[00:15] <Bashing-om> krytarik: popey: "@Bashingom I could probably create a bot account which just uses the RSS feed from the fridge to post when a new issue comes out, if that's any use?". 
[00:17] <guiverc> more than just UWN gets posted to fridge; most from us (News) which includes release stuff, but Community Council have posted notices about members losing that privilege before there too  (ie. not 'great' news though that's rare)
[00:20] <Bashing-om> guiverc: I bet however that popey can set up the bot to scrape for only UWN.
[00:20] <guiverc> there are TAGS though; if the RSS feed was to scan & limit "<category>News</category>" etc the rare stuff could be excluded...
[00:21] <guiverc> ^ what I was ~typing
[00:21] <guiverc> I'd have thought the release stuff is worth including anyway  (to me you'd want to avoid the very rare stuff; it can create some 'hate' type reactions..)
[00:22] <guiverc> s/hate/negative ^
[00:23] <krytarik> Yeah, I was also thinking of the category thing here, but also it'd likely be limited to post title and URL - as opposed to either our usual formatting for social media or even the personal one.
[00:23] <Bashing-om> guiverc: What I am dping on Masyodon presently - like so: https://ubuntu.social/@Bashingom/109819670936137265 . 
[00:23] <guiverc> I'm pretty consistent with title; I believe I've only made a typo in title the once..  (2017 to now)
[00:25] <guiverc> :) Great Bashing-om !   (i was on a waiting list for popey's ubuntu.social; I'll have to chase that up)
[00:31] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Maybe popey is real backed up presently - was quick for me when I applied.
[00:33] <krytarik> It would seem we could simply tie it to the Planet category then - some of those unpleasant posts I remember weren't tagged with it either.
[00:33] <guiverc> i joined just prior to Christmas so assumed Alan was taking time off (fine with me), but I've just not followed it up; re-tried
[00:34] <Eickmeyer> Unrelated, and possibly controversial question: Have you guys thought about posting on the discourse as opposed to the wiki in the future?
[00:34] <guiverc> I concur; the 'defrock' (sorry can't think of a better word) type of posts don't have planet tagged as I recall either  (community maybe only)
[00:35] <guiverc> I posted copies to discourse (long ago), but not the same thing as just summary/redirects to wiki
[00:36] <Eickmeyer> Right, but the wiki is moribund. Most documentation is being transferred to discourse, fwiw.
[00:38] <krytarik> I'm not sure Discourse wouldn't throw a fit at the full length of the usual UWN issues for once though, similar to the forums.
[00:39] <Eickmeyer> Nah, it wouldn't. Highly scalable, more resilliant.
[00:39] <Bashing-om> Yeah - on the Forums I have to do some curtailing :(
[00:39] <guiverc> If you wanted me to test, I could try posting a UWN on Lubuntu's discourse in Admin area (You won't be able to see), but if similar version of discourse I can at least have a 'look'
[00:41] <krytarik> Well, the issue on the forums isn't the scalability either though, but rather it'd raise security issues thinking it's spam.
[00:42] <Eickmeyer> discourse != forums. Not the same thing. Throw what you know of the old Ubuntu forums out of your head, they're not the same thing or the same infrastructure or the same spam filtering.
[00:46] <guiverc> first issue would be size; An error occurred: Body is limited to 32000 characters; you entered 46012  (error tacking UWN773 to a very short test post on lubuntu discourse)
[00:46] <krytarik> guiverc: Thinking about it, since the UWN is literally the only thing we post on the wiki rather than on the Fridge directly, do you think WordPress would cope with their length? :3
[00:48] <guiverc> I have no idea krytarik , you fix many of my mistakes/booboos knowing more about wordpress (& esp. formatting) that I do
[00:48] <Eickmeyer> guiverc: The Ubuntu discourse might perform differently. Canonical's infra vs te_ward's personal infra.
[00:49] <guiverc> I can't disagree with that, I have no idea, and even if same version, settings maybe different..
[00:49] <krytarik> I mean I guess we could just test it by creating a draft there with the current issue.. but then we'd also have to adapt our workflow with Bashing-om being the one who currently assembles the issue on the wiki and who doesn't do WP yet..
[00:50] <guiverc> Yep was thinking of that krytarik ; I can do so.  (& yep... it was clearly visible discourse didn't know what to do with much wiki formatting..)
[00:50] <Eickmeyer> If worse comes to worst, a simple question to IS about it would probably be about as painful as it gets (with a tag to aaronprisk[m]).
[00:52] <Bashing-om> and aaronprisk[m] frequebts the #ubuntu-community-team channel :)
[00:53] <Bashing-om> frequents*
[00:53] <Eickmeyer> (Literally his job)
[00:55]  * guiverc waits for preview to show result... (https://fridge.ubuntu.com/?p=9735&preview=true for those you can peek if they want to)  ... WordPress coped with length well & ignoring formatting issues; it looks good; which some PICS picked up from the 9to5 URLS (not others though)
[00:57] <guiverc> With only picking up 9to5 URLS for pics/shares, we could be 'accused' of favoring?  I don't know why, but that's what I see (just site specific though)
[00:57] <Eickmeyer> Can't see it at all.
[00:58]  * guiverc trying to get around that..
[01:04] <guiverc> try https://imgur.com/QrxB3Pk
[01:05] <krytarik> guiverc: Oh, you mean that it seems to have magically changed the link anchor text in some instances (but not even all of the 9to5linux ones) to the post title?
[01:05] <guiverc> yeah... (inc. not all which I missed at first)... yeah
[01:05] <Eickmeyer> Wordpress magically does that for Wordpress.
[01:06] <guiverc> that was just a paste of wiki.page into a blank (no tag, title added) on fridge/wp
[01:06] <guiverc> it did it only for 3 links (and 2 look very similar)
[01:19] <aaronprisk[m]> I was going to reach out here in the coming days to ask about the future platform for UWN, but since it was brought up.. Do you feel that Discourse would serve as an adequate platform?
[01:22] <guiverc> Personally I'd prefer discourse to wordpress, but that's just me.
[01:27] <Bashing-om> I will use whatever tools are at my disposal - whatever broadens exposure is a good thing.
[01:27]  * guiverc just deleted the test773 on fridge  (so not accidently published)
[01:28] <aaronprisk[m]> I agree. As was stated earlier, it would have the benefit of living on our infrastructure and have the moderation and helpful metrics that come with Discourse.
[01:28] <aaronprisk[m]> I'd be more than happy to help with a transition and remove any blockers.
[01:29] <krytarik> guiverc: When posting to Discourse, can you also just drop a plain URL there without any tags or such and it'll be rendered as an actual link rather than it being unclickable text like on WP?
[01:31] <krytarik> Or anyone else here who regularly posts to any Discourse instance, for that matter.
[01:31] <guiverc> I'd have to post to recall what i do ..  (I just do it, & adjust if I used the wrong formatting for the site; being worse at wp than others).. but a quick look at a doco link on lubu.discourse, URLS are just that & become links
[01:32] <guiverc> I'll re-test with UWN773 (but not all of it this time so no size limit reached)
[01:33] <guiverc> links look okay (diff color), open correctly
[01:34] <guiverc> none of the pics that I saw on wordpress, but all URLs in planet are treated EQUALLY thus easier for us too so ++
[01:35] <aaronprisk[m]> IIRC you use Google docs for staging of links/future issue drafts, correct?
[01:36] <krytarik> guiverc: Alright, that's something at least..  And looking around the net on Discourse formatting, it seems we should mostly match it with what we currently do on the wiki.. so what specifically would be off there?
[01:36] <krytarik> And yes, that's (unfortunately) correct.
[01:36] <guiverc> aaronprisk[m], yep.  
[01:37] <guiverc> alas it was cleared earlier today (after 773 was published)
[01:38] <guiverc> The title format '== General Community' & '=== Welcome New Members' on skel need adjusting; easy I believe (no code)
[01:38] <aaronprisk[m]> I mention it because Discourse does a pretty good job of pulling the formatting from the doc and turning it into the proper Markdown that Discourse likes.
[01:39] <krytarik> guiverc: You mean it doesn't like the right part of them?  Wondered if that'd be the case.
[01:39] <guiverc> the === Text === are treated purely as text; they'll need to be # etc.
[01:40]  * guiverc trying to get screengrab; but it's not reading my firefox/snap window; just getting black for some reason
[01:40] <krytarik> Oh right, different character..
[01:40] <guiverc> that's only adjustment on our skeleton; easy as I see it
[01:41] <krytarik> Yeah, that'd be super trivial then indeed.
[01:43] <krytarik> And grabbing from the Google Doc directly wouldn't work, because we also got notes and placeholders and different formatting there.
[01:44] <guiverc> https://imgur.com/Pxa2Vxq.png is a full screen; sorry it's everything (and messy) .. but the window view is at top (three displays; top screen so middle/top third)
[01:44] <aaronprisk[m]> krytarik: Makes sense. You can always start your topics as unlisted in Discourse, which is what we typically do when working on new community docs, then simply list them once it's ready for publication. 
[01:45] <guiverc> the links are different color (blueish) & all work.
[01:46] <guiverc> another (horrid) view lower down, HUB showing how links for articles appear...
[01:46] <guiverc> https://imgur.com/4dEhAkA.png
[01:49] <krytarik> aaronprisk[m]: Yeah, I guess that'd be similar to the workflow we got on the wiki currently.  While on the latter it's already visible to everybody then, I wonder if unlisted on Discourse means that if you guess the URL minus the appended number, you also get to see it..?  Not that visibility particularly matters in either case though, just curious.
[01:50] <krytarik> guiverc: LOL XD
[01:50] <guiverc> the updates stuff at end looks okay too, listed with links working; https://imgur.com/4yawcMM.png  (posted that as reply and not original)
[01:51] <aaronprisk[m]> Correct, if someone really wants that sneak peek they have to work for it.
[01:52] <krytarik> guiverc: Uhm, so it seems that it also magically changes the link anchor text to the title at the URL's end.. :3
[01:52] <guiverc> yep; different blue hue & open with nothing done :)
[01:53] <krytarik> ..Except for the update links? :o
[01:54] <krytarik> I mean they look like actual links, just with the bare URL rather than the title.
[01:55] <guiverc> all links look good to me krytarik ;  maybe my terrible screenshots
[01:56]  * guiverc wonders why we did this today; my screenshots are showing mouse instead of bird  (menu/de)
[01:57] <guiverc> my top display (i have 3 not aligned) was the discourse..  (bottom right was mousepad)
[01:58] <guiverc> (or wallpaper & telegram for earlier screenshots)
[02:00] <krytarik> guiverc: I mean if you look at the links in the first screenshots, they all got converted from the plain URL also being the anchor text to the latter being the title of the page they lead to - but on the update lists that's not the case.
[02:01] <krytarik> Of course though, the converting is the actual issue here.
[02:02] <krytarik> Which may force us to indeed do tags stuff around the URLs then.
[02:03]  * guiverc looking
[02:04] <guiverc> Yeah I see what you mean, but not yet seeing the consequence though
[02:05] <Eickmeyer> As far as formatting, it's just a different form of markdown. Traditional markdown vs moin.
[02:05] <guiverc> I would hope we could work out to 'tweak' what we want in gdoc so copy/paste gets an almost perfect result..
[02:08]  * guiverc retesting... my final was done as a REPLY not original thread post; maybe that makes a difference
[02:13] <krytarik> guiverc, Bashing-om: Well, why not just start out on Discourse directly instead, with a template that also includes notes - and in the process of finalizing the post remove the excess and unwanted bits the same as currently on the wiki?
[02:16] <Bashing-om> krytarik: I got no heartburn using discourse as our development platform. But like before - I be monkee see monkee do. Be a process of learning the ropes.
[02:19] <krytarik> I mean currently we do all the compiling, writing, and formatting in advance in the Google Doc - and at publishing time copypaste the relevant bits from there to the wiki.  And I can see no real reason why we shouldn't start out at the target directly - and the Google Doc is visible to anybody too.
[02:19] <guiverc> I wonder if what we need is a new "News" area in discourse for it?  (community is probably closest currently on quick scan) & we can 'fudge' the current wiki.post there & work out what is required.  (official 773 remains on wiki)
[02:20] <guiverc> (it'll also confirm if ubuntu discourse has the ~32KB limit the lubuntu site has)
[02:21] <guiverc> Annoucements maybe closest existing category (not community)
[02:22] <guiverc> I'd prefer not to 'crowd' that out, which a weekly would do..
[02:23] <krytarik> Yeah, maybe we can even get a dedicated "Fridge" category! :P
[02:23] <guiverc> aaronprisk[m], a new 'News' or 'Fridge' category on discourse?   Currently I see (^) Annoucements as the best fitting category; but a weekly newsletter would 'crowd' out other key annoucements...
[02:25] <guiverc> my thinking currently is to create a UWN773 there (from our wiki.post for 773) & we can look at issues.. Myself, Bashing-om, krytarik would need access if restricted area
[02:25] <guiverc> aaronprisk[m], ^
[02:26] <krytarik> Speaking of which, why does the site currently not have a favicon? >_<
[02:27] <Eickmeyer> I see a favicon...
[02:28] <aaronprisk[m]> I think either a new Category or even a subcategory under Community would work as it's a community driven entity. Do you have a preference?
[02:28] <krytarik> I'll note that I'm not even registered with the Discourse instance yet though.
[02:28] <Bashing-om> guiverc: How about I try and revert Gdoc to 773 and we work from our Gdoc ?
[02:28] <Eickmeyer> aaronprisk[m]: Even "Flavors" are community driven, so I wouldn't want to overcrowd the Community category.
[02:29] <Eickmeyer> Technically, the entire Ubuntu project is community driven.
[02:31] <krytarik> Eickmeyer: Huh, what the heck.. loading it in a private window made it show up here too.. :o
[02:31] <Eickmeyer> krytarik: Means your caches are messed.
[02:32] <guiverc> Bashing-om, this box isn't my old core2q so maybe a little 'faster' at reverting  (sorry phone call..)
[02:32] <krytarik> Also it loads forever otherwise.
[02:32] <guiverc> aaronprisk[m], I don't have a preference.. 
[02:32] <aaronprisk[m]> Fair point. Top level it is. There is some additional housekeeping that needs to take place at the top level anyhow.
[02:33] <Bashing-om> guiverc: I now have 32 Gigs of ram - I have been anxious to see if now I can "work" Gdoc :D
[02:33] <guiverc> :)     More than me; feel free !
[02:34] <krytarik> I don't see any value in repopulating the Google Doc though.
[02:34] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Lemme see what happens // I make a copy before I do it.
[02:35] <guiverc> the only benefit is we can work/commuicate together  (yeah it's a slower bad version of mousepad... but we both can see & talk.. as in prep on occasion)
[02:36] <krytarik> I mean right now and in the context of trying Discourse with it.
[02:38] <guiverc> I'd use wiki.post & make global changes; '=== ' to '***' probably, then copy/paste to discourse & view in preview window..   when all done; diff with original wiki.post
[02:39] <krytarik> Yep, that!
[02:39]  * guiverc # for major headings...
[02:53] <krytarik> Eickmeyer: Aha, figured why the difference, and as suspected it's got to do with disabled scripts (which is why I was loading the site in a private window to begin with, to possibly enable some more).. for some reason in a non-private window it tries to load scripts from 'ubuntucommunity.s3.dualstack.us-east-2.amazonaws.com' while it doesn't in a private one - which is why it wasn't slow ...
[02:53] <krytarik> ... and broken in the latter. :o
[02:54] <Eickmeyer> krytarik: ope! 
[03:01] <krytarik> guiverc: And yes, the annotation and chat features is what we'd lose on switching to Discourse for the initial compiling.
[03:06] <aaronprisk[m]> I'll work on getting a 'News' category setup tomorrow morning and report back.
[03:06] <guiverc> thanks aaronprisk[m] 
[03:17] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Fridge:: Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter Issue 773 @ https://fridge.ubuntu.com/2023/02/06/ubuntu-weekly-newsletter-issue-773/ (by guiverc)
[03:20] <krytarik> Unless we can somehow get the raw post text via URL from Discourse though, then we'll have issues using the scripts that we currently use for creating the Fridge, the forums, and the microblogging posts from the base.
[03:22] <Bashing-om> krytarik: ^ that will take some time and effort :(
[03:25] <krytarik> I mean the workaround there in that case would be to copypaste the raw text from the Discourse post to a local file in the directory of the script repo and then run the slightly amended script, but obviously it wouldn't be ideal..
[03:25] <guiverc> I just realized that krytarik , everything we have works from wiki... 
[03:26]  * guiverc just out from a shower, where I realized ~all scripts will need work...  
[03:27] <krytarik> And if we have to add extra formatting to make the links not be converted into the titles, then it'd suck to send this out via mail too.
[03:43] <aaronprisk[m]> May be something the Discourse topic API can help with 
[07:44] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Ubuntu Blog: Secure open source MLOps for AI/ML applications in financial services @ https://ubuntu.com//blog/secure-open-source-mlops-for-ai-ml-applications-in-financial-services
[09:14] <guiverc> uwn 773 posted to fb
[21:06] <krytarik> aaronprisk[m], guiverc, Bashing-om: Yeah, I've had success getting the raw text of a post via its thread by using the Discourse API.  Now the remaining issue is the link formatting and whether we do need to add markup around them which would make it unsuitable for sending out via mail.
[21:12] <krytarik> Another thing with regards to compiling is though that Discourse as opposed to the wiki doesn't seem to know the concept of hidden inline comments.
[21:54] <guiverc> ack krytarik 
[21:57] <krytarik> guiverc: I'm also currently working on a script based on the reformat.py one for the forums, to do the same for Discourse - so you'd have it easier later to test posting on the latter.  It should be done soon.
[21:58] <guiverc> :) & thanks krytarik 
[22:14] <krytarik> guiverc: https://paste.opendev.org/show/bpGHkBe3a8qXa0Goj3DI/ - this should be about it, but without taking into account the possibly needed extra formatting for links.. and if we'll have to do that, then 1.) we'd have to amend quite a few scripts, 2.) it'd make it harder for you on writing, and 3.) we can forget about sending the result out via mail.
[22:19] <guiverc> the links as they were (in what I saw with pastes on lubu.discourse) didn't worry me.. I want to understand what's there & where I click to get what i want; and I could use what I saw (ie. me in readers seat; but yes first-time readers will react differently..
[23:54] <Bashing-om> Discourse: Caught up with the log to krytarik's ammended script: https://paste.opendev.org/show/bpGHkBe3a8qXa0Goj3DI/ . Waiting to see what I can do further. 
[23:54]  * guiverc is holding for discourse permission
[23:57] <guiverc> ie.  i was thinking we'd 'massage' latest issue on discourse; then diff what was required (for discourse) to original (wiki source)...   My thinking was all edits being done locally (editor) & pasted ; using preview window for most stuff, but we'll need to post for comments
[23:59] <guiverc> (comments; as in not person doing the text entry who can see preview)