| OvenWerks | Eickmeyer[m]: any way from the commandline to find out _why_ apt says packages have been kept back? | 19:41 |
|---|---|---|
| Eickmeyer | OvenWerks: At this point, it's easy to assume it's due to phased updates. | 19:43 |
| OvenWerks | Eickmeyer[m]: I find lots of recipes to fix this but none that allow one to diagnose why. I think this is pretty important. It may mean I have SW installed that relies on an older version that may not be in the repo for example. | 19:43 |
| OvenWerks | Eickmeyer[m]: I would prefer to know rather than assume | 19:44 |
| Eickmeyer | There's no way to know for certain. It used to be buit-in to just the update-manager, now it's built-in to apt as well. | 19:44 |
| OvenWerks | but from that it would seem it is best to wait, it just seems there is always something not installed | 19:44 |
| OvenWerks | so it is a bug with apt then. Apt should give more information | 19:45 |
| Eickmeyer | Unfortunately, they'll tell you it's *not* a bug in apt. | 19:45 |
| Eickmeyer | https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/phased-updates-in-apt-in-21-04/20345 | 19:46 |
| Eickmeyer | OvenWerks: ^ That might give you what you need to know, and probably something to chime-in on. | 19:49 |
| OvenWerks | Eickmeyer: is there a reasonable explanation of phased updates? The thread gives just enough info to make it seem these are optional but not enough to let one understand why they might be useful. | 19:50 |
| Eickmeyer | OvenWerks: It goes back 10 years: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PhasedUpdates | 19:51 |
| OvenWerks | It does seem to say that this is all the held back means and that a missing dep or bad dep would error out in a different way. | 19:52 |
| OvenWerks | thank you | 19:52 |
| Eickmeyer | It's basically so they can stop regressions before they spread. | 19:52 |
| OvenWerks | Ah so it means they are not using me as a lab rat. | 19:53 |
| OvenWerks | I can live with that | 19:53 |
| OvenWerks | apt could be changed to "held back due to phased release" | 19:54 |
| OvenWerks | The programmer only has to type in once, the users might ask what is this thousands of times | 19:55 |
| Eickmeyer | Right, but that isn't always true. Sometimes packages are held back due to version mismatches. The problem is it would require a lot more work to make it differentiate, and it isn't that smart yet. | 19:55 |
| arraybolt3[m] | There's a whole bug report and discussion about it on Launchpad, lemme see if I can pull it up... | 19:56 |
| Eickmeyer | arraybolt3[m]: I pulled-up the discourse conversation. | 19:56 |
| arraybolt3[m] | https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/1988819 | 19:56 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1988819 in apt (Ubuntu) "When apt keeps back packages due to phased updates, it should say so" [Undecided, Confirmed] | 19:56 |
| Eickmeyer | Oh, that's recent. | 19:57 |
| arraybolt3[m] | Also, I wrote this for helping people who ask about why updates are being held back: https://askubuntu.com/questions/1431940/what-are-phased-updates-and-why-does-ubuntu-use-them/1431941#1431941 | 19:57 |
| arraybolt3[m] | (I still need to update the main Wiki docs, though.) | 19:57 |
| OvenWerks | it apears that "apt-mark showhold" should tell me if something is held due to a package error on my machine. (ie. sw from a PPA that has a dep for an old lib version. | 20:12 |
| OvenWerks | Hmm, so https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/phased-updates.html shows packages that are phased... at least sru packages (are there others?) but while I have 8 packages held back, there are only two shown on that page of which only one is listed on my system as held back (the other is not installed) | 20:35 |
| OvenWerks | arraybolt3[m]: I am guessing this means that some of the other packages held back are dependant on that one package? | 20:36 |
| OvenWerks | the package held back is systemd (good choice to phase) but my list is: libnss-systemd libpam-systemd libsystemd0 libudev1 systemd systemd-sysv systemd-timesyncd udev | 20:37 |
| OvenWerks | Most would probably depend on that package, udev I am not sure but probably that too. | 20:37 |
| arraybolt3[m] | I would guess the dependencies would do things that way. | 21:19 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!