[00:00] <tomreyn> Guest47: so you're reporting that an ubuntu 22.04.0 - or .1 ? - "minimal" installation with the default ubuntu desktop (?) installer with integrated intel graphics (nothing else?) can, with some, undisclosed (!) hardware / firmware will not draw a firefox application window properly, on a Wayland session only, not on X?
[00:01] <tomreyn> - "can"
[00:05] <Guest47> With the default 22.04.1 live usb, Firefox launches.  After installing to disk and updating/upgrading with apt, the minimal installation selected from the installer, Firefox/Kicad does not launch under Wayland, unless Firefox environment variable MOZ_ENABLE_WAYLAND is set.  Intel integrated graphics, i915, GMA950.
[00:06] <Guest47> logging in with xorg session did work.
[00:07] <Guest47> Not asking for any help, I am satisfied with it now on xorg.
[00:50] <junior296> hi
[03:05] <zisco_plankton> hello
[03:37] <saltd> 220
[05:00] <enigma9o7[m]> y0y0y0y0 anyone waiting for help with ubuntu package installation type stuff?
[05:25] <root998ww2> test
[05:41] <kandinsk1> If I'm on 22.04 LTS which is on the 5.15 kernel, and I want to use the hid_nintendo driver that wasn't mainlined until 5.16, would you recommend I install the driver by compiling the dkms-hid-nintendo driver off github and stay on 5.15 or install a new kernel off the ppa mainline installer? I can't evaluate the pros and cons of either solution.
[05:46] <enigma9o7[m]> if you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice
[05:46] <lotuspsychje> kandinsk1: you got a bug ID on that?
[05:51] <kandinsk1> lotuspsychje: no bug ID, because it's not a bug: 22.04 LTS is sticking with 15.5, and the driver I want was mainlined in kernel versions 5.16 and up.
[05:52] <lotuspsychje> kandinsk1: i found something on debian, https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=986350
[05:52] <kandinsk1> oh interesting
[05:52] <kandinsk1> lotuspsychje: thanks, learnt something.
[05:52] <kandinsk1> Still, there are two ways I can get this working today, and this is a wishlist ticket, not really a bug.
[05:53] <enigma9o7[m]> Just installed debian testing.
[05:53] <lotuspsychje> well the way i see it, if something doesnt work on ubuntu by default it can be considered as a bug/wishlist
[05:53] <kandinsk1> I forgot the third option, which was upgrading to 22.10 when it comes out.
[05:53] <lotuspsychje> letting the devs know it doesnt work is a first step
[05:54] <enigma9o7[m]> You can try that know kandinsk1.
[05:54] <enigma9o7[m]> Install devel version.  Or rolling rhino.
[05:54] <lotuspsychje> think it still has kernel 5.15 in this stage
[05:54] <enigma9o7[m]> Troo.
[05:54] <kandinsk1> yes, that's option three, but I'd rather stay with LTS for now.
[05:54] <kandinsk1> I'll use the mainline kernel installer. Will report back.
[05:55] <enigma9o7[m]> great plan
[05:55] <enigma9o7[m]> gold star
[05:55] <lotuspsychje> kandinsk1: mainline kernels are good for testing purposes, best not for daily use
[05:55] <kandinsk1> lotuspsychje: I can boot on it for gaming, then reboot on regular kernel for work.
[05:55] <lotuspsychje> thats an idea yeah
[05:55] <kandinsk1> enigma9o7[m]: thanks, good luck with debian testing!
[05:57] <lotuspsychje> i would bug it if i was you kandinsk1
[05:58] <kandinsk1> lotuspsychje: fair enough
[05:58] <lotuspsychje> kandinsk1: did you have an url saying its implemented in 5.16?
[05:58] <kandinsk1> but it's mainline in 5.16, so it's a matter of taking 5.16 in
[05:59] <kandinsk1> I looked into it yesterday
[05:59] <kandinsk1> waitasec
[05:59] <lotuspsychje> tnx
[05:59] <kandinsk1> reddit link for now: https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/safllb/til_the_kernel_newest_5162_has_added_support_for/
[06:00] <wez> I don't reddit
[06:02] <kandinsk1> https://cdn.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v5.x/ChangeLog-5.16
[06:03] <kandinsk1> It's not in 5.15.63 that I know
[06:04] <lotuspsychje> ok tnx and cool kandinsk1
[06:05] <lotuspsychje> kandinsk1: another option could be jammy HWE when it comes out
[06:05] <lotuspsychje> !hwe
[06:05] <kandinsk1> oh, thanks!
[06:05] <lotuspsychje> so you get a higher kernel then 5.15 on jammy
[06:09] <enigma9o7[m]> No.
[06:09] <enigma9o7[m]> Not today.
[06:09] <enigma9o7[m]> Those hwe updates come when the 6-month versions get their kernels.
[06:10] <enigma9o7[m]> So wait til Halloween.
[08:09] <vargkorp> when i install wallpapers package from older ubuntu versions from synaptic,  wallpapers from debian installs with them?
[08:10] <elias_a> supercool1: Were you able to solve the problem?
[08:13] <vargkorp> as far as i can remember ubuntu does not ship wallpapers from debian?
[08:17] <laguna> i still can't figure out why systemctl enable gdm3 doesn't work
[08:18] <laguna> i guess the update did break a few things
[08:47] <lotuspsychje> laguna: checkout stacer to manage your systemd services GUI
[08:47] <lotuspsychje> !info stacer | laguna
[08:47] <lotuspsychje> !uptodate | laguna and check for apt errors too
[08:49] <laguna> ok lotuspsychje and ubottu
[08:57] <laguna> ubottu i tried all those and still i get the error
[08:57] <laguna> Executing: /lib/systemd/systemd-sysv-install enable gdm3
[08:57] <laguna> The unit files have no installation config (WantedBy=, RequiredBy=, Also=,
[08:57] <laguna> Alias= settings in the [Install] section, and DefaultInstance= for template
[08:57] <laguna> units). This means they are not meant to be enabled using systemctl.
[08:59] <laguna> also 1 other error..aptly is not upgradable
[09:09] <laguna> this is what aptly does report
[09:10] <laguna> aptly version
[09:10] <laguna> aptly version: unknown
[09:15] <lotuspsychje> use a pastebin please laguna for sharing your apt errors
[09:15] <laguna> lotuspsychje..ok where is pastebin
[09:15] <lotuspsychje> !paste
[09:18] <laguna> ubottu ok i made a note of the urls
[09:33] <paki> CIAO
[09:34] <paki> 1list
 How can i stock the result of   wget -qO - https://api.ipify.org to a var to execute directly after my function which locate ip ?
[09:55] <h4k1m0u> Hi eveyrone, I have a noob question. After upgrading from 20.04 to 22.04, python cannot be found anymore. Should I reinstall it?
[09:55] <AlexC> try: python3.10
[09:55] <AlexC> :>
[09:55] <h4k1m0u> yeah thanks AlexC
[09:56] <ravage> python3 should be enough
[09:56] <h4k1m0u> I'll set the default one with update-alternatives
[09:56] <magga> h4k1m0u: what does: 'ls /usr/bin | grep python' print?
[09:56] <ravage> you can install "python"
[09:56] <ravage> that should create the symlink from python to python3
[09:57] <h4k1m0u> magga; it prints: python2, python2.7, python3.7 (no symlink indeed)
[09:57] <SoCkEt7> Any ideas for my question ?
[09:57] <h4k1m0u> sorry python3.10
[09:58] <ravage> SoCkEt7, MYIP=`wget -qO - https://api.ipify.org`; echo $MYIP
[09:59] <ravage> there is also #bash
[10:00] <SoCkEt7> Thanks will try this.
[11:39] <pouya> hi
[12:17] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[12:19] <hype> Hello.
[13:30] <linsux> is zfs in ubuntu as efficient as in fbsd?
[13:38] <murmel> linsux: what do you mean by efficient?
[13:38] <murmel> it's literally the same codebase
[13:38] <linsux> does zfs pick os?
[13:39] <murmel> it depends on how you compile it
[13:39] <murmel> but they should be the same
[13:41] <linsux> ok
[13:43] <cbreak> linsux: ZFS will work on both linux and freebsd very similarly. It even works on MacOS and to some degree Windows
[13:44] <cbreak> ubuntu ships zfs, unlike most of the other distros, so you can more reliably use it for booting off of, but in my opinion, the ubuntu installer does weird things when you chose root on zfs.
[13:44] <cbreak> (you can install it manually though if you dare)
[13:44] <linsux> i'm thinking about photo video storage of zfs
[13:44] <cbreak> zfs is available via DKMS as well, if you want a newer version than shipped, but then you have to deal with dkms
[13:44] <linsux> about 100gb a year at most
[13:45] <cbreak> that's quite tiny.
[13:45] <murmel> and you need to disable the integrated zfs module
[13:45] <cbreak> presumably you want that for reliability?
[13:45] <linsux> yah so maybe i don't need raid?
[13:45] <linsux> reliablitiy yes
[13:45] <cbreak> zfs can provide reliability for local storage
[13:45] <cbreak> but the reliability of zfs is against hardware failure, corruption and so on
[13:45] <linsux> what about btrfs? i see it not much diff from zfs except for raid
[13:46] <cbreak> you still should consider getting backups
[13:46] <cbreak> btrfs is junk.
[13:46] <cbreak> you can't use it anywhere other than linux, because it's not designed to be portable
[13:46] <murmel> cbreak: it is not
[13:46] <lotuspsychje> maybe a topic for #ubuntu-discuss ?
[13:46] <murmel> and idk how often I switched the OS above the raid system oO
[13:46] <murmel> yeah
[13:46] <cbreak> you can't upgrade it independently of the kernel, since it is part of the kernel
[13:46] <cbreak> murmel: I switched to ubuntu.
[13:46] <cbreak> from MacOS.
[13:47] <cbreak> worked ok.
[13:47] <cbreak> I could have switched my freebsd pool to ubuntu too, if I hadn't used GELI encryption there
[13:47] <lotuspsychje> please keep the channel free for support issues guys
[13:48] <lotuspsychje> polls & discussions into the ot & discuss channel
[13:48] <cbreak> support questions like needing support in chosing an OS / Filesystem?
[13:48] <cbreak> or support questions like complaining about other people getting supported in their file system choice? :)
[13:49] <lotuspsychje> cbreak: linsux wanted to poll between zfs and fbsd that sounds like a poll/discussion to me rather then an ubuntu problem
[13:51] <linsux> i'm sorry i just thought ubuntu support zfs natively unlike other distros, so i asked in ubuntu channel
[13:52] <linsux> didn't mean to start some disagreement
[13:52] <wez> Lets btrfs
[13:52] <lotuspsychje> ./join #ubuntu-discuss and talk all day about it : )
[13:52] <wez> lotuspsychje: See you in there!
[13:55] <cbreak> ubuntu does ship zfs natively
[13:55] <cbreak> it's one of the main reasons I chose ubuntu
[13:55] <wez> cbreak:  #ubuntu-discuss
[13:55] <wez> We are talking about it now
[14:02] <joel_> ijf
[14:02] <joel_> ola
[14:02] <joel_> tem alguem
[14:02] <joel_> alguem do brasil
[14:02] <joel_> vamos teclar
[14:09] <gordonjcp> no-one's talking about reiserfs any more
[14:10] <lotuspsychje> join the discussion in -discuss gordonjcp
[14:19] <wez> lotuspsychje: I think he is still in priso
[14:19] <wez> n
[14:20] <murmel> wez: he is, but the fs nowadays doesn't have enough "no other fs has these" features so nobody uses it
[14:23] <rob0> Reiser won't ever get out.
[14:24] <GBGames> Five years ago I bought an HP OfficeJet 5740 through ThinkPenguin, and for quite some time I have been happy with a printer that Just Worked(tm). Unfortunately, sometime in the last couple of years, I've run into annoying issues of it suddenly not recognizing otherwise perfectly fine print cartridges or otherwise having issues with printing. I know hardware can fail, but is this the kind of thing I can blame a firmware update
[14:24] <GBGames> on? As in, HP purposefully making an older printer less functional?
[14:25] <wez> rob0: He made a good FS though even though he was a terrible husband.
[14:25] <rob0> I certainly would not be surprised if HP did make old printers fail.
[14:25] <wez> I disagree with taken away someones achievements because they were committed of a crime, no matter waht it iwas
[14:26] <rob0> wez, yes, I liked reiserfs.
[14:27] <arcane_> hey
[15:12] <luis220413> What is the right channel to seek support for the development release of Ubuntu?
[15:13] <EriC^^> !+1 | luis220413
[15:13] <lotuspsychje> !next
[15:15] <lkthomas> I still don't understand why all the ubuntu server I installed, first boot will goes to /dev/sda1 clean, I need to use virtual console to get a login prompt
[15:15] <lkthomas> the installation itself obviously is okay
[15:31] <jhutchins> lkthomas: What did you expect instead of the console?
[15:32] <lkthomas> jhutchins it's not a normal console, no login prompt
[15:32] <lkthomas> I have to switch to tty2 to login
[15:35] <tomreyn> lkthomas: have you tried to hit enter on tty1?
[15:35] <lkthomas> yes nothing comes up
[15:35] <lkthomas> again, I have to use ctrl+alt+F<num> to switch to another tty
[15:36] <tomreyn> lkthomas: which ubuntu release + point release is this?
[15:36] <lkthomas> 20.04 LTS
[15:37] <tomreyn> .0?
[15:37] <lkthomas> 20.04.4 LTS
[15:38] <tomreyn> and the default iso downloaded from ubuntu.com / official release mirrors?
[15:38] <tomreyn> if so, can you please bring this up in #ubuntu-server ?
[15:38] <lkthomas> shit, I think I know why
[15:39] <lkthomas> I have to remove grub splash and quiet
[15:39] <lkthomas> these two options screw it up
[15:39] <luis220413> What alternatives exist to sendmail in the main component for 20.04 and 22.04?
[15:41] <tomreyn> lkthomas: and those are set by default, you say?
[15:42] <lkthomas> well yes
[15:42] <tomreyn> i guess it's still worth bringing it up in -server then
[15:42] <lkthomas> ok
[15:43] <tomreyn> be prepared to wait for a day or three to get a meaningful reply (may need to repeat the question). there are also mailing lists. if you prefer those.
[15:45] <tomreyn> luis220413: not much thats listed at https://packages.ubuntu.com/focal/mail/ is not also tagged [universe]
[15:46] <lotuspsychje> luis220413: see also; https://www.tecmint.com/best-mail-transfer-agents-mta-for-linux/
[15:47] <tomreyn> i guess you have bsd-mailx, exim4, postfix and that's pretty much it
[15:48] <tomreyn> though bsd-mailx would be a MUA rather than an MTA.
[15:56] <satanhhh> rawr
[15:57] <tomreyn> luis220413: not much left: curl -s https://packages.ubuntu.com/focal/mail/ | grep '^<dt>' | grep -vF '>universe<' | sed 's/^<dt><a [^>]*>\([^<]*\)<.*/\1/'
[15:57] <tomreyn> (yes, there's certainly a better way to extract this info ;-) )
[15:58] <laguna> does anyone know why gdm3 won't enable with systemctl
[15:59] <tomreyn> laguna: which ubuntu release, what are you running, and why, and what'S the output?
[15:59] <tomreyn> use a pastebin, please
[15:59] <laguna> i posted it earlier...let me try to use a pastebin
[16:00] <laguna> i am running jammy jellyfish..to see if the new rosegarden version adds any new features
[16:05] <laguna> ok tom here is link of paste https://dpaste.com/9Q4FCNWBR
[16:08] <tomreyn> laguna: gdm would be active by default on ubuntu. how comes it isn't on your system?
[16:08] <laguna> tomreyn..don't ask me..that is why i asked about the problem
[16:09] <tomreyn> laguna: is this a standard installation of ubuntu 22.04? did you upgrade to it? are you running a different flavor?
[16:09] <tomreyn> can you post the url returned by: systemctl cat gdm3 |& nc termbin.com 9999
[16:10] <laguna> i upgraded it...i was using a prior version where i changed something to stop the display manager so i could use startx...but gnome doesn't work well with startx only gdm3
[16:10] <ioria> laguna, also the output of  'sudo dpgk-reconfigure gdm3' might be useful
[16:11] <laguna> ioria i tried that already
[16:11] <tomreyn> also this, please:  sudo systemctl status gdm3 |& nc termbin.com 9999
[16:12] <laguna> tom ok here is pastebin https://termbin.com/9d91
[16:14]  * saltd executing /usr/sbin/gdm3
[16:15] <laguna> saltd well i use sudo systemctl start gdm3 which works but it is not automatic
[16:16] <tomreyn> saltd: do you have an ubuntu support question?
[16:16]  * saltd transforming text data ... 39%
[16:16] <ioria> laguna, 3 lines  are missing (but i'am comparing with 20.04):  StandardOutput=syslog   StandardError=inherit ExecStartPre=/usr/lib/gdm3/gdm-wait-for-drm
[16:19] <ioria> laguna, can you run systemctl set-default graphical.target  and reboot ?
[16:19] <laguna> ioria where do the 3 lines go
[16:19] <laguna> ioria yes i can
[16:19] <ioria> in the [Service] section
[16:28] <luis220413> tomreyn: Through APT lists
[16:28] <laguna> ioria that fixed it..now it auto boots to gnome
[16:28] <luis220413> grep 'Section: mail' /var/lib/apt/lists*_$(lsb_release -sc)_focal_main_binary-$(dpkg-architecture -qDEB_HOST_ARCH)_Packages
[16:29] <luis220413> tomreyn: There is a better way
[16:29] <luis220413> grep 'Section: mail' /var/lib/apt/lists*_$(lsb_release -sc){,-updates}_main_binary-$(dpkg-architecture -qDEB_HOST_ARCH)_Packages
[16:29] <tomreyn> ioria / laguna: on a freshly installed ubuntu 22.04, the gdm3,service file is identical to laguna's
[16:29] <luis220413> grep 'Section: mail' /var/lib/apt/lists/*_$(lsb_release -sc){,-security,-updates}_main_binary-$(dpkg-architecture -qDEB_HOST_ARCH)_Packages
[16:29] <luis220413> This also works for Kinetic
[16:29] <tomreyn> https://termbin.com/0il3
[16:29] <SoCkEt7> What is the difference of : VAR = $(....) and VAR = (.....)
[16:29] <SoCkEt7> ?
[16:29] <SoCkEt7> thanks
[16:30] <ioria> laguna, ok
[16:31] <luis220413> VAR=$(command) sets VAR to the result of running command
[16:31] <luis220413> VAR=(item0 item1 ...) is non-standard syntax, but works in Bash, and sets VAR to the array of the itemN.
[16:31] <luis220413> item0, item1, ...
[16:32] <SoCkEt7> Ok ! thanks
[16:32] <luis220413> VAR=() sets VAR to an empty array
[16:32] <cbreak> I think it's standard bash syntax
[16:32] <SoCkEt7> Okay
[16:33] <tomreyn> luis220413: thanks. yours works when you're running the respective target release or at least have those apt sources configured).
[16:34] <tomreyn> luis220413: i wasn't strictly looking for a better way, though, just wanted to come up with a quick and dirty way to answer your question
[16:34] <luis220413> If you do not have Ubuntu main configured, you will not be able to update core packages
[16:34] <luis220413> My last command works for any Ubuntu version, but will show PPA versions as well
[16:35] <luis220413> And from any other repositories with suite names RELEASE{,-security,-updates} and component main.
[16:35] <tomreyn> luis220413: if it's not clear, yet: i was responding to: <luis220413> What alternatives exist to sendmail in the main component for 20.04 and 22.04?
[16:36] <luis220413> This one does the trick: grep -B7 'Section: mail' /var/lib/apt/lists/*_$(lsb_release -sc){,-security,-updates}_main_binary-$(dpkg-architecture -qDEB_HOST_ARCH)_Packages | grep Package
[16:37] <luis220413> tomreyn: You answered my question with a previous message. It is exim4 and postfix.
[16:38] <luis220413> There are also 3 MUAs: bsd-mailx, mutt and thunderbird (preinstalled).
[16:39] <tomreyn> i concur. let's get back to what we were doing previously. ;-)
[16:39] <fable212> Ubuntu 22.04 On a HP Laptop: Is there a way to slow down the 2 finger scroll. I don't see an option to slow the scroll via the trackpad
[16:42] <lotuspsychje> dont see a value in dconf-editor fable212
[16:43] <lotuspsychje> fable212: maybe with xinput; https://askubuntu.com/questions/1120045/touchpad-two-finger-scroll-too-fast
[16:45] <fable212> lotuspsychje thanks I'll take a look
 That has helped just installing the driver!
[16:54] <lotuspsychje> fable212: so whats the speed you chose for your scrolling?
[16:55] <fable212> I didn't, just installing it has calmed it down
[16:55] <lotuspsychje> oh you mean you installed xserver-xorg-input-synaptics ?
[16:56] <fable212> Yes sorry
[16:56] <lotuspsychje> good to know! wich laptop brand is yours fable212?
[16:57] <fable212> X360 Envy, do you need the model
[16:59] <lotuspsychje> no its ok, good luck fable212
[17:01] <fable212> Cheers
[17:03] <webchat2> How do I build xrdp from source
[17:04] <lotuspsychje> webchat2: we usualy advice to install packages from the ubuntu repos, instead of compiling your own
[17:05] <webchat2> Well it's out of date
[17:05] <lotuspsychje> !info xrdp
[17:07] <toddc> webchat2: stable vs testing I use stable from the repos most of the day  newer is not always better unles ther is a feature you really need
[17:07] <toddc> and willing to deal with any bugs
[17:07] <webchat2> How do I enable testing
[17:08] <toddc> build from source 1 sec I may have a guide bookmarked
[17:08] <webchat2> Because I want the most latest version of packages
[17:09] <webchat2> I 'M willing to deal with the bugs
[17:10] <toddc> https://github.com/neutrinolabs/xrdp   go down to Compiling
[17:10]  * satanhhh pulls out flyswatter
[17:10] <satanhhh> did someone say bugs?
[17:11] <toddc> satanhhh: ther are no bugs in ubuntu just unresolved code issues
[17:13] <webchat2> How do I install software that is in testing using apt
[17:14] <mybalzitch> add the testing repo?
[17:15] <webchat2> Should I uncomment Some thing in the apt sources
[17:16] <toddc> webchat2: only if you can find it in a repo or untrused PPA Ubuntu default repos are all stable it may or may not exist some where else in the latest version
[17:16] <toddc> webchat2: latest looks like git hub only
[17:17] <webchat2> Ok
[17:17] <webchat2> May I ask another question
[17:18] <tomreyn> webchat2: sure, there's no need to ask before you ask.
[17:18] <tomreyn> as long as it's on topic (ubuntu support) it is fine.
[17:19] <webchat2> toddc are there any package managers similar to nix or homebrew which can be installed on any linux distro
[17:19] <enigma9o7[m]> What's wrong with homebrew?
[17:19] <enigma9o7[m]> If you really want, you can install it on Ubuntu
[17:19] <webchat2> Nothing
[17:20] <webchat2> I just want more package managers similar to homebrew
[17:20] <webchat2> If there are any
[17:21] <toddc> webchat2: there are a few but that is not my area
[17:22] <webchat2> Can you provide me with a list I would like to try 'em  out
[17:22] <webchat2> If you do have any recommendations
[17:25] <toddc> webchat2: no idea I stick to defaults for most things as it just works with no/little debugging
[17:26] <jhutchins> webchat2: Package managers aren't an add-on accessory, they are an integrated part of most Linux distributions.
[17:27] <jhutchins> webchat2: Package mangers for non-managed OSs are different.
[17:27] <jhutchins> webchat2: It sounds like what you're actually looking for is a "rolling release" distribution that has bleeding-edge packages.
[17:27] <jhutchins> webchat2: Ubuntu is not that distribution.
[17:27] <jhutchins> webchat2: Gentoo maybe?
[17:27] <tomreyn> !latest
[17:30] <webchat2> ubottu which package manager can I add to Ubuntu to get the latest version of packages
[17:30] <tomreyn> none needed, "snap" is already there
[17:30] <fable212> How do I highlight a single line in the stock text editor that pops up, ie line 12 say
[17:31] <fable212> too used to windows!
[17:31] <jhutchins> webchat2: That's not how it works.
[17:31] <jhutchins> webchat2: ubottu is a bot.
[17:31] <tomreyn> fable212: double-click it to select it
[17:32] <webchat2> Ok
[17:32] <fable212> tomreyn: Of course.. Thanks
[17:32] <tomreyn> fable212: or copy it and search for it, that will actually highlight it
[17:32] <jhutchins> webchat2: Again, package managers are not add-ons.
[17:32] <webchat2> Ok
[17:33] <CatSu> apt and apt-get
[17:33] <jhutchins> webchat2: If you want to run a testing distribution, you're volunteering to find and report problems, with accurate triage for what is actually broken.
[17:33] <jhutchins> webchat2: To get that, you have to select the testing version of a normal release.
[17:34] <jhutchins> webchat2: That often means installing the latest stable release and upgrading to testing.
[17:34] <tomreyn> jhutchins: i think the term "testing" is misleading in the ubuntu context.
[17:34] <webchat2> Can i use apt to get testing
[17:34] <jhutchins> !next
[17:35] <jhutchins> tomreyn: Sez "next" in the factoid.
[17:35] <tomreyn> yes, it does
[17:35] <jhutchins> tomreyn: So maybe that's the term.
[17:36] <tomreyn> i'm not actually sure whether ubuntu has a specific term for it. i'm just trying to prevent misleading webchat2 with debian nomenclature.
[17:37] <CatSu> Is there going to be any work on 32 bit versions of Ubuntu?
[17:37] <tomreyn> CatSu: no, those are end of life
[17:38] <tomreyn> CatSu: on 80x86 follow-up platforms, that is
[17:38] <tomreyn> i think armhf still gets updates
[17:39] <CatSu> Are there any good distros for 32 bit systems?
[17:39] <tomreyn> CatSu: #linux may have suggestions on this
[17:39] <hermano> Have sever problems with audio. Running ubuntu 22.04 with pipewire. The audio for headset (with cable), suddenly disappears. Only way to get back sound is to unplugg the usb and put it in again.
[17:39] <webchat2> Based on debian CatS
[17:39] <CatSu> Ok
[17:40] <webchat2> Thanks
[17:44] <CatSu> I unity still used?
[17:44] <CatSu> *is
[17:45] <tomreyn> There are no public usage statistics, for all I know.
[17:45] <tomreyn> no current ones, anyways
[17:46] <CatSu> Hmm
[17:46] <CatSu> I thought ubuntu used unity
[17:46] <ioria> not exactly, but there are a set of gnome-shell-exts and a separate distro  and projects (don't know if still active) CatSu
[17:48] <jhutchins> To the googles!
[17:50] <tomreyn> CatSu: you can install ubuntu-unity-desktop on current ubuntu releases
[17:53] <ApostleInTriumph> Hello. I had an internet disruption and the sshfs got unmounted. this resulted in clean wiping a file that was open on VSCode. it has my 2 days of unsaved work. Is it possible to restore the file to its state 2hrs ago? Thanks!
[17:54] <kyle3> I just updated my 18.04 box to 20.04, and I don't know if this is a change, or the first time I've noticed it.. but it appears to need mdns4 for ANY hostname resolution.
[17:54] <tomreyn> ApostleInTriumph: only from backups or snapshots, or, if its dirty bit is set, maybe by repairing the file system.
[17:55] <ApostleInTriumph> tomreyn how do i access snapshot?
[17:55] <CatSu> What environment does Ubuntu use?
[17:55] <kyle3> If I remove mdns4_minimal from /etc/nsswitch.conf's hosts line, no name resolution works.
[17:55] <tomreyn> ApostleInTriumph: you would know if you had a file system which creates any.
[17:55] <kyle3> I can dig against a DNS server by ip, traceroute, etc, but no resolution.
[17:55] <kyle3> Is this by design?
[17:56] <tomreyn> CatSu: the current default ubuntu desktop is gnome-shell (mutter)
[17:59] <ApostleInTriumph> God bless the soul that created snapshot on the server.
[17:59] <ApostleInTriumph> tomreyn thank you very much to you too!!
[18:01] <tomreyn> ApostleInTriumph: oh, looks like you were lucky. :) glad i could help.
[18:02] <fable212>  Does Ubuntu 22.04 Have any QOS Enabled on WiFi Cards, I keep getting a ramp up in D/S speed and can't decide if it's a driver problem or not. No QOS enabled on the router. Works fine on Windows same card. Sorry just working through the quirks!
[18:03] <ApostleInTriumph> "I should probably commit more often to git". i've lost the count and meaning of this......
[18:05] <ApostleInTriumph> this could be automated, true, but i had purposefully set it out fearing the comments my code would warrant
[19:42] <jortal> hi andreasbuhr
[19:44] <laguna> is there a way to get rosegarden 22 instead of 21 on this jammy jellyfish..21 is a little out of date and might not have the latest features
[19:45] <laguna> blender and rosegarden and ardour are important files for audio/video/3d work
[19:46] <laguna> i noticed debian sid which is unstable has rosegarden 22
[19:46] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: I can have it in the Ubuntu Studio Backports PPA in a couple hours if you're patient.
[19:46] <Eickmeyer[m]> But bear in mind:
[19:46] <Eickmeyer[m]> !latest | laguna
[19:47] <Eickmeyer[m]> !ubuntustudio-backports | laguna
[19:47] <laguna> Eickmeyer..ok but i dont' have studio..well when you are trying to create 100 million $ games and movies the latest features matter
[19:48] <jortal> agunal
[19:48] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: Studio is just a flavor of Ubuntu. Same repositories.
[19:48] <Eickmeyer[m]> jortal: Do you have a support question?
[19:48] <ioria> laguna, there's a flatpak, if you're interested
[19:48] <laguna> Eickmeyer oh ok
[19:48] <laguna> ioria what is flatpak
[19:49] <ioria> !flatpak
[19:49] <ioria> !info flatpak
[19:49] <ioria> laguna, https://flathub.org/apps/details/com.rosegardenmusic.rosegarden
[19:49] <laguna> ioria what version is in flathub
[19:49] <ioria> 22
[19:50] <laguna> oh that is great..let me try to use it
[19:50] <ioria> 22.06
[19:51] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: If you don't want a flatpak and stay with Ubuntu packages, add that aforementioned PPA that I pointed to in about an hour and you'll be all set.
[19:51] <Eickmeyer[m]> It's officially maintained by the Ubuntu Studio team.
[19:56] <laguna> Eickmeyer i will try the flatpak
[19:57] <Eickmeyer> laguna: Ok. Just FYI, if you have issues with the flatpak, you'll have to go to the maintainer of the flatpak as inidividual flatpaks are not supported here.
[19:58] <laguna> Eickmeyer..is there a way to uninstall a flatpak file if it is too buggy
[19:59] <Eickmeyer> laguna: "flatpak remove com.rosegardenmusic.rosegarden" would do the trick in this case.
[20:02] <Eickmeyer> laguna: Rosegarden does have a chatroom on libera, but it looks sparse. #rosegarden if you're interested. I don't use rosegarden myself, but I'm familiar with ardour as you mentioned.
[20:06]  * saltd sets mode +m
[20:06] <laguna> well for uematsu quality music for serious games like ff7 rosegarden is a must
[20:08] <laguna> and blender helps with some of the 3d anime
[20:22] <laguna> ioria...the flatpak seems to only have installed version21 unless there is a separate name for the flatpak version
[20:23] <laguna> ioria..does flatpak install over the original in usr/bin
[20:33] <laguna> where does flatpak install the file does it write over the apt file in /usr/bin
[20:34] <laguna> because rosegarden still says v 21
[20:35] <dvx> flatpak doesn't overwrite/write in /usr/bin
[20:35] <murmel> laguna: you have to run it with flatpak run ...
[20:35] <laguna> also real-time scheduling is not enabled by default on jammy jellyfish..this needs to be fixed
[20:36] <tomreyn> laguna: https://askubuntu.com/a/1167893
[20:39] <tomreyn> laguna: you're saying this like it was a bug, but i do not think that's the case.
[20:40] <goddard> i have gnome web installed
[20:40] <goddard> what is it called in the termina;
[20:40] <goddard> s/termina;/terminal
[20:41] <murmel> goddard: epiphany
[20:42] <laguna> ok flatpak run com.rosegardenmusic.rosegarden
[20:43] <laguna> does show v 22 and did not write over the ubuntu version
[20:43] <goddard> murmel: thanks
[20:43] <laguna> but i still need to enable rt scheduling for audio work
[20:43] <laguna> how to enable it on ubuntu
[20:44] <tomreyn> laguna: maybe you mean lowlatency?
[20:44] <laguna> yes as in real time
[20:44] <tomreyn> goddard: the package is called epiphany-browser, though
[20:45] <tomreyn> goddard: i would not expect it to get timely security support, though, as it's in universe.
[20:45] <tomreyn> laguna: that's not the same
[20:46] <laguna> well i need to enable rt scheduling
[20:47] <jhutchins> laguna: ubuntu realtime kernel - About 1,290,000 results (0.51 seconds) - I suggest https://ubuntu.com/blog/real-time-linux-qa#:~:text=Real%2Dtime%20Beta%20now%20available%20in%20Ubuntu%2022.04%20LTS&text=Based%20on%20v5.,their%20extreme%20low%2Dlatency%20requirements.
[20:48] <tomreyn> and then there is https://packages.ubuntu.com/search?exact=1&keywords=linux-lowlatency
[20:50] <tomreyn> but i guess you want PREEMPT_RT based onwhat you said so far.
[20:50] <Eickmeyer[m]> The PREEMPT_RT is enabled in the lowlatency kernel.
[20:50] <Eickmeyer[m]> !rt
[20:54] <AlexC> or use xanmod kernel, it has rt distribution, also has ubuntu/debian repo
[20:55] <laguna> it says i need to supply info for a free version of the realtime low latency kernel..but i put info and it says george name is already in use and also george123
[20:56] <AlexC> what says
[20:56] <laguna> how do you get a token to install the low latency kernel
[20:57] <laguna> i can't get past the user name page
[20:57] <tomreyn> laguna: did you read what Eickmeyer[m] posted?
[20:57] <AlexC> have you ever used linux before?
[20:57] <laguna> only for more than 25 years
[20:57] <AlexC> https://xanmod.org/
[20:57] <AlexC> there you go then
[20:57] <AlexC> you will be able to figure out from here
[20:58] <tomreyn> or just use the supported ubuntu kernels
[20:58] <AlexC> xanmod is actually good, i can recommend for desktop usage.
[20:59] <AlexC> and has RT and eveything what he need
[20:59] <tomreyn> ubuntu kernels are actually good, i can recommend for desktop usage.
[20:59] <tomreyn> and can have RT and eveything what he need
[21:00] <tomreyn> or she, or *
[21:00] <murmel> as this seems like a production system I would definitely recommend something that is actually supported than some "randon" kernel
[21:01] <laguna> tom ok i will stick with supported kernels what do you have in apt
[21:02] <gordonjcp> laguna: you want the lowlatency kernel, not rt
[21:02] <laguna> murmel it is not a production system...just low level hand me down hardware.to try to create some 100 million dollar games and computer graphics movies
[21:02] <AlexC> ttafak
[21:02] <gordonjcp> laguna: also I've never even bothered with ll for audio work
[21:02] <laguna> gordonjcp..no i need rt scheduling enabled
[21:02] <gordonjcp> laguna: for what?
[21:03] <gordonjcp> laguna: are you controlling CNC machines or something?
[21:03] <laguna> for serious audio work on cheap hardware
[21:03] <gordonjcp> no
[21:03] <gordonjcp> you do *not* want RT
[21:03] <gordonjcp> RT is the opposite of what you want
[21:04] <gordonjcp> laguna: if you want to shave 1 millisecond off your latency, it's easy, just sit a foot closer to the speaker
[21:04] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: I'm a 28-year audio engineer. I am also the leader of Ubuntu Studio. I use the lowlatency kernel. I use inexpensive professional hardware. I wrote that article I linked. You do \*not\* want the RT kernel. The lowlatency kernel has RT scheduling enabled. Full-stop.
[21:05] <gordonjcp> I should get back into developing Linux audio stuff
[21:05] <AlexC> make pipewire better
[21:05] <AlexC> thanks
[21:05] <AlexC> :>
[21:05] <AlexC> \o/
[21:05] <gordonjcp> I keep getting asked about porting synths to PC plugins
[21:05] <laguna> Eickmeyer ok if it has rt scheduling enabled that is good enough.how do i install the low latency kernel on this jammy jellyfish
[21:05] <Eickmeyer[m]> AlexC: Talk to the pipewire devs.
[21:05] <AlexC> nah im good, it's good enough for daily use
[21:05] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: sudo apt install linux-lowlatency.
[21:06] <laguna> Eickmeyer..ok thanks let me try
[21:06] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: If you want to take it a step further, add "threadirqs" to your grub boot parameters.
[21:06] <gordonjcp> oooo
[21:06] <gordonjcp> oooooooo I have PCI slots now, I could use my Delta 1010LT again
[21:07] <Eickmeyer[m]> And for those of you that have never heard of it, UBUNTU STUDIO has all of this stuff set-up for you OUT OF THE BOX.
[21:07] <gordonjcp> yup
[21:07] <Eickmeyer[m]> And, if you want to add Ubuntu Studio to an installation...
[21:07] <Eickmeyer[m]> !ubuntustudio-installer
[21:07] <gordonjcp> it's been a while since I used Ubuntu Studio, I quite liked it
[21:08] <Eickmeyer[m]> So, stop doing things manually that I HAVE ALREADY DONE FOR YOU.
[21:09]  * Eickmeyer[m] goes back to solving a future kdenlive problem
[21:10] <laguna> ok let me try to reboot on the new kernel
[21:11] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: oh? What are you working on?
[21:12] <Eickmeyer[m]> gordonjcp: It's offtopic for in here, but there's a bug in a dependency of kdenlive. Somebody uploaded the dependency with the wrong release tarball. Now I have a mess to clean up.
[21:14] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: joy
[21:15] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: I keep meaning to dig into kdenlive, I've never really got it to work
[21:15] <Eickmeyer[m]> It's pretty solid these days.
[21:15] <Eickmeyer[m]> But not in 22.10 for the aforementioned reason. Again, offtopic.
[21:20] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: huh, something's changed since 21.10, I can no longer consistently crash it with a particular set of clips, so that's good
[21:20] <Eickmeyer[m]> gordonjcp: The kdenlive team has been doing a very good job lately.
[21:21] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: also it deinterlaces .m2t properly, which is nice, because it used to make a total horlicks of that
[21:23] <h4k1m0u> HI everyone, did someone try to replace the default display manager (gdm I suppose) with Ly for instance? I had problems to run Sway from gdm
[21:25] <enigma9o7[m]> I use an autologin thing i foun don the sway wiki for my sway machine....
[21:26] <h4k1m0u> is it easy to setup on Ubuntu?
[21:26] <enigma9o7[m]> so not gdm
[21:26] <h4k1m0u> I think autologin is also compatible with Sway
[21:27] <enigma9o7[m]> Depends on how you define easy.  Yes it was easy, but there were a few steps invovled....
[21:29] <enigma9o7[m]> and when i first did it I didnt understand the terminology (i.e. it says to copy the systemd unit to a folder... i was like wtf is a systemd unit... why not just tell me the autologin.service file!)
[21:30] <laguna> ok the low latency kernel is booted..so far not crashing...and reports smp and preempt ...and the rt scheduler is working
[21:32] <laguna> but i don't know where my power supply is for this old hand me down keyboard to try to write a simple symphony about jailhouse blues
[21:33] <laguna> on this v 22
[21:33] <h4k1m0u> enigma9o7[m]: you were referring to this repo right? https://git.sr.ht/~kennylevinsen/autologin
[21:34] <enigma9o7[m]> yep thats the one
[21:38] <luke> Testing
[21:42] <JoeLlama> arraybolt3[m] okay...  apt-offline MUST be borked :(
[21:42] <JoeLlama> I have a get.sig file with a LOT of packages to download...
[21:43] <JoeLlama> and when I try to bundle it using apt-offline it tries to download one security file and then errors out...
[21:43] <JoeLlama> anyone have an idea why apt-offline is borked??? :(
[21:44] <JoeLlama> I cannot continue with this raid install because of this...  gotta get all these files... is there a way I can somehow do an atp-offline without using the --bundle option?
[21:45] <JoeLlama> MAJOR ROAD BLOCK GUYS... does anyone here know now to use apt-offline?
[21:46] <laguna> JoeLlama try the man page
[21:46] <JoeLlama> is it true what arraybolt3[m] says... that it needs a "major overhaul?"
[21:46] <JoeLlama> okay laguna thanks now... what is the man page?
[21:46] <laguna> joe...from terminal type man apt-offline
[21:47] <JoeLlama> on the internet box or the offline machine?
[21:47] <JoeLlama> laguna?
[21:48] <laguna> there is also man 8 aptitude
[21:48] <JoeLlama> *sigh*
[21:48] <JoeLlama> on what machine... offline or internet
[21:48] <enigma9o7[m]> whats with the numbers people sometimes suggested for man?
[21:48] <enigma9o7[m]> i.e. whats the different between `man aptitude` and `man 8 aptitude`
[21:48] <laguna> joellama either one with the man pages included in a normal install
[21:49] <JoeLlama> oh ok then I choose the internet machine
[21:49] <laguna> man is divided into sections so you have to watch for man # topic
[21:50] <laguna> goes back to the early days of slackware and kernel 0.99
[21:50] <laguna> before redhat and gnome
[21:50] <JoeLlama> well...  I typed in the proper things... this page doesn't tell me why my get.sig file which has a TON of packages to download won't download when I do the "apt-offline get get.sig --bundle bundle.zip"
[21:51] <JoeLlama> it gets one thing that doesn't install... it won't download the 100 or so packages
[21:51] <laguna> well read the man pages carefully
[21:51] <JoeLlama> so is arraybolt3[m] correct in saying that the "apt-offline" command is borked?
[21:52] <JoeLlama> hrm....
[21:52] <JoeLlama> anyone here really familiar with apt-offline?
[21:52] <laguna> joellama it might be or there may be a clue in the man pages
[21:52] <laguna> back in the early days...every one advised read the fucking manual
[21:53] <JoeLlama> I am reading it....  I did these things...  I looked at the get.sig file I created on the offline machine... it is loaded with packages to download
[21:53] <JoeLlama> then I did "apt-offline get get.sig --bundle bundle.zip"
[21:54] <JoeLlama> right?  what is wrong? nothing is wrong
[21:54] <JoeLlama> it's supposed to download a ton of updates
[21:54] <JoeLlama> it's not
[21:54] <JoeLlama> arraybolt3[m] said that apt-offline needs a major overhaul
[21:55] <JoeLlama> I'm trying to figure out... is he right?  I do not see anything I am doing wrong
[21:55] <JoeLlama> I know there is an alternate way to do this but I forgot what he said... it worked partially last time I am willing to get a partial download
[21:55] <JoeLlama> *sigh* scroll way back
[21:56] <tomreyn> JoeLlama: i can see how this is frustrating. what is your goal in reporting this here now? are you hoping for someone to reproduce this to maybe file a bug report? then you'd need to provide the exact commands that have been run, and information ont he environment.
[21:57] <tomreyn> another approach could be to summarize what your overall goal is and then maybe someone could come up with alternative approaches to achieve that.
[21:57] <oerheks> apt-offline version v1.8.5 has been released. 15 days ago https://github.com/rickysarraf/apt-offline/issues/191
[21:57] <JoeLlama> yeah thanks tomreyn
[21:57] <JoeLlama> arraybolt3[m] told me to use apt-offline get get.sig -d .
[21:57] <JoeLlama> that worked for many files but not all
[21:57] <JoeLlama> I will just use that
[21:58] <JoeLlama> I am using the --update option
[21:58] <JoeLlama> ok it is downloading packages now
[21:59] <JoeLlama> last time it didn't get them all...
[21:59] <JoeLlama> this is gunna take a long time :/ but that is good at least I'm getting them
[21:59] <tomreyn> JoeLlama: see the link oerheks posted? there indeed seems to be a bug in apt-offline where it can miss several downloads
[21:59] <JoeLlama> perhaps you guys can tell me how to submit a bug report on this
[22:00] <JoeLlama> yes yes tomreyn it does for me hope it's fixed soon :/
[22:00] <JoeLlama> and yes this is a bit frustrating
[22:01] <JoeLlama> now that I have told you guys i'm sure it will be fixed soon :)
[22:01] <tomreyn> the package in ubuntu is community maintained. it may or may not get patch backports. it probably won't upgrade in existing releases.
[22:03] <tomreyn> reporting bugs on irc usually has no impact at all. not if you don't also file a bug report against ubuntu.
[22:03] <tomreyn> !bug
[22:04] <JoeLlama> yeah wish i had time but I'm 63 now I wanna get this all done before I croak (:
[22:04] <JoeLlama> perhaps later in life I can report this serious bug :)
[22:04] <JoeLlama> this is working for the moment gotta knock on wood (it's the ocd you know)
[22:06] <tomreyn> JoeLlama: looks like you're lucky, someone else already filed bug 1977972 and you can simply +1 yourself there and also use the workaround provided.
[22:06] <jhutchins> JoeLlama: Filing bugs is playing your part in the Open Source economy.  You're getting free use of the software, bugreports are how you give back.
[22:07] <oerheks> age is not a valid excuse :-P
[22:08] <jhutchins> Not dead yet.
[22:09] <JoeLlama> yes
[22:09] <JoeLlama> I am sure I will have time to do that right after this project is done and the rent is paid
[22:10] <JoeLlama> however arraybolt3[m] is very aware of the situations and arraybolt3[m] might beat me to that report provided arraybolt3[m] has a little more time than me
[22:10] <JoeLlama> we all have to do our part
[22:11] <JoeLlama> ok this worked...  bbl :)
[22:12] <tomreyn> i guess arraybolt3[m] already did their part by spending a whole lot of (volunteer) time on this with you.
[22:12] <JoeLlama> yes arraybolt3[m] did for sure! :)
[22:12] <JoeLlama> we ended up aborting the server install and I just put lubuntu on the box
[22:13] <JoeLlama> which is fine I like lubuntu a lot and I think it's a better solution
[22:14] <JoeLlama> hope you got your rent paid this month tomreyn I'm working on mine
[22:15] <tomreyn> i should, thanks. good luck on yours.
[22:16] <JoeLlama> thank you
[22:16] <JoeLlama> we'll work on that bug report later maybe tomorrow... I'm sure it doesn't take that much time
[22:16] <enigma9o7[m]> Your words encouraged me to submit a bug report, never done one before, on an unrelated issue.  I got thru the report and login and ready to submit, but then it says the package doesn't exist.  Well it most certainly does.  Can I not file bugs against universe packages or what?
[22:18] <tomreyn> enigma9o7[m]: you can, but you need to file them against the source package, not the binary package. ubuntu-bug automatically resolves this for you. but you can also look up the source package on e.g. https://packages.ubuntu.com
[22:18]  * enigma9o7[m] uploaded an image: (202KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/nbLzLJzUIsSZDlZLHgRzkkAC/Screenshot%20from%202022-08-27%2015-18-15.png >
[22:18] <enigma9o7[m]> I did use ubuntu-bug tho
[22:18] <JoeLlama> ok tomreyn took notes on that...
[22:18] <JoeLlama> so I was able to get a whole directory of files using apt-offline get upgrade.sig -d .
[22:19] <enigma9o7[m]> I did exactly that, `ubuntu-bug nethack-qt` and then it pulled up browser where i logge dinto ubuntu one, see screenshot
[22:19] <JoeLlama> since it's not bundled now how do I install all of these on the target offline machine?
[22:19] <tomreyn> enigma9o7[m]: oh you're on devel
[22:20] <laguna> i still have this problem with rt scheduling on this kernel
[22:20] <laguna> annot create RT messagebuffer thread: Operation not permitted (1)
[22:20] <laguna> Retrying messagebuffer thread without RT scheduling
[22:20] <laguna> Messagebuffer not realtime; consider enabling RT scheduling for user
[22:21] <laguna> any clues on this ubuntu version
[22:21] <enigma9o7[m]> yes tom this bug is in devel version only, not in jammy
[22:22] <tomreyn> enigma9o7[m]: hmm it says "Ubuntu 21.10 Devel" in your report draft, that's a bit weird. i'm not sure why it would do that.
[22:22] <enigma9o7[m]> yeah that is my bad
[22:22] <enigma9o7[m]> i typed that wrong and already noticed and fixed it
[22:22] <enigma9o7[m]> But in any case the problem is it wont let me submit cuz it says not real package
[22:23] <tomreyn> if you look at https://packages.ubuntu.com/kinetic/nethack-qt the source package would be "nethack"
[22:24] <enigma9o7[m]> ah ok then again my fault.  it changed it to nethack, but i switched it to nethack-qt, since  nethack by itself works fine, and nethack-qt is a differnet pacakge, but ok I get it now, thanks for help
[22:25] <deego> On an ubuntu machine, if I actually use the sound card, by using a bunch of spd-say, it crashes sooner or later, and the sound cards simply disappear. Even the setting show "test sound" instead of any sound cards..
[22:26] <deego> disappear* till i reboot
[22:27] <jhutchins> deego: What software are you using to play the sound?  What audio chipsets do you have?  Have you done anything since the install to configure the sound?
[22:28] <deego> jhutchins: spd-say
[22:29] <deego> jhutchins: intel corp alder lake pch-p high def audio controller, and nvidia corp device 2288
[22:29] <deego> from lspci
[22:29] <deego> haven't done anything, vanilla ubuntu
[22:30] <deego> 22.04
[22:31] <tomreyn> deego: keep an eye on     journalctl -f    while this happens. if you use ALSA (by default) you should be able to manage the sound cards using "alsamixer" in a terminal and pavucontrol for the pulseaudio part.
[22:31] <tomreyn> !sound | deego
[22:32] <deego> tomreyn: thanks
[22:34] <laguna> sudo seems to solve RT scheduling...is there a way to enable it for an ordinary user
[22:35] <gordonjcp> laguna: just set it up properly
[22:35] <gordonjcp> laguna: Eickmeyer[m] already told you what to do
[22:36] <gordonjcp> laguna: do you know what groups are?
[22:36] <laguna> gordonjcp well that is what i am asking..what command to enable it for an ordinary user...instead of sudo or root
[22:36] <laguna> gordonjcp..yes what group do i joi
[22:36] <gordonjcp> laguna: add yourself to the correct group, as per the Ubuntu Studio docs
[22:36] <laguna> join
[22:37] <laguna> i have never seen ubuntu studio..i am about serious audio and 3d computer graphics work for serious games
[22:37] <laguna> like final fantasy 7
[22:37] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: I for the life of me can't figure out why you want to do all the heavy work manually when I've already done it for you by making Ubuntu Studio and its installer.
[22:37] <Eickmeyer[m]> !ubuntustudio-installer | laguna
[22:38] <Eickmeyer[m]> It will do the configuration. You just have to trust it.
[22:38] <deego> tomreyn: looking at journalctl, I see a bunch of "too many connections (64)... dropping" from pulseaudio. I never made 64 connections! Just spd-say here and there. Seems like once it hits that, it's gone for good, and any further spd-say simply hangs.
[22:38] <laguna> Eickmeyer is it too hard to just do the config manually
[22:38] <laguna> for a user
[22:39] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: It can be. You have to be able to set a bunch of security permissions and configurations. Why do you want to put yourself through that/
[22:39] <Eickmeyer[m]> ?
[22:39] <tomreyn> deego: i'm afraid i don't even know what spd-say is. you'll probably need to find someone who is more into audio to support you there.
[22:39] <Eickmeyer[m]> There's a reason Ubuntu Studio exists, laguna .
[22:39] <laguna> Eickmeyer...ok fine what do i type in apt to get the studio configs
[22:40] <Eickmeyer[m]> sudo apt install ubuntustudio-installer. Make sure you have ubuntustudio-lowlatency-settings installed after that and you should be fine.
[22:41] <Eickmeyer[m]> And, for the record, I didn't make Ubuntu Studio, I just made it what it is today.
[22:41] <Eickmeyer[m]> It used to be much harder.
[22:41] <tomreyn> deego: okay, now that i ran     spd-say "I'm sorry Tom. I can't let you do that."    I do know. But still, I'm not enough into the topic.
[22:42] <laguna> Eickmeyer..ok i am working on it do i need Carla
[22:43] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: Only if yo uwant it.
[22:43] <laguna> Eickmeyer..what does Carla do
[22:43] <Eickmeyer[m]> It's an audio plugin host and patchbay.
[22:43] <laguna> Eickmeyer..oh that might be useful
[22:44] <Eickmeyer[m]> Cool. Feel free to install it then.
[22:44] <deego> tomreyn: np, thanks
[22:53] <laguna> installing ubuntustudio and ubuntu-lowlatency settings by itself did not fix anything
[22:53] <laguna> i still have this message
[22:54] <laguna> essagebuffer not realtime; consider enabling RT scheduling for user
[22:54] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: Launch Studio Controls. What does it say?
[22:55] <Eickmeyer[m]> Should say at the top whether or not it can fix that.
[22:55] <laguna> Eickmeyer what command name for Studio Controls
[22:55] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: It's a launchable icon. A gui.
[22:57] <laguna> Eickmeyer yes i see it now...it lists about 7 or 8 things to perhaps install
[22:57] <laguna> like ubuntustudio-performance-tweaks
[22:58] <laguna> and ubuntustudio-audio package...etc
[22:58] <Eickmeyer[m]> Oh, you shouldn't have to install all of those.
[22:58] <Eickmeyer[m]> And that's -installer, not controls.
[22:58] <Eickmeyer[m]> Performance tweaks is a good one though.
[22:58] <laguna> but rtkit is listed as a group and my user name is there..but rt messaging is not enabled for the user
[22:59] <laguna> Eickmeyer...how can i manually do this
[22:59] <gordonjcp> do you actually need rt
[22:59] <gordonjcp> especially if you're on a low-spec machine?
[22:59] <laguna> gordonjcp/...of course...poor hardware needs software help
[22:59] <Eickmeyer[m]> Honestly, RT can bring a low-spec machine completely to its knees.
[23:00] <laguna> Eickmeyer...let me worry about tht
[23:00] <laguna> that
[23:00] <Eickmeyer[m]> RT is designed for high performance.
[23:00] <Eickmeyer[m]> Wow. Ok.
[23:00] <gordonjcp> laguna: RT is only suitable for really quite high-end machines
[23:01] <Eickmeyer[m]> No need to be brash, that'll get you yeeted from here quick.
[23:01] <gordonjcp> laguna: but since you clearly know more than the Ubuntu Studio dev, I guess I'll leave you to it
[23:01] <laguna> Eickmeyer....let me try...how can i manually enable rt scheduling for normal user
[23:01] <gordonjcp> laguna: before you start, have you got a fire extinguisher handy
[23:01] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: You should only have to add yourself to the audio group at this point.
[23:01] <laguna> gordonjcp...well i will get a bucket of water
[23:01] <gordonjcp> laguna: not ideal on electrical fires but okay
[23:02] <Eickmeyer[m]> gordonjcp: please, let's not add fuel.
[23:02] <gordonjcp> just isolate the power first
[23:02] <laguna> ok is it groupadd george audio
[23:02] <laguna> i can't reme,,ner
[23:02] <laguna> remember
[23:02] <gordonjcp> laguna: usermod -aG audio <your username> isn't it?
[23:02] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: Sure, you'll just have to logout/in, but I was encouraging studio-controls as it does this for you.
[23:02] <gordonjcp> and then log out and . yes
[23:03] <gordonjcp> sometimes for some odd reason your session hangs around for a bit
[23:03] <Eickmeyer[m]> I'd trust studio-controls to do it, it has a handy button that does it as it autodetects if you actually need it.
[23:03] <laguna> i am already in audio group...this is about enabling rt scheduling
[23:03] <laguna> let me try to find studio controls
[23:03] <Eickmeyer[m]> PLEASE check studio-controls.
[23:04] <Eickmeyer[m]> It should've installed with ubuntustudio-instaler.
[23:04] <Eickmeyer[m]> It's a dependency.
[23:07] <laguna> i pushed the config button for rt settings and restarted jackd..but i still get this message
[23:07] <laguna> annot use real-time scheduling (RR/5) (1: Operation not permitted)
[23:08] <laguna> Eickmeyer..is there a way to manually let user have rt scheduling permissions
[23:09] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: You hit the config button, but you need to log out/in. A simple restart of jack doesn't do it.
[23:09] <Eickmeyer[m]> Sometimes a full restart is even required.
[23:09] <laguna> Eickmeyer..ok i will do a full reboot into the lowlat kernel
[23:10] <Eickmeyer[m]> (and people wonder why I don't work customer service anymore)
[23:15] <agamenon_> So ? Do people talk here ?
[23:15] <laguna> Eickmeyer...ok i think rt is enabled for normal user..let me play a test file i was working on to see if it will crash
[23:16] <gordonjcp> laguna: -rt or no -rt ought not to make it crash
[23:16] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: Ok, that's what we were looking for.
[23:17] <tomreyn> agamenon_: this usually depends on whether they seek or provide ubuntu support or not
[23:17] <Eickmeyer[m]> The only thing that RT might do is make it freeze, but the lowlatency kernel has some safeguards to keep that from happening, hence "lowlatency" and not true RT.
[23:17] <Eickmeyer[m]> But, as stated in the linked article before, you don't want true RT.
[23:19] <gordonjcp> I don't even use lowlatency unless I really really need it
[23:20] <laguna> now its jamin jammy with 32 channels of musical instruments so final fantasy 7 won't be the only great game
[23:21] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: Great, glad to hear it. I used to rock 32 channels on a Behringer X32 when live mixing bands.
[23:22] <laguna> Eickmeyer..well that is what a good audio engineer should do...help others to enjoy quality audio
[23:23] <laguna> let me see what 1812 is going to sound like on rosegarden
[23:23] <Eickmeyer[m]> laguna: Well, glad we could help you through it. Just so you know, one of Ubuntu Studio's goals is to help people have all they need to create high-quality music out of the box.
[23:24] <laguna> Eickmeyer..that is an excellent goal...quality music and games are rare so more people need to be equipped to do a good job
[23:24] <hentai> If I do not install the xubuntu-* packages, is installing XFCE on normal Ubuntu supported by canonical?
[23:25] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: I know a few fairly high-end producers and I always feel bad when they give me stuff to listen to because I mostly only listen to music in the car, so it's over bluetooth into an add-on board I fitted to the factory stereo and battling it out with wind noise, massive chunky offroad tyres, the whiny front diff, the rattly rear suspension, the exhaust vibrating on the towbar, and so on
[23:26] <tomreyn> hentai: canonical supports the packages in the "main" and "restricted" sections, sometimes more.
[23:26] <gordonjcp> high-quality music right until I got hold of it
[23:27] <hentai> oh... forgot that
[23:27] <Eickmeyer[m]> gordonjcp: Yeah, I get that. They'd love my home set-up.
[23:28] <pg> Are there any video wizards about? I'm running Ubuntu Studio and if I attach an external monitor it displays for maybe a minute or two and then goes black.
[23:28] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: a mate of mine works for Linn Hifi
[23:28] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: That seems odd. 22.04?
[23:28] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: you know how there are people running around in cars where the stereo is worth more than the car, right?
[23:28] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: you can do that with houses, too.
[23:29] <Eickmeyer[m]> gordonjcp: It's kinda sad, but we need to get back on-topic in this support chat. :)
[23:30] <gordonjcp> Eickmeyer[m]: sure
[23:30] <pg> Eickmeyer[m]: yes
[23:30] <jbwncster> So how do you remove only the desktop UI from ubuntu?
[23:30] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: Ok, so that tells me KDE Plasma. Any special video hardware, like Nvidia?
[23:31] <jbwncster> I have put on ubuntu mate and lxde
[23:31] <jbwncster> I only want lxde
[23:31] <jbwncster> But when I remove ubuntu mate it won’t boot to the GUI
[23:32] <pg> Eickmeyer[m]: Intel I believe, and yes to KDE plasma
[23:33] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: Ok, that helps a little, but makes this even harder. I assume laptop computer, considering you said "external monitor". Is that correct?
[23:33] <pg> Eickmeyer[m]: yes, Acer
[23:33] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: What kind of connection? HDMI? DisplayPort?
[23:34] <pg> Eickmeyer[m]: VGA port
[23:34] <jbwncster> Does ubuntu support vga anymore?
[23:34] <jbwncster> Idk how but my external monitors work because I have a displaylink docking station
[23:34] <Eickmeyer[m]> VGA! ok, now we're getting somewhere. When you open Display Settings, what does it show?
[23:34] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: ^
[23:35] <Eickmeyer[m]> jbwncster: Of course it does. :P
[23:35] <jbwncster> Well I can’t get the drivers for my hp monitor nor my dell monitor
[23:35] <jbwncster>  But they turn on with displaylink
[23:37] <Eickmeyer[m]> jbwncster: Not sure how to help you there, most monitors don't require drivers.
[23:37] <pg> Eickmeyer[m]: So unfortunately I have my setup blanking the laptop monitor when an external is plugged in. At the moment I get about 10 seconds before it goes to black but it looks like it's only showing one monitor
[23:38] <enigma9o7[m]> yes jbw analog vga is supported just fine
[23:39] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: Very odd. I'd try to get it back to simply extending to the external monitor if possible for troubleshooting purposes. It sounds to me like the hardware is assuming that, by turning off the internal monitor, that it should be turning off all monitors.
[23:39] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: The safest application for your setup might be to mirror the monitors if you want a similar setup, making the external monitor the primary.
[23:40] <pg> Eickmeyer[m]: ok, it stayed on long enough for me to extend to the laptop monitor and both monitors show
[23:41] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: Excellent progress. I hope that helps!
[23:43] <pg> Eickmeyer[m]: So hoping that both monitors on keeps the vga alive? In my research I saw suggestions that Ubuntu has difficulty with 3 video ports but my bios won't let me turn off the hdmi port. Would this help and can I do that from inside Ubuntu?
[23:47] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: I have a laptop with 3 video ports (two displayport and one HDMI) and have had no trouble running all four (including internal) simultaneously, so I don't know if that research is even up to date or valid.
[23:48] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: I'd bet more on keeping both monitors on, as your hardware seems to like that more.
[23:49] <pg> Eickmeyer[m]: Ok, thank you very much for the help. I can keep both displays running but it's not ideal. Any suggestions for further poking around?
[23:50] <jbwncster> My ubuntu machine says hid-generic not recognized
[23:50] <jbwncster> But it works once it boots
[23:51] <jbwncster> Also can’t extend the monitors in lxde
[23:51] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: The best place is the display settings. It's pretty comprehensive. If you have an HDMI port, as you mentioned, that's a better output than VGA any day, so it might be worth investing in a cheap HDMI monitor. You might find a used one on eBay that would be in working order.
[23:51] <jbwncster> Only mirror
[23:52] <Eickmeyer[m]> jbwncster: The Lubuntu folk would tell you that's among many reasons lxde isn't supported anymore, and why they switched to LXQt.
[23:53] <pg> Eickmeyer[m]: Ok, thanks again. I think I've pretty much exhausted the display settings. Guess I'll have to save up for an hdmi monitor. Have a great day.
[23:53] <jbwncster> Lxqt didn’t work either
[23:53] <jbwncster> And snap stuff wouldn’t work
[23:59] <Eickmeyer[m]> pg: You too!