| === JanC is now known as Guest5108 | ||
| === JanC_ is now known as JanC | ||
| ddstreet | o/ | 16:00 |
|---|---|---|
| seb128 | hey! I'm here but will not be able to stay for an hour | 16:01 |
| seb128 | !DMB? | 16:04 |
| seb128 | or do we have an alias of the sort? | 16:04 |
| ddstreet | i think it's set in #ubuntu-devel | 16:04 |
| seb128 | Robie sent an email saying he can't do that one | 16:05 |
| ddstreet | but i suspect nobody else will be able to attend | 16:05 |
| ddstreet | yeah | 16:05 |
| seb128 | Lukasz is at the same sprint than me, unsure if he plans to try to join or not | 16:05 |
| bdmurray | o/ | 16:05 |
| ddstreet | i think everyone on the dmb except me and teward are at the sprint | 16:05 |
| bdmurray | I'm not at the sprint | 16:06 |
| teward | *waves* | 16:06 |
| teward | *slurps the caffeine elixirs* | 16:06 |
| seb128 | Lukasz is in a session at least for another 10 min according to the calendar so we should probably not count on him | 16:06 |
| seb128 | kanashiro, around? | 16:06 |
| seb128 | should we start with those here? | 16:07 |
| seb128 | hum, is my IRC lagging or is everyone just quiet? | 16:10 |
| bdmurray | Its quiet seb128 | 16:10 |
| seb128 | bdmurray, thanks | 16:11 |
| seb128 | how do we get moving? I would chair the meeting if I was familiar enough with the process but I don't feel like I can do that efficiently today | 16:11 |
| bdmurray | ddstreet: ? | 16:12 |
| ddstreet | i can chair if there are no volunteers | 16:12 |
| ddstreet | #startmeeting Ubuntu Developer Membership Board | 16:12 |
| meetingology | Meeting started at 16:12:48 UTC. The chair is ddstreet. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology | 16:12 |
| meetingology | Available commands: action, commands, idea, info, link, nick | 16:12 |
| ddstreet | #topic Current meeting chair | 16:13 |
| ddstreet | this hasn't been discussed for a while, but I think having only sil2100 on the list doesn't seem optimal; anyone else want to volunteer to be on the chairing rotation? | 16:13 |
| ddstreet | #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard/Agenda | 16:14 |
| ddstreet | for reference, the agenda i'm going thru | 16:14 |
| bdmurray | I would after a couple of more meetings | 16:14 |
| seb128 | I will do aft... same | 16:14 |
| ddstreet | ok guess we can bring it up again at later mtg | 16:14 |
| ddstreet | i'll skip the long-term action items as we usually do | 16:14 |
| seb128 | 👍 | 16:15 |
| ddstreet | #topic previous action items | 16:15 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic ddstreet announce fnordahl successful application | 16:15 |
| ddstreet | this is done | 16:15 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic ddstreet adjust fnordahl PPU acl | 16:15 |
| ddstreet | this is done, i haven't checked the TB bug (there is a later item to check it) | 16:15 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic kanashiro announce athos successful application | 16:15 |
| ddstreet | this is listed as done | 16:15 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic kanashiro adjust athos ACL for MOTU | 16:16 |
| ddstreet | also listed as done | 16:16 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic sil2100 update application docs and possibly DMB checklist, to make sure candidates have signed CoC before applying and before DMB approves (carried over) | 16:16 |
| ddstreet | i assume this should be carried over, as he's not here | 16:16 |
| ddstreet | #action sil2100 update application docs and possibly DMB checklist, to make sure candidates have signed CoC before applying and before DMB approves (carried over) | 16:16 |
| meetingology | ACTION: sil2100 update application docs and possibly DMB checklist, to make sure candidates have signed CoC before applying and before DMB approves (carried over) | 16:16 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic sil2100 start discussion on process/rules for when to create packageset vs PPU | 16:16 |
| ddstreet | will carry over as well since he's busy at the sprint | 16:17 |
| ddstreet | #action sil2100 start discussion on process/rules for when to create packageset vs PPU (carried over) | 16:17 |
| meetingology | ACTION: sil2100 start discussion on process/rules for when to create packageset vs PPU (carried over) | 16:17 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic teward follow up to get all application process wiki/docs to explain the process to be able to edit wiki pages, for applicants who don't yet have wiki edit access (carried over) | 16:17 |
| ddstreet | carry over teward? | 16:17 |
| teward | yep | 16:17 |
| ddstreet | #action teward follow up to get all application process wiki/docs to explain the process to be able to edit wiki pages, for applicants who don't yet have wiki edit access (carried over) | 16:17 |
| meetingology | ACTION: teward follow up to get all application process wiki/docs to explain the process to be able to edit wiki pages, for applicants who don't yet have wiki edit access (carried over) | 16:17 |
| ddstreet | ok that's all the previous action items | 16:17 |
| ddstreet | the only application is from me, for a ubuntu-support-uploaders team | 16:17 |
| ddstreet | does the rest of the board want to consider that now or defer it to a meeting where more members are present? | 16:18 |
| bdmurray | Are there people currently interested and ready to join that team? | 16:19 |
| ddstreet | yes | 16:19 |
| seb128 | I think we can review it now, or at least start discussing it | 16:19 |
| ddstreet | i actually am trying to hand this application off to a colleague, but haven't done that just yet | 16:20 |
| ddstreet | ok let's do at least an initial discussions then | 16:20 |
| ddstreet | #topic ubuntu-support-uploaders team application | 16:20 |
| ddstreet | for clarification, this request is to create a new DMB-managed team that has upload rights for a new packageset | 16:21 |
| bdmurray | will this team have the ability to approve their own members? | 16:21 |
| * bdmurray is reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers/TeamDelegation | 16:21 | |
| ddstreet | initially, the only team member would be me (assuming i haven't passed this off to someone before its approved), and the initial first package is sosreport | 16:21 |
| ddstreet | bdmurray the DMB docs on this aren't exactly clear, at least to my reading, but no this would be a standard DMB-managed team that can't manage its own members; new members would need to apply to the DMB to join | 16:22 |
| bdmurray | okay | 16:23 |
| seb128 | why do you feel like there is a need for a such team? | 16:23 |
| seb128 | and who do you envision to be interested to join it? | 16:24 |
| ddstreet | so that the ACL for all the support team's packages is kept in a single packageset, so new members don't need to apply for PPU for a collection of packages | 16:24 |
| ddstreet | re: joiners, members of Canonical support and/or community members who support Ubuntu | 16:25 |
| ddstreet | i believe the setup would be very similar to the 'ubuntu-server' packageset, which is ACL'ed by the ~ubuntu-server-dev team | 16:26 |
| ddstreet | so anyone on the Canonical server team i suspect is familiar with that and understands the usefulness of the setup | 16:26 |
| bdmurray | For the server team I'd think its a stepping stone to core dev though. | 16:27 |
| ddstreet | seb128 if i understand the ~ubuntu-desktop team correctly (which has ACL to upload into the ubuntu-desktop packageset), that is different as far as managing its own members | 16:27 |
| ddstreet | bdmurray could be, though i don't think that's necessarily a goal for support members | 16:28 |
| seb128 | I see the interest of creating a set, providing the content of the set has value to some people who aren't going to apply to more | 16:28 |
| seb128 | I'm not really familiar with what the support team usually needs though, nor with sosreport | 16:29 |
| ddstreet | sosreport, systemtap, crash, gdb, etc | 16:29 |
| ddstreet | packageset additions would have to be approved by the DMB of course | 16:30 |
| ddstreet | initially it's only sosreport | 16:30 |
| seb128 | right, I just foresee that to be of real use that set would need to include things like gdb and apport | 16:30 |
| bdmurray | Given that any changes, of people or packages, would be managed by the DMB I'm fine with creating this team. | 16:30 |
| seb128 | which probably creates an higher contribution trust level than sosreport | 16:30 |
| ddstreet | seb128 absolutely, i just want to defer adding those packages until we can be sure we actually want/need upload rights for them | 16:31 |
| ddstreet | gdb, for example, generally hasn't really required us to upload fixes for it | 16:31 |
| ddstreet | even though we use it extensively | 16:31 |
| seb128 | I feel like people doing those packages should probably aim for coredev | 16:31 |
| ddstreet | that might change in the future if/when debuginfod is implemented for ubuntu | 16:32 |
| seb128 | doing uploads for* | 16:32 |
| ddstreet | seb128 why do you feel that? support's goal is very different and very far removed from devel release work | 16:32 |
| ddstreet | you may be viewing this from product engineering perspective | 16:32 |
| seb128 | it's more that I see some of those components as key ubuntu packages, preinstalled | 16:33 |
| seb128 | so I wouldn't hand upload right for those lightly | 16:33 |
| seb128 | and to win the trust needed you would probably need significant uploads to Ubuntu | 16:33 |
| ddstreet | that seems more like a question of which specific packages should be in the packageset though, not if the packageset should be created in the first place? | 16:33 |
| seb128 | right | 16:34 |
| ddstreet | if you haven't ever used sosreport, for example, do you think only coredevs should be able to upload that? | 16:34 |
| seb128 | but the path leads me to wonder if the packageset is going to be of real use | 16:34 |
| seb128 | no | 16:34 |
| ddstreet | crash likewise is heavily used by support, but i doubt if that really needs a coredev to upload it | 16:34 |
| seb128 | right | 16:35 |
| ddstreet | in any case, the initial application only involves sosreport | 16:35 |
| seb128 | I don't see an issue with creating that packageset | 16:35 |
| ddstreet | any more q from anyone? | 16:35 |
| ddstreet | since i'm applying for the packageset/team, i'll abstain from the voting | 16:36 |
| ddstreet | i would like to get things rolling before the next meeting though, is it ok with everyone here if I ask for a vote (and any further discussion) to happen on the ML? | 16:36 |
| seb128 | that's ok with me | 16:37 |
| bdmurray | that's fine with me | 16:37 |
| ddstreet | #action ddstreet request discussion/voting on ubuntu-support-uploaders continue on ML | 16:37 |
| meetingology | ACTION: ddstreet request discussion/voting on ubuntu-support-uploaders continue on ML | 16:37 |
| ddstreet | ok thanks, i'll send an email to the list to follow up | 16:37 |
| seb128 | just for clarification, my questions were basically aimed at getting a feeling on the value of a such set, but I've not been in the DMB long enough to really understand if that's something we should give consideration to | 16:38 |
| ddstreet | #topic open TB bugs | 16:38 |
| ddstreet | seb128 yep i understand, and i think the DMB might benefit from more defined docs to help new members (and old members!) understand what exactly the process and policies are | 16:39 |
| ddstreet | anyway, moving on | 16:39 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic fnordahl PPU | 16:39 |
| seb128 | right, sorry for derailling thins :) | 16:39 |
| seb128 | things | 16:39 |
| ddstreet | np :) | 16:39 |
| ddstreet | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-community/+bug/1967795 | 16:39 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1967795 in ubuntu-community "[TB/DMB] PPU for ~fnordahl" [Undecided, Fix Released] | 16:39 |
| ddstreet | look like this is done | 16:39 |
| ddstreet | #topic AOB | 16:39 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic No single official source of DMB rules/procedures/policies, and KB wiki page is not complete or correct | 16:40 |
| ddstreet | I don't know if we want to discuss this here and/or in the ML | 16:40 |
| ddstreet | and this might just be my personal opinion | 16:40 |
| seb128 | ML or another time | 16:41 |
| seb128 | I need to wrap in a few minutes at least | 16:41 |
| ddstreet | #subtopic Suggestion (from ddstreet) to discontinue use of private DMB IRC channel, and keep all official communication public | 16:41 |
| ddstreet | this also is just a suggestion from me | 16:41 |
| ddstreet | no need to discuss now, if everyone needs to wrap | 16:41 |
| ddstreet | any comments before we end? | 16:41 |
| ddstreet | or any other AOB topics? | 16:42 |
| seb128 | not from me | 16:42 |
| ddstreet | ok let's wrap, thanks everyone o/ | 16:42 |
| ddstreet | #endmeeting | 16:42 |
| meetingology | Meeting ended at 16:42:32 UTC. Minutes at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2022/ubuntu-meeting.2022-05-02-16.12.moin.txt | 16:42 |
| seb128 | the private channel was discussed on the list iirc, we just need to come to an conclusion | 16:42 |
| seb128 | let's try to do that next time | 16:42 |
| seb128 | ddstreet, thanks! | 16:42 |
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