[11:15] <nteodosio> chrisccoulson, I have updated Bionic's Chromium to 106.0.5249.91 — the last time I pinged you about it the changelog was inaccurate so sorry if that was confusing, I resubmitted it and it's ready already: https://launchpad.net/~canonical-chromium-builds/+archive/ubuntu/stage
[13:41] <xnox> Odd_Bloke:  the point is timing; it is depends such that when one's system stop receiving updates, they already have the tool to opt into ESM post end of standard support. At the moment we have no good way to re-push and re-install the package (even if it is recommends) at end-of-standard-support time. The only way to do this is to keep it as depends =/
[13:41] <xnox> Odd_Bloke:  i do wish that u-a-t was tiny bootstrap package that would self download itself and like bloom into full one. As we really only need it as a stub.
[13:42] <xnox> Odd_Bloke: having it in place is imho required at end-of-basic support =/ as there is no other way to know that one is not receiving any security support anymore.
[16:23] <Odd_Bloke> Aha, OK, I'd missed that wrinkle: that does complicate matters.
[16:24] <Odd_Bloke> alias ua='sed -i s/archive/old-releases/ /etc/apt/sources.list && apt-get update && apt-get install ubuntu-advantage-tools && ua'  # ship it :p
[16:29] <juliank> xnox: I mean we need to add sources.list to figure out available updates in ubuntu pro and show users what they are mssing
[16:32] <juliank> xnox: We can push the package to systems in a final update to -updates by sneakingly marking it as Essential, so dist-upgrade pulls it in
[16:32] <juliank> :D
[16:32] <rbasak> juliank: I don't think we can do that safely - see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-advantage-tools/+bug/1990378
[16:32] -ubottu:#ubuntu-devel- Launchpad bug 1990378 in ubuntu-advantage-tools (Ubuntu) "apt-get will start failing for some users when Bionic reaches ESM" [Critical, Triaged]
[16:33] <rbasak> IOW, we can't just add things to users' sources.list unless they take an action to do it.
[16:33] <juliank> I'm going to say we don't have an option there
[16:34] <juliank> update should continue working in the sense it doesn't exit with an error
[16:34] <juliank> surely at the very least you want to check if esm.ubuntu.com is accessible
[16:35] <rbasak> Ah - update won't error if it can't reach a sources.list entry?
[16:35] <juliank> for future releases, esm.ubuntu.com should be added ahead of time
[16:35] <juliank> rbasak: I believe it should cause a warning message, but not an exit 1 error unless you pass --error-on=any
[16:35] <juliank> rbasak: because by default that's a transient network error
[16:36] <rbasak> It's still not great though. Lots of people have isolated environments, and I don't think users would be happy with apt suddenly calling out somewhere if they've tuned their sources.list to only use a local mirror for example.
[16:36] <juliank> so what it fails is cloud-init I think because that would pass --error-on=any in its retry logic
[16:36] <juliank> rbasak: I mean, there can be a DebConf prompt
[16:36] <rbasak> Configuring apt to add a source and then not use it also seems backwards
[16:37] <juliank> * debconf prompt
[16:38] <juliank> there's some privacy concern if you don't want your machine to report home
[16:38] <juliank> and I guess IS also is not happy about the server load of enabling this everywhere
[16:39] <rbasak> In principle I think it's OK to check for available ESM updates and then report that, and to start doing that in an SRU
[16:39] <juliank> sure
[16:39] <rbasak> It's just the reconfiguration of apt itself by default that I don't like.
[16:39] <rbasak> So there are options like fetching the Packages file without apt, or running a not-system apt to do it, etc.
[16:40] <rbasak> Or some non-apt method of checking for potential updates.
[16:40] <juliank> god no, please not
[16:40] <rbasak> Please discuss in the bug :)
[16:40] <juliank> we'll discuss in person I think
[16:41]  * juliank is generally happy with the approach but could add a debconf prompt "Do you want to enable checking for ubuntu pro updates? This requires APT to access esm.ubuntu.com"
[16:42] <rbasak> I don't want to give every Ubuntu user a debconf prompt. That's horrible UX.
[16:43] <juliank> well it's gotta happen by default. Sure you can place the sources.list file somewhere else and run a private apt and hide the output and stuff but I think that's worse, you gain nothing and users miss out on security patches