lotuspsychjegood morning04:29
wezGood evening lotuspsychje!08:41
* wez cracks open a proper AU pale ale fermented in the bottle and hands it to lotuspsychje 08:42
wezhi guiverc_qa 11:58
guivercG'day wez 12:00
wezG'day good sir12:01
wezor maam12:01
wezor non-binary12:01
wezHow are you?12:01
* wez needs to stop using personal pronouns12:02
guiverctired & was unable to create the bug I was looking for using Ubuntu Desktop (good in one way anyway) that we have currently with Lubuntu lunar  ("." was to create noise on the irc client;..)...  I maybe should have connected to -offtopic12:03
* guiverc normally pings myself via PM; but boxes where in different rooms12:03
Bashing-omUWN: Issue767 now available to our reading public: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue767 :D21:41
cartdrigepipewire doesn't sound as cool as pulseaudio.21:44
cartdrigewe can't tell it has to do with the audio by its name.21:44
JanCwhat about PolypAudio ?21:46
EickmeyerPipewire also handles some video subsystems, so it's not just for audio.21:59
EickmeyerBashing-om: Just some points of correction: I'm fairly certain all of those meetings for the rest of December were cancelled. I know for a fact the TB meeting was, and since Canonical is on break until Jan 3, I'd suspect Foundations and Desktop Indaba are as well.22:07
Eickmeyer(Indaba was done earlier this month)22:08
Bashing-omEickmeyer: No one told us ! We go by what gets posted on various calendars :( .. and yeah will make the Pipe-wire correction. Thanks heaps !22:10
EickmeyerBashing-om: Yeah, hardly anyone has access to Fridge, so that kinda gets forgotten.22:10
EickmeyerAnd as far as Pipewire goes, the video stuff only really gets taken advantage of when using Wayland as the compositor.22:12
Bashing-omguiverc[m]: ^^ Pull from the Fridge ? I do to the WIKI and the Forums ?22:12
EickmeyerFWIW, the TB didn't update their wiki page.22:13
EickmeyerBut their latest meeting notes they did decide to cancel the last meeting of the year.22:13
EickmeyerAnd I just happen to know that Canonical is on break.22:14
guivercFor me to pull anything from the fridge; I'd need a request on ML OR in #ubuntu-news (#ubuntu-community-team or somewhere appropriate), and by someone associated with group.. ie. mostly traceable & understandable reason why it was done.22:15
Eickmeyerguiverc: Jose has access.22:15
Bashing-omEickmeyer: Sp for Meeting - I can report "None as Canonical is on seasonal break" ?22:15
EickmeyerBashing-om: Yeah I would say that's a safe bet.22:16
* Eickmeyer should probably join the news team as he knows way too much 😅22:17
guivercif the tb boards notes say as you do Eickmeyer, provide link & request I remove link in calendar #ubuntu-news etc & I will22:17
Eickmeyerguiverc: I'll get the notes.22:17
* guiverc means just one room, the etc. was intended for a relevant room & need not be #ubuntu-news.22:18
Eickmeyerguiverc: https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2022/ubuntu-meeting.2022-12-13-20.04.moin.txt very end22:18
* Eickmeyer was in that meeting as there was a discussion about Edubuntu22:19
EickmeyerLong story short: project moving forward22:20
guiverccan you please provide request (& link) in #ubuntu-news ; it's where prior requests have been made/actioned22:21
guivercbut the Edubuntu is really great news :)22:21
Bashing-omEickmeyer: Yeah - I keep an eye our for what is taking place for the Edubuntu release :D22:22
Eickmeyerguiverc: Done22:24
guivercthe 'request removal from fridge calendar' please.  (sorry to be a pain; I want a clear record)22:24
EickmeyerOhhhhh ok.22:24
guivercotherwise it'll read like you're reporting 'news' to us...22:25
Eickmeyerguiverc: Better? 😅22:27
guivercthanks :)22:28
Eickmeyeryw. :)22:28
* guiverc irc is different without my usual sound effects (pipewire issue on lubuntu)22:29
EickmeyerStrange. pipewire-pulse should just act like a drop-in replacement. I've been testing on Studio and it seems to be working fine, even with the pipewire-jack backend.22:30
guiverci have music playing using clementine; hexchat (my irc client) is silent.. arraybolt3 noted the same with thunderbird notifications; we've not created a bug report on it yet, BUT couldn't replicate the issue with Ubuntu Desktop (lunar)22:31
EickmeyerVery strange indeed.22:36
EickmeyerMakes me wonder if it's something wrong with the LXQt audio stack.22:36
Bashing-omEickmeyer: Van nit make the Pipewire edits for video or Wayland as the original quthor we are reporting on does not memtion them. I can ping arraybolt3[m] and see of he will edit his article ?22:39
Bashing-omcan not make**22:39
EickmeyerBashing-om: I wouldn't worry about it since Lubuntu's implementation doesn't include Wayland.22:39
arraybolt3I don't know how PipeWire affects video on Lubuntu.22:40
Eickmeyerarraybolt3: I could explain it, but TL;DR: It doesn't.22:40
Bashing-omEickmeyer: Nor yet does Xubuntu support Wayland.22:40
arraybolt3Eickmeyer: As our local A/V on Linux guy, that's good enough for me.22:40
EickmeyerExactly, Bashing-om .22:41
arraybolt3(I mean you're our local A/V on Linux guy.)22:41
EickmeyerI mean, I kinda default to that. 😅22:41
EickmeyerPipewire shines with the video stack when doing video capture, such as on a Google Meet conference.22:42
Bashing-omAll: Leeping in mind guys that UWN is what we, as a community, present to the world - we do strive to make as good a presentation as possible :D22:43
EickmeyerX11 does that natively, but Wayland needs the extra subsystem, hence Pipewire.22:43
EickmeyerBashing-om: No doubt! You're all doing a great job!22:44
gry<Guest70> CPU is Intel i7 -8650U x 8 (ubuntu 18.04.6 says) and memory is 16 GB23:17
gry<Guest70> gry: if I boot 22.10 or 22.04 from a live USB, sometimes it won't make it to the live desktop... or if it does, little after it will freeze... therefore, I would not be able to install those?23:17
grylike 'what the ...' -- these specs are plenty enough, right?23:17
daftykinswhat does the media check say? weird to pick such an old release23:25
grydaftykins: what is a media check23:31
grythey tried to boot live cd and they say it was freezing randomly as described above23:31
daftykinsoh yeah it came in after 18.04 anyway, duh - well the newer ones check themselves and report errors eh23:32
arraybolt3gry: I think a "media check" is when you use sha256sum on the ISO and make sure its hash matches the one in the corresponding SHA256SUMS file.23:34
EickmeyerThe check when the .iso image initially boots is a bit more thorough than the sha256sum, and apport can check to see if the user had let it run or skipped it, which really helps on bug reports.23:41
daftykinsit should definitely have been implemented as a menu option though23:42
daftykinsit could be the default but having had an additional entry with skipping the check would have made more sense23:42
daftykinsi've been in situations with remote console virtual mounting (Dell iDRAC / HP iLO) where it'd take hours to disc check a downloaded ISO due to a slow network link23:43
EickmeyerNo. Seeing that they skipped it is the difference between a valid and invalid bug report.23:43
EickmeyerCan't tell whether or not their media was any good.23:43
daftykinsi'm not talking about your comment regarding bug reports, i'm saying that in my opinion the feature should have been implemented as a choice23:44
daftykinsi understand your view but you can't say 'no' to my opinion over choice, also if i filed a bug and you shouted at me for not testing media and used it as an excuse not to pursue a bug it would be not be great :)23:45
gryi think if it's a bug, it's either their usb or their hardware23:45
gryif it's a graphics problem, i'd rather shoot myself than debug it; i'd prefert to shove the hardware into a bin and get a new one over debugging graphics problems23:46
grybecause graphics problems are a pain23:46
daftykinsso hash the download, re-check the media creation, boot with nomodeset, check firmware is latest, all the usual basics23:46
Eickmeyerdaftykins:  I don't see you helping with Ubuntu development and only being argumentative with those in here that are, and seeing as how Ubuntu is a meritocracy, you don't have much leg to stand on.23:46
gryboot with nomodeset - maybe good idea23:46
daftykinswow i only expressed an opinion on the feature and now you're trying to make it personal? this is extremely unwelcome Eickmeyer 23:47
Eickmeyerdaftykins: I've been watching you be unwelcome to others in here, so that's what's set me off.23:47
gryre booting with nomodeset - is there a good docs page about how to do it23:48
ubottuSystems with certain graphics chipsets may not boot properly out of the box. "Temporarily Add a Kernel Boot Parameter for Testing" as discussed at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/KernelBootParameters to add the "nomodeset" parameter there.23:48
daftykinswell, regardless of your feeling at unconnected other times, you've essentially harmed your own position by claiming i have to be a dev to have an opinion23:48
Eickmeyerdaftykins: No, I'm saying if you want to see change, start helping.23:49
EickmeyerI, on the other hand, benefit from that feature.23:49
daftykinsare you aware i gave over 10 years of support in main?23:49
gryhey, i didn't see either of you two being rude to one another - then Eickmeyer said daftykins is not being super helpful23:49
gryi'm not a dev either...23:49
Eickmeyergry: Support is in #ubuntu.23:49
grynot of the OS, at least23:49
gryi develop some apps, contribute bug reports etc23:50
daftykinsgry is asking how to help another user, that constitutes discussion to my mind23:50
EickmeyerOk, fair.23:50
gryi think it's fine to discuss here how to help users in #ubuntu23:50
Eickmeyergry: Sorry, I thought you were asking for help.23:50
grythat user is super creative too, they create one problem on top of another :o) no worries23:51
daftykinstoo busy attacking me it would seem23:51
Eickmeyerdaftykins: Providing help and support is one thing, but influencing the development of the OS is another.23:51
gryi'd influence development of the OS, but it's such niche changes that theyd not make it to the official .iso23:52
grythey'd break things normal users would want to work23:53
Eickmeyergry: Exactly. The decisions that go into things have to be less about personal opinion and more about what would be generally acceptable and work toward a greater good.23:54
gryi mean you know stallman; the changes that i'd make (and the way i'm using the OS myself every day) are like a 10x amplified version of what stallman says23:55
daftykinsi think you're failing to be objective on this one, it's still possible to skip the checks using a boot parameter... so implementing it as a menu option for those that just want to get on with something if their media access is slow (in the use-case i described) is hardly a world-ending one23:56
gryto the point that even them dont consider my changes necessary23:56
grythough i think it's not necessary for everyone in here to contribute to the generally acceptable good23:56
gryeveryone does what they wish to do, be it within one app or the OS, or only chat help and thats it23:56
Eickmeyerdaftykins: You might be right. As someone who leads an official flavor of Ubuntu, I want to make 100% sure that what they have downloaded, and then written to their installation medium, is exactly correct at any cost, even the 10 seconds it takes to check it.23:58
daftykinsyeah i can absolutely see how annoying it would be to have someone report a bug that was down to their own bad media23:58
gryas long as it says what it is doing (wait ... checking media / iso integrity / whatever ...) rather than being stuck without any message, i'd not complain23:59
EickmeyerExactly. So, if the installer crashes since it couldn't copy a file because the media was bad, and I can see that it had not only a "skip" on the check and a hash mismatch on the file, that tells me with 100% certainty that they have bad media.23:59

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