[02:33] <lotuspsychje> good morning
[03:00] <crax23> hey
[03:01] <crax23> how's the morning doing lotuspsychje ?
[04:42] <wez> yay lotuspsychje is awake!
[15:42] <lotuspsychje> https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxmasterrace/comments/zqnyzz/my_linux_sticker_setup/
[15:54] <leftyfb> lotuspsychje: you love linux stickers eh? :)
[15:55] <lotuspsychje> if i see them popup, ill share :p
[15:55] <leftyfb> I actually haven't put a single sticker on my daily driver yet. I'm thinking I might actually not bother and wait for my next laptop which might be in the next couple years
[15:56] <lotuspsychje> i had to cleanup sticker glue so much on customers, i personaly avoid them myself :p
[15:56] <lotuspsychje> i did like the square samsung ssd stickers came along in the package though
[15:56] <leftyfb> I liked my last one. And I have a whole bunch that are planned to go onto my next one. Some I bought specifically for it. I just never got around to doing it
[16:10] <JanC> ogra: like I said, respect for developers who are fixing bugs, and the decision to release Firefox as a snap probably wasn't theirs, but releasing a critical application with so many bugs unfixed is just wrong & user-hostile IMNSHO
[16:11] <JanC> also, you basically force significant numbers of users to switch to the PPA
[16:12] <JanC> my dad isn't going to wait around twiddling his thumbs for months/years until his browser does what it has to do again...
[16:13] <ogra> well, i'm not sure what you talk about here ... i dont have any issues using FF, nor does my mom
[16:13] <JanC> that's nice for you, but doesn't fix other people's problems...
[16:13] <ogra> i know that the request for the switc came from mozilla after they tested it fr quite a while 
[16:14] <JanC> I know the request came from Mozilla, that's why I included them in my rant  :)
[16:14] <JanC> and obviously Mozilla's testing leaves a lot to be desired
[16:14] <ogra> i still dont know what exact "problems" you talk about ... and you have not given a single concrete example 
[16:14] <leftyfb> pretty sure mozilla is the one who maintains the firefox snap
[16:15] <ogra> for me and most people arund me the browser works as expected
[16:15] <JanC> there are/were many, they are all in the bug trackers AFAIK (I didn't have to report them, they were mostly already known before the release even)
[16:15] <ogra> leftyfb, well, there is a team inside the canonical desktop team working with them, so it isnt them alone, it is a jiont effort
[16:15] <leftyfb> JanC: show me any proof that Canonical or Mozilla knew there was a critical bug in the Firefox snap before they released it
[16:16] <ogra> there were admittedly lacking features ... i.e. native-messaging support missing on release day ... (so you couldnt use keypassxc or install gnome extensions) ... but these were fixed with high prio 
[16:17] <ogra> ... and landd before 22.04 actually became an LTS with the .1 release
[16:17] <ogra> *landed
[16:18] <ogra> nd such known issus were in the release announcement ...
[16:18] <ogra> *and such known issues
[16:19] <JanC> that's not useful for users though
[16:19] <ogra> ??
[16:19] <ogra> that issues get fixed before the official release ? 
[16:19] <leftyfb> release notes aren't userful for users?
[16:19] <leftyfb> useful*
[16:19] <ogra> (or announced in the pre-time)
[16:20] <leftyfb> JanC: can you point to any software company that has ever released any software that was completely bug free, didn't have or need release notes and never required any patches to fix bugs?
[16:20] <JanC> it's useful for me ("the admin") the know that something isn't going to work so I can find an alternative, it's not useful for my dad ("the user") as he just wants it to work
[16:20] <leftyfb> all up in arms because a piece of software has a bug
[16:21] <leftyfb> and has yet to specify a single bug
[16:22] <ogra> right .. that is my prob too with this discussion ... lots of "hypothetical bugs" being mentioned, not a sigle concrete example though
[16:30] <JanC> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/1843392 is one example
[16:30] -ubottu:#ubuntu-discuss- Launchpad bug 1843392 in firefox (Ubuntu) "[snap] smart card reader no longer works" [High, Confirmed]
[16:32] <JanC> (our eIDs, which we need to interact with the government, are smartcards...)
[16:35] <JanC> another issue on release day (and probably still true?) was that Snap updates are forced & you can't really delay them until broken software is fixed (not in a way my dad can do it, at least), which can be necessary when e.g. *Mozilla* break such stuff in Firefox (yes, that happened before)
[16:43] <JanC> that first bug was reported in 2019(!) for Chromium and since at least 2021 for Firefox and is still not fixed, it seems, with just some proposals of how it could be fixed...
[17:31] <lotuspsychje> JanC: im currently using eid on chrome as temp workaround
[17:35] <leftyfb> JanC: wait, so you have government-mandated equipment that they are letting you manage? Not very secure if you ask me
[18:44] <lotuspsychje> leftyfb: belgium uses several ways to manage e-gov services, one of them is eid smartcard to login, so you can fill in taxes or lookup your pension etc
[18:45] <lotuspsychje> since jammy gone FF snap the above bug is blocking the smartcard reading
[18:58] <cartdrige> an electronic white puppy for every belgium and you're done.
[18:58] <cartdrige> +man
[19:02] <lotuspsychje> running ubuntu core? :p
[19:09] <lotuspsychje> JanC: i was following bug #1741074
[19:09] -ubottu:#ubuntu-discuss- Bug 1741074 in firefox (Ubuntu) "[snap] chrome-gnome-shell extension fails to detect native host connector" [High, In Progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1741074
[20:56] <JanC> leftyfb: not sure what exactly you mean, but providing everyone with a government-managed computer just to fill out tax forms or check your vaccination status or whatever seems a bit excessive (and expensive)
[21:02] <enigma9o7> maybe the gov't could run a website
[21:02] <JanC> enigma9o7: that's exactly what it does
[21:03] <JanC> many websites even
[21:05] <JanC> the eID/smartcard contains a X.509 certificate (only accessible after entering a PIN code) that you have to use to authenticate