 "Simon Quigley: Or where do I put..." <- In the bug description :)
[00:14] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: Thanks, description updated.
[00:17] <tsimonq2> Thank you!
[00:20] <arraybolt3[m]> Also how did I do on the "where this could go wrong" section? Was that sufficient? I know I wasn't so good a that in the past.
[00:20] <arraybolt3[m]> s/this/problems/, s/go wrong/occur/
[00:21] <arraybolt3> (Wow. Just wow. Thanks Matrix for making that complicated of a correction line in IRC.)
 "Also how did I do on the "..." <- That has always been my weak point 
[01:55] <guiverc> tsimonq2, what level of verification do you want for 1992507?  blank & use checklist completely? mostly? or just a few & do you have a timeline you'd like (ideally anyway).  Do you want us to use jammy.1 released ISO or current [jammy.2] daily (with -proposed calamares+ added of course!)
[01:56]  * guiverc realizes within 7 days obviously
[01:57] <tsimonq2> guiverc: A lot of great questions here, thanks. I'll start with the easy one, you should use the latest Jammy daily image, meaning, the one that will become .2
[01:59] <tsimonq2> As for the more nuanced part of this, you're essentially testing what will become 22.04.2. We aren't planning any additional changes on our end unless Calamares releases another 3.2 LTS series update, unless I'm mistaken.
[02:00] <tsimonq2> I would clear the checklist simply because it is a Calamares update, but condense it with 22.04.2 testing in whatever way makes the most sense.
[02:00] <guiverc> I'll blank checklist (today) & we'll start to fill anyway.   Using the daily is what I wanted to know anyway (ie. what to write on testing.checklist for completion)
[02:00] <guiverc> thanks...
[02:00] <tsimonq2> No worries :)
 "Also how did I do on the "..." <- I forgot to actually answer your question, oops!
[02:01] <tsimonq2> Give me a second
[02:03] <tsimonq2> (I'd try to be consistent with the correct usage of it's vs its, anyway :P)
[02:03]  * arraybolt3[m] hates typos
[02:04] <arraybolt3[m]> Wait I don't think I typoed that.
 honestly with having the manual on the desktop I was slightly expecting someone new to click on it and point out a typo or something wrong I had done
[02:04] <arraybolt3[m]> I meant "its" when I used "its", and "it is" when I used "it's".
[02:04] <tsimonq2> I know it's proprietary, fair disclaimer (give me a good FOSS alternative, I dare you), but Grammarly is great. I'd recommend it for all of you heh :)
[02:04] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: Are you sure I made a typo or grammar mistake there?
[02:04] <arraybolt3[m]> "However, since the program can't even launch in its current state, things can't get a whole lot worse, so I'd say it's worth the risk, especially since all of the changes appear to be bugfixes."
[02:05] <tsimonq2> That's the correct usage 
[02:05] <arraybolt3[m]> Yeah, that's what I put, right?
[02:05] <arraybolt3[m]> Or did you edit it?
[02:05] <tsimonq2> "It's main purpose is writing novels"
[02:05] <arraybolt3[m]> 🤦 I thought we meant in the [Where problems could occur] section, thus my confusion
[02:06] <arraybolt3[m]> OK, fixed.
[02:06] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: Grammarly is a keylogger, sorry, I won't use it. I know it may be a keylogger from a reputable source, but there's some data I just don't like giving to anyone. Personal files is one. Keystrokes is another.
[02:06] <tsimonq2> Last paragraph is too anecdotal imo
[02:07] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: Meh, fair. Standalone app is different than the extension
[02:07] <tsimonq2> tsimonq2: And the first one needs to focus more on what actually might go wrong, "the usual" is usually not good enough for the SRU team
[02:08] <arraybolt3[m]> I'm not quite sure what anecdotal means in this context. And I did try to put more details right after "the usual", so I was making clear that this was a possible outcome but not the full set of possible outcomes, which would be too broad to list here.
[02:11] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: "I can see" and "I'd be surprised" - that's sort of what I mean 
[02:11] <tsimonq2> I say just move that into the third person and you'll be good :P
[02:12] <arraybolt3[m]> OK, I like it. I can also make "upgrade failures" more specific (do I mean "the upgrade doesn't happen" or "i tried to do-release-upgrade and it broke"?)
[02:12] <tsimonq2> Please do :)
[02:13] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: OK, how's that? I edited it.
[02:14] <arraybolt3[m]> I didn't fix the first paragraph because I'm not sure how to make it better.
[02:15] <arraybolt3[m]> I mean now that I think about it, I can fix that too...
[02:15] <arraybolt3[m]> (man that took me a while)
[02:16] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: Reload the page again, I just did yet another update. Sorry for being kind of slow on the draw tonight...
[02:18] <tsimonq2> No worries, re-reviewing :)
[02:20] <tsimonq2> "appear to be" confidence level - are they, or are they not all bugfixes and minor improvements? :P
[02:21] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: Appear to be - because I didn't dig into the code of every single commit and info about merge requests, I just looked at the changelog and checked anything that didn't look like a bug fix. So if they didn't log something, I'll have missed it.
[02:21] <arraybolt3[m]> Or if they mislogged something, or whatever.
[02:27] <tsimonq2> Fair enough 
[02:27] <tsimonq2> I think I've sufficiently roasted you on this one :)
[02:27] <arraybolt3[m]> And improved the bug, and hopefully future ones too :)
[02:29] <tsimonq2> Did you maybe want to dig into that script for migrating things over? 
[02:29] <arraybolt3[m]> Definitely. Working on learning the basics of Python.
[02:35] <tsimonq2> Let me know how it goes :)
[02:39] <guiverc> If anyone knows, is there an easy way to comment out on phab.wiki  (# don't work, and I'd rather not delete then restore as I've done in past)
[02:43] <guiverc> tsimonq2, https://phab.lubuntu.me/w/release-team/testing-checklist/?v=1046 contains what I've listed; key bit is list of options after "Please use" near top... (ignore the lines with # and visible around /* .. */ or attempts to have sections not display instead of delete..)..   if you want to check/look over;   I'll check/correct details once my zsync.jammy has completed & update ISO details 
[02:45]  * guiverc adds package versions calamares/lubuntu-default/casper etc should be correct; my check_jammy script gave me those; I'll check on actual manifest once I have it
[02:46] <tsimonq2> LGTM from an initial lookover. Try PHP-style // comments or HTML-style <!-- --> comments?
[02:48] <guiverc> thanks
[02:48] <arraybolt3[m]> OK, I just remembered there's some more stuff I need to do (order a pair of Yubikeys, get some food, and refresh my Internet subscription), so my Python attack will be a bit delayed, brb.
[03:00] <guiverc> tsimonq2, the jammy daily appears old; ie. https://cdimage.ubuntu.com/lubuntu/jammy/daily-live/current/ is sept-19 ?   I see Ubuntu Desktop as recent, alas not ours.  (am I missing something?)
 "OK, I just remembered there's..." <- No worries
 "Simon Quigley, the jammy daily..." <- I don't think you're wrong. Let me follow up
[03:30] <tsimonq2> guiverc: VERY NICE catch - we have recent focal dailies but not jammy - the red here should explain why :P https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-cdimage/ubuntu-cdimage/mainline/view/head:/etc/crontab#L46
[03:34] <guiverc> nah sorry I don't see the explanation (I wasn't after proposed packages on ISO, my changes assumed they weren't there), but I could write using the sept-19 ISO (that's later than 22.04.1 which I believe was august from memory)
[14:30] <tsimonq2> Good morning everyone.
[14:31] <tsimonq2> I'm going to manually respin Jammy today, since Brian just turned those back on. The Jammy dailies were turned off, thanks to Chris for catching it.
[14:32] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: If you have any questions re: infra scripting, please do let me know, I'll be at a computer until approx 6 PM Central today
 Good afternoon :p (re @lubuntu_bot: (irc) <tsimonq2> Good morning everyone.)
[14:33] <tsimonq2> :P :D
[14:34] <tsimonq2> @Roberalz: While you're here, something I'd appreciate some thought on going into this cycle would be, how can we make translations in Lubuntu better?
[14:34] <tsimonq2> Waaaaaay back in 18.xx era, we had a Weblate instance. As far as I remember, that was unable to accomplish the task at hand for us.
[14:35] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: Still haven't tackled scripting, finished Manuskript yesterday then had a bunch of other stuff happen and ended up falling asleep. Thankfully today the script is my main goal so that should be fun. I too will be at a computer, pretty much most of the day, if all goes according to plan.
[14:35] <tsimonq2> If you can find translation software that supports Sphinx (what the Lubuntu Manual uses) and our individual .desktop entries, specifically the sub-directories, I'd be very interested to hear your thoughts.
[14:35] <tsimonq2> (Of course, we'll circle back in probably <= 1 month, in case you haven't found anything/had the time.)
[14:36] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: No worries, just keep me in the loop. :)
[14:36]  * tsimonq2 passes arraybolt3 ☕️
[14:36]  * arraybolt3[m] guzzles
[14:36] <arraybolt3[m]> (Actually that's not a bad idea, I may do that at some point <coffee I mean>)
 I have some .desktop in my github pending to put each one in its place, (re @lubuntu_bot: (irc) <tsimonq2> @Roberalz: While you're here, something I'd appreciate some thought on going into this cycle would be, how can we make translations in Lubuntu better?)
[14:38] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: Silly question, but is installing PyCharm Community maybe a good idea for this and future dev work, or do you just throw a text editor at it?
[14:38] <tsimonq2> Very nice!
[14:38] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: I use KDevelop for complex development projects, Vim for simple ones, if that helps.
[14:38] <tsimonq2> (Everyone else at Altispeed is a big proponent of VSCodium, so I'll also throw that out there for your serious consideration.)
 I'm going to look at that sphinx thing... Thanks (re @lubuntu_bot: (irc) <tsimonq2> If you can find translation software that supports Sphinx (what the Lubuntu Manual uses) and our individual .desktop entries, specifically the sub-directories, I'd be very interested to hear your thoughts.)
[14:39]  * arraybolt3[m] forgot I had VSCode already installed
[14:39] <tsimonq2> lubot: Thanks, no *huge* rush, let me know what you find :)
[14:40] <tsimonq2> > * <@arraybolt3:matrix.org> forgot I had VSCode already installed
[14:40] <tsimonq2> At the end of the day, whatever floats your boat. As long as it quacks like a text editor, it should be okay. :P
[14:41] <tsimonq2> In the meantime, I'm going to submit a semi-formal response to the Calamares bug, just saying "heya, we see you, we're working on it, thanks for your patience" :)
[14:41] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: Alright, sed it is. 🤪
[14:44] <tsimonq2> Eickmeyer: Could you please give more insight on bug 1795278 and why Lubuntu 22.04 dailies would be affected by it?
[14:44] -ubot93:#lubuntu-devel- Bug 1795278 in software-properties (Ubuntu Kinetic) "software-properties-{qt,kde} attempts to use KUrl but it doesn't exist" [Undecided, Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1795278
[14:45] <Eickmeyer[m]> Simon Quigley: I've got nothing on that bug.
[14:45] <tsimonq2> guiverc: How far did you get with upstreaming our test suite and is there a conclusion you reached following the discussion?
[14:46] <tsimonq2> Eickmeyer[m]: Just going off of your response on Sept 27th of this year: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-properties/+bug/1795278/comments/14
[14:46] -ubot93:#lubuntu-devel- Launchpad bug 1795278 in software-properties (Ubuntu Kinetic) "software-properties-{qt,kde} attempts to use KUrl but it doesn't exist" [Undecided, Triaged]
[14:46] <tsimonq2> No worries, just wondering if I also should be helping solve this bug.
[14:47] <Eickmeyer[m]> I just did a little triage because, once again, it's a neglect because "KdE/qT TheReFore NoT FixInG!!!!1!!"
[14:48] <Eickmeyer[m]> Still getting to the bottom of that dysfunction, btw.
[14:50] <tsimonq2> Got it. What's the user story on this? As in, is this a pretty noticeable bug?
[14:51] <tsimonq2> Eickmeyer: I can't tell if o7 is scratching your head or facepalming, either way, did I explain that correctly in -flavors? 😆
[14:52] <Eickmeyer[m]> You did, I saw the conversation in -release. o7 is a salute.
[14:52] <tsimonq2> OH! Cool, thanks 😃
[14:52] <Eickmeyer[m]> 🫡
[15:02] <tsimonq2> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/calamares/+bug/1992507/comments/5 cc Eickmeyer 
[15:02] -ubot93:#lubuntu-devel- Launchpad bug 1992507 in calamares (Ubuntu) "[SRU] Calamares 3.2.61" [Medium, In Progress]
[15:02] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: I use o\ for salute, /o\ for panic, and :facepalm: for facepalm.
[15:04] <tsimonq2> I really enjoy the ability to quick-insert emojis in Matrix... makes 🤦‍♂️👋😕 pretty easy :P
[15:05] <arraybolt3[m]> 🤦‍♂️🔥💥😱🏃👋
[15:05] <tsimonq2> 🤣
[15:06]  * arraybolt3[m] goes back to Python code
[15:06] <arraybolt3[m]> Actually nvm, system update, /me needs to reboot
[15:08]  * tsimonq2 "off" to $dayjob - I can help in between :)
[15:28] <tsimonq2> Oh hey, there was one more thing before I go go, and it's the Lubuntu Manual/two questions I have, sec...
[15:32] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: OK I found a Python pip module for interacting with Phab, it is *supposedly* made by Disqus (the same guys who make the comment thingy on 9to5linux I believe), trouble is that I can't verify that the GitHub repository owner really is the company it claims to be, and I've heard enough horror stories of supply chain attacks via repositories like this.
[15:33] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: That's the one I've used in the past; if you want me to do a preliminary security review, I can as well. Just pass me the repo :)
[15:33] <arraybolt3[m]> Heh, that sounds like a long process though. If I can call the shell from Python, I may as well just construct a cURL line for any calls I want to make and then call those as needed. A tiny bit of wrapping with a function and it should even be easy.
 "Oh hey, there was one more thing..." <- 1. Do we *really* not have a GUI for bluetooth connections, in 2022?!? Searching the manual gives me https://manual.lubuntu.me/stable/2/2.1/2.1.4/bluedevil.html
[15:36] <tsimonq2> 2. When a bluetooth device is connected, in my panel I'm still only able to change the volume of my computer speaker (which is muted!) unless I manually change the source every time.
[15:36] <tsimonq2> We should be better about a simple GUI for this. Does bluedevil already have a full-fledged management interface that I'm missing, or just one program to add and one program to send files?
[15:36] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: Python has an http library which can be used as a drop-in replacement for curl calls iirc
[15:37] <kc2bez[m]> > <@tsimonq2:linuxdelta.com> 1. Do we *really* not have a GUI for bluetooth connections, in 2022?!? Searching the manual gives me https://manual.lubuntu.me/stable/2/2.1/2.1.4/bluedevil.html... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/59aaafbc26302ccca744cf7f4ce264f4aa5533db>)
[15:37] <arraybolt3[m]> > <@tsimonq2:linuxdelta.com> 1. Do we *really* not have a GUI for bluetooth connections, in 2022?!? Searching the manual gives me https://manual.lubuntu.me/stable/2/2.1/2.1.4/bluedevil.html... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/c3dc14ec92e008f6dcc23c45ecc5b9853610e30f>)
[15:37] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: Nice.
[15:38] <tsimonq2> The most precise question would likely be: what component do we need to file a feature request against?
[15:38] <tsimonq2> I would imagine lxqt-config
[15:39] <kc2bez[m]> The answer from a LXQt standpoint has been ConMan I think.
[15:39] <tsimonq2> ...which we don't support in favor of n-m as a platform requirement for being an Ubuntu flavor :/
[15:40] <kc2bez[m]> Yeah, and I don't know of a stand alone Qt GUI to handle just Bluetooth. Blueman exists but GTK.
[15:41] <tsimonq2> Oh, blueman is GTK. Nice.
[15:41] <arraybolt3[m]> Sounds like we have another app to develop.
[15:41] <arraybolt3[m]> (hey btw we may want to change the channel topic now that KK is released)
[15:41] <tsimonq2> BRING OUT THE LIST!
[15:41]  * tsimonq2 hears thunderous footsteps in the distance
[15:42] <kc2bez[m]> arraybolt3[m]: We need an Op for that.
[15:42] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: I don't remember if I have powers
[15:42] <kc2bez[m]> teward may
[15:42]  * kc2bez[m] slides teward a coffee as a reward in advance.
[15:43] <teward> *screeches in aramaic*
[15:43] <tsimonq2> WE HAVE SUMMONED HIM
[15:43] <teward> *smites tsimonq2*
[15:43] <kc2bez[m]> A little bribery goes a little ways.
[15:44] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: No, Greek. We don't speak Aramaic here.
[15:44] <teward> kc2bez: i don't have access, Unit193 and IRCC have access
[15:44] <teward> we never gave them the list of ops for -devel
[15:44] <teward> i'll stab IRCC
[15:44] <kc2bez[m]> Thanks!
[15:45] <arraybolt3[m]> Remember Unit193 is now Montresor (or something similar to that).
[15:46] <tsimonq2> Oh?
[15:47] <arraybolt3[m]> I watched him nick-switch for Halloween while helping test Xubuntu Core.
[16:04] <tsimonq2> It occurred to me that I have yet to respond to someone on Reddit re: the custom command option in LXQt
[16:05] <tsimonq2> https://www.reddit.com/r/Lubuntu/comments/y9kbc3/lxqt_panels_custom_command_widget_missing/
[16:05] <tsimonq2> If someone is willing to give them a better answer than I was able to on mobile, go for it, I'll sign off on your answer :)
[16:05] <tsimonq2> Otherwise, that's a $later thing
[16:07]  * arraybolt3[m] has to help my dog get some outside time... in the middle of a thunderstorm... wish me luck
[16:07] <kc2bez[m]> I think you were on the right track, it is a 1.1.0 thing. I wonder if their panel didn't update?
[16:07] <tsimonq2> > * <@arraybolt3:matrix.org> has to help my dog get some outside time... in the middle of a thunderstorm... wish me luck
[16:07] <tsimonq2> Have fun, stay dry :)
[16:07] <arraybolt3[m]> (oh, another item for the list, mixed-mode EFI support? 32-bit EFI on 64-bit system, might be really nice)
[16:08] <arraybolt3[m]> (we really had better start compiling a list)
[16:08] <tsimonq2> kc2bez[m]: My gut reaction to that not working on their end is that we may have a bug on our hands. A good test for this would be installing the Jammy daily, upgrading to Backports, and seeing if maybe it's config-related.
[16:08] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: ikr
[16:09] <arraybolt3[m]> (also I can test it if we try to add support for mixed-mode efi, I have a way of making a VM with a 64-bit CPU and a 32-bit EFI system)
[16:09] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: As someone not intimately familiar with EFI user stories, how is this beneficial?
[16:09] <tsimonq2> (I remember something along these lines, just need a refresher.)
[16:10] <arraybolt3[m]> Old Windows 8 systems sometimes have a 64-bit CPU but only a 32-bit EFI firmware. Said systems should be able to work with Lubuntu due to the 64-bit CPU, but since only the 64-bit bootloader is shipped, the 32-bit EFI gets in the way. Fedora supports this, Debian supports this, Lubuntu tries to support this but since the ISO doesn't have the bootloader, it doesn't boot.
[16:10] <kc2bez[m]> tsimonq2: I have it on my 22.04 work machine with backports. It is far from a fresh install though. 
[16:11] <tsimonq2> Also, https://www.reddit.com/r/Lubuntu/comments/y99n69/comment/it6m02h/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3 reminded me of the possibility of shipping Kvantum. We had a discussion on this at some point, I'll admit I don't remember the conclusion.
[16:11] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: OH, yeah I remember that, do you have such a system to test on?
[16:11] <tsimonq2> I THINK that's what some of the initial manual hacks in Cala were
[16:11] <arraybolt3[m]> Not physical, but there's a QEMU hack that lets me test it.
[16:12] <tsimonq2> kc2bez[m]: Right, I guess from the perspective of "we support a clean install of Jammy upgrading to a now-less-clean install of Kinetic"
[16:12] <arraybolt3[m]> You just make a 64-bit VM and hand it a 32-bit EFI firmware binary, and if you shake it just right it works. Only works with one CPU core, for some reason multicore confuses it, but single-core seems to work right.
[16:12] <tsimonq2> Makes me curious why it's working on your end and not this user's end.
[16:13] <kc2bez[m]> tsimonq2: I don't know. I can try digging with a comment or two later. 
[16:13] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: What's your confidence level 1-10 on how well it emulates that case? Are you able to reproduce a failure only present on such an environment?
[16:14] <tsimonq2> kc2bez[m]: No worries, just wanted to make sure this was on our radar. Thanks :)
[16:15] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: I'd say confidence level 8. I can reproduce failures only present on such an environment using this setup, but of course it's a VM so it might not be perfect. I still haven't bought my Yubikeys, due to a mixup with the licensing since I actually bother to read that stuff, maybe I'll order some cheapo system off eBay that will match the testcase while I'm at it.
[16:15]  * tsimonq2 uploaded an image: (37KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/linuxdelta.com/GorNdSfAkwdYBkBorakjvNDw/image.png >
[16:15] <tsimonq2> Looks like this will end up on our PipeWire switch TODO list
[16:15] <tsimonq2> Also, the fact that our mixer is named pavucontrol-qt :P
[16:16] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: (This *would* be a good use of Lubuntu money...)
[16:16] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: I have plenty of my own money here, but if you say so.
[16:17] <tsimonq2> I think, as long as you're specifically able to reproduce a 32-bit EFI with a 64-bit system, and you can confirm as such, we're golden to use QEMU for initial testing and Real Hardware once the fix is formulated to test before uploading
[16:17] <arraybolt3[m]> One of our Discourse regulars has such a system, lemme see which one he's got...
[16:17] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: Sounds like a plan. Debian Multiarch will make testing that a breeze.
[16:17] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: Hey Discourse looks broken again.
[16:18] <arraybolt3[m]> arraybolt3[m]: A bunch of user avatars aren't popping up right on the main page.
[16:18] <tsimonq2> So, we need a list for all of this... Phab is deprecated so we also need our (relevant yet ancient) TODO list items off of there
[16:18] <arraybolt3[m]> I have a pretty good list on my end.
[16:19] <tsimonq2> I say notes.lubuntu.me, but I also kind of wanted to organize infrastructure prior to this
[16:19]  * arraybolt3[m] sent a code block: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/1a7be9e70d4a9e063bfa2f79864f3ad50cd02e8d
[16:19] <tsimonq2> (Thus the script ;) )
[16:19] <arraybolt3[m]> Yeah, that's my main priority.
[16:19] <tsimonq2> > <@arraybolt3:matrix.org> ```... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/6ff1d69d4632a5e4a176d2e045e9e1d1d1a61b42>)
[16:20] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: Sweet. I'll be AFK in the next few minutes; I have lunch with my dad
[16:20] <tsimonq2> (He enjoys talking very much, so I'll be gone for a few hours.)
[16:20] <tsimonq2> Let me know how I can help, I'll respond to pings in a bit :)
[16:21] <kc2bez[m]> Lunch seems like a good plan.
[16:24] <arraybolt3[m]> Whew, that took forever. Here's the thing about the mixed-mode EFI: https://discourse.lubuntu.me/t/vintage-laptop-asus-x205ta-supported/3424
[16:25] <arraybolt3[m]> OK, I really do have to go now. C ya!
[16:31] <arraybolt3[m]> ok well that didn't take long thankfully.
[16:35] <arraybolt3[m]> And also this is the very laptop that was mentioned in the post (or at least a very similar one): https://www.ebay.com/itm/Asus-X205T-Intel-Atom-Z3735F-1-33GHz-2GB-Electronic-Laptop-Portable-/384992398080?_trksid=p2349526.m4383.l4275.c4#viTabs_0
[16:35] <arraybolt3[m]> Alright, back to Python.
[16:36] <arraybolt3[m]> (linked wrong laptop, hold on)
[16:36] <arraybolt3[m]> https://www.ebay.com/itm/ASUS-X205TA-11-6in-32GB-Intel-Atom-1-9GHz-2GB-Notebook-Laptop-Blue-X20-/334437930069?_trksid=p2349526.m4383.l4275.c4#viTabs_0 (alright that's the laptop mentioned in the Discourse post I believe)
[16:57] <arraybolt3[m]> OK well that's new. You can make severe bugs in your code with an indentation error in Python. That's going to be interesting to work around.
 Will begin testing the latest Jammy daily ISO later this evening @tsimonq2
[17:54] <arraybolt3[m]> Found an awesome tutorial on using Python Requests, so I think I'm getting pretty close! This language was a lot easier to learn than I expected.
[18:06] <teward> arraybolt3[m]: probably my infra, i had a network outage so i'm poking.  i'll look when i get time, I don't have any at the moment
[18:06] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: No problem, thanks!
[18:09] <arraybolt3[m]> Holy smoke I got Gitea to give me a list of all repo names. OK that was fun.
[18:13] <teward> arraybolt3[m]: welcome to Gitea!  :P
[18:14] <teward> and APIs and niceness
[18:14] <teward> (i can get you a list of ALL repos on Phab as an admin)
[18:14] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: If that's helpful for migration purposes, sure!
[18:15] <arraybolt3[m]> For having never written Python before in my life, I have to say it is very easy to pick up and feels familiar. Kind of like someone took all the best features from C# and Bash and glommed them together.
[18:15] <arraybolt3[m]> Yet it still feels like it's whole own language - I don't look at it and think "Someone jammed Java and Pascal together and then sprinkled on a hearty helping of parenthesis" or something :P
[18:17] <arraybolt3[m]> (OK I did initially look at it like "C# and Bash had a baby and then all the curly braces got dropped", but after a bit it started to feel right.)
[18:17] <kc2bez[m]> It is better than Perl which is the most interesting use of special characters.
[18:17] <arraybolt3[m]> Worse even than ${#a[@]}?
[18:18] <arraybolt3[m]> I mean Perl's worse than the above Bash monstrosity for getting the length of an array?
[18:18] <arraybolt3[m]> (I still remember hitting that part of Bash and thinking "No. Just no.")
[18:36] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: Behold, the script:
[18:36]  * arraybolt3[m] sent a code block: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/527b7fa18dc1a84702341e49e5eca231adea2fcc
[18:36] <arraybolt3[m]> Yes, I hardcoded most everything except for the Phabricator API token. 🙃
[18:37] <arraybolt3[m]> This is what it spits out for me:
[18:37]  * arraybolt3[m] sent a code block: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/f2a0a21fbde5648e6c1fac3e60f83a1b2bbacefd
[18:38] <arraybolt3[m]>  * ```... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/b44c745544cf27e1b873870e3e3024aff1791258>)
[18:38] <arraybolt3[m]> So, there you go. My first functional Python script. That was a lot of fun.
[18:39] <arraybolt3[m]> So I guess now the question is how many of these are actually missing and how many are just named differently.
[18:39] <kc2bez[m]> Hmmm, I think Gitea has some of those 
[18:40] <arraybolt3[m]> A bunch appear to just be named differently "lxqt-globalkeys" vs "lsqt-globalkeys-packaging".
[18:41] <kc2bez[m]> Some are missing and shouldn't probably be carried over too.
[18:43] <kc2bez[m]> I also didn't add the ones that originate in Launchpad 
[18:53] <arraybolt3[m]> (Wow ok my initial script has some optimizations I can make, also I'm going to try to clean up dups.)
[18:58] <arraybolt3[m]> Script v2:
[18:58] <arraybolt3[m]> ```
[18:58] <arraybolt3[m]> Yep, empty script. Attempt 2:
[18:58]  * arraybolt3[m] sent a code block: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/beb5029c1a7db501c34e4eb314dcb6713c5676f7
[18:58] <arraybolt3[m]> * empty script. (I hate hitting Enter too early.) Attempt 2:
[18:59] <arraybolt3[m]> And the new output:
[18:59]  * arraybolt3[m] sent a code block: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/8ae6768c6279d941923d2a7911e8a89327e92823
[19:00] <arraybolt3[m]> Hmm that seems to have missed qps-packaging...
[19:04] <arraybolt3[m]> Oh because I'm only getting the first page of info from Gitea.
[19:18] <arraybolt3[m]> Alright, hopefully last iteration.
[19:18]  * arraybolt3[m] sent a code block: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/77ef634fa809b5252a0162ea48e44addcdd9a53c
[19:19] <arraybolt3[m]> And the output:
[19:19]  * arraybolt3[m] sent a code block: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/7463bea35c4d23c2ab67205651f819fa465c4f84
[19:19] <arraybolt3[m]> That looks much more accurate to me.
[19:19] <kc2bez[m]> Yeah, seems pretty close
[19:19] <arraybolt3[m]> Not sure if I was actually helpful or if this was just an interesting Python coding exercise, I hope I actually helped some.
[19:24]  * arraybolt3[m] is hungry and brainfried after that, going to get some more food and take a short break
[19:25] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: ^ final script (hopefully) is here
 "Not sure if I was actually..." <- Hopefully both. It sure won't hurt to have information.
 "Simon Quigley: ^ final script (..." <- OK at least final info gathering script at least, if we want to automate the migration then it will need a lot of work
[20:00] <teward> hggdh: if you can add myself, kc2bez, and tsimonq2 to ops in here that'd be great, if possible.  (I got busy with stuff)
[20:20] <tsimonq2> Oh wow, seems like I'm coming back to quite a backlog :)
 "https://www.ebay.com/itm/ASUS-X2..." <- Definitely not bad.
 "OK well that's new. You can make..." <- It's the only language I can easily think of that is this way
[20:34] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: There is a cheaper one of these on eBay, but it's only an ASUS-x205t, not an x205t*a*, so it might not end up being the same system, and the only reason we want the system at all is for testing one particular aspect of it, so getting a similar-but-not-the-same system might not work.
 "So I guess now the question is..." <- The original scheme I came up with is, if it's *our* original source, e.g. artwork, default settings, etc. - doesn't get the -packaging suffix. All packaging gets that suffix
[20:35]  * arraybolt3[m] wonders if there's any difference, I should check.
 "(Wow ok my initial script has..." <- PEP-8
[20:36] <kc2bez[m]> `pylint` or something along those lines can give you a double check.
[20:38] <teward> tsimonq2: link to the pages you're seeing discourse issues on?
[20:38] <teward> things *look* OK to me here
[20:39] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: Wrong person pinged, also the issues I saw were right on the home page.
[20:39] <teward> err: tired
[20:39] <arraybolt3[m]> np
[20:39] <teward> arraybolt3[m]: looks OK here, open the page with the console open and show me what console errors you see
[20:39] <teward> also nuke your browser cache
[20:40] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: Mine is usually "err:dont_know_what_im_doing"
[20:40] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: Eh, seems to have resolved itself, or maybe my connection was bad, so I guess nevermind on that front.
[20:40] <teward> cool cool
[20:40] <teward> well discourse is getting its updates now so 
[20:40] <teward> UPDATE TIME!
[20:41] <arraybolt3[m]> *dum dum dum, drumroll *
[20:41] <arraybolt3[m]> (failed Matrix formatting)
[20:41] <arraybolt3[m]> s//**/, s/ */***/
[20:41] <arraybolt3[m]> (fixed Matrix formatting)
[20:43] <tsimonq2> > <@arraybolt3:matrix.org> ```... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/5507a77dde0a043cdf71802c5a0804abdbd58334>)
[20:44] <tsimonq2>  * 1. Python tends to be more intuitive than other languages. Here's an example of code you may consider simplifying:... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/63d6fcd065806daad0920661f989268a4c84d9f6>)
[20:44] <tsimonq2>  * 1. Python tends to be more intuitive than other languages. Here's an example of code you may consider simplifying:... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/57229883b553f0fbcc27704c327bd300084357f9>)
[20:44] <teward> wow that lagged hardcore
[20:44] <tsimonq2> That's about all the feedback I have on the script itself
[20:44] <tsimonq2> sorry IRC users :/
[20:44] <tsimonq2> I also made two edits, very last link for IRC users
[20:45] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: wrt the number 10, right, sorry, magic constant. Trims the substring "-packaging" off the end of a string.
[20:45] <arraybolt3[m]> (comments ftw!)
 "Not sure if I was actually..." <- The output is extremely helpful, I just won't tell anyone to do it all manually ;)
[20:45] <teward[m]> *sends Simon to the abyss*
[20:46] <teward[m]> the Simon shall be dispelled into the Abyssal Realm
[20:46] <tsimonq2> oh noesssssssssssss
[20:46]  * tsimonq2 breaks msttcorefonts on the way out
[20:46]  * arraybolt3[m] throws all my fonts out the window, all u need is Monospace
[20:47]  * Eickmeyer[m] points finger and laughs
[20:47] <teward> *points at Eickmeyer, yells something in aramaic, and Eickmeyer flies up into the air*
[20:47] <tsimonq2> who's laughing now :P
[20:48]  * arraybolt3[m] shouts at teward in Hebrew and he disappears into a poof of silicon shreds
[20:48]  * teward was never corporeal to begin with so now his voice booms across the cosmos
[20:48] <Eickmeyer[m]> Joke's on teward , I'm a licensed pilot and can maneuver in this.
[20:48] <arraybolt3[m]> No problem, throws cosmos into trash can
[20:48] <teward[m]> fun fact the trash can is /dev/null and shall consume all
[20:48] <teward[m]> anyways
[20:49] <Roberalz[m]> XD
[20:50] <tsimonq2> This is minor, but has anyone else noticed XDG desktop portal from Firefox not working??
[20:51] <arraybolt3[m]> Not here, though I've not tested it all that heavily.
[20:51] <Eickmeyer[m]> tsimonq2: I saw a recent bug report or discourse post.
[20:51] <tsimonq2> Eickmeyer[m]: If you happen to come across it again, just let me know :)
[20:52] <arraybolt3[m]> (also about Python being more intuitive, that's good to know, however I'm very used to how C-style languages work and tend to do things with tons of parentheses and method-call-like operations, so I may take a while to break out of that habit.)
[20:52] <arraybolt3[m]> (Thus why I used not(expression), not knowing about putting not right in the expression)
[20:52] <arraybolt3[m]> (I also just guessed that "not" existed and tried it and it seemed to work :P)
[20:53] <teward> oh it works.  it's just not pythonic
[20:54] <teward> it'll eval what's in the parentheses first then not that
[20:54] <teward> so i mean
[20:54] <teward> PEP-8 format guidelines wil whine though :P
[20:54] <arraybolt3[m]> My first language was Javascript, then Powershell, then C#, then Visual Basic (yuk), then some C++, and PHP was somewhere in there.
[20:54] <tsimonq2> Pythonic. That's the word
[20:54] <arraybolt3[m]> (And I may have missed some languages somewhere in there.)
[20:55] <arraybolt3[m]> So yeah, I kinda got stuck in a C loop. while(true) { aaron_brain_step(); }
[20:55] <teward> *sends SIGKILL to the C loop process*
[20:55] <Eickmeyer[m]> Simon Quigley: bug 1970489
[20:55] -ubot93:#lubuntu-devel- Bug 1970489 in xdg-desktop-portal (Ubuntu) "Some (eg firefox) snap's modal dialogs don't follow dark-theme preference until log out and log back" [Low, Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1970489
[20:55]  * arraybolt3[m] sends SIGILL to teward's systemd
[20:55] <tsimonq2> Eickmeyer[m]: Thank you :)
[20:56] <teward> arraybolt3[m]: "socket.error: timed out"
[20:56] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: :(){ : | & }; :
[20:57] <arraybolt3[m]> s/&/:/
[20:57] <teward> no forkbombs posted here even if joking
[20:57] <Eickmeyer[m]> arraybolt3: Careful, posting that can actually get you banned per policy.
[20:57] <teward> that's a general rule because SOME PEOPLE are idiots and will run that
[20:57] <teward> that's actually HARD against policy
[20:57] <arraybolt3[m]> Sorry, was not aware.
[20:57] <teward> now you are
[20:57] <Eickmeyer[m]> I'm pretty sure that's network policy.
[20:57] <arraybolt3[m]> Which policy? Ubuntu CoC or Libera.Chat policy?
[20:57] <teward> All
[20:57] <arraybolt3[m]> (I've read both but can't remember.)
[20:58] <Eickmeyer[m]> arraybolt3[m]: Yes.
[20:58] <teward> you also forget IRCC policy - we're governed by that too
[20:58] <tsimonq2> All of them.
[20:58] <teward> and IRCC has a general rule that dangerous commands should NEVER be posted for any reason
[20:58] <teward> jokingly or otherwise
[20:58] <arraybolt3[m]> Crud. I didn't realize that it was that bad. Sorry, won't do that again.
[20:58]  * arraybolt3[m] does a refresher course on Ubuntu CoC
[20:58] <tsimonq2> Don't worry about it, let's move on :)
[20:58] <teward> *moves on, and then puts a bag of flaming cat poo on simon's lap*  :P
[20:58] <teward> anyways.
[20:59] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: The next step would be to actively migrate everything over, from those lists
[21:00] <tsimonq2> First on the list is probably changing the repo type from mirror to regular, something along those lines, on the GiTea end
[21:00] <tsimonq2> API or manual, that's our choice ;P
[21:01] <arraybolt3[m]> I think that since the output of the API stuff isn't guaranteed to be right, manual would be the way to go, lest we mangle something.
[21:01] <teward> speaking of mangling.  tsimonq2: did you know github release pages are no longer static pages and cause chaos with uscan?
[21:01] <Eickmeyer[m]> Simon Quigley: Corresponding discourse post: https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/known-issues-with-firefox-snap/24663/40
[21:01] <tsimonq2> teward: Old news ;)
[21:01] <teward> tsimonq2: did you know i figured out a painful way to use the GH API to get the release pages' links instead?  :P
[21:02] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: Is there an automated way to guarantee nothing goes awry, though? What are the parameters?
[21:02] <tsimonq2> teward: you responded to the long, convoluted d-devel thread right :P
[21:02] <teward> tsimonq2: nope, CBA to
[21:02] <teward> because the way I make it work is **dirty**
[21:02] <tsimonq2> is that the one with the ugly non-compact regex? >:P
[21:03] <teward> see https://salsa.debian.org/debian/vmfs6-tools/-/blob/master/debian/watch
[21:03] <teward> ACTUALLY it's quite sane regex
[21:03] <teward> but it's ugly nonetheless
[21:03] <tsimonq2> oh that is CLEAN
[21:03] <arraybolt3[m]> (I know we're moving on past the forkbomb mess, but I would be interested if someone could point me to where it's against policy, since I just skimmed the CoC, Libera.Chat network policy, and IRC guidelines, and can't find it. I really hope it's not that I missed something and just that it was an unspoken rule that I'm now aware of. I've been watching people post obviously joking malicious commands and rarely doing so myself,
[21:03] <arraybolt3[m]> and didn't think anything of it.)
[21:03] <teward> clean yes, but still ugly
[21:03] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: (May be de facto and not de juris)
[21:03] <teward> tsimonq2: it also breaks things relying on the releases tarballs right now anyways
[21:04] <arraybolt3[m]> At any rate, either way, won't do so anymore.
[21:04] <teward> because the way I do it relies on the tags' tarballs since i don't upload my own for vmfs6-tools
[21:04] <teward> so while it works for that it's dirty As Heck for other projects
[21:04] <teward> esp. when repackaging is needed or such
[21:04] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: Well by "things going wrong" I mean like making garbage or duplicate repos on accident.
[21:04] <teward> arraybolt3[m]: you mean on the gitea side?
[21:04] <teward> i can take a snapshot of gitea as is right now - a hard restore point
[21:04] <arraybolt3[m]> Yes.
[21:05] <arraybolt3[m]> Eh, sure, why not. Might come in handy.
[21:05] <arraybolt3[m]> OK, /me needs coffee, then will return for migration work
[21:06] <tsimonq2> May need an actual API key for GiTea for this operation ;)
[21:06] <teward> heheh
[21:06] <arraybolt3[m]> Got one of those :)
[21:06] <arraybolt3[m]> Web APIs turned out to be shockingly easy.
[21:07] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: You're only at the peak of the learning curve :P
[21:07] <tsimonq2> it gets way harder from here lol
[21:08] <arraybolt3[m]> Oh great.
[21:08] <tsimonq2> Either way... I work on web stuff for $dayjob at the moment, happy to help parse
[21:15] <teward> the infra box needs a reboot :/
[21:15] <teward> *reboots it*
[22:13] <arraybolt3[m]> OK I'm back.
[22:16] <arraybolt3[m]> So I'm thinking, just take all of the repos that aren't already in Gitea, clone them locally, then push them to Gitea. That should just be a matter of making the getPhabRepoList function/method (not sure what to call it in Python) grab the entire JSON object related to each repo in Phab rather than just the name, then calling git with the shell to clone, then using API to make a new repo in Gitea and then push the repo. Does that
[22:16] <arraybolt3[m]> sound reasonable?
[22:17] <arraybolt3[m]> * the name, extracting the Git URL from those, then calling
[22:30] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: Sooo... 502 Bad Gateway on git.lubuntu.me. Box still mid-reboot?
[22:31] <teward> probably but i am away from my computer.  guess you get a night's reprieve while i hang with friends heh
[22:31] <arraybolt3[m]> Alrighty then!
[22:31] <arraybolt3[m]> (fwiw phab.lubuntu.me appears to be operational.)
[22:33] <arraybolt3[m]> teward: Anyway, thanks for everything, and have a great day!
[22:37] <teward> arraybolt3[m]: yeah git isnt on autoboot yet oops
[22:37] <teward> but i'll fix that later
[22:38] <kc2bez[m]> arraybolt3: Now that I have had a chance to study  the list I am not convinced they should all be migrated.
[22:39] <arraybolt3[m]> Dan Simmons: Now that you mention it, I remember you saying something similar a bit ago. Which one's shouldn't come? I'll just make my script pull them out.
[22:39] <kc2bez[m]> Some of them may be misnamed too.
[22:41] <kc2bez[m]> pastebinit
[22:41] <kc2bez[m]> deprecated-seeds
[22:41] <kc2bez[m]> qtbase
[22:41] <kc2bez[m]> sddm-config-editor
[22:41] <kc2bez[m]>  * ````lxqt-l10n... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/f1e14facf1d903053a1159743824244b0a648875>)
[22:41] <kc2bez[m]> Those should be left off for sure
[22:42] <kc2bez[m]> I feel like `redshift-qt` and `ci-metadata` too
[22:43] <kc2bez[m]> `lubuntu-artwork` and `artwork` are probably the same, just named different.
[22:44] <arraybolt3[m]> Sounds likely, I can check that
[22:44] <arraybolt3[m]> (github mirror will give me the info in the absence of our Git instance)
[22:45] <kc2bez[m]> `seed` is in Launchpad and needs to stay there. phab just mirrored it before. We should be able to do the same with git.l.m
[22:45] <arraybolt3[m]> Yep, it's literally in the repo description "Lubuntu's Artwork - Bidirectional mirror of lp:lubuntu-artwork"
[22:45] <kc2bez[m]> I think `sddm` is in Launchpad too.
[22:47] <kc2bez[m]> yup, sddm is in ubuntu-qt-code
[22:50] <kc2bez[m]> By my poor math that leaves. `lxqt-meta` `qlipper` lubuntu-meta` `lubuntu-breeze-config`
[22:50] <kc2bez[m]>  * By my poor math that leaves. `lxqt-meta` `qlipper` `lubuntu-meta` `lubuntu-breeze-config\`
[22:51] <kc2bez[m]> * `lxqt-meta` `qlipper` `lubuntu-meta` `lubuntu-breeze-config`
[22:51] <kc2bez[m]> I'll get it right eventually
[22:52]  * arraybolt3[m] sent a code block: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/49e054c2349a02620b57a19c6968d90c400ca582
[22:53] <arraybolt3[m]> kc2bez[m]: Heh, you should see my bad markdown skills sometimes.
[22:55] <tsimonq2> Reading backlog again, last call to get something to me before I'm away from my computer for the night :)
[22:56] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: I think we're done for today, git.lubuntu.me is down so we can't do any more migration stuff.
[22:58] <arraybolt3[m]> And my code literally won't even run while that site is down (throws an exception trying to access the Gitea API)
 "So I'm thinking, just take all..." <- The only other suggestion that immediately comes to mind is: maybe see if you can store it in memory? (e.g. a Python variable containing the contents of the Git repo)
[22:58] <tsimonq2> Otherwise, that's about right, yeah. Just don't forget the function to set the default branch in the web UI :)
[22:59] <tsimonq2> Read/write operations to memory are exponentially faster than read/write operations from disk, as I'm sure you know :)
[22:59] <arraybolt3[m]> > <@tsimonq2:linuxdelta.com> The only other suggestion that immediately comes to mind is: maybe see if you can store it in memory? (e.g. a Python variable containing the contents of the Git repo)
[22:59] <arraybolt3[m]> > 
[22:59] <arraybolt3[m]> > Otherwise, that's about right, yeah. Just don't forget the function to set the default branch in the web UI :)
[22:59] <arraybolt3[m]> That's not a terrible idea, but I think if we want to do that, using /dev/shm would make things way easier.
[23:00] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: Sounds good, I'll get going and respond from my phone :)
[23:00] <arraybolt3[m]> (Dunno why I phrased it that way, it's not just "not a terrible idea", it's a great idea.)
[23:00] <arraybolt3[m]> 👋 See ya!
[23:00] <arraybolt3[m]> Talk to Texans accepted.
[23:02] <tsimonq2> As I'm wrapping up, I'm reminded of a feature idea I had in PCManFM-Qt (also on my "will scratch my own itch" list)...
[23:02] <tsimonq2> Let's say you create file `foo`. File `bar` already exists, you want to move `foo` to `bar`, overwriting it. It's two GUI steps, not just one
[23:04] <tsimonq2> Now that that's out there... bye for real :)
[23:05] <arraybolt3[m]> Basically a "rename and clobber" feature? Like if you drop one file onto another, it offers to let you destroy the old one and rename the new one to the old one's name?
[23:14] <genii> That sounds like a recipe for accidental misuse
[23:16] <arraybolt3[m]> It would be awfully convenient in some instances though. Maybe it needs to be hidden behind an "I know what I'm doing, don't stop me" switch or something.