[01:42] <lotuspsychje> good morning
[01:43] <murmel> lotuspsychje: hey
[01:43] <lotuspsychje> heya murmel 
[01:49] <murmel> lotuspsychje: are you in a european tz?
[01:50] <lotuspsychje> yeah, belgium
[01:50] <murmel> wow, any reason why you wake up so early?
[01:50] <lotuspsychje> yeah, work :p
[01:53] <murmel> ugh
[01:53] <murmel> I mean I am _still_ awake, and I hate it :(
[01:53] <lotuspsychje> where are you murmel 
[01:53] <fluxcapacitor> Anyone here tried using Ubuntu server edition as a desktop? My hunch is that the server version is likely more stable as I assume there is less bloat on the initial install ...
[01:54] <lotuspsychje> fluxcapacitor: you could install minimal ubuntu flavour(s) if you like, xubuntu core for example
[01:55] <fluxcapacitor> I will pass on Xubuntu, Lubuntu and the likes, given the GUIs suck.
[01:55] <fluxcapacitor> They are less appealing from a visual perspective which in my mind defeats the purpose of running Ubuntu to begin with.
[01:55] <fluxcapacitor> However, the lighter footprint sure is sexy.
[01:55] <lotuspsychje> how about i3 + ubuntu server then? many swear by it
[01:56] <fluxcapacitor> Never heard of it. I will scurry on over to distrowatch and read up!
[01:56] <murmel> lotuspsychje: right now in budapest
[01:56] <fluxcapacitor> Not finding that ...
[01:57] <murmel> i3 is a tiling wm
[01:57] <fluxcapacitor> That is textspeak if I don't say, mate. Can you type in full phrases without using abbreviations like TTYS
[01:57] <murmel> are you talking about wm = window manager?
[01:58] <fluxcapacitor>  Oh, you are referring to that - but not the OS, actual Windows managers.
[01:58] <fluxcapacitor> I don't go out of my way to isolate flaws on a granular level. If the Windows manager didn't work, I would not follow the modular approach and simply replace it. I would replace the entire Desktop interface
[01:59] <fluxcapacitor> The UNIX way though is modularity ... that's the design philosophy so that makes sense but it's too much work for me to diagnose that.
[02:00] <lotuspsychje> fluxcapacitor: you can also install an ubuntu flavour, and just strip the bloat out yourself, remain a minimal syste of your needs
[02:01] <murmel> yeah, most just use server and build from there, as it's easier than stripping
[02:01] <lotuspsychje> ubuntu server is not really designed to be a GUI desktop right
[02:01] <sarnold> fluxcapacitor: ubuntu server and ubuntu desktop are installed from the same set of packages; it's just which packages come by default. no server admin would tolerate pulseaudio, networkmanager, etc; no laptop user would tolerate netplan :)
[02:01] <fluxcapacitor> I am about to do just that. Was and am in the process of installing my release. I will mount it to a VM then test it by replacing the Gnome variety before trying it out on my live system.
[02:01] <fluxcapacitor> *downloading my release. I am downloading Focal
[02:02] <fluxcapacitor> I will immediately replace Gnome vanilla with Gnome minimal and see if it bugs out the system but even that won't tell me as I have a lot of bloat on this bad boy.
[02:02] <sarnold> fluxcapacitor: it's not exactly *common* to install the server and then the desktop pieces you want, but people do it; my laptop started out as a 'debootstrap' install from ubuntu-minimal; I then installed x11, i3wm, my terminal, firefox, and whatever else I need as I find I need it
[02:02] <fluxcapacitor> I'm not installing the server version. I only asked that as a curiosity. I won't be doing it.
[02:03] <fluxcapacitor> I just wanted to know if that's something people do. I just assume there are SysAdmins who fall in love with their servers at work so just take them home.
[02:03] <fluxcapacitor> Then there are people literally running hardcore NAS set-ups at home with several attached storage blocks so I can see the use case for these things.
[02:04] <lotuspsychje> for example when you boot an i3 ontop server, your booting speed will be bloody faster then a -desktop
[02:05] <sarnold> heh yeah I've got one of these in my basement now https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/system/3U/6038/SSG-6038R-E1CR16L.cfm
[02:05] <lotuspsychje> skips a lot of GUI userspace
[02:05] <sarnold> it's getting sad though :( it tells me it needs a few friends
[02:05] <fluxcapacitor> I cannot find that on distrowatch, by the way. Are you referring to the intel processor model or is there a distro with the name i3 in it?
[02:05] <sarnold> fluxcapacitor: https://i3wm.org/
[02:05] <murmel> fluxcapacitor: I hope they _don't_ take the server with them to their home, otherwise work won't have any servers left ;)
[02:06] <fluxcapacitor> There are some hardcore people who are so anti-GUI they run everything headless and don't even use a Windows manager. Those are blokes and ladies which legends emenate from. I am no so hardcore and bare bones.
[02:07] <murmel> ugh, good that you almost offended me (I would definitely run cli only, if there would be a usable browser)
[02:07] <fluxcapacitor> Thanks, sarnold! I will try that on a VM.
[02:07] <fluxcapacitor> I will not betray Ubuntu and distro hop. At least not just yet but maybe I'll implement that.
[02:07] <murmel> but I am just less distracted in a cli environment than gui
[02:07] <sarnold> murmel: links and w3m are so close and yet so far :(
[02:07] <fluxcapacitor> I have been loyal to Ubuntu - with steady loyalty since circa 2016
[02:07] <lotuspsychje> checkout reddit/unixporn to feed your inspiration instead of distrowatch, you will then make up your mind what you wanna try
[02:07] <sarnold> oh yeah solid advice on r/unixporn
[02:08] <fluxcapacitor> I had this broken gaming tower with Windows 7 and I had this weird way of fixing it. I would just boot into Ubuntu on the dual boot and somehow that would repair the boot sector for Windows. Very weird shit. I wasn't as handy then and didn't find the ultimate cause of the bug I had ... but, anyway, that was my cheap hack for fixing it. I don't dual
[02:08] <fluxcapacitor> boot these days
[02:08] <fluxcapacitor> I recommend multiple drives, each dedicated to its own OS
[02:09] <murmel> nowadays not really needed anymore
[02:09] <lotuspsychje> i did a lot of older boxes with lubuntu 20.04 its rocksolid
[02:09] <fluxcapacitor> Dual booting isn't needed? I think for a noob who doesn't know how to install a hard drive, it makes sense. Though anyone can plug a drive into a SATA port or if they think they cannot, they have simply never tried
[02:10] <lotuspsychje> the gui, you can tweak that any way you need
[02:10] <murmel> fluxcapacitor: 2 disks is not needed
[02:10] <fluxcapacitor> you dual boot?
[02:10] <murmel> I setup systems for friends/fam
[02:10] <fluxcapacitor> I have Debian on one SATA SSD and Ubuntu, I think this one is on an NVME with a adapter in an expansion slot
[02:10] <fluxcapacitor> It's an M3 NVME
[02:11] <murmel> I hope it's a m.2 ;) not m3
[02:11] <murmel> I setup win+linux mint
[02:11] <murmel> for those people as it resembles more windows
[02:11] <fluxcapacitor> Ubuntu is on a PCI expansion slot with the heat sink over the NVME
[02:12] <fluxcapacitor> Ha...
[02:12] <fluxcapacitor> No, I mispoke. Ha, yes, I think it is an m.2
[02:12] <fluxcapacitor> You're right
[02:12] <murmel> the only thing I have to say is, there are quite a few uefi implementations which are not great
[02:13] <fluxcapacitor> NVMe M.2
[02:13] <fluxcapacitor> https://www.makeuseof.com/nvme-vs-sata-vs-m2-differences/
[02:13] <murmel> and it's definitely PCIe not PCI ;)
[02:13] <sarnold> I might still have a pci machine around here :)
[02:13] <fluxcapacitor> If you're being a curmudgeon and you are
[02:13] <sarnold> course I don't know if it still boots..
[02:14] <fluxcapacitor> Very much the curmudgeon. I am glad you did not teach my 6th grade Spanish class.
[02:15] <fluxcapacitor> You rock your gaming towers from scratch, murmel? This is the stuff: https://pcpartpicker.com/
[02:16] <fluxcapacitor> I don't build from the ground up but that's the place to start if you do. I buy old Dell Optiplexes and rebuild them
[02:16] <fluxcapacitor> *Semi-old. I have an Optiplex XE3 which is still in production, or it was last time I checked.
[02:16] <murmel> fluxcapacitor: if I would anywhere near trump, I would use that site, but as I don't no ;)
[02:17] <fluxcapacitor> I don't live in the states. I am on a DNS server in, I think, NY but I am in Australia
[02:17] <fluxcapacitor> Very bad topic by the way: he is horrifying
[02:18] <murmel> I mean here in europe we have something similar (depending on the country)
[02:19] <fluxcapacitor> Yes ... Well, I don't know how to scale that. Trump caused an insurrection.
[02:19] <fluxcapacitor> You have politicians who storm your capitals?
[02:19] <murmel> I was talking about pcpartpicker ...
[02:19] <murmel> nobody wants to talk about the US
[02:19] <fluxcapacitor> Someone says Trump: the verb or the president?
[02:20] <fluxcapacitor> You can trump as in defeat or best but then there is the American man
[02:21] <murmel> yeah I would definitely use a different word for "to trump". I mean I know somebody in the US who changed his first name (as it was donald)
[02:21] <fluxcapacitor> Yes, we don't have to talk about the U.S., mate.
[02:21] <fluxcapacitor> Is that really true, mate? murmel ... On the name change?
[02:21] <murmel> yes?
[02:21] <fluxcapacitor> I had a boss who went to Trump's school and always thought that must be embarrassing for him.
[02:22] <murmel> i mean that's something I would definitely try to sweep under the rug
[02:23] <fluxcapacitor> Yeah ... I inappropriately find solace in it: terrible boss
[02:25] <fluxcapacitor> My my. I'm on that site. There are apparently people with gaming towers worth more than the last car my wife owned when we sold it off, haha
[02:26] <murmel> yea but most of the time it's just a dream pc they want to own at some point
[02:27] <fluxcapacitor> I work with offensive security. The only thing I can justify something like that for is password cracking. The GPUs work really good with stuff like Hashcat and John the Ripper.
[02:27] <fluxcapacitor> I nearly fried a MacBook when I was a security student.
[02:27] <fluxcapacitor> The processor simply could not handle Hashcat
[03:02] <fluxcapacitor> Got quiet real quick.
[03:08] <fluxcapacitor> It cannot possibly be... One driver is a godsend for all of my bugs. I just installed synaptics and it seems to have done the trick.
[03:27] <wez_hn> yay
[03:28] <fluxcapacitor> Yes, I cannot believe it.
[03:29] <fluxcapacitor> I changed keyboards, installed random bloat ... Lots and lots of work and over one driver. I knew it was a driver as the performance changed slightly and imwheel first fixed it but I couldn't pin it down.
[03:29] <fluxcapacitor> Now I can go back to the wireless keyboard and not worry about the housecat getting into mischief with this one.
[03:31] <fluxcapacitor> Good thing I didn't reinstall over this. Everyone on Focal, seriously copy this and look over this conversation several times over if you experience scroll lag and seemingly i/o errors
[07:21] <ducasse> morning
[07:34] <fluxcapacitor> Just compiled Firefox ... that was fun, hehe
[11:22] <zoknert> ahi.