[19:28] <jamesp> And yes, I'm from Michigan!
[19:46] <jrwren> welcome 
[19:48] <jamesp> It's too bad this community isn't very active.
[19:48] <jrwren> it can be as active as you want it to be ;)
[19:48] <jrwren> but also, ubuntu is kinda done.
[19:49] <jamesp> Yeah Ubuntu isn't running on my computer, but it'll be running on my server soon!
[19:49] <jrwren> linux is for servers.
[19:50] <jamesp> of course, even though there are many desktop users (and even more gamers now that there's the steam deck)
[19:52] <jamesp> Currently I have a Linode server running Rocky Linux, but that was too difficult for me and I ended up needing a snap (certbot)
[19:52] <jamesp> I'm also using a configuration for Ubuntu, and I'm not using cPanel, so here I am now!
[19:53] <jamesp> I actually started on Linux Mint and Pop!_OS. I'm using Arch (sorry guys) on my desktop as I type this.
[19:54] <jamesp> nhaines I liked your video "Ubuntu Over the Years"
[19:54] <jamesp> I have that video saved on my computer. I like the song "Afterglow"
[19:55] <cmaloney> Yeah, I'm remembering a lot more folks that no longer connect over IRC>
[19:55] <cmaloney> Which is unfortunate because at its height it was an amazing community
[19:55] <cmaloney> and then they let go of the community.
[19:55] <jrwren> you needed snap for certbot? that seems so wrong.
[19:55] <jamesp> And they all switched to Discord or Matrix.
[19:56] <cmaloney> or rather, believed that it would stick around in perpetuity when not given a voice in anything
[19:56] <jamesp> Yes I needed certbot on Rocky Linux
[19:56] <jrwren> afterglow the CHVRCHES song?
[19:56] <jamesp> By Josh Woodward
[19:57] <jamesp> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jn_oIRHcr2o
[19:58] <jamesp> Yeah maybe it could be related to Ubuntu's decline too
[20:01] <jrwren> what decline?
[20:05] <jamesp> Because Ubuntu got kinda boring, people switched to other distros
[20:06] <jamesp> And nowadays Ubuntu isn't actively recommended by the Linux YouTubers.
[20:06] <cmaloney> eh, I don't mind the boring
[20:07] <cmaloney> but it actually felt like (at the beginning) like there was something greater than ourselves
[20:07] <cmaloney> in the end, no, it was just free labor.
[20:14] <jrwren> yeah, that isn't a real thing in industry. It certainly is a real thing in the press.
[20:14] <jrwren> But for paying users, ubuntu is more used now than ever.
[20:15] <jamesp> That's right, Ubuntu had more users now than ever, and it's expected to keep growing as Linux gets more adoption
[20:16] <jrwren> but... i only know ubuntu-server and ubuntu-cloudimg. I don't know anything about ubuntu-desktop. Does ubuntu-desktop even exist? :))
[20:17] <jamesp> ubuntu-desktop is the actual ubuntu desktop, I assume
[20:17] <jamesp> Or it's just plain old ubuntu
[20:23] <cmaloney> jrwren: apt install ubuntu-desktop
[20:23] <cmaloney> ;)
[20:24] <jrwren> nevar!
[20:26] <jrwren> we'd have to agree on what "actual ubuntu" means, since from my POV there are an order of magnitide more instances of installed ubuntu-server and then another order of cloudimg
[20:26] <jrwren> :p
[20:29] <jamesp> oh that
[20:30] <jamesp> You can use Ubuntu server to install the ubuntu desktop, kind of like Arch Linux
[20:31] <jrwren> and visa-versa.
[20:32] <jrwren> apt-get purge $(cat all-them-desktop-packages)
[20:32] <jrwren> :)
[20:32] <jamesp> LOL
[20:33] <jamesp> Because maybe you want to convert to kubuntu without reinstalling
[20:34] <jamesp> I like Kubuntu, I'm using KDE
[20:48] <jamesp> cmaloney: Can you please add HTTPS to your website?
[20:53] <cmaloney> maybe
[20:54] <cmaloney> (That's been on my backburner for a while now)
[20:55] <cmaloney> jrwren: Is there something new that is prompting this request because I can prioritize it
[20:57] <jamesp> Well for some reason my web browser doesn't play well with HTTP sites (the back button glitches out)
[20:57] <cmaloney> Oof
[20:57] <jamesp> Also, Google will put you higher on the search rankings
[20:58] <jamesp> My website has https
[20:58] <cmaloney> you say this like it's a feature. ;)
[20:58] <jamesp> It's easy to do with certbot
[20:58] <cmaloney> But yeah, it's overdue
[20:59] <jamesp> Then just open port 443 if it isn't
[21:04] <jrwren> TLS is a scam and HSTS even more!
[21:05] <cmaloney> Honestly that we went so hard into TLS is slightly disturbing to me
[21:06] <cmaloney> having most of the web having to shovel encrypted traffic seems slightly overkill
[21:06] <jrwren> remember HTTP caching? all gone.
[21:07] <jrwren> I mean... i use TLS, I'm j/k.
[21:08] <jrwren> but HSTS bit me hard once, if you want to keep control of your domains, don't setup HSTS, that puts control into all of the browsers that visit your site worldwide. there is no going back :(
[21:10] <cmaloney> Oof
[21:11] <cmaloney> Yeah, HTTP Caching was quite nice
[21:11] <cmaloney> especially with bandwidth suddenly getting metered and what-not.
[21:18] <jamesp> You don't have to force HTTPS, just support it.