| lotuspsychje | good morning | 01:42 |
|---|---|---|
| wez | .o/ | 01:49 |
| wez | Afternoon lotuspsychje! How are you today? | 01:49 |
| lotuspsychje | all good tnx, coffee set go! | 01:50 |
| wez | \o/ | 01:51 |
| Square | Can Linux kernel version change for LTS releases? | 05:33 |
| Square | Like is there any chance we'll see linux 6.1 in 22.04 LTS? | 05:34 |
| daftykins | before release, sure they can change their mind - but usually there's a freeze date in the planning | 05:34 |
| daftykins | don't forget HWEs can enable newer kernels to be backported after LTS releases | 05:34 |
| Square | HWE? | 05:34 |
| daftykins | !hwe | 05:34 |
| ubottu | The Ubuntu LTS enablement stacks provide newer kernel and X support for existing LTS releases, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/LTSEnablementStack | 05:34 |
| murmel | Square: specifically 6.1 won't very likely hit 22.04, but with the next release (22.04.2) we get 5.19 and then with 22.04.3 we should get something >6.1 | 05:35 |
| Square | cool. Getting hyped about the Rust addition here. =D | 05:35 |
| murmel | oO, I mean you won't even "see" any difference | 05:35 |
| Square | I know little about the inner workings of linux. Just think its cool Rust is being accepted as the 2nd language. Imagine great thinks could happen when we get Rust API's. | 05:38 |
| murmel | Square: https://github.com/torvalds/linux it's not the second language. still can't really grasp how so many people can fanfare a language. I mean the language is quite neat, but nothing new | 05:39 |
| murmel | Square: ahh depending on your device, maybe using linux-oem _could_ also work. right now 6.0 is in testing phase | 05:42 |
| Square | murmel, I confess I can't assess the importance. | 05:43 |
| Square | I read this https://www.zdnet.com/article/rust-takes-a-major-step-forward-as-linuxs-second-official-language/ | 05:43 |
| Square | For me languages are important. I love Haskell, but understand why it can't be used as a systems language. C/C++/GO all bore me cause of their dated/limited featuresets. Rust got a bunch of features i totally like. | 05:45 |
| Square | murmel, ^ | 05:45 |
| murmel | Square: probably zdnet is not the best source for something like that, I quite like lwn, but it's paid (except you wait for a bit, till they go free) | 05:46 |
| murmel | Square: don't get me wrong, I understand why Rust gets its fanfare (at least on paper) but the internet is "raving" way too much (plus they need to rewrite everything in rust) | 05:47 |
| murmel | but at the same time I curse cargo :x | 05:48 |
| Square | oh, its bad? My Rust knowledge is limited. I just went through the 94 exercise "Rustlings" course. And that's probably all i know so far. =D | 05:49 |
| murmel | Square: try to compile a project, hf with the dependencies most projects have :(. the projects I use myself (but don't compile) have most of the time, quite the limited dependency list (most of the time somewhere around 20-30) | 05:50 |
| murmel | Square: there is a reason why people call it cargocult ;) | 05:51 |
| murmel | as those dependencies can also pull in their own dependencies | 05:51 |
| murmel | and some pull in a project, just because they want to use only a very small *function* | 05:52 |
| Square | murmel, "hf"?` | 05:54 |
| murmel | Square: have fun | 05:58 |
| Square | murmel, what happens when you do this? Slow? Memory greedy? Crash? | 05:59 |
| murmel | Square: it's not about that. just think about it from a security standpoint. you pull in stuff where you don't know where it's coming from (who develops it etc) and I can guarantee you the dev won't verify that the dev (of dependency) is trustworthy etc | 06:02 |
| murmel | Square: I can still remember somebody using a random docker container in production (business) where he had issues connecting to the server (ssh). just because noone vetted the container, where "by accident" a ssh server was running, so the dev of that software piece, could always connect to instances to see whats going on | 06:03 |
| murmel | just to make it clear, linux stays far away from cargo (the package manager for rust) | 06:07 |
| Square | ah gotcha. Yeah, that doesn't sound great I guess. | 06:10 |
| === JanC_ is now known as JanC | ||
| lotuspsychje | arraybolt3: bug #1993278 | 15:52 |
| -ubottu:#ubuntu-discuss- Bug 1993278 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "ZFS + Encryption crash after install" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1993278 | 15:52 | |
| arraybolt3[m] | lotuspsychje: Thanks! | 17:09 |
| lotuspsychje | arraybolt3[m]: seems like ravage zfs bug on jammy, keeps on living on kinetic | 17:09 |
| arraybolt3[m] | What's weird is it was working painlessly enough on Xubuntu Core earlier in the cycle, so Idk what happened. | 17:12 |
| lotuspsychje | arraybolt3[m]: bug #1970066 was the first one | 17:14 |
| -ubottu:#ubuntu-discuss- Bug 1970066 in snapd (Ubuntu Jammy) "(Encrypted) ZFS breaks 22.04 installation" [Critical, Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1970066 | 17:14 | |
| arraybolt3 | Good grief. That's a nightmare. | 17:14 |
| * arraybolt3 hopes they just remove ZFS installation support entirely | 17:15 | |
| sarnold | "It seems that the apt install triggers systemd to unmount every zfs mount because systemd mistakenly thinks the rpool key is not loaded" oowwwwwwwwwwww | 17:51 |
| * ogra pets his ext4 disks | 17:57 | |
| tomreyn | note when this (latter) bug report was filed, enhanced with well-reproducible steps, and what its current status, importance and assignment values are. | 18:03 |
| ogra | well, the snapd team is hiring i think ... | 18:07 |
| lotuspsychje | there are a few roles open still :p | 18:08 |
| ogra | should get beter soon ... | 18:08 |
| ogra | *better | 18:08 |
| lotuspsychje | whats gonna happen ogra | 18:08 |
| ogra | more developers to look at bugs ... | 18:09 |
| lotuspsychje | oh | 18:10 |
| sarnold | s/look at/write more/ | 18:12 |
| murmel | arraybolt3: I believe canonical wants to remove zfs-on-root, as they almost didn't include zsys for 22.04, and the newer installer doesn't have that option anymore | 21:13 |
| arraybolt3 | murmel: Yeah. It seems like a good idea to me at this point. | 21:25 |
| arraybolt3 | And people who really need ZFS-on-root can just set it up manually, right? | 21:25 |
| murmel | yeah, definitely. | 21:26 |
| murmel | arraybolt3: oh, btw, if I want to edit a wiki page, I assume the changes are instantanious? | 21:28 |
| murmel | so there is no approval before its being shown? | 21:28 |
| arraybolt3 | murmel: For all the pages I've edited, correct. | 21:28 |
| murmel | kk | 21:29 |
| JanC | ogra: I'd rather have them hire people to improve APT/dpkg; most features of snap/flatpak could have been implemented as part of that... | 22:50 |
| sarnold | we did that to get to click packages | 22:51 |
| sarnold | but those weren't perfect, and mixing "frequent update" things along side "rarely update" things wasn't great | 22:51 |
| JanC | we already get frequent APT updates, so I don't really see the difference :) | 22:52 |
| sarnold | yeah, but they don't do huge version lifts as a matter of course | 22:53 |
| JanC | but APT can do that | 22:54 |
| JanC | it's matter of namespacing & such | 22:54 |
| JanC | and snapd is very far from perfect too :P | 23:05 |
| sarnold | amen | 23:07 |
| murmel | JanC: yeah, I still hope, we get a package manager to manage all (deb,flatpak,snap,maybe appimage). best case imho, implement it in apt | 23:18 |
| JanC | what I mean is implement the features in APT/dpkg/.deb, not add support for a zillion types of packages that are only different because people don't understand the existing package managers :) | 23:20 |
| murmel | JanC: i did not dive too deep, but not sure how well that would work for all those container systems | 23:21 |
| JanC | well, you don't need a different container systems for every developer who thinks they invented warm water ;) | 23:22 |
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