 1xR8
[00:12] <kenneth> @jojje From my understanding it's part of a Media package, most distros  do the same with kmail because kmail brings in lot's of other apps and there dependencies so to reduce the size or lighten things up.
[00:18] <kenneth> @k__2 I think most people are using qemu and kvm these days.
[00:30] <k__2> 1) i use from win7   2)sory but this is not an answer
[00:30] <k__2> @kenneth 1) i use from win7   2)sory but this is not an answer
[00:48] <kenneth> @k__2 I was just saying lol, Hum do you have virtualbox extensions installed on the vm? that's about the only thing I can think of.  "sudo apt-get install virtualbox-guest-additions-iso"
[00:51] <k__2> @kenneth Yes. installed.  And i wrire before: "mint work with audio"
[01:45] <user|6> where i can get the original md5sum of Kubuntu 22.04 LTS?
[01:55] <kenneth> in term md5sum  your.iso the md5's are listed here https://kubuntu.org/alternative-downloads/
[02:36] <tomreyn> those MD5 checksums are actually SHA256 checksums, though
[03:54] <niels84> Good morning
 https://twitter.com/kubuntu/status/1517807215884881920
 When we can upgrade from 21.10?
 When some known bugs for upgrading are fixed, and when the Ubuntu release team decides it is ok. An exact ETA on those is not certain at the moment (re @adhooooooooom: When we can upgrade from 21.10?)
[10:47] <Glumfish> RikMills: apparently there is some bug with `snapd` and `update-manager` and upgrades will be delayed for some days
 I know
[11:45] <tano> ciao
[12:27] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[12:53] <k_> hi
[13:13] <user|31> How to upgrade to 22.04 online
[13:14] <tomreyn> user|31: see the release notes (/topic) - upgrades are not supported, yet
[13:14] <user|31> thanks
[13:15] <tomreyn> depending on what you run now, it will be a matter of days or weeks, and months
[13:50] <k_> ъ
 Kubuntu 22.04 hotspot is getting generated but when trying to connect via mobile sometimes it gets connected some times it just shows connecting and then says network not found.
[14:49] <aYo96> Hi there
[14:50] <aYo96> I jut installed 22.04 - no surprises a few things do not work , I know they will come online in the fullness
[14:50] <aYo96> I did want to ask about the full screen application dashboard -  I cannot find it
[14:51] <aYo96> Is it there? or it's just something I've missed
[14:53] <cbreak> aYo96: that's already in 21.10 I think
[14:54] <cbreak> you can add it to your widget bar if you want
[14:54] <aYo96> On my other laptop it's in 20.04, however I've spent the whole afternoon trying to find where to activate it with no success
[14:55] <aYo96> the launcher at the moment is the standard Left aligned one - I cannot recall but I think in 20.04 you could chose how you wanted the launcher to display
[14:56] <cbreak> aYo96: what happens when you right click on your pannel thing, can you select "add widget"?
[14:57] <aYo96> Please pardon me - are you saying I need to choose a different widget that's full screen?
[14:59] <cbreak> if you want a full-screen launcher, you have to add it to the pannel
[15:02] <aYo96> Thanks, much appreciated - Hmmm it seems the configuration use-case is a little more cloudy this time around - 20.04 was straightforward to implement. I believe in set upp time you had options to choose Launcher and a few other bits n pieces. Much appreciated dude
[15:03] <aYo96> Have you also noticed that a lot of the cursors when installed do not show up in the cursor list
[15:03] <aYo96> I guess those will be rectified as the updates keep coming in and things get updated
 Gs there a biult in screen recorder in kubuntu 22.04?
[17:30] <Ekushey> Any way to increase the icon sizes on taskbar on 22.04?
[17:32] <Ekushey> On 20.04, adding "iconSize=3" on ~/.config/plasma-org.kde.plasma.desktop-appletsrc used to work, but not any more.
[17:38] <Glumfish> Ekushey: can't you change it from system settings?
[17:39] <Glumfish> In Appearance -> Icons -> Configure Icon Sizes -> Panel
[17:39] <Glumfish> Keep in mind if you are utilizing display scaling on X11 you need to set an environment variable
[17:40] <Kilos> Hi all. I just downloaded 22.04 kubuntu. Is the /home folder not tere anymore or will I only see it after installing
[17:42] <Kilos> I have been using kde LTS since 14.04 I think it was, and I am too old and stupid to learn everything from scratch again
[17:42] <Ekushey> Thanks @Glumfish, just changed the icon size to highest from there, but that didn't make any difference. Maybe I need to logout and login again?
[17:43] <Ekushey> @Kilos, are you doing to fresh installation?
[17:43] <Ekushey> *doing a
[17:43] <Kilos> most likely yessir, on a new ssd
[17:44] <Ekushey> Oh OK, did you setup the /home partition while installation?
[17:45] <Kilos> I have not started an install yet. I am still using 18.04 kde here because 20.04 has too many hassles getting mobile internet in south africa
[17:45] <Ekushey> I always do manual partition and configure my /home, / and swap, there's a step for that while installation.
[17:46] <Kilos> I do as well, but when running live from a stick I think I used to see /home even from there
[17:46] <cbreak> Kilos: if you create a user, its home directory will be in a subdirectory of /home by default
[17:47] <cbreak> there's no point in having /home if you don't have any user that has a home directory inside it
[17:47] <Kilos> well I will be the iuser of course
[17:47] <cbreak> if you make ubuntu install with root on zfs, you'll get your own dataset mounted inside /home
[17:48] <Kilos> and I dont use a sawp partition on an ssd but a swapfile instead
[17:48] <Kilos> oh my, not ext4 anymore?
[17:49] <cbreak> normally you get ext4
[17:49] <cbreak> (on lvm or so... there are a bunch of options)
[17:50] <Kilos> I make a / and a /home partition normally
 ufw is blocking me to connect to the hotspot generated by my laptop kubuntu 22.04 any solution?
[17:54] <cbreak> Kilos: I never liked having partitions in old-school filesystems
[17:54] <cbreak> they'd always be too big or too small
[17:54] <cbreak> with zfs I don't have that problem... unless they're all too small :D
[17:54] <Kilos> oh my
[17:55] <Kilos> i dont even know what zfs is
[17:55] <Kilos> i make 35g root and the rest home normally
[17:56] <cbreak> among the many things you get is "filesystems" (similar to partitions) without static provisioning
[17:56] <Kilos> I am just worried about all the changes in 22.04
[17:56] <cbreak> if you install fresh, on a separate ssd, you can always go back :)
[17:57] <Kilos> lol yes you are right
[17:57] <Kilos> I am just past 70 years old and all the new stuff baffles me
[17:58] <Kilos> like installing 20.04 and copying my /home from my 18.04 and then after the first update upgrade no more internet
[18:03] <Glumfish> cbreak: does ZFS support extending a filesystem "upwards"? Typically you can shrink or grow the end of a partition in other filesystems, but not the top
[18:04] <Glumfish> (or shrinking the volume from the start)
[18:04] <Glumfish> by filesystem I mean volume/partition
[18:04] <Glumfish> and I mean doing it in a non-destructive manner
[18:07] <cbreak> Glumfish: not directly, now
[18:07] <cbreak> but it supports redundancy expansion
[18:07] <cbreak> so you can add a new disk that's bigger
[18:07] <cbreak> then replace the old one with itself shifted
[18:08] <cbreak> and remove the other disk again
[18:08] <cbreak> Glumfish: zfs is not a simple filesystem, it's a bit like software raid, filesystem, logical volume manager and some other things in one
[18:10] <Kilos> Thanks guys, let me go experiment
[18:21] <Glumfish> cbreak: yeah I am aware of such features, I mean as a complete package if it offers such abilities
[18:22] <Glumfish> scratch that I saw the messages above
[18:23] <Glumfish> although I'll probably never use ZFS I am excited to tree Btrfs on Fedora
[18:31] <cbreak> btrfs is a quite inferior alternative :P
[18:31] <cbreak> it has many of the same capabilities though
[18:51] <Glumfish> cbreak: I'm planning to use it for a single drive setup on my desktop maybe with a raid of 1 or 2 disks so the benefits of ZFS don't outweigh the pains of getting it setup
[18:51] <Glumfish> If I was building a server I would use ZFS as well
[18:52] <keithzg> I've always found ZFS such a pain, I'd be hard pressed to call it a dramatically superior option; being far better in theory doesn't matter that much if it's a pain in the ass in practice!
[18:53] <keithzg> And there are some weird deficiencies of ZFS, especially for a non-enterprise user, although maybe some of them have been solved since I last played around with it, like ZFS's insane inability to shrink a volume
[18:53] <cbreak> I found the setup quite painless
[18:53] <cbreak> 20.04 had installer support for it, and later they also added a shoddy encrypted zfs option
[18:54] <cbreak> keithzg: it still doesn't shrink easily
[18:55] <keithzg> cbreak: Ah yeah see there's a few times in recent memory where if I was using ZFS that woulda completely screwed me. I totally get that it's not part of ZFS's intended use-case but that kind thing in turn largely puts ZFS out of *my* use cases, there always seems to be *some* gotcha if you don't have huge budgets to throw at large orders of hardware.
[18:56] <keithzg> Of course if it's working well for you, rock on!
[18:56] <cbreak> I've used zfs a lot over the years
[18:56] <cbreak> on my from my old Mac, to my MacBook, a hackintosh, some servers at work, freenas here at home, and now booting off of it on ubuntu
[18:57] <cbreak> never had the desire to shrink a pool :P
[18:58] <keithzg> Oh man that reminds me of a friend of mine who went big on ZFS when an OSX preview integrated it, then he had several years of complaining about having to use BSD when Apple removed ZFS from the final release hehe
[18:58] <keithzg> I was like, dude maybe don't base your entire storage strategy around a feature of a tech preview :D
[18:58] <cbreak> I started with zfs much later
[18:58] <cbreak> lundman's zfs was quite stable when I started
[18:59] <cbreak> it's too bad apple abandoned it
[18:59] <cbreak> zfs is still superior to their new APFS (in reliability)
[19:04] <keithzg> Yeah alas that's a common motif in Apple's history, they *could* just adopt an external standard or piece of software but instead go it alone on something that, despite having more money than God, they don't actually develop into a superior product than the open and free alternative they're giving the cold-shoulder.
[19:05] <keithzg> Reminded of that recently trying to help a friend play Among Us from her Mac; no Proton on MacOS because Apple decided to be almost agressively hostile to Vulkan...
[19:05] <keithzg> Among Us works perfectly fine here on my Kubuntu system of course hehe
[19:05] <cbreak> I think there's a vulkan -> metal layer somewhere
[19:05] <cbreak> molten-vk or so?
[19:06] <cbreak> never tried it
[19:07] <keithzg> Yeah, third parties have hacked stuff together that apparently does work, but not nearly reliably (ah, another motif) enough to be baking it into Steam or such, especially when it's still largely at Apple's mercy, they could change something in an update and break it all tomorrow.
[19:08] <keithzg> Like, it wasn't *that* hard to get Wine and Among Us wrapped up in a .app for my friend, but it's a fragile and fiddly setup and I can entirely see why Valve wouldn't bother.
[19:11] <Glumfish> cbreak: although its not really a fair comparison as APFS was never really intented for the same goals as ZFS
[19:12] <keithzg> I mean, it does seem like a HUGE improvement over HFS+ but HFS+ was one of the absolute worst file systems in common usage...
[19:12] <cbreak> well, there's a reason I switched from MacOS to Ubuntu...
[19:12] <cbreak> well... many in fact.
[19:13] <cbreak> ZFS support is a big one though :)
[19:15] <keithzg> Glumfish: APFS, I must say, fails the "doesn't crash Disk Utility on a Mac whenever I try and do anything with it" test but I do, I must admit, have a spectacular ability to find edge cases without even trying. Still, compressing a .dmg that's internally using APFS doesn't seem like something that should be so easy to go wrong!
[19:18] <ILOVEROCKANDROLL> hilfe
[19:19] <Glumfish> keithzg: I've used APFS for on both machines (one in fact where the filesystem was upgraded from HFS+), never had any problems with it although I also don't do anything crazy with it
[19:20] <Glumfish> As a product I don't think its designed for any type of advanced usage and the average MacOS user isn't even going to know or mess with a filesystem in general
[19:21] <Glumfish> If you wanna have fun with your computer and try out new things switching to Linux is probably the best idea
[19:21] <keithzg> Glumfish: I'm sure it mostly works fine for most people, but I've had problems about 80% of the time I've had to interact with it, heh. And it's particularly crazy to me that it causes problems when creating and running standard operations on a disk image within Apple's built-in Disk Utility program!
[19:21] <Glumfish> I'm currently running a 2013 trashcan Mac Pro on Kubuntu
[19:22] <Glumfish> keithzg: what sort of work do you do (Mac related)?
[19:22] <Glumfish> and with APFS specifically
[19:23] <keithzg> Glumfish: Generally helping friends with something or another, in the most recent Disk Utility case it was the aforementioned packaging up of a PC game into a Mac .app file. I was like, oh I remember Apple apps tend to come in .dmg files, I should shove this into one then to send along. Hooooo boy did I not know what I was getting into.
[19:24] <keithzg> I mean in the end the CLI tools that also ship with the OS worked fine, but simply the act of compressing a .dmg file in Disk Utility, that had been created with Disk Utility, was enough to crash Disk Utility?!
[19:25] <keithzg> If I went out of my way to change the default filesystem used from APFS to HFS+ it worked fine, but.
[19:30] <Glumfish> hmmm, interesting
 Hi friends 👋
 Relatively new to the linux world and I just gifted myself a new laptop for my learn-linux journey. It has 32GiB RAM and  and I'm just wondering if I need a swap partition? Is it even advisable with an SSD/nvme?
[19:36] <cbreak> IrcsomeBot: Roesti: I don't think you strictly need one. Ubuntu can use swap files too.
[19:37] <keithzg> Ah yeah I was gonna say I often have installed without setting up a swap partition, and sometimes found myself kindof needing one and just using a swap file instead.
[19:38] <keithzg> @Roesti: Modern SSDs don't have the low write lifespans of older ones, so especially if it's new and expensive enough to be an NVMe drive I don't think you need to necessarily worry about it being inadviseable, just potentially unnecessary.
[19:40] <keithzg> Glumfish: For what it's worth, my most recent Disk Utility tribulations were with MacOS 12.1, on an old "Late 2014" Mac Mini.
[20:10] <Glumfish> Roesti: You can always create one later
[20:11] <Glumfish> I'm running 64GB of RAM now and I haven't really needed one
[20:11] <Glumfish> Even Chrome with many tabs open doesn't manage to get it all
 Nice, thanks for the response! The use case I had in mind is hibernation of my system since I'm a bit lazy and want to preserve my open applications etc. but also having the security to have it locked by luks
[21:54] <user|9> Hi
[21:55] <user|9> I
[21:55] <penfeld> hello
[21:55] <user|9> I've a question, by upgrading my Kubuntu from 21.10 to 22.04 LTS, will my personal data be wiped?
[21:56] <user|9> Note that I'll follow these steps https://help.ubuntu.com/community/JammyUpgrades/Kubuntu
[21:57] <penfeld> well I'm not near expert but I would expect that if you are using an automated update you would be fine
[21:57] <user|9> Many thanks penfeld! :)
[21:58] <user|9> it looks that I should wait my Kubuntu prompting and asking for the update!
[21:59] <penfeld> I'm just learning linux and have made a separted partition to store files for when I break everything waiting will be long since they usually want each distro to last 5 years awayfrom keeybord
[22:01] <valorie> penfeld: I usually take the occasion of a major upgrade to do a backup, but I've never yet lost data in well over 10 years (almost 20!) of using Kubuntu
[22:01] <valorie> I mean I've lost data but that was all on me and not on upgrades
[22:06] <penfeld> if you haven't broken it you really weren't trying hard enough were you?
[22:07] <user|9> Hmm
[22:07] <user|9> By following these steps https://help.ubuntu.com/community/JammyUpgrades/Kubuntu
[22:07] <user|9> What is the chance for my data to be lost?
[22:11] <penfeld> user|9: note first instruction is to read a presumably huge disclaimer file so like in mountain climbing how well and often you tie off should be dictated by how far you are willing to fall
[22:14] <penfeld> you probably should have at least 3 copies of everything you want to keep lying around your "data center" see comment by valorie.  I don't know anyone who actually owns fail proof hardware so what do you backup to?
[22:15] <penfeld> valorie: you still there?
[22:46] <penfeld> is anyone alive out there?
[22:47] <cbreak> people are here
[22:48] <penfeld> I was wondering
[22:50] <penfeld> my kubuntu stick is almost ready and I was wondering if there were anyone around who could suggest an information source for setting preferences
[22:58] <cbreak> I recommend trying the defaults first
[23:14] <valorie> penfield I have two portable drives and back up first to one, the next time to the other
[23:14] <valorie> and yes, all hardware will fail
[23:14] <valorie> sadly
[23:14] <penfeld> cbreak: <begin snark mode> gosh, why didn't I think of that? after 49 years in computer science and information technology who am I to think I can aid my own user experience. and jeeze try to learn new things how dare I. <end snark mode>
[23:16] <valorie> I rarely change the defaults
[23:16] <penfeld> Valorie: sadly isn't that hardware fails it's that they quit making disaster recovery hardware
[23:16] <valorie> if you want to, it's easy because they are all in text files
[23:19] <penfeld> I looked over books from o'reilly (used to be fairly usable) and found nothing in linux that wasn't so long in the tooth I doubted it would be usable.
[23:21] <penfeld> found some videos in english but most seem painfully slow (going through each bash command one at a time for 3 hours)
[23:22] <penfeld> valorie: so which text files? located where? and how should I have known that if you had not been gracious enough to tell me?
[23:23] <valorie> they are all in $HOME in ~/.config
[23:24] <valorie> penfeld: we do have a manual, available on the website, kubuntu.org
[23:25] <penfeld> soo cool!
[23:30] <valorie> I use lots of cli commands because they are short & quick, but the application versions are very good these days
[23:31] <valorie> and there is an app called yakuake that will pop up a konsole with a single key, which I use F12
[23:31] <valorie> and very often, just up-arrow to get to the most used commands
[23:32] <penfeld> I've spent six months with mint and the nearly complete lack of a hood latch has become frustrating  (I've learned to look and point and ask many questions before sticking my fingers in the fan blades), so far I'm able to find magical commands to paste into the shell but nothing to sink my teeth into
[23:32] <valorie> I'm just a user, maybe a "power user" but no coder
[23:33] <valorie> my tech blog is called Linux Grandma
[23:33] <valorie> everything I write about there still works
[23:35] <penfeld> I suffered a power outage while installing a game (of all things) I know the source list of apps is broken but since the list is no longer supported and is a text file saying this is just a place holder don't edit it, I'm moving on to a different distro of linux
[23:36] <valorie> got it
[23:36] <penfeld> could you share the secret of "plasma"?
[23:36] <valorie> we do have a list of installed apps but it is a bit tricky to get to
[23:37] <valorie> but I think I blogged about how to get to it
[23:37] <valorie> the secret of plasma? Lots of years of love and dedication by volunteer (mostly) devels
[23:39] <penfeld> what is it? ubuntu is the kernel, kde is the gui, bash? is the command processor/shell/terminal what's left?
[23:41] <valorie> ubuntu is a project, there are lots of "flavors" most of which are different desktops/guis, some of which are like Ubuntu Studio, set up for creatives
[23:41] <valorie> Plasma is the workspace, and yes, gui
[23:41] <valorie> KDE is the community that makes loads of different software
[23:41] <valorie> not just Plasma
[23:42] <valorie> the kernel is Linux
[23:42] <valorie> you can use bash or other terms
[23:42] <valorie> I mean, the sky is the limit with linux distros
[23:43] <valorie> I like the choices that Kubuntu has made
[23:43] <penfeld> you ever heard of System V?
[23:43] <valorie> but it's not religion
[23:44] <valorie> to me, it's a fit tool for what I want to do, and that's mostly genealogy and admin stuff these days
[23:44] <valorie> sure
[23:45] <valorie> I used to run CP/M
[23:45] <valorie> :-)
[23:45] <valorie> on my ADAM computer!
[23:45] <penfeld> When I passed my first and last sys admin for Unix it was still a product from bell labs
[23:46] <valorie> seems like a long time ago
[23:46] <valorie> although it really isn't
[23:46] <penfeld> my first computer was used by neil armstrong, yes it was
[23:46] <valorie> shorter than my lifetime
[23:48] <penfeld> really the exact same computer I learned to keypunch on was sold by nasa to caltech, but 18 months in human has been 40 years in computer
[23:50] <penfeld> kubuntu.org has a picture of a guy with " sudo apt -remove sudo" I almost get that... i think
[23:50] <valorie> heh
[23:51] <valorie> I doubt the system allows that command, but I could be wrong!
[23:51] <valorie> there is always a first time
[23:51] <valorie> I gotta go rustle up dinner
[23:51] <valorie> ttyl
[23:52] <penfeld> thank you for your patience