to desktop ubuntu would be: … - a readonly rootfs … - rootfs limited to 2GB … - aggressive battery management … - applications are confined
 @Elias [Ubuntu Touch is not an open linux distribution, you can just do what you want to …], if that is need we need to find a way to install it no?
 @Elias [Okay, sorry I didn't understand, on Ubuntu Touch it's recommended to use only th …], uh no, that's not completely through, apt just isn't supported and if libertine is not useful, there's no other alternative.........yet
 @Joannis [It's a reinforced circle with ecosystems like these. More negative or lack of at …], agreed xD
 @Elias [Okay, sorry I didn't understand, on Ubuntu Touch it's recommended to use only th …], [Edit] uh no, that's not completely through, apt just isn't supported and if libertine is not useful, there's no other alternative.........yet … currently if the solution is `install this-app` then its worth to see if libertine can do the trick
[13:36] <ubptgbot> peterpepper was added by: peterpepper
[13:58] <ubptgbot> Manish was added by: Manish
 I've just ordered a secondhand Nexus 5. Can anyone tell me about their experiences with convergence? Does it work well? What do you do about keyboard & mouse? Thanks
 bluetooth kb/mouse or the phone itself should become a virtual touchpad (not sure if that's still not working right on n5 or not)
[15:06] <ubptgbot> mrcyjanek was added by: mrcyjanek
 @dohbee [bluetooth kb/mouse or the phone itself should become a virtual touchpad (not sur …], Oh, I didn't realise that would work as a virtual mouse. Sounds good
 virtual touchpad on the nexus 5 wasn't working before but it got fix but it's broken again 😅
 what you need is a slimport HDMI adapter amd BT KB and mouse for a better experience
 it works quite well but the RAM is a limiting factor especially if you want to use the browser and/or webapps a lot
 I have a long video showing it on youtube
 Please link it here @Javacookies
 here, it's a long one 😄 … https://youtu.be/WpUO4d5BByk
 Good work on the OTA-14 release folks.
 @wayneTBT [Good work on the OTA-14 release folks.], 15 it is ^^ but thank you
 hah, oops, took it from the pinned message above.
 ohhh yeah, pinned messages
 Yeah the problem is now you can have multiple pinned msgs
 @Flohack [Yeah the problem is now you can have multiple pinned msgs], I think it's really usefull feature
 Ubuntu Touch OTA-15 is here with improvements to our newest and most powerful devices, redesigned tab navigation in Morph Browser, and so much more. Coming to your Ubuntu Touch device on the "Stable" channel this week! … https://ubports.com/blog/ubport-blogs-news-1/post/ubuntu-touch-ota-15-release-3736
 @Flohack [Yeah the problem is now you can have multiple pinned msgs], [Edit] I think it's really useful feature
 @Flohack [Yeah the problem is now you can have multiple pinned msgs], you can unpin old ones though
 speaking of pinned messages, the one on the  pinephone is still about UBppots 😀
 @UniversalSuperBox [Ubuntu Touch OTA-15 is here with improvements to our newest and most powerful de …], Thanks, looking at this now.
 (Photo, 1280x960) https://irc.ubports.com/6JdDlnVq.png
 Say which os is this
 😅😁😁😄😄
 not ubuntu touch
 @dohbee [you can unpin old ones though], Yes but we Admins should not mess too much, that should be done by one guy only (unfortunately ;))
 so the wrong place to discuss it :P
 @ggio01 [Say which os is this], It's Ubuntu, possibly xfce, with latte dock. But you might prefer https://t.me/UBportsOF for those discussions :D
 @ggio01 [<reply to media>], kali kde 🤮
 @ggio01 [<reply to media>], [Edit] kali kde 🤮 #stopusingkali
 @just_carlod [kali kde 🤮 #stopusingkali], Yah using kde kali is responding verry slow no matter how ur hardwere is
 But kde is very beautyful and fully tumhari izabel
 [Edit] But kde is very beautyful and castomaiseable
 @ggio01 [<reply to media>], is this hack ? lol 😂
 Hack !!??
 What r u asking for ??
 The font
 I think
 That's the first thing that came to mind anyway haha
 @just_carlod [kali kde 🤮 #stopusingkali], So suggest a os remember i never used arch so don't say black arch
 Please move to https://t.me/UBportsOF for further discussions about Kali. This room is about Ubuntu Touch and other UBports projects :)
[16:10] <ubptgbot> <Oxy Kali> @dohbee [not ubuntu touch], yeah
 @Oxy Kali [yeah], What about having a ubuntu touch specific one?
[16:58] <ubptgbot> xaber22 was added by: xaber22
 redmi note 8 is compatible with ubuntu touch??
 @xaber22 [redmi note 8 is compatible with ubuntu touch??], Please go to https://t.me/WelcomePlus and read the messages I did just post (and pin) there.
 That hopefully answers all your questions.
 If not feel free to ask. 😊
 @Javacookies [what you need is a slimport HDMI adapter amd BT KB and mouse for a better experi …], Okay. I'll put it on my Santa list!
 @Javacookies [here, it's a long one 😄 … https://youtu.be/WpUO4d5BByk], Thanks 👍👍
 @Danfro [That hopefully answers all your questions.], Thanks 👍🏻😁
 You are welcome. (and not the only one asking that question 😉)
 @Javacookies [speaking of pinned messages, the one on the  pinephone is still about UBppots 😀], UBPpots? is that a cooking show?
 what would UBP stand for?
 UltraBook Pro :D
 @Fuseteam [UBPpots? is that a cooking show?], it's an illegal fork of UT
 @NotKit [what would UBP stand for?], why UBPorts ofcourse :p
 @RealDanct12 [UltraBook Pro :D], 😂
 @Fuseteam [UBPpots? is that a cooking show?], Lol
 First time I wrote lol and laughed
 ._.
 lol
[19:04] <ubptgbot> germanztz was added by: germanztz
[19:25] <ubptgbot> Abdelouahed Touimi was added by: Abdelouahed Touimi
 @Elias [Hello, I would like to run the entire UBports network through TOR every time the …], there is no supported way of doing so currently. and i'm not sure what you'd need to configure exactly otherwise if you want to do the unsupported method by expanding your rootfs and using it in r/w mode
[19:47] <ubptgbot> nikio was added by: nikio
 So I switched to RC from Stable, is it possible to go back to Stable
 Could it be cuz am on 28% (still charging)
 yes you can switch channels again
 Clicking install and reboot does nothing
 At first it notified me of low battery, charging it to around 30% i attempted again, which got me to this point
 ok, not sure. maybe it will install if you reboot to recovery mode
 I will charge it a bit more and attempt again after a reboot
 If anything it could be a bug that has to be documented
[20:24] <ubptgbot> RiveraManny was added by: RiveraManny
[21:16] <ubptgbot> floop2 was added by: floop2
[22:28] <ubptgbot> sagar_hp was added by: sagar_hp
 @SomaSchicksal [If anything it could be a bug that has to be documented], rc to stable is normally done in Settings:Updates
[23:57] <ubptgbot> JOH_1 was added by: JOH_1