| OvenWerks | Eickmeyer: CCLI and presumably other chart sources provide "Chordpro" charts which are a markup language for charts. Ubuntu already has a CL program called chordii for converting these files to PS While possibly also changing key. | 01:10 |
|---|---|---|
| OvenWerks | Eickmeyer: however there is also an actual chordpro program that includes a GUI based version that prints PDFs (or displays them. I think, judging by https://github.com/ChordPro/chordpro/blob/master/LICENSE that Fedora has it. It appears to be GPL 1+ or Artistic License as in the file included. | 01:13 |
| OvenWerks | I don't know if we can pull that in or not | 01:15 |
| OvenWerks | chordii seems to work alright even though it only makes post script files because our pdf reader deals with them just fine. | 01:25 |
| OvenWerks | chordpro requires libpdf-api2-perl libtext-layout-perl libapp-packager-perl libfile-loadlines-perl libstring-interpolate-named-perl libimage-info-perl but even though their website feels debian/ubuntu should have these packages ubuntu does not seem to anyway. So maybe it is more work that it is worth. | 01:46 |
| OvenWerks | doing the cpan install pulls eveything in anyway | 01:46 |
| * OvenWerks is not really happy with any of these yet. | 02:47 | |
| Eickmeyer | OvenWerks: Looks interesting, I'll look into it. | 15:34 |
| OvenWerks | Eickmeyer: I have continued looking.... There is a thing called music stand that CCLI suggests but from reading the comments, it wants to do a download every time you put together a set. There is no use predownloaded from a file library stuff. (CCLI of course charges by the DL) There are lots of other difficulties too. I think I will have to wait till I have a tablet to use. The main thing | 17:21 |
| OvenWerks | is that I always know what the songs are but almost never the key and I am not to the Nashvile chart yet... though I probably could work with that on bass, guitar maybe not. I might try printing out a NV set using chordii. | 17:21 |
| Eickmeyer | Yeah, I'm very familiar with CCLI. They charge for every download unless you're a church with a subscription. | 17:22 |
| OvenWerks | I think even then. | 17:22 |
| OvenWerks | maybe it depends on the sub | 17:22 |
| Eickmeyer | It depends on the subscription. The churches I worked for were allowed unlimited downloads. | 17:22 |
| OvenWerks | The place I was going a few years ago mentioned they paid for use | 17:23 |
| OvenWerks | but the where we are now has a nicer one | 17:23 |
| OvenWerks | I haven't asked what it is or charges | 17:23 |
| arraybolt3 | What are you trying to do? Get sheet music for church music? | 17:24 |
| OvenWerks | Have something that I can change the key in real time | 17:25 |
| OvenWerks | I think now is the time to learn nashville charting | 17:25 |
| OvenWerks | back in a bit\ | 17:25 |
| Eickmeyer | OvenWerks: Honestly, ChordPro's licensing doesn't make me comfortable. GPL1+ is all well and good, but the problem is that, afaik, and per Debian's stance, the GPL can't be dual-licensed because it's a viral license and overrides anything it touches. Therefore, the license can't be GPL-1+ *AND* Artistic, therefore the LICENSE file, from a Debian | 17:33 |
| Eickmeyer | standpoint, is invalid. | 17:33 |
| Eickmeyer | Hence, probably why it's never been packaged for Debian or Ubuntu. | 17:34 |
| Eickmeyer | (Also why anything VST3 can't be packaged for Debian) | 17:35 |
| arraybolt3 | Not a disagreement, but why does the GPL override anything it touches? I mean the copyright owner can license things however they want, why can't they dual-license things? | 17:43 |
| Eickmeyer[m] | arraybolt3: IANAL, but it has to do with the way it's worded and its viral-licensing nature. The Debian legal team has repeatedly taken the stance that a project, while it can contain components from multiple licenses, the project as a whole cannot be dual-licensed as GPL (or any viral license) and something else. | 17:45 |
| arraybolt3 | Hmm. I'm guessing they make an exception for Qt then? | 17:46 |
| Eickmeyer[m] | I honestly don't know. I believe there are specific circumstances for Qt. For instance, if it's a commercial entity for a specific project, then Qt has a proprietary license. If it's for non-commercial or open-source, Qt is GPL. That's how they get around it. | 17:47 |
| Eickmeyer[m] | In the case of VST3 and ChordPro it's "Take your pick" which doesn't jive. | 17:48 |
| arraybolt3[m] | Ah, because it's not a "pick any one you want", it's a "This is *the* license, if you want to go outside its requirement we have room for that with a different license". OK, I get it. | 17:48 |
| arraybolt3[m] | Because then someone could use it under the terms of the non-GPL license and then get sued for a GPL violation. | 17:48 |
| Eickmeyer[m] | Exactly. | 17:49 |
| OvenWerks | Is it _and_ or _or_? I got the idea it was OR not and | 17:53 |
| Eickmeyer | Even if it's OR, you can't pick-and-choose with the GPL. | 17:53 |
| OvenWerks | So for dual licencing you have to keep two repos | 17:54 |
| arraybolt3 | They could just release two separate "versions" of the software, like ChordPro GPL edition and ChordPro Artistic Edition. Same code, different copyright headers everywhere, different downloads. | 17:54 |
| Eickmeyer | Correct. | 17:55 |
| arraybolt3 | If it was able to get their software into Debian they might do that. | 17:55 |
| OvenWerks | (evn though GPL contains _or_ | 17:55 |
| Eickmeyer | OvenWerks: But that's "or any later version" of the GPL, not another license. | 17:55 |
| Eickmeyer | And that's only if the software is forked. But even if it's forked, it must still be GPL. | 17:56 |
| OvenWerks | Same difference. GPL 1 is not GPL2 or GPL3 | 17:56 |
| arraybolt3 | If someone downloaded dual-licensed, GPL-ified code, how would you know which license they chose? What if they followed Artistic and got sued for GPL violation, or the other way around? Unless they specifically chose a license at download time or compile time. | 17:56 |
| arraybolt3 | Then they'd be bound to exactly that license (and hopefully the software would leave a record of what license was chosen). | 17:57 |
| * arraybolt3 wonders if maybe the problem could be circumvented with a clever Debian package that presented a license choice option to the user at install time | 17:58 | |
| Eickmeyer | arraybolt3: There's no way to know, unfortunately, hence Debian makes a pretty hard stance as to not even touch it. | 17:58 |
| arraybolt3 | Eickmeyer: Exactly my point, thus why I see why Debian would reject it. | 17:58 |
| arraybolt3[m] | OK, back to figuring out why "killall" isn't present by default in the packaging for the lubuntu upgrader. | 18:02 |
| Eickmeyer[m] | arraybolt3: Isn't "killall" part of the core and hence not part of any packaging? | 18:07 |
| OvenWerks | Anyway, it is not a stellar application anyway. | 18:07 |
| arraybolt3[m] | Eickmeyer: It's part of psmisc. Having lubuntu-update-notifier not depend on psmisc is making autopkgtest grumpy. | 18:08 |
| arraybolt3[m] | Anyway I added the dep and it seems to have calmed it down there. | 18:08 |
| arraybolt3[m] | So now I get to fight with all my syntax and logic errors now! :D | 18:08 |
| Eickmeyer[m] | Ah, I see. | 18:08 |
| * OvenWerks might make his own gui wrapper for chordii. | 18:11 | |
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