 @tsimonq2 @Rick_Timmis @DarinMiller @Valoriez Mamarok I have a draft WIP of the Flatpak blog post in WP now.
 Pastebin? (re @ahoneybun: @tsimonq2 @Rick_Timmis @DarinMiller @Valoriez Mamarok I have a draft WIP of the Flatpak blog post in WP now.)
[01:41] <mparillo> I previewed the draft, and copied the HTML to a snippet, and e-mailed the link to the snippet to your Kubuntu.org address.
[04:17] <valorie> um, where's the login bit on the website?
[04:17] <valorie> used to be at the bottom of the page for me
 kubuntu.org/admin
[08:29] <valorie> thank you
[08:29] <valorie> howevever, logged in I can't see any recent drafts at all. 
 @ahoneybun Post looks like a good start. I made a couple of edits to try to close the length and meaning of the sentences. Scratching my head as I still think it's missing something, perhaps around clarity on our position on Flatpaks. Tricky one I know, as we're not fully aligned. Please take a look and let me know what you think
[10:58] <mparillo> After I log in, I only see *my* recent drafts. To see the flatpak draft, you need to go to Posts > All Posts.
[16:09] <RikMills> 5.27 looks good for kinetic backports, so kopying that now
 \o/
 I just installed 22.04 :(
 Hi Aaron. Thanks for writing up the Flatpaks and Kubuntu draft.
 I have a question and few suggestions.  Is a restart really required to enable the Flatpak repo's or is that a JTBS (just to be sure) suggestion?
[16:22] <ahoneybun[m]> It's needed for adding flathub per their docs.
 That must be a blanket statement to avoid providing package manager restarts for all the different DE's.  I will play with Flatpak repo to see if I can determine the command(s) required to initialize Discover.
 Just confirmed after removing flatub repo, flatpak and plasma-discover-backend-flatpak (and rebooting).  I was able install flatpak, respective repo and then install flatpak apps via Discover without rebooting. However, I did have to restart Disover as I did everything from command line. (re @DarinMiller: That must be a blanket statement to avoid providing package manager restarts for all the different DE's.  I will play with Flat
 Aaron, Would mind if I updated the verbiage on your post?
 No you can do that
 Hmm....strange.  A restart is not required to install a Flatpak package, but Flatpak installed packages do appear in the menu until after restart... will test if plasmashell restart fixes this or problem is deeper in the config...
 do not appear ^
[17:42] <arraybolt3> Just in case it's helpful, the behavior @DarinMiller pointed out with Flatpak is something I experience on all machines I enable Flatpak on, regardless of DE (happened on my Ubuntu Unity 22.10 box also).
 I could not figure out how to update the XDG_DATA_DIRS variable using systemctl. Thus, log-out/in or restart is also my recommended action to enable Flatpak.  Verbiage updated. Feel free to revert or modify as needed.
[21:14] <valorie> mparillo: thanks! I fixed a couple of things including a typo. Does anyone think it needs a final sentence or is it ready to go?
[21:15] <valorie> wind is whipping up here so I will log out
[21:17] <ahoneybun[m]> Fallen: do you want to see it beforehand? 
[21:21] <valorie> I found one more thing to fix; now logged out
[21:21] <valorie> thanks so much to each person who touched this
[21:22] <valorie> I think the cake is baked and is ready for eating
[21:22] <Fallen> If you'd like me to provide advice I would be happy to take a read.
[21:22] <valorie> as a metaphor
[21:23] <valorie> https://kubuntu.org/?p=5012&preview_id=5012&preview_nonce=7e5242772a&preview=true might work for you, Fallen
[21:24] <valorie> if you are logged in
[21:24] <valorie> and you have Powerz
[21:24] <Fallen> Not allowed to preview drafts. I don't think I have any powers there, but I can check
[21:26] <Fallen> Does not work when logged in
[21:26] <valorie> Here's the text: 
[21:26] <valorie> Kubuntu is and has always been “Ubuntu” combined with the greatest software from the KDE Community. Prior to 23.04 and aligned with Debian packaging, Flatpack and Snap package sources were included as installable options with each source requiring its own set of commands and repositories. However, enabling both sources caused confusion with new users (and *Ubuntu support groups) as the user was unsure about several issues including which or 
[21:26] <valorie> how their packages were installed; the proper place to report issues; and/or how to remove them. As a result, Canonical (Ubuntu’s parent company) has chosen to only support Snaps upon initial install.
[21:26] <valorie> User and community member, arraybolt3, provides more details regarding challenges of Flatpack support.
[21:26] <valorie> No worries; Flatpaks are still available for all Ubuntu flavors. To enable Flatpaks in KDE’s Discover in Kubuntu 23.04, run this command:
[21:26] <valorie> sudo apt install flatpak plasma-discover-backend-flatpak
[21:26] <valorie> To enable the largest Flatpak repository, run this command:
[21:26] <valorie> flatpak remote-add –if-not-exists flathub https://flathub.org/repo/flathub.flatpakrepo
[21:26] <valorie> Log out and log back in (or restart) to re-initialize the XDG_DATA_DIRS variable, otherwise, newly installed Flatpak apps will not run or appear in the startup menu.
[21:26] <valorie> did that all appear in channel?
[21:26] <valorie> last sentence: og out and log back in (or restart) to re-initialize the XDG_DATA_DIRS variable, otherwise, newly installed Flatpak apps will not run or appear in the startup menu.
[21:28] <valorie> err, log in etc.
[21:30] <valorie> any changes to be made before publishing?
[21:30] <valorie> last call....
[21:30] <Fallen> One comment, sec
[21:30] <valorie> k
[21:32] <Fallen> You have been here longer than me, but my understanding is that the decision on snaps was essentially made by the Technical Board. I'd mention Ubuntu there, or Ubuntu's Technical Board. Does that sound reasonable?
[21:33] <valorie> anyone here who's read all the back and forth conversation about this change?
[21:35] <valorie> IMO Mark/Canonical in general dictate policy; the Tech. Board puts it into action
[21:36] <valorie> well, all the various Boards, but in this case, the Technical Board
[21:36] <valorie> logging back in
[21:38] <valorie> How about: As a result, Canonical, Ubuntu's parent company and the Ubuntu Technical Board has chosen to only support Snaps upon initial install.
[21:39] <valorie> with a comma between company, and
 That; sounds great to me.
[21:39] <valorie> probably should be have chosen not has
[21:39] <valorie> ok to publish?
[21:39] <Fallen> https://ubuntu.com/community/governance has some info on this. Mark is certainly part of the boards as SABDFL, but the councils re meant to be in the deciding position.
[21:40] <valorie> Fallen: having dealt with Mark in person and in meetings - he is the founder and Prime Mover
[21:41] <valorie> I see no reason to pretend otherwise
[21:43] <Fallen> Thats fine, understood. What I'm trying to avoid is pushing more into the "Canonical said" direction, while I've been trying hard to build consensus in this decision instead of going through the TB to set policy.
[21:44] <Fallen> It is certainly up to you all though, I'm not intending to impose direction here.
[21:45] <valorie> agreed that the final version of each policy is published by the TB
[21:46] <Fallen> That aside, I really appreciate the time you've taken to put this together. Generally I think you've found a good balance in the blog post.
[21:46] <valorie> good to hear
[21:47] <valorie> publishing now
 Will a seed change now be necessary?
 Or has this already been done?
[21:48] <valorie> https://kubuntu.org/news/flatpaks-and-kubuntu/
[21:49] <valorie> for social media
[21:50] <Fallen> Minor typo I missed before, s/Flatpack/Flatpak/g
[21:51] <valorie> oh gosh
[21:51] <valorie> fixx0ring
[21:52] <Fallen> https://packages.ubuntu.com/lunar/kubuntu-desktop has plasma-discover-backend-flatpak which depends on flatpak, so I think you'll need to do a seed change to remove plasma-discover-backend-flatpak.
[21:53] <valorie> fixed 'em all - half were correct
[21:53] <Fallen> I believe it might need a FF exception, I can help ping the release team tomorrow to help get that through.
[21:54] <valorie> the commands at least were all correct
[21:55] <Fallen> Ah I think wordpress botched your dashes.  --if-not-exists instead of –if-not-exists
[21:55] <valorie> hmmm
[21:55] <valorie> dunno how to fix
[21:55] <Fallen> Can you put it into a code block? Or copy-paste the dashes separately?
[21:56] <Fallen> If all fails, switch to source view, and fix it in the HTML
 Feature Freeze is a soft freeze and there's general consensus, I'm going to JFDI
[22:03] <Fallen> Awesome!
[22:37] <valorie> someone else with more WP skillz than me will have to fix the errant dashes
[22:37]  * valorie is on to another project now
 Fallen it is a short block or whatever in WP
 For that command.
[22:42] <Fallen> I'm not sure, seems all WPs are different. Preformatted text, or go to html view and wrap with <code>xxx</code>
 https://git.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-dev/ubuntu-seeds/+git/kubuntu/commit/?id=7bb26bcce2e0edb7db9b449321d2ad8399e58a7e
 https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kubuntu-meta/1.430
 On the (somewhat bold) assumption that no autopkgtests for reverse dependencies are triggered, tomorrow's daily should be without Flatpak.