[02:03] <leftyfb> I just don't understand people who run things like mergerfs with samba yet don't know how to look at logs when things don't go right
[02:03] <leftyfb> elsewhere someone was having issues opening "xterm" in kali linux
[02:03] <leftyfb> :/
[02:03] <leftyfb> walk before you run
[02:04] <sarnold> spending years with slackware first was a great way to get the hang of debugging problems
[02:05] <leftyfb> A started with slackware but at a time where I was just interested in "Free games" :)
[02:05] <sarnold> robots! wumpus!
[02:06] <leftyfb> actually, it was doom and quake but I didn't realize at the time I still needed the wad files so I gave up
[02:07] <leftyfb> eventually started playing with Redhat 5
[02:07] <leftyfb> got a desktop going there but then started setting up web and DNS servers
[02:08] <leftyfb> then I got to about RH7 and did some dumb rpm things and all I can remember is I saw libc errors. Wiped it all and went with fedora
[02:08] <leftyfb> somewhere in there also messed around with Mandrake
[02:08] <leftyfb> then settled on Ubuntu in 2007
[04:01] <arraybolt3> A big part of me is getting really tired of the constant low-interferance trolls, where they just do little bits of annoying things every once in a while for days and days. I'd really like if Mr Final Fantasy 7 would just leave and never come back...
[04:02] <sarnold> I knew the nickname looked *too* familiar, but I couldn't place why..
[04:03] <arraybolt3> :P At least the percentile-for-everything person seems to have lost interest.
[04:03] <leftyfb> ah, looks like they've brought that up many times in the last 2 months
[04:04] <sarnold> hah, I like the percentile-for-everything guy
[04:04] <sarnold> when he's at about 10%, he's nice enough
[04:04] <sarnold> 100% percentile guy is definitely way too much :(
[04:04] <arraybolt3> It is kinda fun in off-topic. He used to be around in #ubuntu a lot though. Is he still in #ubuntu-offtopic?
[04:05] <sarnold> yeah, he's still around in -offtopic
[04:05] <arraybolt3> (I had to /part from there, it was sucking away too much time.)
[04:05] <lotuspsychje> good morning
[04:05] <arraybolt3> lotuspsychje: You have reached the National Troll Griping Center, how can we help you?
[04:05] <lotuspsychje> arraybolt3: its the same troll gang haunted main from freenode, working in gangs
[04:06] <lotuspsychje> joining every 5min with fantasy issues
[04:06] <lotuspsychje> good example last week was that diagon guy with repeated nvidia optimus
[04:07] <arraybolt3> Ah, I wasn't around in the Freenode days so I'm missing a bunch of that.
[04:07] <lotuspsychje> one day we will find that channel they all laughing in
[04:08] <arraybolt3> Maybe one of us should start trolling #ubuntu sporadically and see if we can get one of the other trolls to DM us. Then we can get Libera staff to bust the whole gang!
[04:08] <arraybolt3> (We'd use an alternate account, of course.)
[04:09] <lotuspsychje> thats an idea lol
[04:09] <lotuspsychje> mine has been nmapping trolls, but i didnt got a pattern yet
[04:09] <lotuspsychje> there are smart uruk-hai trolls
[04:10] <arraybolt3> nmap - like scanning their network? Is that legal?
[04:10] <lotuspsychje> is trolling legal? :p
[04:10] <arraybolt3> Actually I think trolling is legal...
[04:11] <arraybolt3> Anyway I've taken us *way* way way off topic for even this room. I wonder if we should make an #ubuntu-meta or something.
[04:11] <lotuspsychje> there is no real solution yet for made up issues
[04:12] <lotuspsychje> as they try to get to 99% to real issues
[04:12] <lotuspsychje> but with that difference they keep coming back
[04:13] <arraybolt3> I've kinda noticed that.
[04:13] <lotuspsychje> i think the best way, would be the co-operation with an ircd op
[04:14] <lotuspsychje> to gather as many info on them, to find a pettern where they come from
[04:14] <arraybolt3> Though sometimes they aren't always the most subtle about their fake problems - I will have a hard time forgetting "help I turned on ubuntu and a tree just hit my house what do I do oh wait sudo apt update fixed it" that one day.
[04:14] <lotuspsychje> i reported it once on freenode, without much luck
[04:14] <arraybolt3> (Dunno if that's exactly how it went but similar.)
[04:15] <lotuspsychje> i can recognize them joining in gangs, like 5 issues in 30min thats not how reality support goes
[04:16] <lotuspsychje> we usualy get a calm .eu support and when US wakes up a more crowdy support
[04:16] <arraybolt3> US people are more cranky I guess?
[04:17] <lotuspsychje> no, its just the bigger part of the world waking trying to find solutions
[04:17] <arraybolt3> (it was a joke, I live in the US :P)
[04:17] <lotuspsychje> :p
[04:19] <arraybolt3> *yawn* Welp, I should probably get my computer backed up and reinstalled. I'm flavorhopping on my main rig, going from Kubuntu LTS to Lubuntu Development Version. Yes, I am about to use the dev version in production.
[04:19] <lotuspsychje> i got great luck with lubuntu 20.04 myself
[04:21] <arraybolt3> Ah, loved that release. I used to use that a lot.
[04:21] <arraybolt3> 20.04 was my first real dive into the official Ubuntu world.
[04:21] <lotuspsychje> what was it before?
[04:22] <arraybolt3> Before that it was ChaletOS (unofficial Xubuntu derivative made to look like Win7) and KXStudio (unofficial Kubuntu derivative similar to Ubuntu Studio). And before that it was Windows 8.0.
[04:22] <lotuspsychje> cool
[04:24] <arraybolt3> You should have seen me hunting for the KXStudio ISO. I had absolutely no experience with Linux at that time, and was using HP QuickWeb (some weird Linux OS made by HP that shipped on a Compaq laptop of theirs) to download it. It was... so bad. Outdated Firefox on the modern Web, with a clueless user who had no fear of getting hacked, digging around in page 498 of Google trying to figure
[04:24] <arraybolt3> out why I couldn't download the Linux equivalent of .EXE files for KXStudio or where the ISO went when the repository was supposedly available for download.
[04:26] <arraybolt3> (KXStudio *was* a downloadable OS until after 14.04, whereupon it became a repo that you added on top of Kubuntu. Me, with zero Linux knowledge at the time, did not understand this and insisted that I find the ISO, which I finally found deep within the guts of SourceForge, which wouldn't render properly on my outdated browser. Somehow I got it downloaded, and proceeded to try and flash it
[04:26] <arraybolt3> in non-DD mode with Rufus on an offline system, which didn't work. I can't remember how I ever got it on a flash drive to install it onto hardware but I managed to somehow.)
[04:26] <arraybolt3> (Actually, now I remember, I burned it to a DVD instead. OK, that makes sense.)
[04:27] <sarnold> cripes what an ordeal ;)
[04:27] <sarnold> it makes "download 53 floppies" seem pretty danged easy by comparison, heh
[04:27] <lotuspsychje> lol
[04:28] <leftyfb> in 1994, Slackware took up 73 floppies
[04:29] <leftyfb> that's about the time I was running Slackware, I think maybe 1993
[04:29] <arraybolt3> Yeah lol. Once I finally managed to get it, I did all sorts of stuff on it and loved it. It was insanely difficult for me and also insanely fun. One time I broke some part of it and never could figure out how to fix it (I had no Internet access), so I just lived with the breakage. :D
[04:29] <lotuspsychje> holy tux leftyfb 
[04:30] <lotuspsychje> i had some boxes with linux on that had a floppy bay, but thats about it :p
[04:30] <arraybolt3> Oh and that's not even the really fun part of it yet. The really fun part was trying to install that ISO (which was only halfway compatible with EFI systems) on my HP desktop and an old MS Surface tablet, both of which used EFI. Ended up learning how to use GRUB by hand in that ordeal. Took me multiple days.
[04:30] <arraybolt3> I ended up writing the grub.cfg file *by hand* and putting it in the wrong place to get the system to boot.
[04:31] <sarnold> *dang*
[04:31] <sarnold> once again
[04:31] <sarnold> making LILO on slackware seem like a breeze
[04:31] <leftyfb> ugh, LILO
[04:31] <leftyfb> those were NOT the days
[04:31] <sarnold> LILILILILILILILI
[04:31] <arraybolt3> I do my Linux on hard mode way too often. Planning on doing it again.
[04:32] <leftyfb> I'll go further back though. Trying to get sound cards working on MSDOS by messing with IRQ's and DMA's
[04:32] <arraybolt3> Ah, never had that battle, but I sure did read a lot about it.
[04:33] <sarnold> it's been a very long time since I did that slackware install, but I *think* it was segregated by which packages you wanted to install, and if you just wanted a bare-bones system with no X11, no servers, no apps, that'd be like five floppies, and each group of features would add another eight to twelve floppies... I wanted a *lot* but not everything so '53 floppies' is what sticks in my mind
[04:33] <sarnold> leftyfb: and juggling the TSRs to try to get things loaded juuuust right to get all your stuff to run
[04:33] <sarnold> I'm so happy for those days to be in the past, hehe
[04:33] <arraybolt3> I have an old computer book, "Troubleshooting, Maintaining, and Repairing PCs" that has a good amount about that stuff.
[04:33] <lotuspsychje> lol sarnold 
[04:33] <arraybolt3> TSR ordering and the works.
[04:34] <arraybolt3> Even had low-level formatting ESDI hard drives (and whatever the HDD type was before that).
[04:34] <leftyfb> MFM's
[04:35] <arraybolt3> My brain has ST/486 stuck in it - I know the number at the end is *not* 486 but I don't remember what the number actually is lol
[04:35] <leftyfb> 486 was a type of CPU arch
[04:35] <sarnold> I missed MFMs
[04:35] <arraybolt3> True. While this was a disk controller I'm trying to think of the name of.
[04:35] <leftyfb> the 1st computer I ever bought with my own money was a 486sx25
[04:36] <arraybolt3> Mine was an HP Chromebook x2.
[04:37] <arraybolt3> (Found it! ST/506.)
[04:42] <arraybolt3> leftyfb: Weird how tech like that went obsolete so fast. I remember using my Pentium III desktop for years and years and it didn't occur to me that one day it would be outmoded until way far later.
=== waveform_ is now known as waveform
[18:48] <leftyfb> tomreyn: push, don't pull ;)
[18:49] <tomreyn> leftyfb: hmm?
[18:50] <leftyfb> tomreyn: I prefer they push their requests and supplied data as opposed to me pulling it from them ... after I ask once of course
[18:50] <tomreyn> leftyfb: oh i didn't mean to criticise you, sorry for not making this clear.
[18:51] <tomreyn> i was referring to their communication
[18:51] <tomreyn> "does not work" 'style'
[18:52] <leftyfb> no no, we're good. I was refering to you asking pj for more data after I already asked them for data that they have yet to provide. push(from them) not pull(from us) :)
[19:09] <tomreyn> leftyfb: oh ok
[19:10] <tomreyn> i do this usually because some just don't dare to say "i don't know what this means" or "i don't understand", then giving them an alternative question can help, i think.