[07:15] <caribou> Don't want to be too annoying, but is this removal of some of the 5.15 / 5.19 kernel packages from the archive a normal situation ?
[07:23] <alkisg> caribou: what packages, do you mean old ones that have been superseded?
[07:23] <juergh> caribou: we don't remove packages from the archive. /me thinks.
[07:23] <caribou> yes, some of them but not all
[07:24] <caribou> This is one example of them : linux-image-5.15.0-52-generic
[07:25] <alkisg> Yeah, superseded, we're in -71- now
[07:26] <juergh> should still be in the archive though
[07:26] <caribou> here is a listing : https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/CNmXJHsW29/
[07:26] <ultratox> But how come old versions disappeared from the archive?
[07:26] <alkisg> Then apt update would need a lot more data, if all the versions of all the packages were being kept ...
[07:26] <caribou> that's our question : for some reason one kernel version was pinned for installation and now the install fails since it is no longer there
[07:26] <alkisg> And mirrors too
[07:27] <alkisg> AFAIK the original kernel is kept, from the installation media, and the two last ones
[07:27] <ultratox> When du the purges occur?
[07:28] <juergh> Kernels are different. A new kernel version is a new package (not just a new version of an existing package). So should always be in the archive.
[07:29] <ultratox> For the 5.19 in Jammy, only the last one has been kept for example, so this does not seem to comply with this policy.
[07:29] <alkisg> Well, apt install linux-image-5.15.0- and tab-tab, shows only 25 and 71 available (25 is the original one from the installation media)
[07:30] <caribou> alkisg: the current situation is a change from what is always been the case : all kernel packages were present in the archive
[07:31] <caribou> you could pretty well need to go back to an old kernel package + dbgsym for crash dump analysis for instance
[07:31] <alkisg> caribou: I'm just a long time user so my opinion isn't too important. But I've never seen more than 2-3 versions of the same kernel in the archive in the last 10 years.
[07:31] <alkisg> caribou: in these cases, I had to download it from launchpad, where they are kept
[07:32] <caribou> yes but right now there not even on launchpad : https://packages.ubuntu.com/jammy/linux-image-5.15.0-52-generic
[07:32] <caribou> does 404
[07:32] <alkisg> They're in the build history
[07:32] <alkisg> Your link there is the archive, not the launchpad build
[07:32] <juergh> hrm
[07:32] <juergh> juergh@gollum:~$ curl -s http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/l/linux/ | grep linux-image-unsigned-5.4.0-[0-9]*-generic | wc -l... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/c721c575159c7bc64a588a56494227ee6b452234>)
[07:33] <alkisg> caribou: here's a link to get you started: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+publishinghistory
[07:34] <alkisg> From there you'll end up in the .debs
[07:34] <alkisg> So when I needed to pin an older kernel, I always used the "installation media" one
[07:34] <alkisg> That's available via apt, instead of searching launchpad and using wget
[07:50] <caribou> This is still a sudden deviation from what it used to be
[08:02] <ultratox> As of march 1st, for example, there was still 20 releases of the 5.15.0 kernel available from the Jammy repositories, including the original -25, going from -27 through -60. So there must have been either a deletion mistake or a deliberate purge. Whatever it is, there must be some kind of explanation somewhere.
[08:05] <alkisg> ultratox: I've never seen that, I believe you somehow remember wrong
[08:11] <ultratox> alkisg: Try this command on an up-to-date Bionic, Focal and Jammy --> apt-cache search linux-image | grep -E '^linux-image-[0-9].*-generic' | sort -t. -nk2
[08:12] <alkisg> ultratox: I think you're right, I think I was confused with the result of `apt policy linux-generic`, which only lists the last and the original version
[08:13] <alkisg> And the commands that juergh has posted also verify what you're saying
[08:13] <alkisg> (i.e. I was pinning linux-generic instead of individual kernel packages)
[08:26] <ultratox> So, is this possible that there was a mistake? Any reversion possible?
[09:32] <soeby> Hi, does anybody know why all but the latest kernel versions for Jammy, has gone missing from the jammy-updates repo and is now only in proposed ?. This happened on Tuesday morning (UTC) 
[09:34] <caribou> soeby: have a look at the logs, we discussed it a few minutes ago : https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2023/05/11/%23ubuntu-kernel.html
[09:35] <ultratox> soeby: We happen to be talking about this
[09:35] <soeby> sorry - I just joined the sorry :-) 
[09:35] <ultratox> Good thing you add your voice to this cry for help ;-)
[09:57] <soeby> On May 8th, we had 23 kernels (-27 through to -71) in the updates repo. On May 9th, only one (-71) was available. 
[09:59] <soeby> 5.15 series ^^
[09:59] <ultratox> Have you got any log regarding the 5.19?
[10:03] <soeby> @ultravox - yes, apparently the versions from 5.19.0-28 to -40 went missing on the 10th, so a bit later...
[10:04] <tjaalton> read ubuntu-release@, it was announced in late april that obsolete kernel abi versions are getting cleaned now
[10:05] <tjaalton> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2023-April/005625.html
[10:12] <soeby> @tjaalton - so the resolution for installing an older (possibly working) kernel is to enable the proposed repo ?  
[10:12] <tjaalton> no
[10:13] <tjaalton> you install the metapackage
[10:13] <soeby> ...but I do not *want* the latest kernel 
[10:14] <tjaalton> then you keep your own mirror
[10:14] <tjaalton> and don't remove stuff
[10:16] <tjaalton> if proposed still has them, I think it's an oversight
[10:19] <soeby> The .deb packages are still there - so the size of mirrors are the same... only what is included in -security and -updates definitions are changing. 
[10:20] <juergh> For the record, I believe it's always possible to get package from LP: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archive/primary/+files/<debname>. For example: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archive/primary/+files/linux-image-5.15.0-30-generic_5.15.0-30.31_arm64.deb
[10:21] <tjaalton> anyway, it's pointless to complain about it here, use the mailing list
[10:22] <tjaalton> or discourse, since it's the Future
[10:22] <soeby> @tjaalton - I will...
[11:50] <caribou> thanks for the clarification tjaalton