[01:10] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: CCLI and presumably other chart sources provide "Chordpro" charts which are a markup language for charts. Ubuntu already has a CL program called chordii for converting these files to PS While possibly also changing key.
[01:13] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer:  however there is also an actual chordpro program that includes a GUI based version that prints PDFs (or displays them. I think, judging by https://github.com/ChordPro/chordpro/blob/master/LICENSE that Fedora has it. It appears to be GPL 1+ or Artistic License as in the file included.
[01:15] <OvenWerks> I don't know if we can pull that in or not
[01:25] <OvenWerks> chordii seems to work alright even though it only makes post script files because our pdf reader deals with them just fine.
[01:46] <OvenWerks> chordpro requires libpdf-api2-perl libtext-layout-perl libapp-packager-perl libfile-loadlines-perl libstring-interpolate-named-perl libimage-info-perl but even though their website feels debian/ubuntu should have these packages ubuntu does not seem to anyway. So maybe it is more work that it is worth.
[01:46] <OvenWerks>  doing the cpan install pulls eveything in anyway
[02:47]  * OvenWerks is not really happy with any of these yet.
[15:34] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Looks interesting, I'll look into it.
[17:21] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: I have continued looking.... There is a thing called music stand that CCLI suggests but from reading the comments, it wants to do a download every time you put together a set. There is no use predownloaded from a file library stuff. (CCLI of course charges by the DL) There are lots of other difficulties too. I think I will have to wait till I have a tablet to use. The main thing 
[17:21] <OvenWerks> is that I always know what the songs are but almost never the key and I am not to the Nashvile chart yet... though I probably could work with that on bass, guitar maybe not. I might try printing out a NV set using chordii.
[17:22] <Eickmeyer> Yeah, I'm very familiar with CCLI. They charge for every download unless you're a church with a subscription.
[17:22] <OvenWerks> I think even then.
[17:22] <OvenWerks> maybe it depends on the sub
[17:22] <Eickmeyer> It depends on the subscription. The churches I worked for were allowed unlimited downloads.
[17:23] <OvenWerks> The place I was going a few years ago mentioned they paid for use
[17:23] <OvenWerks> but the where we are now has a nicer one
[17:23] <OvenWerks> I haven't asked what it is or charges
[17:24] <arraybolt3> What are you trying to do? Get sheet music for church music?
[17:25] <OvenWerks> Have something that I can change the key in real time
[17:25] <OvenWerks> I think  now is the time to learn nashville charting
[17:25] <OvenWerks> back in a bit\
[17:33] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Honestly, ChordPro's licensing doesn't make me comfortable. GPL1+ is all well and good, but the problem is that, afaik, and per Debian's stance, the GPL can't be dual-licensed because it's a viral license and overrides anything it touches. Therefore, the license can't be GPL-1+ *AND* Artistic, therefore the LICENSE file, from a Debian
[17:33] <Eickmeyer> standpoint, is invalid.
[17:34] <Eickmeyer> Hence, probably why it's never been packaged for Debian or Ubuntu.
[17:35] <Eickmeyer> (Also why anything VST3 can't be packaged for Debian)
[17:43] <arraybolt3> Not a disagreement, but why does the GPL override anything it touches? I mean the copyright owner can license things however they want, why can't they dual-license things?
[17:45] <Eickmeyer[m]> arraybolt3: IANAL, but it has to do with the way it's worded and its viral-licensing nature. The Debian legal team has repeatedly taken the stance that a project, while it can contain components from multiple licenses, the project as a whole cannot be dual-licensed as GPL (or any viral license) and something else.
[17:46] <arraybolt3> Hmm. I'm guessing they make an exception for Qt then?
[17:47] <Eickmeyer[m]> I honestly don't know. I believe there are specific circumstances for Qt. For instance, if it's a commercial entity for a specific project, then Qt has a proprietary license. If it's for non-commercial or open-source, Qt is GPL. That's how they get around it.
[17:48] <Eickmeyer[m]> In the case of VST3 and ChordPro it's "Take your pick" which doesn't jive.
[17:48] <arraybolt3[m]> Ah, because it's not a "pick any one you want", it's a "This is *the* license, if you want to go outside its requirement we have room for that with a different license". OK, I get it.
[17:48] <arraybolt3[m]> Because then someone could use it under the terms of the non-GPL license and then get sued for a GPL violation.
[17:49] <Eickmeyer[m]> Exactly.
[17:53] <OvenWerks> Is it _and_ or _or_? I got the idea it was OR not and
[17:53] <Eickmeyer> Even if it's OR, you can't pick-and-choose with the GPL.
[17:54] <OvenWerks> So for dual licencing you have to keep two repos
[17:54] <arraybolt3> They could just release two separate "versions" of the software, like ChordPro GPL edition and ChordPro Artistic Edition. Same code, different copyright headers everywhere, different downloads.
[17:55] <Eickmeyer> Correct. 
[17:55] <arraybolt3> If it was able to get their software into Debian they might do that.
[17:55] <OvenWerks> (evn though GPL contains _or_
[17:55] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: But that's "or any later version" of the GPL, not another license.
[17:56] <Eickmeyer> And that's only if the software is forked. But even if it's forked, it must still be GPL.
[17:56] <OvenWerks> Same difference. GPL 1 is not GPL2 or GPL3
[17:56] <arraybolt3> If someone downloaded dual-licensed, GPL-ified code, how would you know which license they chose? What if they followed Artistic and got sued for GPL violation, or the other way around? Unless they specifically chose a license at download time or compile time.
[17:57] <arraybolt3> Then they'd be bound to exactly that license (and hopefully the software would leave a record of what license was chosen).
[17:58]  * arraybolt3 wonders if maybe the problem could be circumvented with a clever Debian package that presented a license choice option to the user at install time
[17:58] <Eickmeyer> arraybolt3: There's no way to know, unfortunately, hence Debian makes a pretty hard stance as to not even touch it.
[17:58] <arraybolt3> Eickmeyer: Exactly my point, thus why I see why Debian would reject it.
[18:02] <arraybolt3[m]> OK, back to figuring out why "killall" isn't present by default in the packaging for the lubuntu upgrader.
[18:07] <Eickmeyer[m]> arraybolt3: Isn't "killall" part of the core and hence not part of any packaging?
[18:07] <OvenWerks> Anyway, it is not a stellar application anyway.
[18:08] <arraybolt3[m]> Eickmeyer: It's part of psmisc. Having lubuntu-update-notifier not depend on psmisc is making autopkgtest grumpy.
[18:08] <arraybolt3[m]> Anyway I added the dep and it seems to have calmed it down there.
[18:08] <arraybolt3[m]> So now I get to fight with all my syntax and logic errors now! :D
[18:08] <Eickmeyer[m]> Ah, I see.
[18:11]  * OvenWerks might make his own gui wrapper for chordii.